RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222)

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> After Action Reports >> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222)

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RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 12:28:59 AM

KamilS

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quote:

Balou

Do you have any idea what the germans are looking for that far southeast of Rostov 2 weeks before mud ? Units will turn bright red for a couple of weeks, RR must be far away. The only apparent benefit would have been AGS to split in AGA and AGB, but no need to go beyond the "3 towns". In any case, i am curious to see what he's up to.

Few turns ago I totally lost idea what my opponents wants to achieve.

quote:

Tarhunnas

Do you do any counterattacking? It seems there are several promising targets in the Moscow shot.

My army was badly battered so I didn't want to take any risk.

Time will come next turn - mud will save me from any retribution.

(in reply to Tarhunnas)

Post #: 151

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 1:11:34 AM

Flaviusx

Posts: 7750
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Tarhunnas is right, you are playing way too passively and have let the enemy get into your head here.

There's a totally vulnerable motorized division in a clear hex sitting next to massive and fresh units just west of Moscow, for example --it can be hit on 4 sides, for christ's sake. I would be all over that like white on rice.

Large sections of his line are being held by regiments. He needs to be punished for that. He's doing whatever he wants to do secure in the knowledge that he can get away with it. 3 rifle divisions can kick back an undug regiment in clear terrain, easy. If you've let them get dug in...that's your fault.

< Message edited by Flaviusx -- 5/20/2012 1:17:33 AM >

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Post #: 152

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:11:47 AM

KamilS

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quote:

Flaviusx

There's a totally vulnerable motorized division in a clear hex sitting next to massive and fresh units just west of Moscow, for example --it can be hit on 4 sides, for christ's sake. I would be all over that like white on rice.

He would lost around 1-2 Cv I would 3-4 times more. Not great considering the fact that he is strong near Moscow, barely do anything at all and I will assault his positions along the front next turn.

quote:

Flaviusx

Large sections of his line are being held by regiments. He needs to be punished for that. He's doing whatever he wants to do secure in the knowledge that he can get away with it. 3 rifle divisions can kick back an undug regiment in clear terrain, easy. If you've let them get dug in...that's your fault.

I do not have enough strength to attack his regiments properly, plus he has not committed his panzers so I can easily be punished for being aggressive without having any depth.

< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 3:15:55 AM >

(in reply to Flaviusx)

Post #: 153

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:19:24 AM

hfarrish

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In Kamil's defense, slapping around German formations seems to get you nothing. I try to be aggressive and hit them and it usually just means every unit that attacked gets pocketed. There doesn't seem to be much if any consequence to the German player if you attack. I do it anyway because the game is boring otherwise...

(in reply to KamilS)

Post #: 154

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:23:15 AM

hfarrish

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I would add particularly if you opponent is big into breakdowns...hitting broken down panzer regiments is satisfying on an emotional level but seems to be irrelevant to an overall campaign.

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Post #: 155

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:25:47 AM

Farfarer61

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Did you save over 300 ARM and the KV1 factory in Leningrad? yes ? Then you will win.

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Post #: 156

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:46:16 AM

KamilS

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quote:

Farfarer

Did you save over 300 ARM and the KV1 factory in Leningrad? yes ? Then you will win.

313 Arm and all tank factories (I moved 1 point)

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Post #: 157

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:50:53 AM

KamilS

Posts: 1827
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T17 north (German)

I was surprised to notice that Saper forced crossing near Rybinsk Res. Surprised not by the fact that result of battle was 2,0:1, but by the fact that battle was has been fought in first place - why attack after all this turns of inactivity?

Why attack in area were he will not have supply?

btw, Leningrad has finally fallen.

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< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 4:25:55 AM >

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Post #: 158

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:54:33 AM

KamilS

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T17 centre (German)

Minor thrusts towards Moscow from west and south - I don't have to add that attacks across river were lost narrowly (2,3 and 2,1).

To be honest I hope mz opponent will try to continues his offensive in November.

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< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 4:22:08 AM >

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Post #: 159

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 3:56:32 AM

KamilS

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T17 south (German)

Several spoiling attacks and weird penetration towards lake Manych

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Post #: 160

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:11:09 AM

KamilS

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T17 north (Soviet)

I can't attack here so at least I will try to annoy my opponent by moving units to his flanks.

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< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 4:23:03 AM >

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Post #: 161

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:13:26 AM

KamilS

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T17 centre (Soviet)

Near Moscow were I am strongest there are no easy targets, so I decide to remove best units from front-line and start refitting them.

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Post #: 162

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:15:02 AM

KamilS

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T17 centre/south (Soviet)

Regiment bonanza can't be experienced because of lack of troops in these area.

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Post #: 163

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:18:22 AM

KamilS

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T17 south (Soviet)

I am very pleased.

Germans are far from their supply source so I think encircled unit is going nowhere.

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Post #: 164

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:19:52 AM

KamilS

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T17 Crimea (Soviet)

Interesting opportunity appeared here.

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Post #: 165

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 4:33:39 AM

Farfarer61

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I think it is a tactic now to starve greater Leningrad so that the 90 or so population will not migrate and will be permanently lost. Offhand this takes about 8 turns after isolation. I could be wrong...

