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RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 5:04:38 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Thanks for the post Alfred.  Believe it or not I have actually read that thread.  I do have Engs present and they are building.  Just hasn't reached fort 1 yet.  Is their a way to calculate adjusted AV from unadjusted AV?

6th Oct

KB out of search range
MKB unknown
NCV unknown

Sian
Got plastered again.  Runway still closed down and will prob remain closed.

Nanyang
Jap units marched into the base today.  Our units will march out tomorrow before they attack.

Marshall Islands
BB TF heading east towards Wotje.  All AC that can be moved has been.  Base is locked down awaiting the BBs.  subs have been repositioned.

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 781
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 5:10:34 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		I would be curious if anything besides supply and terrain effect AV with leaders being "dice modifiers". If that makes sense. I never got aircraft into Sian, the supply being somewhat mysterious to TWIT HQ in China. I did withdraw much of the Red Army through it to Chungking where I have been able to reconstitute them and 20th AG. I'd like to see your China situation with the hex ownership turned on. I'm struggling to find a plan maybe we could offer mutual support.

Sincerely,
CnC TWIT HQ
Zulu

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 782
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 5:24:57 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Screenie China Sian




Attachment (1)

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 783
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 6:30:56 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

Thanks for the post Alfred.  Believe it or not I have actually read that thread.  I do have Engs present and they are building.  Just hasn't reached fort 1 yet.  Is their a way to calculate adjusted AV from unadjusted AV?



Not sure I quite understand what you mean about calculating AV.

Have a look at post #677 in zuluhours AAR and see if that answers your question. If it doesn't could you explain exactly what it is you want to do.

Always remember that what is really important is firepower, not unadjusted AV, See my post in Canoerebel's AAR yesterday regarding this finesse.

Alfred

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 784
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 6:37:45 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: zuluhour

I would be curious if anything besides supply and terrain effect AV with leaders being "dice modifiers". If that makes sense. I never got aircraft into Sian, the supply being somewhat mysterious to TWIT HQ in China. I did withdraw much of the Red Army through it to Chungking where I have been able to reconstitute them and 20th AG. I'd like to see your China situation with the hex ownership turned on. I'm struggling to find a plan maybe we could offer mutual support.

Sincerely,
CnC TWIT HQ
Zulu


Fortifications is also important (ah did I include that in post #677 of your AAR?). Of course number of disabled/ready devices (which includes infantry squads) is also, ahem, basic too. A disabled device gives no AV but does once it is ready.

Yes, leaders are, as you term them, "dice modifiers" which occurs behind the scenes as does the impact of firepower. Which is why players so easily forget that firepower is what is really important because they do not see the battle effect nor even know the algorithmns. Other "dice modifiers" are disruption, morale, fatigue, and the combat bonus contribution from HQs.

Alfred

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 785
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 6:41:21 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

Screenie China Sian





You might want to peek at the movement paths some of your LCUs show. Based on the screenshot, you have several units not moving in the most efficacious direction.

Alfred

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 786
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 6:56:01 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		I have just reviewed that post in my AAR (recorded to sticky for future Alfred 101 adenda) and was shocked at what I found in China. What I had assumed was a strong defense in several areas is actually quite susceptible to a concentrated effort by the IJA. I am now considering a more defense in depth to allow time to respond with reserves. Alfred, I hope at some point you post the locations (all in one place ) of your 101 places. Joe, I am looking over your China theater.

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 787
RE: I'm Back - 8/5/2012 8:52:05 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Alfred: I forgot the thank you for taking the time to post and answer my questions.  I am always appreciative and delighted to see that you have stopped by.  That goes for you Kurt and the others.  Also I like when Alfred posts my hit count goes up.    Sorry for not conveying my thoughts appropriatly Alfred.  Ok so if firepower is the key.  What is firepower in the game?    With the unit movements most of those are moving only one hexs.

Kurt:  I don't think I have done very well in China now.  I got complacent.  Now I am paying for it.  Hopefully I will learn from it and can do better on my next game.

