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RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 10:38:07 AM   
Froonp


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quote:

I see no problem with dual names as we did for Boden/Lulea.

I like this.
In that case, I'll make it so that names are both near the symbol they correspond to. For Lulea / Boden and Merida / Progreso this could not be possible because there is a single icon (port). Except it is demonstrated that Merida population in the 40s warranted a city (it is 793k inhabitants currently, so it may be)

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 241
RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 11:02:17 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

I see no problem with dual names as we did for Boden/Lulea.

I like this.
In that case, I'll make it so that names are both near the symbol they correspond to. For Lulea / Boden and Merida / Progreso this could not be possible because there is a single icon (port). Except it is demonstrated that Merida population in the 40s warranted a city (it is 793k inhabitants currently, so it may be)

I am not sure if I was clear here. I meant for there to be 1 label that contains 2 names: Lulea (Boden).

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Post #: 242
RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 9:40:53 PM   
Earl Uhtred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Earl Uhtred
It's a minor point, but Merida in Yucatan isn't on the coast and thus isn't a port. The port of Merida is Progreso.

I wonder what to do.
Are Merida & Progreso of equal size, or is there one larger that the other ?
WiF FE has it that the port is named Merida, but this is a Pacific Scaled Area, so they took Merida even if it was not really coastal. Maybe it is larger ?

From wikipedia I get that Merida is the capital of Yucatan with 793k inhabitants, 11st Mexican city, 35 km from the coast.
From the same place, I get that Progreso has a 45k population, so while they are in the same hex, the name of Merida must stay.

It is this case with a good number of cities that are near the coast, but that are not coastal. There is Lima also for example, for which the port is Callao. The original WiF FE map has both names written in the same hex, Callao near the port, and Lima near the city. It may also be the case for Boden / Lulea in Sweden too.
But it seems this is never the case in MWiF.

Should 2 names appear for a hex, one for the port, one for the city, when there is a city near the shore, that is not a port, and another much smaller, that is the real port ?


Merida is certainly much bigger and much older, but while the only thing in the hex is a port... If Merida appeared on the map as a city, or if Progreso was a suburb of Merida rather than a physically separate community, then by all means use that name, but until then surely it makes more sense to use the name of the anchorage that is the main defining feature of this hex?

Taking your example of Callao: I seem to remember on the America in Flames map it got its own hex and was named. Can't remember whether Lima was in the same hex. But it's been a while since I broke AiF out so who knows.

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 243
RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 10:03:48 PM   
jesperpehrson


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Earl Uhtred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Earl Uhtred
It's a minor point, but Merida in Yucatan isn't on the coast and thus isn't a port. The port of Merida is Progreso.

I wonder what to do.
Are Merida & Progreso of equal size, or is there one larger that the other ?
WiF FE has it that the port is named Merida, but this is a Pacific Scaled Area, so they took Merida even if it was not really coastal. Maybe it is larger ?

From wikipedia I get that Merida is the capital of Yucatan with 793k inhabitants, 11st Mexican city, 35 km from the coast.
From the same place, I get that Progreso has a 45k population, so while they are in the same hex, the name of Merida must stay.

It is this case with a good number of cities that are near the coast, but that are not coastal. There is Lima also for example, for which the port is Callao. The original WiF FE map has both names written in the same hex, Callao near the port, and Lima near the city. It may also be the case for Boden / Lulea in Sweden too.
But it seems this is never the case in MWiF.

Should 2 names appear for a hex, one for the port, one for the city, when there is a city near the shore, that is not a port, and another much smaller, that is the real port ?


Merida is certainly much bigger and much older, but while the only thing in the hex is a port... If Merida appeared on the map as a city, or if Progreso was a suburb of Merida rather than a physically separate community, then by all means use that name, but until then surely it makes more sense to use the name of the anchorage that is the main defining feature of this hex?

Taking your example of Callao: I seem to remember on the America in Flames map it got its own hex and was named. Can't remember whether Lima was in the same hex. But it's been a while since I broke AiF out so who knows.


Merida was Spanish capital in Yucatan, a very old city by American standards (excluding indigenous cities of course) and it is very large. Most of the buildings are white I rememeber correctly and the city is even called "the white city". But it is FAR from the ocean so it does not make sense to call a port Merida.

