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- 12/13/2002 8:26:10 AM   
brent_2

 

Posts: 1990
Joined: 3/27/2001
From: Rheingau, Hesse, DE
Status: offline 		As I see it, no CDs are a practical workaround...

Culi - I have a laptop too and have DL'd some NOCDs for it, for the same reason - it is a royal pain to cart around an extra pack of CDs, there is enough other stuff to worry about. Especiallly if you are travelling for an extended period of time.

I have no problems using noCD patches as I have already paid in full for all my games, and I do not lend them out - so it becomes a convenience item for me. I also keep all the disks in cases, but with kids around that is not always safe, music or CDrom... :(

_____________________________

I'm essentially graphically and history oriented, unfortunately to connect the two I have to do maths. I hate maths.
CSO_Brent

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 31
- 12/13/2002 1:17:00 PM   
Culiacan Mexico

 

Posts: 8348
Joined: 11/10/2000
From: Bad Windsheim Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by SLAAKMAN
[B]IF THE WORLD WOULD JUST ABOLISH COPYRIGHT AND PATENT LAW THEN NOBODY COULD MONOPOLIZE ANY IDEA. I PUT THIS MOTION FORWARD. VOTE YES.
SLAAKATTAK [/B][/QUOTE]:D

No one would create anything either. :(

_____________________________

"If you love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lig

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 32
- 12/14/2002 3:53:57 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		"No one would create anything either."

ACTUALLY I KNOW PEOPLE WHO CREATE ALL KINDS OF THINGS JUST FOR THE FUN OF IT AND AS A NECESSITY. ABOLISHING THESE TWO SCOURGE/LAWS WOULD REDUCE THE CRIME OF HORDING AND ENCOURAGE TEAMWORK. DO YOU EVER NOTICE HOW MUCH TECHNOLOGY THE AUTO INDUSTRY IS HOLDING OUT ON WHILE USING PATENT LAW TO PROTECT THEIR "SHELVED INVENTION" STRATEGY?

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 33
- 12/14/2002 5:21:53 PM   
Culiacan Mexico

 

Posts: 8348
Joined: 11/10/2000
From: Bad Windsheim Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by SLAAKMAN
[B]"No one would create anything either."

ACTUALLY I KNOW PEOPLE WHO CREATE ALL KINDS OF THINGS JUST FOR THE FUN OF IT AND AS A NECESSITY. ABOLISHING THESE TWO SCOURGE/LAWS WOULD REDUCE THE CRIME OF HORDING AND ENCOURAGE TEAMWORK. DO YOU EVER NOTICE HOW MUCH TECHNOLOGY THE AUTO INDUSTRY IS HOLDING OUT ON WHILE USING PATENT LAW TO PROTECT THEIR "SHELVED INVENTION" STRATEGY? [/B][/QUOTE]When they started in the Soviet Union it was "From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs" at the end it was "We pretend to work and they pretend to pay us".


Self interest rules all.

_____________________________

"If you love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lig

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 34
- 12/14/2002 9:08:49 PM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Money is the weak link, and it's not going to ever go away as a factor any time soon.

People want to get paid to do what they do, and if we all want to get paid, we all have to pay.

Now if programmers programmed merely because they could.....

If people made cars, or did dentistry, or sold vegetables, or painted pictures, sung music, taught, or any other human activity just because they were good at it.....

Copywrite is about protecting our right to get paid for what we do.
If there was no reason to get paid, because there was no need to get paid.....

But no, I am not going to wait for this silly dream world notion to come to fruition. People want to get paid.

But I am a good example of what happens when just a few times, something is done, just to be nice.
Karma, it's a wonderful thing.

I have lots that I was given for free, and I have often given freely that which I had, because it felt good.
Last good example of something I did (just because I could).
I made a set of solid wood floor to ceiling bookcases (8' tall is a large bookcase!). I asked a buddy, "what would you charge?" (he has a business, me I was just doing it).
He quoted me a price of $400.00 (Canadian eh).
I charged the business I did them for, 50 bucks plus all costs of materials (I needed 50 bucks at the time to buy a book I wanted).
I made a second unit later, but after finding out my work was rated at 400, I asked for 100.

