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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

 
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 2:27:24 PM   
Lecivius


Posts: 4845
Joined: 8/5/2007
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Thank you

_____________________________

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12901
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 3:18:20 PM   
crsutton


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AcePylut


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zecke

to--------Acepylut

ya ya ya..(means I GOT YOU)¡¡

so....

I know why this game is unfriendly; but the japans have fun until 43; then there are six crucial months where I GET really for playing this game; and then my game is finish and start another game called ADMIRAL EDITION where the allys have fun, but we dont;

then..you dont want to continue and understood; me too; why?

Because you only have to do, is play until 43, we see how you have fun. and the allys recognise your victory on how good are you played¡..maybe.

THEN ME..as japan continue your game; because am Spanish so if you want an AAR-PBME i will play what you have left; navy (dont sink too much) play until 43 and i continue until 46..and we compare what have you done and what have i done.

so start a PBME and i will take japan rest; just one favor build as much as you can JACKs about 3000. ACEPYLUT, 3000 jaks please. and go with the KBs TO HELL.




The reason I haven't made it to "end game" is because the Japanese player has always "disappeared" once the "Japanese fun time" is over (late '42).

I've got a game going on right now that looks promising. We're in Jan '42 (still early) but there's been good give and take. I've learned enough from my 5-7 previous short pbem's that I'm not going to, and don't have to, "Sir Robin".

If for some reason that game ends, I'll take you up on your offer. Unfortunately, as it is, due to real life commitments I can only really afford the time for 1 game at any given time.


Yep, the hardest part of this game is vetting opponents. I had long campaigns in WITP but my opponents eventually quit and never even bothered to respond. With AE I have been lucky in having an excellent opponent and we are deep into our 2nd campaign. If you are an Allied player I think it is best to find a top notch Japanese player and take your lumps. The average Japanese player can easily make a big mistake and lose heart early. Top players generally will not and take pride in fighting it out.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

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Post #: 12902
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 5:11:22 PM   
Flicker

 

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CR - to continue with crsutton's observation, I like how you are 'playing until the whistle blows' and fighting to the end, even though you might be able to hunker down, not take risks, and still win. Thanks.

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 12903
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:15:27 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Man, that is one good picture for your campaign!
The "troops surrounded" message usually means one or more units also gets eliminated. There might be only one or no enemy units there next turn.

IIRC Hué was the last place on the rail line up the EC of Vietnam that the Japanese held. If they retreated inland off the rail line, you can probably draw supply all the way to Vinh and load your LSTs there, shaving three or four days travel off their mission and saving a bunch of fuel too. Of course, clearing Hainan comes first.


Surrounded doesn't eliminate units, but it is bad. The only guidance I received on it was that it meant the number of disabled devices in the unit was doubled (presumably for each type of device).

I have to beg to differ - with evidence from a turn of mine this morning. The Allies invaded Pagan which was weakly held and attacked last turn, taking the base but not eliminating the enemy. But at the end of the ground combat phase of the turn (after one more combat in a different place) the text about Japanese troops surrounded at Pagan appeared, and the map for the next turn shows no IJA unit left on Pagan.
The Combat Report with overlay of the subsequent map:






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 12904
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:17:36 PM   
BBfanboy


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And the bottom of the Combat Report ....






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 12905
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:32:04 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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1/31/45

LOC Games: KB East appears to be raiding SoPac. I'll probably dangle a few small fry, like LSMs or LSTs. But I'll try to do a better job of keeping the merchantmen away. I don't plan to ambush KB, so this time there's no notion of enticing him forward and whittling away at his sorties and strike aircraft.

Despite the great interest John has shown and is continuing to show in my LOC from the DEI to Pago Pago - he's working very hard and scoring minor successes now and then - supply levels at Boela continue to rise nicely.






Attachment (1)

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Post #: 12906
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:42:20 PM   
HansBolter


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

And the bottom of the Combat Report ....