I am also confused on the name of the Guatemalan pacific port. I have been there for 8 months and I never heard of the name Istapan. To be honest there is no real city along the coast that could warrant a port but if one would be chose it would be Puerto San José or Champerico (a real stretch on that last one though)

(in reply to Earl Uhtred)
Post #: 244
RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 10:26:29 PM   
Froonp


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quote:

I am also confused on the name of the Guatemalan pacific port. I have been there for 8 months and I never heard of the name Istapan. To be honest there is no real city along the coast that could warrant a port but if one would be chose it would be Puerto San José or Champerico (a real stretch on that last one though)

You're right I think. The real WiF FE map, because of its Pacific Scale, had the City of Guatemala and a minor port on the Pacific Coast, but the minor port was not named.
I will put Puerto San José on the map, a little westwards.

(in reply to jesperpehrson)
Post #: 245
RE: Panama - 10/16/2006 10:27:45 PM   
Froonp


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quote:

Merida was Spanish capital in Yucatan, a very old city by American standards (excluding indigenous cities of course) and it is very large. Most of the buildings are white I rememeber correctly and the city is even called "the white city". But it is FAR from the ocean so it does not make sense to call a port Merida.

I've put both names, with Progreso in parenthesis.

(in reply to jesperpehrson)
Post #: 246
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 7:33:27 PM   
Froonp


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One more remote place : Patagonia.




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Post #: 247
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 7:34:08 PM   
Froonp


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Does this place remind you of something ?




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Post #: 248
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 7:43:05 PM   
Froonp


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Here is southern Brazil, still a draft coastlines.




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Post #: 249
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 7:44:51 PM   
Froonp


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All of South America was posted here for you to see and criticize if needed, to complement and comment, so don't be shy.

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Post #: 250
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:21:04 PM   
wfzimmerman


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It's the "Falkland Islands", not "Falkland Island".

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Post #: 251
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:22:42 PM   
jesperpehrson


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wfzimmerman

It's the "Falkland Islands", not "Falkland Island".


I believe they are both wrong, it is called "Las Malvinas"

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Post #: 252
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:29:27 PM   
wworld7


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quote:

ORIGINAL: capitan

I believe they are both wrong, it is called "Las Malvinas"


NOT!

Flipper

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Post #: 253
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:44:13 PM   
Froonp


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quote:

ORIGINAL: flipperwasirish
quote:

ORIGINAL: capitan
I believe they are both wrong, it is called "Las Malvinas"

NOT!
Flipper

The Falkland Islands are a contested Area.
The British People call it the Falklands, and the Argentinian people call it Las Malvinas.
Not wanting to take side on any side, I simply left the name that there is on WiF FE maps.
The spelling error is not on the real MWiF maps.

(in reply to wworld7)
Post #: 254
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:44:15 PM   
wfzimmerman


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The map does a nice job of showing the underlying military logic of the 1982 conflict.

A German para flying on a JU-52 could easily make its way to Port Stanley from Argentina.

But once it gets there, there are five invadable hexes to garrison against a CW counterattack.

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Post #: 255
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 8:59:07 PM   
Froonp


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp
One more remote place : Patagonia.


About this one, I had to delete a bit of railway that linked Viedma (Argentina) and Puerto Montt (Chile), because it was on the original MWiF maps (and it is on the WiF FE maps), but this railway do not even exist in 2006. So I deleted it.

But, having deleted this railway between Chile & Argentina, I'm leaving only 1 such railway on the map, and the WiF FE map has 2 Chile - Argentina Map.

So to restablish the situation (having 2 x Chile - Argentina railways), I thought about adding a Antofagasta - Salta railway. This railway exists in 2006, but I don't know if it existed in the 40s. (see next post for an illo)

Would anyone here know ?

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 256
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 9:01:15 PM   
Froonp


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Map for proposed new railway.




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Post #: 257
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 9:02:33 PM   
wworld7


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp
The Falkland Islands are a contested Area.
The British People call it the Falklands, and the Argentinian people call it Las Malvinas.
Not wanting to take side on any side, I simply left the name that there is on WiF FE maps.
The spelling error is not on the real MWiF maps.



Froonp,

While it is true Argentinia has not dropped its demand for the islands. It is not contested by the people living in the islands. In fact the people voted to stay part of Great Britain.

And until Ireland completes its conquest of the world this issue will not been settled.

