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Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel...

 
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Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 4:51:23 PM   
artuitus_slith

 

Posts: 141
Joined: 11/22/2009
Status: offline 		Under what conditions do collisions occur? I've seen collisions in surface engagements, but is there a random chance that your ships will just crash into each other? The reason i ask is because the Yorktown has had a collision with someone/something in open ocean without engaging in any type of combat surface or air attack. Am I correct in assuming that a collision can occur anywhere at anytime or is this a bug? And do things like bad weather and number of ships in TF affect the chance of collision?

Personally I think the AI is just cheating to punish me for damaging one of It's CVs by mining Merak.
Post #: 1
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 5:20:59 PM   
rms1pa

 

Posts: 370
Joined: 7/4/2011
Status: offline 		i think it is WAD,


in real life we called ourselves "tin cans" and the carriers "can openers".

rms/pa

_____________________________

there is a technical term for those who confuse the opinions of an author's characters for the opinions of the author.
the term is IDIOT.

(in reply to artuitus_slith)
Post #: 2
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 5:39:56 PM   
Walloc

 

Posts: 3141
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gmoney

Under what conditions do collisions occur? I've seen collisions in surface engagements, but is there a random chance that your ships will just crash into each other? The reason i ask is because the Yorktown has had a collision with someone/something in open ocean without engaging in any type of combat surface or air attack. Am I correct in assuming that a collision can occur anywhere at anytime or is this a bug? And do things like bad weather and number of ships in TF affect the chance of collision?

Personally I think the AI is just cheating to punish me for damaging one of It's CVs by mining Merak.


The number of ships in TF affects the chance of collision. If its directly proportional or not i dont know, but it does seem to happen much more frequently in larger TFs. Each turn they sail around i assume a roll is done cuz it can happen during moving around. Also going into combat there in that combat rolls for collisions.

Hope it helps,

Rasmus

< Message edited by Walloc -- 8/13/2012 5:44:40 PM >

(in reply to artuitus_slith)
Post #: 3
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 6:07:35 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		There were lots of collisions in WWII IRL. Two notable ones that come to mind...

Two USN fast BBs, Washington and (IIRC) South Dakota.

The Queen Elizabeth cut an escort in half when nearing port once.

(in reply to Walloc)
Post #: 4
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 8:21:12 PM   
artuitus_slith

 

Posts: 141
Joined: 11/22/2009
Status: offline 		I figured it was WAD, but still think its revenge for my well laid out minefield in Merak damaging one of the AI's CVL groups. 1 CVL and CL damaged and as many as 5 DD sank. :) Regardless it doesnt appear to be a big deal since the impending invasion of Canton seems to have been called off, instead the japs are occupying the solomans so I'll just retire to brisbane for repairs. On an unrelated note I was planning a raid on Truk, lots of merchant shipping there, when my subs stumbled across 2 seperate CV groups with at least 3 CVs in them-glad i didnt go through with that plan lol

As for the helmsman who allowed the collision-normally the captain is responsible for all actions on his ship and this case is no diffrent, however Adm Spruance is too valuable to the war effort to be replaced until after the war. The helmsman in question however is replaceable, and has been re-assigned to the POW infiltration Group, in other words he has been dropped off in a lifeboat near Baker Island in order to 'infiltrate' the Jap POW system.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 5
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 9:03:05 PM   
CaptDave

 

Posts: 659
Joined: 6/21/2002
From: Federal Way, WA
Status: offline 		You did make sure that LCdr Queeg didn't have the conn, right?

(in reply to artuitus_slith)
Post #: 6
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 9:05:01 PM   
Crackaces


Posts: 3858
Joined: 7/9/2011
Status: offline 		One thing to think about .. weather .. I suspect "severe storms" is a trigger for a collison die roll modified by the number of ships in the TF ...

In a convoy of 20 TK with 10 escorts of vaious types inclluding a CA with float planes . IN a combat replay I just noted an air patrol being cancelled due to bad weather [severe storms] followed by a collision of two TK's ...

_____________________________

"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so"

(in reply to artuitus_slith)
Post #: 7
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 9:44:17 PM   
Gridley380


Posts: 464
Joined: 12/20/2011
Status: offline 		I like to run 100 ship transport TFs from the West Coast to Pearl and I swear I get a collision or a major engineering casualty or SOMETHING every third convoy - almost always on the return leg. The AI does not appear to be smart enough to create escort TFs after such events, even when a 14kt convoy has been slowed down to 5kt.

Yes, size does matter.

(in reply to Crackaces)
Post #: 8
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/13/2012 10:10:29 PM   
jmalter

 

Posts: 1673
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline 		IMO, chances for collision increase w/ more ships in the TF, and i don't doubt that weather is a factor.

surely 2 x 50-ship TransTFs would (in the long run) suffer fewer collisions than 1 100-ship TF, 3 x 33-ship convoys would suffer even less.

collisions occur only within TFs, i've never seen a collision between ships of different TFs.

i've seen more than a few collisions occur when a SurfTF is involved in combat. Does anyone know if ship experience and/or captain/TFcommander ratings affect the possibility of collisions?

