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Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 12:25:06 AM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		RDAF Buffalo by yours truely.

Really, I'm just playing with my new camera.
-F-




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RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 12:31:48 AM   
Terminus


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Status: offline 		Nice job, on both the modeling and the pic.

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Post #: 2
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 2:20:47 AM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
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From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		Thanks!



-F-

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Post #: 3
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:46:38 AM   
TOMLABEL


Posts: 5116
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: Alabama - ROLL TIDE!!!!!
Status: offline 		Agreed...very nice!!!! Love the camo!

Is this Tamiya? If so, I have one in the pile that will be a CV2 bird.....eventually.................one day..........................I hope!

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RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 6:44:38 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
Status: offline 		I assume it's not the new 1/32 kit from Special Hobby.  That doesn't come with a pilot figure.  Somebody else came out with a new 1/48 Buffalo within the last couple of years, but I forget who.  Is this the old Tamiya kit?  I have a couple of those I plan to build one of these days.  For it's age, it's a nice kit.

The pilot looks like he's praying.

Nice job on the Buffalo.  It was an important milestone in naval aviation.  It was just obsolete by 1941.  (Brewster also wasn't top of the mark on production quality either.)

Bill


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RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 7:06:12 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
Joined: 3/18/2002
From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
Status: offline 		Buffalo is one of my favorite planes. The Finnish air force made very good use of them.

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Post #: 6
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 7:22:09 AM   
Yamato hugger

 

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Status: offline 		Looks to me like the pilot is praying

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Post #: 7
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 7:52:05 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Looks to me like the pilot is praying



If he is a Dutch pilot piloting a Buffalo he has good reason to pray.

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Post #: 8
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 12:41:52 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		"Dear God, please don't give me any missions until after May 1st..." 

Yes, I think it's the Taymia kit at 1/48.  I like Fujimi as well (or however you spell it).  I've got one of USS Hornet w/ the B-25s plodding along as well.  I actually don't care about the B-25s.  I might have to get a pack USN AC to fit out out.

Actually, I've filled up most of the my wife's china cabinet with 1/72 airplanes.  I had made it my goal to build all the AC of WW2O, for those that remember it (Hurri, Spit, Bf-109, Bf-100, Blen-IV, Stuka, He-111, Dew-520, H-35, et al).  But the boys (3 and 4 years old), have "played with them" occasionally, so they're often missing a landing gear or prop blad here and there (* shrug *).

-F-

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Post #: 9
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 12:54:07 PM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
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From: Near Portland, OR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

"Dear God, please don't give me any missions until after May 1st..."

Yes, I think it's the Taymia kit at 1/48. I like Fujimi as well (or however you spell it). I've got one of USS Hornet w/ the B-25s plodding along as well. I actually don't care about the B-25s. I might have to get a pack USN AC to fit out out.


The 1/700 scale kit? I believe that is a Fujimi kit. There were 4 Japanese kit makers who agreed to pool their resources to make most of the ships of the IJN in 1/700 scale rather than compete: Tamiya, Hasegawa, Aoshima, and Fujimi. They made some Allied and German ships too, the Hornet is one of them. Many of the Aoshima and Fujimi molds are getting old, but Tamiya and Hasegawa have been retooling their old kits. Tamiya also sort of broke the agreement and released a couple of subjects done by other kit makers including the Yamato class and Shokaku class.

quote:


Actually, I've filled up most of the my wife's china cabinet with 1/72 airplanes. I had made it my goal to build all the AC of WW2O, for those that remember it (Hurri, Spit, Bf-109, Bf-100, Blen-IV, Stuka, He-111, Dew-520, H-35, et al). But the boys (3 and 4 years old), have "played with them" occasionally, so they're often missing a landing gear or prop blad here and there (* shrug *).


Some of the more obscure aircraft are hard to find, even in 1/72 scale.