Flipper

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Post #: 258
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 9:33:42 PM   
jesperpehrson


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quote:


It is not contested by the people living in the islands. In fact the people voted to stay part of Great Britain.


All five of them?

Anyway let´s not discuss politics here. I have my opinion and you have yours. Let´s leave it at that.

Now...only 10 more corpsized INFs to go before all Germans INFs are done. Then of course all the other nations of the world remain

(in reply to wworld7)
Post #: 259
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 10:44:46 PM   
argaur


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for the spanish is las malvinas too

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Post #: 260
RE: Panama - 10/20/2006 11:02:18 PM   
Greyshaft


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quote:

ORIGINAL: capitan
Now...only 10 more corpsized INFs to go before all Germans INFs are done. Then of course all the other nations of the world remain


Hang in there... the MWiF Forum is sending reinforcements

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/Greyshaft

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Post #: 261
RE: Panama - 10/21/2006 12:54:35 AM   
Froonp


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Would this be okay for everyone ?
Edit 1 : OK, I forgot to correct the "ISLAND" typo, but it is not on the real map.
Edit 2 : Notice that Gallegos (WiF FE name) was renammed Rio Gallegos, as it seems to be the correct name of the place.
Edit 3 : Notice that Magallenas (WiF FE name) was renammed Punta Arenas, as it seems to be the correct name of the place.




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< Message edited by Froonp -- 10/21/2006 12:58:01 AM >

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Post #: 262
RE: Panama - 10/21/2006 1:23:50 AM   
wworld7


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quote:

ORIGINAL: capitan

quote:


It is not contested by the people living in the islands. In fact the people voted to stay part of Great Britain.


All five of them?

Anyway let´s not discuss politics here. I have my opinion and you have yours. Let´s leave it at that.

Now...only 10 more corpsized INFs to go before all Germans INFs are done. Then of course all the other nations of the world remain


Capitan,

Consider it dropped.

Flipper


(in reply to jesperpehrson)
Post #: 263
RE: Panama - 10/21/2006 4:27:29 AM   
christo

 

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Ahh... that explains why Langdorf put the Graf Spee into Montevideo rather then Buenos Aires. Montevideo gave him access to two sea areas insted of just the one!

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Post #: 264
RE: Panama - 10/22/2006 9:21:00 PM   
trees trees

 

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I like how the edge of the world is a black abyss again, just like it was 500+ years ago.

Lots of nice work Patrice!

Could the weather line maybe be thickened up a bit?

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Post #: 265
RE: Panama - 10/22/2006 10:11:05 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: trees trees

I like how the edge of the world is a black abyss again, just like it was 500+ years ago.

Lots of nice work Patrice!

Could the weather line maybe be thickened up a bit?

I haven't decided on the weather line graphics yet, but it needs to be changed. The green on dark blue is almost invisible in the sea areas art low resolution; and that is when I think it will be most important.

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Post #: 266
RE: MWiF Map Review - America - 11/1/2006 1:51:52 AM   
ajds

 

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Is it too late to comment on the America map detail? My first comment is with regards to the southern California resource placement. The current map has oil in the mountains to the northeast of the Los Angeles basin - to my knowledge there was no significant oil production in that area. Regional oil production was in the western Los Angeles basin and in Bakersfield. On the map this means I suggest moving the oil resources into the clear hex with the city marker and factories, or perhaps moving one there and putting the other into Bakersfield (the southernmost clear hex of the San Joaquin Valley north of Los Angeles). This latter idea would of course require a transportion connection to make the resouce usable and hence may not be tenable (as I don't believe we have pipelines in the game currently). There was (is) heavy crude production and refining in Bakersfield as well as Los Angeles.

My second comment is also with regard to the current location of the southern California oil resource, as it seems to be in the right place for a normal resource marker, perhaps the one currently in the mountains southeast of San Jose. I say this because the Kaiser steel mills were historically in the San Bernardino area east of Los Angeles, served by the Eagle Mountain iron mine even further east. I am not suggesting there isn't significant resources in the coastal mountains where the current resource marker is, I just am not aware of them, but the Kaiser mills and related mine were substantial in the WWII timeframe. In addition there was and is quite a bit of strategic mineral mining in the desert hexes to the northeast of Los Angeles (notably potash and cement), supporting the resource on that side of Los Angeles.

