Unit surrender

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Unit surrender - 7/25/2011 12:29:06 PM

PirateJock

Posts: 465
Joined: 9/14/2006
From: North West, UK
Status: offline

At the moment the only way for a unit to surrender is if it's a 'Rabble'. From Manual, page 41...

quote:

Whenever a unit designated as �Rabble� is adjacent to an enemy unit at the end of an enemy Movement Phase, the Rabble unit takes a Quality Check. If it passes (by rolling less than or equal to its Quality rating), there is no effect. If it fails (by rolling greater than its Quality rating), the unit Surrenders and is eliminated.

The rabble option is set by the scenario designer.

Now I've had many, many, many occasions where units are at Disruption Level 4, do not withdraw (even with the new patch) and sit there and continue sitting there, occupying the hex and preventing the opportunity for an advance, even though in subsequent turns they are still being disrupted or might lose a hit.

It looks as if once a unit is at D4 it can't be removed from the game until it's lost all its hits as well. Any further disruption has no effect at all.

I've been thinking it could help the game flow if these D4 units, if they took further disruption, should either surrender OR at least take a guaranteed hit.

What do people think?

I know the unit isn't pinning any units but there are plenty of situations where you can't move around it anyway ... you want to get into the hex the unit is sitting in to push forward.

Post #: 1

RE: Unit surrender - 7/25/2011 11:07:52 PM

Fred98

Posts: 4430
Joined: 1/5/2001
From: Wollondilly, Sydney
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PirateJock

.....where units are at Disruption Level 4, do not withdraw (even with the new patch) and sit there and continue sitting there, occupying the hex and preventing the opportunity for an advance, even though in subsequent turns they are still being disrupted or might lose a hit.

I've been thinking it could help the game flow if these D4 units, if they took further disruption, should either surrender OR at least take a guaranteed hit.

Yes I agree.

Currently an advance can be totally stopped.
-

(in reply to PirateJock)

Post #: 2

RE: Unit surrender - 7/26/2011 7:22:44 AM

sabre1

Posts: 1928
Joined: 8/15/2001
From: CA
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No I don't agree...

(in reply to Fred98)

Post #: 3

RE: Unit surrender - 7/26/2011 7:23:29 AM

sabre1

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Joined: 8/15/2001
From: CA
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Of course I agree, if I'm the one doing the disrupting.

(in reply to sabre1)

Post #: 4

RE: Unit surrender - 7/30/2011 12:51:21 AM

Obsolete

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Joined: 9/4/2007
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Well I don't agree if I'm doing the defending.

Hitting a unit like that is as good as it gets. If your boys are such terrible shots that they are having a bit of trouble finishing them off, then I'd like to think that's the problem with your boys, and the defender shouldn't just raise their heads and commit suicide in the face of the enemy.

What I think.. .is down the road in say, Combat Command III, I'd like to see an extra moral system implemented, then perhaps we can examine something like that. Maybe a moral/fatigue hybrid.

I have seen it mentioned a long time ago, that the counters in CC can be moved non-stop through day and night for 72 hours, and if they are not shot-up, they can still fight as though they just woke up from a good night's rest. Granted, that does seem a little wrong, and I think PUSHING a unit too hard should have a bit of... a negative effect.

There is a bit of an abstraction here, with night time travel causing extra disruptions, etc. but I'm not sure that cuts it.

_____________________________

King-Tigers don't let Tiger-I's get over-run.

(in reply to sabre1)

Post #: 5

RE: Unit surrender - 8/8/2011 12:53:39 PM

PirateJock

Posts: 465
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From: North West, UK
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I am right in thinking that a unit at Disruption Level 4 will NOT take any further disruption from Quality Checks etc?

Cheers

(in reply to Obsolete)

Post #: 6

RE: Unit surrender - 8/9/2011 6:56:28 AM

Obsolete

Posts: 1492
Joined: 9/4/2007
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I believe you are correct, since level 4 is the highest you can get. Though it's possible it does checks but these are ignored?

I never remember taking a look at that in detail, since it isn't something that matters, and there isn't really much you can do with a unit that badly disorganized anyhow. If you're out of E-ZoC, switch to Tac posture and hope for the best :p

_____________________________

King-Tigers don't let Tiger-I's get over-run.

(in reply to PirateJock)

Post #: 7

RE: Unit surrender - 8/9/2011 1:31:41 PM

PirateJock

Posts: 465
Joined: 9/14/2006
From: North West, UK
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It's quite likely that you can have a unit at D4 that's taken no hits. So to destroy it could still take a further 3 turns! A lot can happen in 3 turns - reinforcements etc.

Of course, it should have done an automatic withdrawal before then and got out of the way. Hopefully the v1.03 patch will address this.

But having said that it still doesn't feel quite right that, in situations where a D4 unit doesn't withdraw and it takes further disruption, there is no consequence.

Cheers

(in reply to Obsolete)

Post #: 8

RE: Unit surrender - 8/10/2011 2:50:36 AM

Rosseau

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To preface this, I don't know squat, but...at D4 with no losses, shouldn't further disruption result in one-step loss automatically?

(in reply to PirateJock)

Post #: 9

RE: Unit surrender - 8/15/2011 8:21:43 AM

Obsolete

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Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

But having said that it still doesn't feel quite right that, in situations where a D4 unit doesn't withdraw and it takes further disruption, there is no consequence.

Yes, I had been thinking on that for a while as well. However, at least the D4 unit can't really retaliate firepower.

Time for more editor testing though...

_____________________________

King-Tigers don't let Tiger-I's get over-run.

(in reply to Rosseau)

Post #: 10