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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

 
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 1:19:20 AM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		They call that genre "Yacht Rock" nowadays. Stuff like Gerry Rafferty, the Doobie Brothers, Toto, England Dan and John Ford Coley.

Cheers,
CC

_____________________________

Beer, because barley makes lousy bread.

(in reply to JohnDillworth)
Post #: 10591
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 1:36:01 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		There is a moment frozen in time: Early 1970s. My father watching the evening news. The news closes with short video of a street guitarist seated by the surface entrance to a subway tunnel in Paris, France. The guitarist is singing "City of New Orleans." Haunting. Absolutely haunting.

(in reply to JohnDillworth)
Post #: 10592
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 1:49:00 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

My favorite 70's song. Best version....Arlo Guthrie:
Riding on the city of New Orleans
Illinois Central, Monday morning rail
Fifteen cars and fifteen restless riders
Three conductors and twenty-five sacks of mail
All along the southbound odyssey
The train pulled out at Kankakee
And rolls along past houses, farms and fields
Passin' trains that have no names
And freight yards full of old black men
And the graveyards of the rusted automobiles
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
And I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done
Dealin' card games with the old men in the club car
Penny a point ain't no one keepin' score
Pass the paper bag that holds the bottle
Feel the wheels rumblin' 'neath the floor
And the sons of Pullman Porters
And the sons of engineers
Ride their father's magic carpet made of steel
Mothers with their babes asleep
Are rockin' to the gentle beat
And the rhythm of the rail is all they feel
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done
Nighttime on the city of New Orleans
Changing cars in Memphis, Tennessee
Half way home, we'll be there by morning
Through the Mississippi darkness
Rolling down to the sea
But all the towns and people seem
To fade into a bad dream
And the steel rails still ain't heard the news
The conductor sings his songs again
The passengers will please refrain
This train has got the disappearing railroad blues
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done


Steve Goodman wrote that song and a lot of other fine tunes. Guthrie's version was a great one. Goodman died very young of cancer.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to JohnDillworth)
Post #: 10593
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 3:15:08 AM   
Smoky Stoker


Posts: 87
Joined: 3/25/2011
Status: offline 		It is odd how congruent the eclectic musical tastes of war gamers tend to be. I have never liked Frank Sinatra, but that is because I worked in hotels and meeting him professionally kept me from enjoying his work. You may have seen Jefferson Davis' quote "Never be haughty to the humble; never be humble to the haughty"? Mr. Sinatra had it reversed.

My favorite single piece of music - this year, it changes - is Pachelbel's Canon in D by an ensemble named Voice of Music;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3uh75-OXQo

A few years ago it was "Yerushalayim shel Zahav", which, like Leonard Cohen's "Hallelujah", is such a good song that there are a lot of bad cuts of it out there;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnPInqMUSJ8

< Message edited by Smoky Stoker -- 5/29/2017 3:17:00 AM >

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 10594
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 6:23:22 AM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

My favorite 70's song. Best version....Arlo Guthrie:
Riding on the city of New Orleans
Illinois Central, Monday morning rail
Fifteen cars and fifteen restless riders
Three conductors and twenty-five sacks of mail
All along the southbound odyssey
The train pulled out at Kankakee
And rolls along past houses, farms and fields
Passin' trains that have no names
And freight yards full of old black men
And the graveyards of the rusted automobiles
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
And I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done
Dealin' card games with the old men in the club car
Penny a point ain't no one keepin' score
Pass the paper bag that holds the bottle
Feel the wheels rumblin' 'neath the floor
And the sons of Pullman Porters
And the sons of engineers
Ride their father's magic carpet made of steel
Mothers with their babes asleep
Are rockin' to the gentle beat
And the rhythm of the rail is all they feel
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done
Nighttime on the city of New Orleans
Changing cars in Memphis, Tennessee
Half way home, we'll be there by morning
Through the Mississippi darkness
Rolling down to the sea
But all the towns and people seem
To fade into a bad dream
And the steel rails still ain't heard the news
The conductor sings his songs again
The passengers will please refrain
This train has got the disappearing railroad blues
Good morning, America
How are you?
Say don't you know me? I'm your native son
I'm the train they call the city of New Orleans
I'll be gone five hundred miles when the day is done


Steve Goodman wrote that song and a lot of other fine tunes. Guthrie's version was a great one. Goodman died very young of cancer.