I have an unfortunate jones for larger kits. I have most of the 1/24 scale aircraft kits in existence. I also have a lot of 1/32 scale kits. I deal with the space issue by hanging them up. Can't do that with armor or ships though.

I like interior detail on a kit. It's the engineer in me. It's an interesting learning experience to build the kit and find out something new about how the original worked.

Bill

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Post #: 10
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 1:10:11 PM   
USSAmerica


Posts: 18715
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From: Graham, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Very nice work, Feinder! 

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Post #: 11
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 1:55:04 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4708
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		I still have around, probably now missing some pieces the 1/72 Buffalo from Matchbox.

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Post #: 12
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:30:48 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline
quote:

I deal with the space issue by hanging them up.


There's a "real" barber shop down the road from me.  Not SuperCuts.  But the kind with a barber pole and fat old men where buisness deals are struck.

The owner is USMC Korean War vet, and has a bunch of models suspended from the ceiling (including several of mine).

My boys like to go down there and point out which models Dad made.

-F-

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Post #: 13
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:35:10 PM   
Shark7


Posts: 7937
Joined: 7/24/2007
From: The Big Nowhere
Status: offline 		Of course you realize you've now encouraged me to build mine (still sitting in the box). Though I think I will mark it as a Singapore squadron.

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Post #: 14
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:44:42 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		Dutch... RAAF... RAF... USN...

They all look alike eventually...


-F-






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Post #: 15
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:47:01 PM   
Shark7


Posts: 7937
Joined: 7/24/2007
From: The Big Nowhere
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

Dutch... RAAF... RAF... USN...

They all look alike eventually...


-F-







Finland seemed to be able to put them to good use though. I suspect the planes they were facing weren't vastly superior to them as was the case in the Pacific.

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Post #: 16
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:47:02 PM   
stuman


Posts: 3907
Joined: 9/14/2008
From: Elvis' Hometown
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson


quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

"Dear God, please don't give me any missions until after May 1st..."

Yes, I think it's the Taymia kit at 1/48. I like Fujimi as well (or however you spell it). I've got one of USS Hornet w/ the B-25s plodding along as well. I actually don't care about the B-25s. I might have to get a pack USN AC to fit out out.


The 1/700 scale kit? I believe that is a Fujimi kit. There were 4 Japanese kit makers who agreed to pool their resources to make most of the ships of the IJN in 1/700 scale rather than compete: Tamiya, Hasegawa, Aoshima, and Fujimi. They made some Allied and German ships too, the Hornet is one of them. Many of the Aoshima and Fujimi molds are getting old, but Tamiya and Hasegawa have been retooling their old kits. Tamiya also sort of broke the agreement and released a couple of subjects done by other kit makers including the Yamato class and Shokaku class.

quote:


Actually, I've filled up most of the my wife's china cabinet with 1/72 airplanes. I had made it my goal to build all the AC of WW2O, for those that remember it (Hurri, Spit, Bf-109, Bf-100, Blen-IV, Stuka, He-111, Dew-520, H-35, et al). But the boys (3 and 4 years old), have "played with them" occasionally, so they're often missing a landing gear or prop blad here and there (* shrug *).


Some of the more obscure aircraft are hard to find, even in 1/72 scale.

I have an unfortunate jones for larger kits. I have most of the 1/24 scale aircraft kits in existence. I also have a lot of 1/32 scale kits. I deal with the space issue by hanging them up. Can't do that with armor or ships though.

I like interior detail on a kit. It's the engineer in me. It's an interesting learning experience to build the kit and find out something new about how the original worked.

Bill


At one point , years ago, I had an entire air fleet hanging from my ceiling. I had left a number of models I had built at my parents house. When my kids were old enough to wander around a bit by themselves, they found these. Not many survived their " curiosity "


< Message edited by stuman -- 6/25/2009 5:00:29 PM >

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Post #: 17
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 4:53:39 PM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline 		Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

RDAF Buffalo by yours truely.

Really, I'm just playing with my new camera.
-F-





1:72?

Very nice!