I enjoyed making the things, it was enough.
Just for the amusement of working with all that wood though, I would have done it for free, if I had not needed a bit of pocket cash at the time.

If I had the skill to program, odds are I would make the "perfect wargame" and just give it away much the way Linux is "here make it better if you can!" attitude.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 35
- 12/15/2002 1:19:55 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		Copywrite is about protecting our right to get paid for what we do.

IT MAY HAVE STARTED OUT THAT WAY BUT ITS NOT WHAT THESE LAWS ARE REALLY ABOUT NOW. THE CURRENT STATUTES PRIMARILY PROTECT HORDING AND NOT THE IDEA. THERE IS ONLY A VERY WEAK APPARATUS TO REDUCE INFLATION AND ACCELERATE MONEY VELOCITY IN PLACE AT THE MOMENT AND BY REMOVING THESE TWO LAWS
NEW INVENTORS COULD UTILIZE THE IDEA'S THAT ARE SITTING IDLEY ON A SHELF AND BRING THEM TO MARKET.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 36
- 12/15/2002 1:57:38 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		No I disagree, I am also a writer.

Copywrite is most definitely about protecting what is yours, entirely due to our need to get paid for our efforts.

This is because the world uses money. Money is used to get the other things we need. no more complicated than that.

If inventors lived in a world where they could invent, and not require money, because all the rest of humanity was not using it either, then copywrite would only be about getting credit for the invention.

But such is not the case. Some people invent, and others merely use inventions. But we all live on the planet, and all need the money.

If it takes me 3 months to write a good book, that was 3 months of labour. I expect that book to produce 3 months of income at the very least, or I am making no money at all. Inventors have bills to pay as well.

Some laws might be dumb, but that's just life.

If tomorrow I invent a battery that will power a car for one week and not generate pollution, and GM buys my battery for 100 million dollars, and then sells it to a major Oil company for 3 Billion dollars, just so the oil company can put it on a shelf. Well that was all by choice.

I would have 100 million and likely be dammmmm happy. But my invention would not belong to the world. It would just be real stupid of me to sell out the world like that is all. But it would still not entitle anyone to it.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 37
- 12/15/2002 2:48:21 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		"Copywrite is most definitely about protecting what is yours,entirely due to our need to get paid for our efforts."

THE QUESTION WOULD BE THEN, HOW MUCH? GERMANY FOR EXAMPLE HAS TARIFF SYSTEM THAT INSURES STABLE WAGES FOR EACH POSITION. THIS TYPE OF SYSTEM WOULD INSURE WAGE PROTECTION WITHOUT "HORDING LAWS" SUCH AS COPYRIGHTS.

"This is because the world uses money. Money is used to get the
other things we need. no more complicated than that."

DUH? THATS A LITTLE OVERSTATING THE OBVIOUS.

"If inventors lived in a world where they could invent, and not
require money, because all the rest of humanity was not using it
either, then copywrite would only be about getting credit for the
invention."

YOUR MISSING THE POINT. I DO WANT PEOPLE TO GET PAID THEREFORE IM A LASSAIZ FAIRE CAPITALIST AND AM PUTTING FORTH THE IDEA THAT MARKETS WOULD BE MORE EFFICIENT WITHOUT LAWS SUCH AS PATENT AND COPYWRITE THAT PROTECT HORDING.

"But such is not the case. Some people invent, and others merely use inventions. But we all live on the planet, and all need the money.Some laws might be dumb, but that's just life."

HAR HAR HAR. SO WE'RE JUST SUPPOSED TO SIT BACK AND BEND OVER BECAUSE SOME PODUNK, ANAL RETENTIVE LEGISLATORS PRETENTIOUSLY DECIDED THAT THEY KNEW WHATS BEST FOR EVERYONE? WRONG!!

"If tomorrow I invent a battery that will power a car for one week
and not generate pollution, and GM buys my battery for 100
million dollars, and then sells it to a major Oil company for 3
Billion dollars, just so the oil company can put it on a shelf. Well
that was all by choice."