Steve Goodman with input from John Denver, at least according to his Biography.

_____________________________

Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 10595
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 9:33:22 AM   
JohnDillworth


Posts: 3100
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Steve Goodman wrote that song and a lot of other fine tunes. Guthrie's version was a great one. Goodman died very young of cancer.
The way I heard the story is Guthrie was performing in a bar and Goodman said I have a song you might want to record. Guthrie said "buy me a beer, and I listen to your song for as long as it takes me to finish that beer". Needless to say he decided to record the song well before that beer was done.

_____________________________

Today I come bearing an olive branch in one hand, and the freedom fighter's gun in the other. Do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. I repeat, do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. - Yasser Arafat Speech to UN General Assembly

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 10596
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/29/2017 7:57:36 PM   
Dirtnap86


Posts: 95
Joined: 10/3/2016
Status: offline 		Well I'm likely the odd man out musically here, probably because I'm a youngin'. I switch the radio between a station that plays 70s-90s 'classic' rock and another that plays modern alternative rock. The sounds you can't stand lull me to sleep at night, CR. You'd think a guy that spent 8 years playing classical trumpet would have better taste eh

In other news, for my fellow vets out here, I hope your Memorial Day is going well.

(in reply to JohnDillworth)
Post #: 10597
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/30/2017 1:44:47 AM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Smoky Stoker

It is odd how congruent the eclectic musical tastes of war gamers tend to be. I have never liked Frank Sinatra, but that is because I worked in hotels and meeting him professionally kept me from enjoying his work. You may have seen Jefferson Davis' quote "Never be haughty to the humble; never be humble to the haughty"? Mr. Sinatra had it reversed.

My favorite single piece of music - this year, it changes - is Pachelbel's Canon in D by an ensemble named Voice of Music;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3uh75-OXQo

A few years ago it was "Yerushalayim shel Zahav", which, like Leonard Cohen's "Hallelujah", is such a good song that there are a lot of bad cuts of it out there;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnPInqMUSJ8


I could go the rest of my life without ever hearing Pachelbel anything and be A-OK.

(in reply to Smoky Stoker)
Post #: 10598
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/30/2017 6:27:06 AM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		I recently discovered Sissel, a beautiful lady from Norway with an even more beautiful voice.

SHENANDOAH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1EG_4IBzbA

I was actually searching for Paddy Maloney

< Message edited by JeffK -- 5/30/2017 6:29:27 AM >

_____________________________

Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 10599
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/30/2017 8:25:26 AM   
JohnDillworth


Posts: 3100
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline 		thanks for that, it was pretty good

_____________________________

Today I come bearing an olive branch in one hand, and the freedom fighter's gun in the other. Do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. I repeat, do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. - Yasser Arafat Speech to UN General Assembly

(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 10600
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/30/2017 3:38:41 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		Beautiful voice and a beautiful lady, but they only seemed to use one verse of the song. Compare with Tennessee Ernie Ford's version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khxx3sCVhtE


_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 10601
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 2:47:18 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/6/44

Peep Show: Allied forces continue to make progress in China and in closing Formosa's airfields.

I think Amoy will fall in two or three days. At that point, I have a big decision to make: (1) retire Death Star to replenish and then escort supply into theater; or (2) if KB remains in the DEI, move immediately to invade Formosa at one or two places, since the Allies currently control the theater and all airfields are suppressed.

I always think John has no choice but to commit KB....and John never commits KB. But, dang, if he doesn't now, he's giving me a lot of freedom to hit him I the vitals.




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(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 10602
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 2:59:43 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/6/44

KB & the DEI: Interesting game within the game going on in the DEI, where John has full KB in position to overwhelm Allied defenses at Boela.

Purely from a Victory Point +/- accounting standpoint, this mission probably makes sense; from an opportunity cost standpoint, I think it doesn't make sense; from a military positioning and advantage standpoint, it makes zero sense.




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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10603
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 3:13:31 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		That is how you do it...Japan's initial strength in the air gone, and the planes are destroyed on the ground. I wonder if he evacuated the pilots or if you are killing some pilots with each airfield strike?

