RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale

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RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 3:48:22 PM

Bartje

Posts: 308
Joined: 4/27/2010
From: Netherlands
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You clone because there is room for growth and a nessicity to populate all those new and empty planets.

You don't want others to overrun those nice empty planets do you?

Its quite efficient for space agers to clone pop instead of relying on natural growth cycles.

Why bother with parents at all if you clone educated adults just like that??

Just how this works in the DW universe hasn't been filled in by the developers unfortunately

(in reply to Krelos)

Post #: 31

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 4:26:37 PM

Krelos

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Joined: 4/10/2010
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The only perspective that makes sense from is the perspective of a person playing a game. People don't think about real life like that.

Besides, human society would never allow cloning like that to take place. If it did it would cease to be a human society.
As soon as humans are totally dispensable and replaceable they become also totally worthless, making them nothing more than smart cows.
As soon as people no longer have parents, they no longer have people who truly care about them. This combined with being completely replaceable in every way makes them totally worthless on a personal level.

Cloning as you described would end human society and collapse it's civilization.

(in reply to Bartje)

Post #: 32

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 4:45:04 PM

Bartje

Posts: 308
Joined: 4/27/2010
From: Netherlands
Status: offline

Why would it lead to society's collapse? (I do agree it may be confusing if they look exactly alike!

)

Individual Value:

It does not diminish an invdividual's value. (it may be perceived as lowering an individual value relative to other individuals but the clone & original are still unique; this is an illusion. They would be worth exactly what other non clones are worth; that is they are beyond valueing because they are unique. In other words, they are still economically scarce.)

A clone and the original are not the same person.

They are not identical. They are alike in every (relevant) aspect that we can visually observe But not identical.

A clone may develop into a genius with novel ideas and scientific applications while the original may be a depressed and deeply troubled individual.

Cloning does not replace an original creature, it shapes something else into a close likeness of the original. They are by no means identical.

Nothing can be in the same place at the same time right? By virtue of this natural law we may reason that there for nothing is identical and that everything is unique. This leads to the conclusion that everything, including life is scarce by simply existing in one form or another.

Following this line of reasoning cloning in this form could make perfect sense.

At the very least it could be controversial

This could net DW some nice media attention

Still it would be a very effective way to create more people; far faster than traditional reproduction.

Plus it would keep women in the workforce and out of pregnency leave!

It really makes sense.

Besides; who says you won't somwhat randomize the genetic profile of the clone?

To return to your argument of society's collapse:

1 - A healthy society would make the distinction between individual potential & scarcity as opposed to the collective good. (the will of the group & its leaders)

2 - An unhealthy society would rule in favor of the collective good and against individual freedom (thus limiting individual potential & expression for the good of the group & its leaders)

In the second example it would indeed be far easier to use human beings as "cows" but that does not mean that it is the "right" or successfull model.

A healthy society would be far more vibrant, adaptive and "natural" than example 2.

In example 1, even if the individuals are clones they are still capable of developing and expressing freely and thus driving culture as well as technological progress.

Example 2 would inhibit this.

The only "society" that would succesfully implement model 2 is a bug society in which the individual does not exist and has no "potential" anyway.

In such a group the individual is merely an extension of the hive. The only invidual in such a society in essence would be the "hive mind".

This would be very nice to see in DW.

There is certainly a logical foundation for it!

In short: I logically cannot conclude that there is anything against cloning.

From a religious perspective I understand such a step would be drastic and perhaps disagreeable. (I am not religious this way though)

From a functional / moral & logical view I would vehemently support this because it is the rational thing to do.

What do we call people who hold faith over fact?

We usually call them insane and put them in institutions to "heal".

Other times we call them religous and let them try to convert others.

I cannot help but wonder what perspective the developers have on this.

Erik or Elliot, if you read this by chance would you please comment

Anyone else?

< Message edited by Bartje -- 5/17/2010 5:15:17 PM >

(in reply to Krelos)

Post #: 33

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 7:05:48 PM

Dadekster

Posts: 141
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

I thought Star Wars handled the whole cloning issue very well and find it to be believable. Many people have issues with cloning on several levels including religious and as self worth. As a species though we are alone, our perspective may change when and if we ever come into contact with another sentinet species. What do you think humans would think of a sentinent insectiod type species that may eat its own progeny in times of famine for example?

Oh...and thread successful derailed, we're awesome!

< Message edited by Dadekster -- 5/17/2010 7:06:52 PM >

(in reply to Bartje)

Post #: 34

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 9:40:35 PM

Bartje

Posts: 308
Joined: 4/27/2010
From: Netherlands
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I rest my case

(in reply to Dadekster)

Post #: 35

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/17/2010 9:50:28 PM

Jaimoe_MatrixForum

Posts: 59
Joined: 2/25/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Krelos

As soon as people no longer have parents, they no longer have people who truly care about them.

The Government will still love you!

(in reply to Krelos)

Post #: 36

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/18/2010 1:32:54 PM

Bartje

Posts: 308
Joined: 4/27/2010
From: Netherlands
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And your friends! Your Girl friend!

(in reply to Jaimoe_MatrixForum)

Post #: 37

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/18/2010 1:53:42 PM

RViener

Posts: 123
Joined: 7/8/2004
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Erik, I'm following the varius threads on potential bug fixes and improvements but I would most appreciate a list of your plans for improvement/fixes.

(in reply to Bartje)

Post #: 38

RE: Minor Request: Fix the Time Scale - 5/19/2010 1:57:18 PM

Stardog

Posts: 93
Joined: 1/17/2006
From: Hickory N.C.
Status: offline

Sup Guy's!!

To J SCOTT

I like that idea also.

Maybe there could be a slider or box check for stanard time or slowed time frame/rate.. ?

The game does seem to go a little fast. I never play at normal speed .
I play on 0.50X most of the time ,sometime's 0.25X when in late game.

WM

< Message edited by Stardog -- 5/19/2010 2:02:28 PM >

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(in reply to Krelos)

Post #: 39