Leo "Apollo11"

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Post #: 18
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 7:07:49 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		No, the Buffalo is 1:48.  But I have a bunch of 1:72, because they don't take up much space.

-F-

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Post #: 19
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 7:54:56 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		very nice.



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Post #: 20
RE: Zero fodder - 6/25/2009 8:23:49 PM   
mdiehl

 

Posts: 5998
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline
quote:

RDAF Buffalo by yours truely.


Nicely done!


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Post #: 21
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 1:34:16 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7
Finland seemed to be able to put them to good use though. I suspect the planes they were facing weren't vastly superior to them as was the case in the Pacific.


Some Russian fighters gave the Me-109 and Fw-190 fits when in the right hands. The Sturmovik was also a tough nut to crack. The Rata was obsolete at war's start, but the next generation of Russian fighters was really fairly good, though maybe lacking in firepower and range.

The Finns were beating front line Russian fighters with fixed landing gear Fokkers. The Buffaloes were a step up.

The Finnish Buffaloes were flown by very good pilots up against some not so hot Russian pilots. The Dutch Buffaloes suffered from poor quality engines (they were recycled airliner engines that were a bit worn out), and the RAF Buffalo pilots at Singapore suffered from a British doctrine of dog fighting anything they encountered. The British in the Far East were slow to change tactics away from dogfighting to utilizing the other advantages of their fighters. The Finns were flexible in their tactics and adjusted them as needed.

In US service, the Buffalo only saw combat once, at Midway. The Buffaloes at Midway were flown by inexperienced pilots thrown into an ad hoc defense. They were outnumbered by highly experienced Japanese pilots.

As a result, the Finns were much more successful with the Buffalo than anyone else. The Buffalo had more maintenance problems than the Wildcat, and it was more expensive to build, but in performance, when maintained properly, it appears that it was on par with the Wildcat.

In the original fighter competition, the Buffalo beat out the Wildcat, though Grumman's initial Wildcat entry was a biplane. The Wildcat went on to gain an incredible reputation and the Buffalo was dumped in the dustbin of history due in part to the Buffalo's poor performance in the SRA, where it was not competently handled and hamstrung by bad engines (in the case of the Dutch). The USN was phasing out the Buffalo when the war started because the Wildcat was much easier to maintain and Grumman had fewer production problems than Brewster.

Brewster's management and production problems were so bad that the government took them over during the war and the company ceased to exist just after the war. The Buffalo wasn't the only problem aircraft Brewster produced.

In the 1938 build up program, the Navy ordered a back up torpedo bomber and back up dive bomber program to serve as a back stop if the TBF or SB2C program ran into trouble. Brewster won the contract for the SB2A Bermuda dive bomber. Even though the Helldiver ran into serious problems that delayed its entry into service (it and the Corsair should have been entering fleet service in June 1942 alongside the TBF), the Bermuda was so much worse it was never seriously considered.

After the Bermuda debacle, the Navy decided to give Brewster the contract to license build Corsairs. The F3A Corsair was so poorly built that none ever left the US. The entire production run was dedicated to training.

One F3A was pulled from a swamp somewhere in the South a few years ago and there are plans to rebuild it. Other than a few Buffaloes, I believe it is the only other surviving Brewster airframe.

The reputation the Buffalo had in the Navy may have been in part due to the known problems with Brewster Aircraft. They were the Yugo of American aircraft builders.

Bill

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Post #: 22
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 1:40:10 AM   
TOMLABEL


Posts: 5116
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From: Alabama - ROLL TIDE!!!!!
Status: offline 		Great information, Bill! Good info that I never knew.

Thank you very much!

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RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 2:00:25 AM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
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quote:

They were the Yugo of American aircraft builders.


An insult to the Yugo!!

As has been pointed out, it takes an exceptional weapons manufacturer to go broke during the biggest war in history...