I suspect you might be better served either cutting China in half and hooking up with the Chinese or picking targets closer to Honshu....but since I don't know troop strengths in that area I am simply speculating.

With no KB around, I might want to look at how could I activate the Soviets.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10604
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 3:15:52 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/6/44

SEAC: Allied momentum in Indochina is complementing Peep Show.




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(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10605
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 3:20:10 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

That is how you do it...Japan's initial strength in the air gone, and the planes are destroyed on the ground. I wonder if he evacuated the pilots or if you are killing some pilots with each airfield strike?

I suspect you might be better served either cutting China in half and hooking up with the Chinese or picking targets closer to Honshu....but since I don't know troop strengths in that area I am simply speculating.

With no KB around, I might want to look at how could I activate the Soviets.


Activating the Soviets is one of three major possibilities I'm considering now. It's probably third on that list, only because it's something I know the least about.

I think I'd have to put enough Western Allied troops in Manchuria to negatively tilt John's garrison requirements. I don't have any idea how much cushion he has at the moment, so I don't know if the task is easy, feasible or long shot.

Before pulling the trigger on any operation that will follow Formosa, I definitely have to bring in supply. I'm down to a theater reserve of 60k aboard ships (the rest is already unloaded at various bases and therefore "committed.")

Supply is really an issue now. I think I have enough with that 60k to pull off a quick move against an isolated and battered Formosa....if KB stays away. As long as KB is away, my bombardment TFs and bombers can pulverize John's positions. And now my troops are highly prepped for three targets: Takao, Taichu and Taihoku. Most units are in the upper 80s or low 90s.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10606
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 3:57:56 PM   
paullus99


Posts: 1985
Joined: 1/23/2002
Status: offline 		Operationally, you're in great shape. Without those airfields & a contested China, John isn't going to be able to save Formosa - even with the KB.

He doesn't have enough carriers left to support that type of defense against your armada. At this point, better to work on getting supply to your troops and planning the next op - and, of course, get your bombing campaign off the ground.

Everything else is a sideshow - he's trying to nibble around the edges for VPs, but once the bombing campaign starts in earnest, he'll be wishing he had done more to keep you away from the HIs.

_____________________________

Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon...

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10607
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 4:07:57 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

That is how you do it...Japan's initial strength in the air gone, and the planes are destroyed on the ground. I wonder if he evacuated the pilots or if you are killing some pilots with each airfield strike?

I suspect you might be better served either cutting China in half and hooking up with the Chinese or picking targets closer to Honshu....but since I don't know troop strengths in that area I am simply speculating.

With no KB around, I might want to look at how could I activate the Soviets.


Activating the Soviets is one of three major possibilities I'm considering now. It's probably third on that list, only because it's something I know the least about.

I think I'd have to put enough Western Allied troops in Manchuria to negatively tilt John's garrison requirements. I don't have any idea how much cushion he has at the moment, so I don't know if the task is easy, feasible or long shot.

Before pulling the trigger on any operation that will follow Formosa, I definitely have to bring in supply. I'm down to a theater reserve of 60k aboard ships (the rest is already unloaded at various bases and therefore "committed.")

Supply is really an issue now. I think I have enough with that 60k to pull off a quick move against an isolated and battered Formosa....if KB stays away. As long as KB is away, my bombardment TFs and bombers can pulverize John's positions. And now my troops are highly prepped for three targets: Takao, Taichu and Taihoku. Most units are in the upper 80s or low 90s.


I'm only reading this side to enable me to comment freely. Obviously John knows Formosa is at risk, but I wonder what is his assessment of its status as an Allied target: does he think an invasion is pending or that it will be bypassed for now while the Allied invasions move northward?

As far as moving farther north in China, it's just difficult and resource intensive. I don't mean to suggest that it's a bad idea, but it will reduce what you have available elsewhere so it is very much a strategic level decision.

_____________________________

Intel Monkey: https://sites.google.com/view/staffmonkeys/home

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10608
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 4:20:37 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		I would say China would suck supplies away from the coast...but here the Burma road is open and there are no exclamation points in Chinese held bases.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 10609
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 5:39:58 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Japan has to keep a garrison, if it falls below the garrison requirement then a roll is made -- so it isn't automatic. It has nothing to do with the amount of your troops present.