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 788
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 1:34:42 AM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		OK checking China out closely, The most unfortunate situation to me is up north at Paulow. He looks to have something less than a division, judging by the shading but now has westward access to exploit. If he exploits north it could FUBAR air reinforcements which will become available to you up there. I'm not sure how it will effect them. I'd (I stress "I") would leave the force in place there to the west to threaten his supply line for awhile to see what he has in mind. As its a really long walk west from there you should have time to send a small army group (perhaps Mao's boys) and establish a river defense in the rough 100 miles to the east of Lanchow with an engineer unit. At Yenan why not try and force him to make an assault accross the Yellow river? The unit accross the Yellow River from Yenan could do another wait and see. If he tries to cross with all his units there (looks like a division) cut him off. If he tries to ford with less you may get some "holy" rolls when he shock attacks. Make sure you replace Corp COs with good ground skills behind the rivers. I did this early in China (fortunately as you know my PP situation) very cheaply. I also replaced the AG COs with the best I could find. They to are cheaply bought. Sian looks more difficult but you do have the Yangtze River and some nice rough to the south east. You have one of the few paved roads there, don't panic. I like rear guards in the rough, at least it will make him deploy if hes in "blitz" mode. I'm not sure you will be able to do this in your situation, but I was able to pull supply into Chungking and rebuild the 11th Army group (except two trapped divisions in Burma, which rebuilt very quickly in Dehli) and it became my fire brigade with 20th AG after the Kukong battles.

2 cent from HQ TWIT

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 789
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 5:52:51 AM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		New screenie kinda busy. Over 7k worth of AV in this area.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 790
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 8:27:45 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		7th Oct

KB NW Roi Namur
MKB unknown

Nanyang
Jap capture it.  Koniu was kinda mad after he sat thru the long attack replay to find out no troops were there.  4 ID's 3 Art  units and 2 armys were present in the attack.  The units that were crossing the river have stopped and are now moving in a different direction.  This should give me some time to prepare my defenses.

Marshall Islands
Massive sweeps over Maloelap and Wotje.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 791
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 8:49:59 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Your in a good chess game now. I can't see the AV clearly (I'm color blind to fair extent) but I would make him stop and fight in the jungle rough NW of Nanyang. At least make him deploy and give you more time. I just noticed your supply situation does not look bad that will help. I think that 900AV (?) SE of Xian could take some wind out of his sails and maybe give him a damn good bloody nose. Have you reviewed your COs?

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 792
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 9:07:26 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Im going to fight in the wooded hexs south of Sian.  Supply is ok.   Almost 3k is out of position but I am moving them into the area.  I hate giving up ground and bases for free.  That is what put me into this position.  CO's yes I have started to change some of them.  Don't have many good ones.  If he wants to reach Sian from the Nanyang or thru the woods ok so be it.  I will make him pay for it.

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 793
RE: I'm Back - 8/6/2012 9:19:11 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Two areas worry me.  China is one the other is Marshall Islands.

Marshall Islands
I see that 2 ID's are heading towards Turk.  No prepping intel yet.  I would say they are going to go to the Marshalls.  I am going to put some more mines at Wotje and more subs in the area.  I can't get past his fighters or the KB.  The only thing I can think of is to make some landing and force him to pull out some fighters.

I am prepping for PM, Milne Bay, Tagula Island, Koepang and others.  I want to hit Milne and Tagula first then hit PM.  I think this will catch his attention.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 794
Op Shoestring - 8/7/2012 4:34:46 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Operation Shoestring

This is an amphib operation to Koepang and Roti.  The objectives of this mission are to: 1.  Start to take back parts of DEI.  2.  Establish an AF within striking distance of several Jap bases.  3.  Force the Japanesse to pull in fighters from other areas.