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Post #: 267
RE: MWiF Map Review - America - 11/1/2006 2:07:53 AM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ajds
Is it too late to comment on the America map detail? My first comment is with regards to the southern California resource placement. The current map has oil in the mountains to the northeast of the Los Angeles basin - to my knowledge there was no significant oil production in that area. Regional oil production was in the western Los Angeles basin and in Bakersfield. On the map this means I suggest moving the oil resources into the clear hex with the city marker and factories, or perhaps moving one there and putting the other into Bakersfield (the southernmost clear hex of the San Joaquin Valley north of Los Angeles). This latter idea would of course require a transportion connection to make the resouce usable and hence may not be tenable (as I don't believe we have pipelines in the game currently). There was (is) heavy crude production and refining in Bakersfield as well as Los Angeles.

My second comment is also with regard to the current location of the southern California oil resource, as it seems to be in the right place for a normal resource marker, perhaps the one currently in the mountains southeast of San Jose. I say this because the Kaiser steel mills were historically in the San Bernardino area east of Los Angeles, served by the Eagle Mountain iron mine even further east. I am not suggesting there isn't significant resources in the coastal mountains where the current resource marker is, I just am not aware of them, but the Kaiser mills and related mine were substantial in the WWII timeframe. In addition there was and is quite a bit of strategic mineral mining in the desert hexes to the northeast of Los Angeles (notably potash and cement), supporting the resource on that side of Los Angeles.


No, it's not too late. We had very little, if any, feedback from forum members about the USA west coast. By making use of the personal knowledge of individuals we make the game better.

Patrice is handling the details of map modifications, such as those you suggested.

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Post #: 268
RE: MWiF Map Review - America - 11/1/2006 6:57:29 PM   
SurrenderMonkey

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Here is what the Northwest of the USA looks like in MWiF, with the draft coastlines I drew.






Steve mentioned that there has been no feedback regarding the US West Coast, so - as a lifelong resident of the Pacific NW - I guess this is where I contribute a little:

1) The terrain north of Seattle towards Vancouver should not be clear. It is all forested, and there is only one major north-south highway which was built in the 50's under Eisenhower. The distance between the coast and the coastal mountain ranges is pretty narrow, too. So those hexes should be forests.

2) The Willamette Valley south of Portland apparently accounts for the clear hexes there. I can live with that as it is a huge valley. However, two hexes SE of Portland there is a clear terrain hex between two mountain hexes. That should be forest. It is the Medford-Roseburg region, and it is definitely heavily forested.

3) Two hexes east of Spokane there is a forest "passage" through the mountains. It should be mountains. It is called 4th of July pass and it is very high and rugged. There is an interstate highway there now, but it was built in the 50's as well. In the 40's, it is definitely mountains.

4) The huge Columbia River due west of Portland should run straight to the sea, rather than hooking NW to Grays Harbor and the Aberdeen inlet. There is some small room for debate about this, but given the location of Tacoma, there is no question. It should run due west to the sea.

Other than that, it looks good!


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Post #: 269
RE: MWiF Map Review - America - 11/1/2006 8:31:22 PM   
Froonp


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Thanks for the feedback ajds and monkey.
I'm considering it.

About NW USA, do you think that Vancouver and Victoria (I know they are in Canada, but you might know) should be in those types of hexes (Clear and forest). The WiF FE maps has them both as mountain hexes. Would mountain hexes be better ?

Also :
San Francisco is in a Forest hex on the WiF FE map, and in a clear hex in MWiF. What is best in your opinion ?
Los Angeles is in a Desert hex on the WiF FE map, and in a clear hex in MWiF. What is best in your opinion ?
Tacoma is in a Forest hex on the WiF FE map, and in a clear hex in MWiF. What is best in your opinion ?
Portland is in a Mountain hex on the WiF FE map, and in a clear hex in MWiF. What is best in your opinion ?

Also, a few weeks ago, Borger asked :

quote:

US Pacific ports between San Francisco and Seattle

I notice there are currently no US minor ports between San Franciso and Seattle. Is that true or have we forgotten some port that had any

importance during WW2? I can't find any suitable port, but maybe it's like this because there is no such port. I don't know.

What's your opinion with this ?

I am tempted to add Eureka, somewhere on the center west coast. Do you think it is a good idea ?

(in reply to SurrenderMonkey)
Post #: 270
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