I have no clue what your two other options are, but I suspect activating the Soviets early would be the toughest as you need to destroy/disable enough AV to cause Japan to drop below the garrison requirement, and then get the die roll. That is what makes the strategy attractive.

However, with an active China....


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10610
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 5:46:12 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Supply is arriving at Rangoon in pretty large amounts now. The Chinese bases and units in China are fully supplied. Some Chinese units are beginning to fill out.

But I don't plan to expand the ground war in China. I'll take Amoy. I may move on Swatow, just to keep up the appearance of a major offensive (I'm seeing a lot of movement dots on John's MLR with today's new turn, so John is reacting sharply now - I want to keep him thinking that way).

The importance of Formosa is so obvious that John will have to engage in mental gymnastics to reconcile himself to losing it. He poured 150k troops into it during the lead-up to Peep Show and he really worked its air defense hard. So, at one time he rated Formosa very highly.

If he keeps KB in the DEI with the Allies biting off chunks of China and Formosa, he's neutered himself as a general; he's too much in love with his Navy to expend it; he's fallen into the trap that General Lee spoke of (something to this effect: A good general must love his men but must be willing to lose his men; he must be willing to destroy that which he loves). Is John so in love with his navy that he's lost the ability to use sound military judgment?

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10611
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 5:54:25 PM   
paullus99


Posts: 1985
Joined: 1/23/2002
Status: offline 		Yes.

And to expand slightly, for John, it's always about the Navy, balanced with a desire to kill as much as he possibly can (a very offensive-minded fellow, by all indications).

It appears the desire to keep his remaining fleet intact is a lot more important than keep you from ranging in on the home islands


< Message edited by paullus99 -- 5/31/2017 5:59:29 PM >

_____________________________

Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon...

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10612
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:03:09 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

Is John so in love with his navy that he's lost the ability to use sound military judgment?

Turkey trots to water.

_____________________________

Intel Monkey: https://sites.google.com/view/staffmonkeys/home

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10613
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:15:12 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/7/44

Peep Show: No CAP over Formosa again today. If Allied bombers close Taichu (they should soon), his closest airfields will be Wenchow (level 3) and Okinawa. In other words, he won't have the ability to contest the air battle over Formosa.

Meanwhile, the Allies will have to big airfields (Amoy and Foochow) in close proximity, and Orchid Island went to level two today.

A mixed brigade arrived at Amoy today, in time to spoil the Allied deliberate attack, though forts dropped to 3. But I think this unit was his biggest defense force on the coast. If, as I expect, Allied bombers manhandle it, and if the next Allied attack overwhelms the defenses, John's position in coastal China collapses.

With this turn, I suddenly see lots of movement dots on his MLR today. So he's reacting sharply - perhaps even panicking a bit.




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(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 10614
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:25:37 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/7/44

SEAC: Signs that John is drawing down his MLR in China and pushing up big units from Indochina; this is understandable but ultimately may contribute to the avalanche, as Allied units may be able to press forward more freely....eventually moving into China and linking up with the Peep Show troops.




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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10615
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:30:49 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/7/44

KB: John's carriers are in position to do something....but haven't done anything yet.




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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10616
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:34:13 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/7/44

Aircraft Losses: John's losing a lot of good aircraft on the ground every day.




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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10617
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:40:09 PM   
paullus99


Posts: 1985
Joined: 1/23/2002
Status: offline 		Better he lose those Franks on the ground than you having to face them in the air....It appears that John didn't consider just how vulnerable Formosa is to bombardments.

_____________________________

Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon...

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10618
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:52:00 PM   
Panther Bait


Posts: 654
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline 		He might have thought the rail network on the island would help, but not when CR can shut all the fields down at the same time.

_____________________________

When you shoot at a destroyer and miss, it's like hit'in a wildcat in the ass with a banjo.

Nathan Dogan, USS Gurnard

(in reply to paullus99)
Post #: 10619
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 5/31/2017 6:53:39 PM   
DRF99


Posts: 90
Joined: 9/3/2009
Status: offline 		John pounded CR in Sumatra with constant bombardments. Now it's payback time.

(in reply to paullus99)
Post #: 10620
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