RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light"

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/8/2010 7:49:43 PM

PipFromSlitherine

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To put it in perspective, I built something similar to what you are talking about (actually a kind of survival scenario with Axis troops spawning in) in about an hour including testing and rebalancing (although I did use an existing MP map - I'm a programmer not a prettifier dammit!). So doing the kind of thing you're talking about it not hard at all.

I'm suprised there aren't any YouTube gameplay vids up yet - maybe people are too busy playing :)

Cheers

Pip

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Post #: 31

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/8/2010 8:36:15 PM

Pford

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PipFromSlitherine
I'm suprised there aren't any YouTube gameplay vids up yet - maybe people are too busy playing :)

Because the game makes you unlock the scenarios one by one? This may be inhibiting the MP activity as well.

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Post #: 32

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/8/2010 9:07:01 PM

IainMcNeil

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Deleted - didn't see Phil's reply :)

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Post #: 33

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/8/2010 10:08:37 PM

PipFromSlitherine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545

Looks like about 3-4 miles square which is plenty big for this scale imo.�

It would probably help, if a demo is unavailable, to make the manual available, maybe online in a way that can't be copied.� Something like that to get a feel for the game.�

Or maybe a couple dozen more screenies of the maps and units along with some description of how the ui works.� Like moving and firing etc.

And to repeat my previous question.....
How easy is the scripting?� Could I take a map from one of the scenarios, add random forces, and borrow a script from one of the scenarios or modify one to make an unpredictable scenario?� If so, how easy would this be?

Sorry for all the particular questions but this game looks worthwhile enough to ask them.� No gamebreakers for me yet.�

Just to check, you might want to check out the fairly in-depth (with lots of screens) AAR posted on the Slitherine forum if you haven't already.

http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18092

Cheers

Pip

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Post #: 34

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 3:13:08 AM

rich12545

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Yeah, that was very interesting. And brings up a couple more questions.

I enjoy playing infantry more than tanks. It was hard to tell this from the pix. Is infantry capable of entering buildings? Going to the second floor? Can infantry urban warfare be played satisfactorily?

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Post #: 35

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 3:25:51 AM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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Infantry can not only enter buildings, they actually are quite dangerous to armour FROM them. Tanks need covering infantry to actually root out enemy troops.

Regarding vertical movement, not sure that can be done, but then I would not be in a position to answer that.

Buildings, fortifications, various forms of prepared positions, rough ground woods. All very infantry friendly. Driving your vehicles around whilly nilly is not wise.

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 3:36:04 AM

vonRocko

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Infantry can be dangerous, but the battles are all about tanks. Last player with tanks should win.

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Post #: 37

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 3:47:44 AM

rich12545

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So is it pretty easy to take out the tanks and add infantry in the editor? Easy to make an all infantry scenario that way?

And is terrain/buildings destructible?

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Post #: 38

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 4:14:59 AM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vonRocko

Infantry can be dangerous, but the battles are all about tanks. Last player with tanks should win.

Thing is, vehicles can't take objectives they can't drive into.

You might end up with no way to root out a win all because you couldn't claim it.

It just takes one troop with artillery support dropping grief on your armour. And if the armour can't find that troop, it's pretty well outta luck.

You can't win without keeping both alive.

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 9:23:03 AM

Obsolete

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quote:

Tanks need covering infantry to actually root out enemy troops.

That isn't quite correct. You can still kill or cause infantry to surrender with just tanks alone, even if they are in cover terrain.

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 1:51:35 PM

Great_Ajax

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I had two StuGs in the Bocage scenario move to nice little attack spots and they did not fire at all during my turn. During my opponent's turn, four Shermans showed up, popped off two rounds a piece and destroyed one of the StuGs. The StuGs never engaged with any Opfire. When it was my turn, I targeted one of the Shermans with my remaining StuG and it only had a 3% chance of a kill. In this game, I have never seen any of StuGs engage in Opfire against enemy tanks. I have seen my other tanks engage and my StuGs did fire upon enemy infantry at close range. The StuGs seems quite helpless against enemy armor and that seemed strange to me.

Trey

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Post #: 41

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/9/2010 2:44:06 PM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Obsolete

quote:

Tanks need covering infantry to actually root out enemy troops.

That isn't quite correct.� You can still kill or cause infantry to surrender with just tanks alone, even if they are in cover terrain.

I won a game, where I had NO infantry, but the objectives belonged to me last and the remaining tank couldn't take them, so I just dropped 10 tons of hell on the tank, eventually blew it up, and scored the win with my bren carrier (which of course wisely avoided the tank.

1 lousy enemy infantry unit would have defeated me.

