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RE: Create Barge -> any use?

 
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RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/23/2013 5:17:23 PM   
bigred


Posts: 3599
Joined: 12/27/2007
Status: offline 		I linked into this thread but am still looking at what is the trigger to allow landing craft creation by a Transport tf.
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2481133&mpage=1&key=create%2Cbarges%EF%BF%BD

< Message edited by bigred -- 3/23/2013 5:28:53 PM >

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RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/23/2013 5:27:29 PM   
rockmedic109

 

Posts: 2390
Joined: 5/17/2005
From: Citrus Heights, CA
Status: offline 		Just like PT boats. They have to be in the pool. You can find out if you any in the same place as for PT boats.

Ignore me. I didn't realize he answered it on the next page. Excuse me while I put on my dunce cap.

< Message edited by rockmedic109 -- 3/23/2013 5:30:18 PM >

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Post #: 32
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/23/2013 6:28:40 PM   
Cpt Sherwood

 

Posts: 837
Joined: 12/1/2005
From: A Very Nice Place in the USA
Status: offline 		You have to have supply, the TF you showed on the previous page has no supply, just fuel.

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Post #: 33
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/23/2013 6:45:33 PM   
bigred


Posts: 3599
Joined: 12/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cpt Sherwood

You have to have supply, the TF you showed on the previous page has no supply, just fuel.

agreed, I used that tf as a quick screenie to show the the activation click location.

So all I need is:
1-supply in an american tranport TF.
2-Landing craft available in the pool.
3-unloading location on an american or austrailian base.

Is it true that LC help off loading transports?

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Post #: 34
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/23/2013 8:57:41 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bigred


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cpt Sherwood

You have to have supply, the TF you showed on the previous page has no supply, just fuel.

agreed, I used that tf as a quick screenie to show the the activation click location.

So all I need is:
1-supply in an american tranport TF.
2-Landing craft available in the pool.
3-unloading location on an american or austrailian base.

Is it true that LC help off loading transports?

The developers say 'yes', beaching type craft or ships (LCI, LST, etc.), and those with their own complement of landing craft (simulated by the game but not shown explicitly, such as APA, AKA, AP, AK, LSD, etc. have) do assist other ships in the same TF once they have finished their own unloading.

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Post #: 35
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/24/2013 6:33:18 PM   
AirGriff


Posts: 701
Joined: 10/11/2004
Status: offline 		Isn't it a little gamey to send any kind of ship out knowing it will run out of fuel long before it reaches its destination? I don't think they (commanders on either or any side) would have done that as a routine tactic. No doubt there are extreme examples in forlorn hopes and the like, but I doubt it was done as a "normal" SOP. Having flung the proverbial grenade, I will calmly leave the room and close the door

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Post #: 36
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/24/2013 7:05:59 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AirGriff

Isn't it a little gamey to send any kind of ship out knowing it will run out of fuel long before it reaches its destination? I don't think they (commanders on either or any side) would have done that as a routine tactic. No doubt there are extreme examples in forlorn hopes and the like, but I doubt it was done as a "normal" SOP. Having flung the proverbial grenade, I will calmly leave the room and close the door


That's why you add xAK or something so they can refuel from it....depicts very well how they were transported anyway.


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Post #: 37
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/25/2013 7:48:50 PM   
towers58

 

Posts: 20
Joined: 1/25/2013
Status: offline 		The developers say 'yes', beaching type craft or ships (LCI, LST, etc.), and those with their own complement of landing craft (simulated by the game but not shown explicitly, such as APA, AKA, AP, AK, LSD, etc. have) do assist other ships in the same TF once they have finished their own unloading.


So LCT and LCVP will help unload other ships.

< Message edited by towers58 -- 3/25/2013 7:49:36 PM >

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Post #: 38
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/25/2013 9:14:31 PM   
CV 2

 

Posts: 376
Joined: 2/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar


quote:

ORIGINAL: AirGriff

Isn't it a little gamey to send any kind of ship out knowing it will run out of fuel long before it reaches its destination? I don't think they (commanders on either or any side) would have done that as a routine tactic. No doubt there are extreme examples in forlorn hopes and the like, but I doubt it was done as a "normal" SOP. Having flung the proverbial grenade, I will calmly leave the room and close the door


That's why you add xAK or something so they can refuel from it....depicts very well how they were transported anyway.