Koepang did have 3 Bde's guarding it.  I will have to do some recon to see what he has at Koepang and at Roti.  I believe this will draw Koniu's attention.  4E's will be able to strike several oil producing bases and 2 of his major AFs in the area.  Location is also good because most of his fighters will be stationed around 10 or more hexs away.  Those that he has.  I have only seen 2 fighter squadrons recently. 

Koniu is a smart man.  He will probably know what the real Opearation Shoestring was.  I am playing on that to see if he moves towards the Canal area.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 795
RE: Op Shoestring - 8/8/2012 3:37:26 AM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Ahhh. The soft underbelly of Japan. I like the deception, definately lose that with the AI. The DEI is a great place to threaten, as the Japanese player can't ignor the threat to his lifeblood.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 796
RE: Op Shoestring - 8/8/2012 11:28:09 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		8th Oct

KB Marshall Islands
MKB unknown

Marshall islands
US sub duds on a CA.

Paoshan
We bomb a Jap IR.

Saumlaki
We bomb the AF at night for little damage.  A bunch of ships are present.  I will sweep with P38s and Wildcats and send in the bombers with escorts.

Norm you are right.  I also think its kinda soft right now.  Koniu will have to pull in alot of fighters to protect his interests in this area.  I'm gathering up forces and seeing what all I will need to keep Koepang in my hands.  More later on Op Shoestring.

(in reply to NormS3)
Post #: 797
RE: Op Shoestring - 8/9/2012 3:35:16 AM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Good show.

In your deception department, have you used some of the west coast restricted units ? I've seen others like Canorebel set them to plan for different "false" objectives as part of their deception campaigns.

I notice that you have divided your subs into divisions do you do this by putting them into different hqs? Or do you just label them with the task force discriptor?

Keep up the good game!

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 798
RE: Op Shoestring - 8/9/2012 9:24:38 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		9th Oct

KB Moving towards Truk
MKB unknown

China
I bomb some he bombs some.  He is still chaseing me up around Sian.

Saumlaki
Wildcats shot down 4 A6m3a's and lose only 2 of their own.  No ships to bomb.

Got intel the 28th ID is prepping for Wotje.  They are also heading to Truk.  I am moving in more subs and placing more mines around Wotje.  SBD's will be moved to Johnson Island to wait for the invasion.  I have a SAG raiding off the coast of Japan, I am moving them south to see if I can hit one of the troop convoys.

I made a mistake and forgot to turn off upgrades to my CVs.  I disbanded them to fix some sys damage, now they are upgradeing for 20 days.  Great job. 

Wotje has 2 forts with 125 AV.  My only hope is to damage the troop convoys.

Norm, Thanks for following and posting.  No false objectives on my part Koniu is using them.  I wish I could say that I was doing something cool as putting subs in different Hq's and stuff.  I just pick a sub and send it somewhere.  If they go to one area I put them at one base so I do know the area they were patroling in.

(in reply to NormS3)
Post #: 799
Questions for you guys. - 8/10/2012 1:36:08 AM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		I am going to fly in a US Army INF Bn from Wake.  40 AV plus the 125 thats already at Wotje.  We have 2 forts with full supply.  Alfred: the post in Zulus AAR about modifiers to unadjusted AV.  I know you get 1 for full supply and 1.25x for fort lv 2.  So do you add all that together ie; 125 plus supply modifier = 250 unadjusted AV?  Then add the fort modifier onto that or what. 

Also I have a few CD guns disabled at Wotje.  Full supply with plenty of support, will changing my CO help repair them?  If so what traits do I need to look for?  Yes I am needy today. 

I also changed the CO for my Inf Rgt to a better land skill.  Really he was better in all skills.  In a few days I will have over 100 mines in 5 different mine fields plus and ACM.  I will also try and withdraw fragments out of Wotje's garrisons.  Yes I know I can buy them back, but I think its easier to just rebuild and quicker.  I might try to get a Raider Bn up here also.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 800
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/10/2012 9:25:28 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		10th Oct

KB unknown
MKB unknown

China
Bombings and troop movement.  Fighters and 2E bombers are being moved in for a raid.  Not for sure if I want to go after his AF or after some troops.  AF has 123 fighters present.