(in reply to Gridley380)
Post #: 9
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/23/2012 3:10:16 AM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		I am certain that TF commander naval skills and ship crew experience are factored in. When I have had collisions and checked the ship info afterward the Captain's naval skill was usually poor and the crew experience mediocre.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to jmalter)
Post #: 10
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 8/24/2012 5:01:20 PM   
Cavalry Corp

 

Posts: 3107
Joined: 9/2/2003
From: Sampford Spiney Devon UK
Status: offline 		I had two Jap modern DD collide in a 4 ship asw TF

Both ships suffered massive damage 57 flt etc, the other suffered over 50 engine damage.

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 11
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 9/22/2012 7:49:34 PM   
SpitfireIX


Posts: 264
Joined: 1/9/2003
From: Fort Wayne IN USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

There were lots of collisions in WWII IRL. Two notable ones that come to mind...

Two USN fast BBs, Washington and (IIRC) South Dakota.

The Queen Elizabeth cut an escort in half when nearing port once.

Actually it was the Queen Mary, and the unfortunate victim was HMS Curacoa. My grandfather went to Britain with his unit aboard the QM, but not on that voyage.

Other notable collisions include HMS Punjab's being run down by HMS King George V and the collision between IJN Mogami and IJN Mikuma which led to the latter's being sunk by SBDs at Midway.

Near misses also occured. From The Big E, by Edward P. Stafford (p. 365, Naval Institute Press edition):

quote:

At 5:00 a.m. on the twenty-eighth [of May, 1944], an Enterprise ensign gave some very bad moments to a great many other men, including a highly articulate command echelon of one vice admiral, one rear admiral, and two senior captains. He ordered left rudder instead of right in executing the zigzag plan. For a horrible minute, Enterprise, flying the two-star flag of Rear Admiral J. W. "Black Jack" Reeves, commanding Task Group 58.3, and Lexington, with Vice Admiral Marc Mitscher, Commander Task Force 58 embarked, angled toward each other and a catastrophic collision at 18 knots. The error was discovered in seconds and collision averted, but [Captain] Mat Gardner did not recover his calm good humor for two days, and it was many weeks and hours of instruction later that the ensign again stood watch on the Big E's bridge as junior officer of the deck.




_____________________________

"I know Japanese. He is very bad. And tricky. But we Americans too smart. We catch him and give him hell."

--Benny Sablan, crewman, USS Enterprise 12/7/41

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 12
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 9/22/2012 10:56:29 PM   
Reg


Posts: 2787
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: NSW, Australia
Status: offline
Post war, HMAS Melbourne collided with and sank two escorts, HMAS Voyager in 1964 who cut across her bow and USS Frank E. Evans in 1969 under similar circumstances.

These incidents, along with several minor collisions, shipboard accidents, and aircraft losses, led to the reputation that Melbourne was jinxed.



_____________________________

Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

(in reply to SpitfireIX)
Post #: 13
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 9/22/2012 11:34:35 PM   
msieving1


Posts: 526
Joined: 3/23/2007
From: Missouri
Status: offline
quote:

Two USN fast BBs, Washington and (IIRC) South Dakota.


Indiana, not South Dakota. Indiana's captain was relieved and never served at sea after the collision.


(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 14
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 9/23/2012 12:54:54 AM   
John Lansford

 

Posts: 2662
Joined: 4/29/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

There were lots of collisions in WWII IRL. Two notable ones that come to mind...

Two USN fast BBs, Washington and (IIRC) South Dakota.

The Queen Elizabeth cut an escort in half when nearing port once.


King George V ran over a destroyer as well, but the DD got even when its depth charges went off underneath the BB's stern, damaging it enough to send her in to port for repairs.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 15
RE: Yorktown Helmsman Asleep at the wheel... - 9/23/2012 5:49:29 AM   
jmalter

 

Posts: 1673
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline 		i've lost the link i had to what was essentially a USN Pacific kriegstagebuch, but it seemed to me that mishaps occurred daily - collisions, groundings, semi-major engineering failures, crashing into a pier, even food-poisoning outbreaks that could hit an entire ship's company.

i like how the game models damage increase over long voyages, & gives you the occaisional collision or amphibious 'bottom ripped out', but IMO it doesn't realistically portray the frequent occurrence of mid-level malfunctions that would put 5 to 15 damage points onto sys, float, or engines.

tho' awhile back, someone posted that he'd had a 'boiler explosion', which was a hoot 'cos it happened to a diesel-powered LST!

< Message edited by jmalter -- 9/23/2012 5:51:27 AM >

(in reply to John Lansford)
Post #: 16
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