Kinda defeats the point of using barges in the first place.

Barges can only be attacked at 100' height. Add another ship in there, an AK or a PB and you turn it from a barge TF which cant be bombed into a transport TF that can be.

Personally IMHO, a true "barge" TF is kinda pointless and a waste of VPs. And if you have to add other type ships to get them there, then why even bother?

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Post #: 39
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/25/2013 10:31:06 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
Barges that carry fuel can refuel other barges (in the same TF) at sea. If you order a barge TF to load supplies and set the destination before loading takes place, and the barges do not have enough range to make it to that destination, 1/4th of the barges will load fuel instead of supply for refueling in route.

For a troop TF you must create a separate barge TF, load it with fuel, and merge it with the barge TF carrying troops.

Before you ask, the extra steps for a troop barge TF were intentional. If you keep troops at sea in barges long enough for the barges to run short of fuel the troops disruption will soar.

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Post #: 40
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/26/2013 12:48:29 PM   
USSAmerica


Posts: 18715
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Graham, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Wow, great nugget, Don!

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Post #: 41
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/26/2013 1:58:59 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen


Barges that carry fuel can refuel other barges (in the same TF) at sea. If you order a barge TF to load supplies and set the destination before loading takes place, and the barges do not have enough range to make it to that destination, 1/4th of the barges will load fuel instead of supply for refueling in route.

For a troop TF you must create a separate barge TF, load it with fuel, and merge it with the barge TF carrying troops.

Before you ask, the extra steps for a troop barge TF were intentional. If you keep troops at sea in barges long enough for the barges to run short of fuel the troops disruption will soar.




thanks for this info Don. Have noticed this long ago and wondered if this was working as designed or some flaw in the loading routine. As it didn't really affect me I haven't put more thought in it though.

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Post #: 42
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/26/2013 2:01:42 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CV 2


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar


quote:

ORIGINAL: AirGriff

Isn't it a little gamey to send any kind of ship out knowing it will run out of fuel long before it reaches its destination? I don't think they (commanders on either or any side) would have done that as a routine tactic. No doubt there are extreme examples in forlorn hopes and the like, but I doubt it was done as a "normal" SOP. Having flung the proverbial grenade, I will calmly leave the room and close the door


That's why you add xAK or something so they can refuel from it....depicts very well how they were transported anyway.



Kinda defeats the point of using barges in the first place.

Barges can only be attacked at 100' height. Add another ship in there, an AK or a PB and you turn it from a barge TF which cant be bombed into a transport TF that can be.

Personally IMHO, a true "barge" TF is kinda pointless and a waste of VPs. And if you have to add other type ships to get them there, then why even bother?



don't know how it looks like for the Japanese but for the Allied, barge TF are great. Use them a lot with 23 LCT and 2 PT in each TF. Such a TF carries roughly 3500 tons out to 17 hexes. Perfect in areas like the SRA while being under enemy air threat.

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Post #: 43
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/26/2013 10:43:23 PM   
jetjockey


Posts: 256
Joined: 11/23/2009
Status: offline 		I will use a chain of Dot bases to extend the range of my barges. For example, after Guadalcanal is cut off by air, but before it falls, I run supplies in by barge from Shortlands. My first barges run fuel to Munda (55 gallon drums or their equivalent). Once Munda has an adequate supply, I use it to refuel barge TFs enroute to the Russell Islands and repeat the process. From the Russell Islands, barge TFs can reach Lunga if need be. A lot of work, to be sure, but if you pre-stage fuel at these islands...

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Post #: 44
RE: Create Barge -> any use? - 3/27/2013 2:19:09 PM   
CV 2

 

Posts: 376
Joined: 2/21/2011
Status: offline 		Im not saying they cant be used. Im not saying I dont know how to use them. Im saying it isnt worth it.

Barges have to be micro-managed. That is to say, you cant create a CS (or should I say you COULDNT, I dont know if thats still the case) with a barge TF and just have them ferry fuel/supply. When Im dealing with such insignificant amounts, it isnt something I want to have to take the time to check every day. Easier to just load up a TF of smaller AKs, put 400 CAP on, and have them zip in and unload in a night.

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Post #: 45
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