IN THIS CASE THOSE INVENTORS CAN MAKE THOSE CHOICES IF THEY WANT TO BUT WITHOUT PATENT LAW ANYONE COULD ALSO MAKE THE CHOICE TO UTILIZE THAT IDEA AND HAVE THE SAME CHANCE TO BRING IT TO MARKET WITHOUT INTERFERENCE FROM HORDERS. GLUTTONY IS ONE OF THE SEVEN DEADLY SINS.
SLAAK

PS- DONT TAKE IT PERSONALLY OR ANYTHING SARGE. IM NOT STARTING A FLAMEWAR. IF IT LOOKS LIKE A FLAMEWAR IS ERUPTING, I WILL IMMEDIATELY ABORT THE MISSION.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 38
- 12/15/2002 3:03:18 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		No your points were well stated dude, heck if I "fully" understood all the many aspects of patent law, my computer would be newer that's for sure, I would also be a well paid lawyer heheh.

But the whole problem with patent law is also mired in the problem of what is patentable and how.

Latest thing I have seen is the onco mouse for instance. Now there is a messy topic.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 39
- 12/15/2002 3:58:32 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]IF THE WORLD WOULD JUST ABOLISH COPYRIGHT AND PATENT LAW THEN NOBODY COULD MONOPOLIZE ANY IDEA. [/QUOTE]

Wow, Microsoft would love that. You think they are the evil empire now, if they didn't have to buy out competitors or work around copyright infringement they would harvest ideas for free and use their tremendous financial power to completely smother the competition.

So the organizations with the money can exploit someone elses intelectual property without paying for it.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 40
- 12/15/2002 5:25:07 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		"So the organizations with the money can exploit someone elses intelectual property without paying for it."


THEY DO IT ANYWAY. WITHOUT THE GROSSLY EXPENSIVE LEGAL SYSTEM TO HIDE BEHIND ALL INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY WOULD BE FAIR GAME AND NOBODY COULD MONOPOLIZE A DAMNED THING! THE DOOR SWINGS BOTH WAYS.
SLAAKATTAK

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 41
- 12/15/2002 5:27:21 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		Monolpolization would be a direct function of monetary resources. So without money, you have nothing.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 42
- 12/15/2002 8:22:12 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		WITHOUT MONEY YOU HAVE NOTHING?? TELL THAT TO THOMAS PAINE. THE SHOT THAT WAS HEARD AROUND THE WORLD DIDNT NEED A BANKER TO MAKE ITS IMPACT. ROMANTIC AINT IT?!

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 43
- 12/15/2002 8:36:16 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Money is just a tool.

And it is a tool we can do without, we but have to wish it be so.

Life could be all about barter, we could but make it so if we wanted it to be so.

Life is the way it is, because collectively humanity wants it that way.

It't the reason I don't really care about a lot of the world's woes in some ways. To many people happy to be miserable, why should I force them to be happy eh?

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 44
- 12/15/2002 8:46:28 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]WITHOUT MONEY YOU HAVE NOTHING?? TELL THAT TO THOMAS PAINE. THE SHOT THAT WAS HEARD AROUND THE WORLD DIDNT NEED A BANKER TO MAKE ITS IMPACT. ROMANTIC AINT IT?![/QUOTE]

Are we talking about making it easy for corporate america to steal ideas from individual entrepenuers, writers, and inventors; or are we talking armed insurrection?

Last time I checked, a significant part of the American revolution revolved around money (No taxation without representation)

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 45
- 12/15/2002 9:51:44 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		TRUE. MONEY IS SOMEWHAT THE BOTTOM LINE OF MY EARLIER POINT. BUT IM NOT SATISFIED WITH THE SO-CALLED SOLUTIONS TO THE SLOW MONEY VELOCITY THAT THE COUNTRY SUFFERS FROM NOW. PLUS AS AN AMATEUR TECHNOLOGY RESEARCHER ITS DAMNED DISGRUNTLING TO READ ABOUT GREAT INVENTIONS THAT SUPPOSEDLY HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR YEARS ONLY TO LEARN THAT THE "RIGHTS" TO USE THEM HAVE BEEN SHELVED BY SOME GREEDY JERK OR COMPANY OF JERKS THAT ARE MAKING A KILLING OFF THE OLD TECHNOLOGY WITHOUT LETTING ME GET IN ON THE SCAM. DAMNED FRUSTRATING IT IS!