Koepang
We close the runway with 4Es.  Ground attack is ordered for tomorrow.  More troops are being sent to Oz for Op Shoestring.

Ambon
S boat sinks an xAKL.

Truk
Sub misses an xAK in his troop convoy.  14 xAKs 2 xAPs escorted by 5 DDs is reported.  Our SAG was a few days to late.  It has spotted a 2 ship TF and will move to intercept tonite.

Wotje
I changed the CO of the CD unit and and one gun has been repaired.  I decided to try and get a TD Bn into here.  Lets hope it happens.


(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 801
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/10/2012 9:46:33 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Pretty cool you have soomething to raid with in China. I finally have a fighter group (trained to) and a bomber squadron there after about a year of complete dominance by the IJAF. The bomber squadron won't fly, CO is a ****. The fighter group is not worth risking to attrition without a goal. I'm thinking B29 base in the late spring.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 802
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/10/2012 9:48:26 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		I would guess 165x1.25=206.25 x terrain.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 803
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/10/2012 10:18:22 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Kurt
Not all of the bomber and fighter sqds in China are Chinese.  But I do have some good ones.  I have been training them since day one.  I have found that buying them out is a pretty good idea.  I have one Chinese ace several that are close to it.  One sqd has 60 -70 exp with air 67 above and the same for defense.  Lancers have been good to me.   I got good bomber pilots too but 2 bad raids and your bombers are gone.

(in reply to zuluhour)
Post #: 804
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/11/2012 1:11:26 AM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

I am going to fly in a US Army INF Bn from Wake.  40 AV plus the 125 thats already at Wotje.  We have 2 forts with full supply.  Alfred: the post in Zulus AAR about modifiers to unadjusted AV.  I know you get 1 for full supply and 1.25x for fort lv 2.  So do you add all that together ie; 125 plus supply modifier = 250 unadjusted AV?  Then add the fort modifier onto that or what. 

Also I have a few CD guns disabled at Wotje.  Full supply with plenty of support, will changing my CO help repair them?  If so what traits do I need to look for?  Yes I am needy today. 

I also changed the CO for my Inf Rgt to a better land skill.  Really he was better in all skills.  In a few days I will have over 100 mines in 5 different mine fields plus and ACM.  I will also try and withdraw fragments out of Wotje's garrisons.  Yes I know I can buy them back, but I think its easier to just rebuild and quicker.  I might try to get a Raider Bn up here also.


1. Not my understanding of the process for determining adjusted AV which is based on ancient explanations by others.

It isn't possible to be fully predictive what the adjusted AV will be because the fire phase intrudes, as do those under the hood factors such as leadership and HQs. But my understanding of how it "works" for a single [if multiple LCUs it is the sum of the individual values] LCU is:

(unadusted AV)(unit supply status)(fortification level)(terrain modifier)

Therefore the current Wotje unadjusted AV is:

(125)(1)(1.25)(1) = 156.25 adjusted AV

Supply status is not a positive modifier. At best (= unit fully supplied), you suffer no ill effects. Under any other circumstances it imposes a penalty on combat.

2. Unit leaders really should have no impact on the rate of recovery for devices which are unready. The availability of plentiful supply and lack of combat is important. Don't confuse this issue with reducing disruption and fatigue where the inspiration rating of the leader can have an impact, but again rest and supply is the best medicine even then.

3. Nothing wrong with your intention to rebuild fragments rather than resurrecting the dead unit. That ability to resurrect a dead unit, which was introduced in the mega series of beta patches, is one of the many features which "everyone" applauded but not me. As implemented it has significant game play ramifications which are not fully in keeping with the fundamental game design concepts.