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Post #: 166

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:29:28 AM

Tarhunnas

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From: Hex X37, Y15
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kamil

quote:

Flaviusx

There's a totally vulnerable motorized division in a clear hex sitting next to massive and fresh units just west of Moscow, for example --it can be hit on 4 sides, for christ's sake. I would be all over that like white on rice.

He would lost around 1-2 Cv I would 3-4 times more. Not great considering the fact that he is strong near Moscow, barely do anything at all and I will assault his positions along the front next turn.

quote:

Flaviusx

Large sections of his line are being held by regiments. He needs to be punished for that. He's doing whatever he wants to do secure in the knowledge that he can get away with it. 3 rifle divisions can kick back an undug regiment in clear terrain, easy. If you've let them get dug in...that's your fault.

I do not have enough strength to attack his regiments properly, plus he has not committed his panzers so I can easily be punished for being aggressive without having any depth.

While you will lose more than the Germans even on a successful attack, you can replace the losses, he cannot. And it will drive down his morale and give you wins that you need for guards conversion.

I agree with Flaviusx, you seem to be too passive. He has achieved psychological domination. If you let the German hold large stretches of the front with regiments and don't to anything, you leave him free to concentrate wherever he wants. You must force him to spread out, which will inevitably make his attacking thrusts weaker. Being passive just plays into his hand!

You only really need slightly more CV than he has to attack, the 1:1 will kick in and do the rest!

Nice job in the Crimea though!

_____________________________

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41Ger
41Sov
41Ger
42Ger
42Sov

(in reply to KamilS)

Post #: 167

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:51:04 PM

KamilS

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quote:

Tarhunnas

While you will lose more than the Germans even on a successful attack, you can replace the losses, he cannot. And it will drive down his morale and give you wins that you need for guards conversion.

I agree with Flaviusx, you seem to be too passive. He has achieved psychological domination. If you let the German hold large stretches of the front with regiments and don't to anything, you leave him free to concentrate wherever he wants. You must force him to spread out, which will inevitably make his attacking thrusts weaker. Being passive just plays into his hand!

Hmm.

Thing is he is spread out. His panzers and infantry advanced along the front in many unnecessary direction, and I focused my efforts on saving Moscow.

I decided against attacking because he is ridiculously strong at the moment and I am still weak.

He will price for his regimental breakdowns and deep thrusts into void.

I am not saying I am not making mistakes, but although I like attacking sometimes it is better to wait a bit.

(in reply to Tarhunnas)

Post #: 168

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:52:48 PM

KamilS

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T18 north (Soviet)

I am regaining some ground.

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Post #: 169

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:53:51 PM

KamilS

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T18 centre (Soviet)

Same stuff here.

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Post #: 170

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:55:56 PM

KamilS

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T18 south (Soviet)

Rather successfully turn.

Although he shattered one of my cavalry divisions my catch is bigger.

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Post #: 171

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:57:34 PM

KamilS

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T18 Crimea (Soviet)

Few more divisions arrived.

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Post #: 172

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 5:59:20 PM

KamilS

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T21 north (Soviet)

All along the front I am falling back to my positions from before mud. No point of risking troops before December.

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Post #: 173

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:03:20 PM

KamilS

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T21 centre (Soviet)

I am starting to gather cavalry divisions in Moscow area (additionally I am building few more). Main attack will be launched from this area.

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< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 6:04:12 PM >

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Post #: 174

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:06:04 PM

KamilS

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T21 south (Soviet)

For me it is second most important area in this phase of game, so plenty of new troops will be shipped here.

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Post #: 175

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:06:24 PM

TulliusDetritus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kamil

T15 centre (Soviet)

I almost feel secure here.

I'm pretty certain you could have achieved minimum a dozen retreats here

EVEN a single German division could be easily trashed with 6 rifle divisions (deliberate attack)...

To be honest, to me fun (or should I say a big laugh) is what matters -as opposed to an �ber serious operational plan. Trashing enemy units is a good laugh. This does not mean I will commit suicide actions but still, trash every unit you can. I mean, you really could have done it. You will have a good laugh and then you will hurt your e-enemy.

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Post #: 176

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:07:19 PM

KamilS

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T21 Crimea (Soviet)

I hope I won't regret not sending more troops here.

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Post #: 177

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:12:37 PM

KamilS

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quote:

TulliusDetritus

To be honest, to me fun (or should I say a big laugh) is what matters -as opposed to an �ber serious operational plan. Trashing enemy units is a good laugh. This does not mean I will commit suicide actions but still, trash every unit you can. I mean, you really could have done it. You will have a good laugh and then you will hurt your e-enemy.

Everyone is saying that I should counter-attack and I know that most of the time majority is right ... but I can't justify risky and draining attacks that will weaken me before blizzard and won't affect Germans too much.

As much as I like attacking I am not able to force myself to do it now.

< Message edited by Kamil -- 5/20/2012 6:13:47 PM >

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Post #: 178

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:32:52 PM

Flaviusx

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How much of his stuff is in the red supply wise? He's got to be well ahead of his rail lines in a lot of spots.

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Post #: 179

RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) - 5/20/2012 6:36:25 PM

KamilS

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quote:

Flaviusx

How much of his stuff is in the red supply wise? He's got to be well ahead of his rail lines in a lot of spots.

I think everywhere but in Moscow and Rostov areas he was out of supply.

(in reply to Flaviusx)

Post #: 180

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