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 46
- 12/15/2002 10:01:23 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		I agree that there are problems with the systems as is.

I am not intimately familiar with patent law, but was under the understanding that there is a time limit associated with the patent. I would think that you can't keep something shelved forever. I always remember that the guy who patented the television didn't get squat because WW II delayed it's introduction, and so his patent had expired by the time it became big.

I am personally more concerned with copyrights then patents anyway.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 47
- 12/15/2002 10:02:27 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Look on the bright side, regardless of who you hear it from, odds are they are not entirely right.
The simple fact is humanity is massively accelerating the process heading us to the next Ice Age.

As such, in a very short span of time (you might actually witness it), society, and all of humanity, might come to grips with mother nature in her worst mood. A mood she has never demonstrated in human history (or at least human history that matters to us now).

And the survivors, there will be lots of them, will have all the clutter all the mess and as a result all the stupidity rather brutally, erased.

And people will be able to go the process of starting mostly anew, and maybe just maybe get it right next time.
But don't hold your breathe.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 48
- 12/15/2002 10:06:09 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]As such, in a very short span of time (you might actually witness it), society, and all of humanity, might come to grips with mother nature in her worst mood. A mood she has never demonstrated in human history (or at least human history that matters to us now). [/QUOTE]

What do you that the rest of us don't, Sarge? (Besides how to speak French:D )

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 49
- 12/15/2002 10:40:22 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		I read this one book The Coming Global Superstorm. I would have enjoyed it more if the authors hadn't keep interrupting the story after each chapter with discussions of a purely scientific sort.

Alas, it ain't a fairy tale.

No the truth of the matter is that the future ain't so bright.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 50
- 12/15/2002 10:45:49 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Interesting you should mention French though, I am from Quebec heheh.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 51
- 12/15/2002 10:57:10 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		Did you get some good ideas for some retirement property out of that booK? Like some place that won't be destroyed and/or somewhat habitable in 20-30 years?

A new ice age doesn't seem like it would do alot for Canada.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 52
- 12/15/2002 10:57:59 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		!!!!! QUEBEC??!!! DUUUDE! YOU CAN SET ME UP WITH ALL THOSE FINE MONTREAL BABES!!!

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 53
- 12/15/2002 6:50:36 PM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		No you want Quebec City actually.

As for Canada and the next 100 years, hmm you might want to buy a home in New Zealand or Australia, closest thing to Canada culturally, and a lot safer. Because eventually there won't be a Canada (unless you are Inuit, I guess they will be prepared for a long bout of snow).
But it will naturally be a lot warmer in the Mediteranean regions. North Africa has a lot of promise. Bit sandy though. Possibly south Saharan.
I don't suggest the Carribean though, it will be a lot wetter there, before the snow arrives. Place gets trashed regularly by Mother Nature already.

The trouble of alarmist talk of Ice Ages, is it's getting so hot lately. Which is not a problem when you study the past proven mechanics of global glaciation that have already occurred numerous times.
Oh any archeologist/geologist/planetologist/climatologist worth their degrees can show you that Global Warming isn't a trendy "what if" scenario eh.
Mother Nature, she has done it several times before already, she knows exactly how to do it.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 54
- 12/16/2002 1:25:10 AM   
SLAAKMAN


Posts: 2725
Joined: 7/24/2002
Status: offline 		NAAAH ICEAGE-SCHMICEAGE. I LIKE COLD WEATHER. ESPECIALLY WHEN I CAN JUMP INTO A NICE HOT BATH WITH THREE OF MY LOVELY FRENCH LADIES TO HAVE SOME HUGGIE-SQUEEZIE. NOW GET OUT THERE FIND ME MY DREAMGIRLS SO I CAN VOULEZ-VOUS ON A MOONLIT NIGHT.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 55
- 12/19/2002 9:17:45 AM   
SoulBlazer

 

Posts: 839
Joined: 10/27/2002
From: Providence RI
Status: offline 		I'm surprised no one here mentioned one of the biggest reasons why people who buy the games (like myself) would get a NoCD crack for them.