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Post #: 42

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/10/2010 2:16:22 AM

jomni

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quote:

ORIGINAL: el hefe

I had two StuGs in the Bocage scenario move to nice little attack spots and they did not fire at all during my turn. During my opponent's turn, four Shermans showed up, popped off two rounds a piece and destroyed one of the StuGs. The StuGs never engaged with any Opfire. When it was my turn, I targeted one of the Shermans with my remaining StuG and it only had a 3% chance of a kill. In this game, I have never seen any of StuGs engage in Opfire against enemy tanks. I have seen my other tanks engage and my StuGs did fire upon enemy infantry at close range. The StuGs seems quite helpless against enemy armor and that seemed strange to me.

Trey

I think the opfire logic also checks the chance to kill before firing. So in your case, they'd rather not fire since there is low chance to kill.

Maybe the StuG in the game is primarily anti-infantry as they are initially designed that way historically. The tank destroyer role came secondary but it eventually proved itself to be good at it in the Eastern Front through superior tactics.

< Message edited by jomni -- 8/10/2010 2:19:46 AM >

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Post #: 43

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/10/2010 10:09:40 PM

Great_Ajax

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These are long barreled StuGs in Normandy with the same cannon as the Pz-IVH. They should be just as capable as my normal tanks in engaging armor. One StuG, with full Opfire remaining, stood by and watched as an adjacent Panther was engaged and destroyed by a Sherman and the StuG never fired a shot.

Trey

quote:

ORIGINAL: jomni

quote:

ORIGINAL: el hefe

I had two StuGs in the Bocage scenario move to nice little attack spots and they did not fire at all during my turn. During my opponent's turn, four Shermans showed up, popped off two rounds a piece and destroyed one of the StuGs. The StuGs never engaged with any Opfire. When it was my turn, I targeted one of the Shermans with my remaining StuG and it only had a 3% chance of a kill. In this game, I have never seen any of StuGs engage in Opfire against enemy tanks. I have seen my other tanks engage and my StuGs did fire upon enemy infantry at close range. The StuGs seems quite helpless against enemy armor and that seemed strange to me.

Trey

I think the opfire logic also checks the chance to kill before firing. So in your case, they'd rather not fire since there is low chance to kill.

Maybe the StuG in the game is primarily anti-infantry as they are initially designed that way historically. The tank destroyer role came secondary but it eventually proved itself to be good at it in the Eastern Front through superior tactics.

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Post #: 44

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/10/2010 11:16:59 PM

Lukas

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I must admit I never got the chance to try MP - and thus actualy controlling StuGs - but I always found them to be quite lethal in singleplayer.

Maybe there is something wrong with the opfire chance calculation, because the unit seems powerful enough.

How do you feel they perform in your own turn?

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/10/2010 11:37:59 PM

Great_Ajax

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I tried using them to engage the Shermans and all I could manage was a 3% chance for a kill. I finally had a StuG do an Opfire shot when an enemy Sherman got within three squares. I couldn't manage a single kill with the StuGs. I need to play this scenario again with this knowledge and see if I can do any better.

Trey

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lukas

I must admit I never got the chance to try MP - and thus actualy controlling StuGs - but I always found them to be quite lethal in singleplayer.

Maybe there is something wrong with the opfire chance calculation, because the unit seems powerful enough.

How do you feel they perform in your own turn?

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Post #: 46

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/10/2010 11:47:19 PM

Great_Ajax

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Okay, this Opfire business needs to be seriously looked at. My veteran Tiger just got attacked by at least five American tanks who took pot shots and them shuffled off to hide without a single Opfire from my Tiger. A US infantry squad moves out from a building at least six squares away and the Tiger decides to open fire on that infantry unit alone.

I also want to qualify my criticisms here that I am really enjoying this game overall. I have been waiting for a good turn based tactical game for awhile and this is fitting in nicely. I plan on digging into the scenario creation here soon. Keep up the good work guys.

Trey

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Post #: 47

RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/11/2010 12:28:57 AM

Obsolete

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I have never seen Op-Fire work perfect in any game. Even in the best of war-games, it's open to exploitation and other problems. This is one reason I would always avoid this type of game mechanic when writing a wargame from the ground up. I guess some people want it, but then you have to realize there will be many cases where you won't be happy with how the results are auto-handled.

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/11/2010 1:29:40 AM

sabre1

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Opfire works pretty well in JTCS.

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RE: The truth about Steel Panthers "Light" - 8/11/2010 9:46:29 PM

IainMcNeil

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Stugs are tank destroyers. They have not turret and are not designed to move and fire. If you moved fast which I assume you did to get a 3% chance ot kill this is why they got chewed up. Stugs will take out Shermans head on all factors being equal.

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