Alfred

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 805
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/11/2012 1:41:22 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		11th Oct

KB unknown
MKB unknown

China
Bombers didn't fly.  Jap troops are moving towards Changsha.  Is this real or a fake.  Don't know yet.  Koniu has done a fake before.  I have 4,048 AV with 7 forts, full supply in light urban terrain, Thats 20,240 unadjusted AV waiting for him.  Divide that by 400 (Avg div AV) he would need over 50 IDs.  Now I know it dosen't work out that way int he game but it makes me feel better.  Koniu has 28 units in 2 stacks that show up as moving towards Changsha.  Troops are still moving towards Sian with hardly any problems.  My first line of defense will consist of around 1k worth of unadjust AV in 2x terrain around 1 or 2 forts per unit.  Another hex has 1.7k unadjust AV with 2 forts or so in the same type of terrain.  In one stack Koniu has 1.8k of unadjust AV the other big stack I don't know yet.  I will have 1k worth of unadjust AV with 4 forts at Lanchow in 2 days.

Koepang
3 units are reported by intel.  Ground bombing reports 3 units 7th BF, 41st AF Bn, and 113th IR. 

Lautem
AF is bombed for 40 or so hits.

Marshall Islands
No sightings of big TFs yet or bombers at Roi Namur.  Still trying to reinforce Wotje.

Alfred; Thanks for posting.  The AV cal helps thanks.  Unit leaders I thought that it did help but guess not.  I did see some more guns repair this turn.  I kinda agree with you on 3.


(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 806
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/11/2012 2:04:58 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		Lets talk about Changsha.  I guess I am worried about it.  I haven't seen many major land battles so I want some input.

I told you the stats above.  All but one of the units is 100% prepped for Changsha.  They all have 99 moral.  4 Art units and 1 AT unit.  I forgot to upgrade my art units to 105s damn it.  I really dont want to lose all my AC stationed here if he can take the base quickly.  I plan on bombing him once he enters the hex.  My CAP will act as escorts and I will sweep him.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 807
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/11/2012 10:07:36 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		12th Oct

KB unknown
MKB unknown

Sian area
Japs bomb my units and don't do anything.  We hit the stack of 13 trying to cross the river.  250 KIA's  Koniu has divided his divisions.

I think tomorrow I will bomb the stack of 22 units outside Changsha.  Intel states 40k worth of people here.

Lots of ASW attacks on my subs but no hits. 

Intel shows part of the 26th ID heading to Ponape.  80 mines have been dropped off at Wotje. ACM should be their tomorrow if nothing happens to it.  PTs and AGP will be at Maloelap in 3 days. 

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 808
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/12/2012 1:08:49 PM   
DOCUP


Posts: 3073
Joined: 7/7/2010
Status: offline 		13th Oct

KB unknown
MKB unknown

Chungking
Air raid!!  Jap bombers come in for pay back from the raid the day before.  Oscars sweep first then bombers come in escorted by Oscars.  16 Vangaurds training jump an unescorted group of Sallys and shoot down 12 of them.

My bombers had moved to Changsha.  They did attack the Jap LCUs today so maybe tomorrow.

Sian
Japs are still advancing towards Sian they will reach the wooded hex just south of Sian in a day or so.  I have around 1.5k of AV present  When I last saw these guys they had 1.8k of unadjust AV and 1.4k of adjusted AV with lots of arty.  We will see what they can do againist some Chinese in a rough wooded hex with 1 or 2 forts infront of them.

Marshall Islands
We get a message from Imperial Japanese command stating that he didn't like to see ships around the Marshalls and he was sending in his navy.  BB TF is spotted moving towards those TFs.  Subs are in the area so maybe we can score a hit on something.  More CD guns are repaired this turn.  Other TFs are hanging out of search range waiting for orders to go in.  Another intel that the 28th Div is prepping for Wotje.  94 mines are present and another 36 will be dropped off tonite.  ACM is present.  AGP will be at Maloelap tomorrow with some more PT boats.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 809
RE: Questions for you guys. - 8/12/2012 3:29:36 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

We get a message from Imperial Japanese command stating that he didn't like to see ships


Cocky little yellow man.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 810
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