The games run SO much better without the CD!

Too many games I have have problems with SafeDisc or whatever else they use to protect the CD's, and it slows the loading time and can cause problems with gameplay. I've had some games crash to dekstop more often not due to the copy protect.

Even a game like UV runs a lot better without the need for the CD in it each time.

Yes, I know pirates will get the full game from someone and then crack it so they can play it, but patchs usually (or should) require the CD in the drive. And that's fine with me -- it's quite understandable being asked to prove ownership now and then.

But it does make me wish for the old DOS days when all I had to do was keep the manual handy. :)

(and I used cracks on my leagaly owned games then, also)

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 56
- 12/19/2002 11:19:18 AM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		In today's age of advanced incredibly powerful machines, it seems odd how software is such a pain to protect. Can't someone think of a way to verify you actually own that software?

For those that are not actually aware, Safedisk works by intentionally, yes, intentionally dumping bad sectors, garbage, and all manner of crud on the cd.

The initial portion of the cd is rife with junk that is all but unreadable to programs that copy cds.

It's no wonder artificial intelligences are so pathetic for computers, when the best software makers can think up, is cram heaps of crap on the cd to thwart thieves.

I'm not much of a fan admittedly of no cd cracks. But that is primarily, due to the simple fact that no cd cracks are basically just a tool of the dishonest more so than the honest. Don't get yer hackles up, I ain't accusing anyone here. But I have seen to many people use no cd cracks for dishonest purposes (I ain't making this up).

Software needs a different solution. Some way to verify, yes you bought it, without really requiring the cd in the drive.

Don't get me wrong, I really hate having to run the cd to play the game. It produces wear and tear on the drive.
I don't mind the 10 seconds out of my hectic schedule to load a cd, but I would rather extend the life of the drive by only using it when I really need to use it.

I have no brilliant ideas at this time. If I did, I would be fairly rich really fast I suspect.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 57
- 12/19/2002 10:26:36 PM   
Colonel von Blitz

 

Posts: 262
Joined: 12/4/2000
From: Espoo, Finland
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Les the Sarge 9-1
[B]I mean really, I can't see any justification for no cd options at all. [/B][/QUOTE]

Here is one justification, for example: Grand Prix Legends, the reprinted 'cheap' version. If the game was upgraded, the copy protection system no longer indentified the original CD as original and the game failed to run. This was fixed by issuing official NoCD patch.

Colonel von Blitz

_____________________________

--Light travels faster than sound, that's why some people appear bright until you hear them speak--

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 58
- 12/19/2002 11:02:10 PM   
Les_the_Sarge_9_1

 

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
Status: offline 		Col. that sounds like the fault of the person re releasing the software but not much else.

If I make a program, sell it, then some day later, its bought from me and re released by another, if they don't release it the way I produced it, then it is their headache if the software no longer works.

And if a consumer buys an aftermarketed version that is not capable, then they have reason to be angry at being sold software that is non functional.

But the trouble is this.

It takes a lot of effort to make software. It takes a lot of money to produce it. It takes almost no effort to steal it. Anything that comes between the theft and a sale is a good thing. Anything that aids a theft is a bad thing.

I doubt no cd software is the right idea to safe guard the software. I doubt there currently is any good way to safe guard the software.

The average person will no doubt realise that almost anything can be fraudulently copied.

Am I sympathetic with software creators ...yes.

Am I willing to do whatever, to ensure their copyright is protected... almost entirely.

Do I expect to see any solution appear any time soon...no.

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 59
- 12/20/2002 7:27:58 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		Sales is the message to the developers to make more games of that kind.

Without income, the software developers disappear. And so do the games to steal.

Since Matrix is back on track bringing games without the corporate crap, until there is a better way, I'm with Sarge on this one.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to abradley)
Post #: 60
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