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Post #: 24
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 2:39:44 AM   
YankeeAirRat


Posts: 633
Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		Remember that Brewester Aircraft Company started out as a carriage and leather makers back in the 1830's. They then expanded into car manufacturing producing copies of successful Delaunay-Belleville French cars. Then just before the start of WW1 they were the sales agents for Rolls-Royce in the US. They were importing and the repair company. Most of these cars were special orders from some of the richest people in the US. Such as JP Morgan, Vanderbilt, Astor, Rockefeller, Ford, Tiffany etc. Post WW1 Brewster lost the deal with Rolls and when then picked up a deal just after the Depression started where they were taking Ford V8 Engines and chassis and putting a Brewster body on it. They were selling well, but something turned in the '30's and the company went bankrupt and sold off at public auction in 1937. Meanwhile one of the other division outside of leather manufacturing/cars/carriages became the aicraft company. It was the only unit of the Brewester Company to maintain the Brewster name after the 1937 bankruptcy auction. However, the aircraft portion was just formed at the wrong time. It was founded in 1924 and begain to flounder in 1929 after the Depression started. According to most historians they believe the Navy contract for the F2A was the only thing keeping that company afloat. The board of Brewster Aircraft basically drove the company out of business because they weren't fully successful to adapt to what was going on in the economy.

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RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 3:18:46 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
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From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
Status: offline 		The Fins also made some changes to the aircraft itself. They coaxed 10-15 more HP out of the engine. They got rid of the pitiful armanent of one .50 cal MG and one .30 cal MG and went with four .50 cal MGs. They inverted the piston rings which greatly improved reliability. They gave it a gunsight that was accurate. They stripped off all the unnessacary parts which shaved off hundreds of Lbs. They added a armoured backseat for the pilot.

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Post #: 26
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 11:49:06 AM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4708
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		The best site about Finish Airforce with a lot about Buffalos:

http://www.sci.fi/~fta/BWtoFAF1.htm

quote:

On the same day the Italian test pilot Cugnasca had brought one more Fiat(G.50) from Göteborg. On the next day two more Fiats came from Göteborg. During the same day Winston flew a practice air combat against Karhunen in Brewsters. Later on the same day he flew against Cugnasca and in the fight the Brewster proved to be a little slower but more agile in the close combat.

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Post #: 27
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 1:12:07 PM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
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From: Near Portland, OR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

The Fins also made some changes to the aircraft itself. They coaxed 10-15 more HP out of the engine. They got rid of the pitiful armanent of one .50 cal MG and one .30 cal MG and went with four .50 cal MGs. They inverted the piston rings which greatly improved reliability. They gave it a gunsight that was accurate. They stripped off all the unnessacary parts which shaved off hundreds of Lbs. They added a armoured backseat for the pilot.


Actually the Finnish Buffaloes came with 1 .30 caliber and 3X .50 calibers. The engine was also down rated from what the navy had, so adding 15 hp was still leaving them with less power than the Navy Buffaloes.

This details all the Buffalo versions: http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/f2a.html

Bill

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Post #: 28
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 1:39:41 PM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

The Fins also made some changes to the aircraft itself. They coaxed 10-15 more HP out of the engine. They got rid of the pitiful armanent of one .50 cal MG and one .30 cal MG and went with four .50 cal MGs. They inverted the piston rings which greatly improved reliability. They gave it a gunsight that was accurate. They stripped off all the unnessacary parts which shaved off hundreds of Lbs. They added a armoured backseat for the pilot.


Actually the Finnish Buffaloes came with 1 .30 caliber and 3X .50 calibers. The engine was also down rated from what the navy had, so adding 15 hp was still leaving them with less power than the Navy Buffaloes.

This details all the Buffalo versions: http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/f2a.html

Bill



how much sense makes it to couple one cal.30 with three cal.50?


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Post #: 29
RE: Zero fodder - 6/26/2009 1:56:26 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		It probably had something to do with weight.  I don't actually the actual reason for whatever configuration they were using.  But usually, it's about weight.

-F-

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Post #: 30
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