Yes, surrounded units CAN be eliminated by the surrounded status outside of the combat routine, but, like most things in this game, it's a variable chance and not a set result.

My experience is that 9 times out of 10 the surrounded units are still there the next turn waiting to be destroyed.

In fact, with large stacks surrounded, they can survive multiple turns in that surrounded condition.

_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 12907
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:50:07 PM   
Canoerebel


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My experience is identical to Hans's. I've had dozens of these reports in China the past few months. Most of the time the enemy units are still there, though very weak and about ready to capitulate or evaporate.

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 12908
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 6:55:03 PM   
witpqs


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Man, that is one good picture for your campaign!
The "troops surrounded" message usually means one or more units also gets eliminated. There might be only one or no enemy units there next turn.

IIRC Hué was the last place on the rail line up the EC of Vietnam that the Japanese held. If they retreated inland off the rail line, you can probably draw supply all the way to Vinh and load your LSTs there, shaving three or four days travel off their mission and saving a bunch of fuel too. Of course, clearing Hainan comes first.


Surrounded doesn't eliminate units, but it is bad. The only guidance I received on it was that it meant the number of disabled devices in the unit was doubled (presumably for each type of device).

I have to beg to differ - with evidence from a turn of mine this morning. The Allies invaded Pagan which was weakly held and attacked last turn, taking the base but not eliminating the enemy. But at the end of the ground combat phase of the turn (after one more combat in a different place) the text about Japanese troops surrounded at Pagan appeared, and the map for the next turn shows no IJA unit left on Pagan.
The Combat Report with overlay of the subsequent map:


What you are seeing is the confluence of two different things. A long time ago there was a discussion about the 'surrounded' message. MichaelM commented that the message indicates a unit is out of supply, and that explained what I had been seeing because I too had thought 'surrounded' meant the unit was being destroyed. I was seeing (and continued to see) 'surrounded' messages in many cases where the unit was still there the following turn (whether my unit or an enemy unit).

Being out of supply has consequences as we know. Those consequences plus whatever else the unit suffered earlier during the turn sometimes result in the unit being destroyed that same turn. But not always.

Your observations of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit being destroyed are certainly true, and the observations of others of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit not being destroyed are also true.

_____________________________


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Post #: 12909
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 7:03:36 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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1/31/45

Fancy Pants: More progress in the Coastal Plains. Big attack at Hong Kong tomorrow.

Funnel Cakes: Invasion armada should weigh anchor tonight.

Strategic Bombing: A few minor successes today, but the main raid aborts.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12910
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/9/2017 7:06:45 PM   
crsutton


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Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Man, that is one good picture for your campaign!
The "troops surrounded" message usually means one or more units also gets eliminated. There might be only one or no enemy units there next turn.

IIRC Hué was the last place on the rail line up the EC of Vietnam that the Japanese held. If they retreated inland off the rail line, you can probably draw supply all the way to Vinh and load your LSTs there, shaving three or four days travel off their mission and saving a bunch of fuel too. Of course, clearing Hainan comes first.


Surrounded doesn't eliminate units, but it is bad. The only guidance I received on it was that it meant the number of disabled devices in the unit was doubled (presumably for each type of device).

I have to beg to differ - with evidence from a turn of mine this morning. The Allies invaded Pagan which was weakly held and attacked last turn, taking the base but not eliminating the enemy. But at the end of the ground combat phase of the turn (after one more combat in a different place) the text about Japanese troops surrounded at Pagan appeared, and the map for the next turn shows no IJA unit left on Pagan.
The Combat Report with overlay of the subsequent map:


What you are seeing is the confluence of two different things. A long time ago there was a discussion about the 'surrounded' message. MichaelM commented that the message indicates a unit is out of supply, and that explained what I had been seeing because I too had thought 'surrounded' meant the unit was being destroyed. I was seeing (and continued to see) 'surrounded' messages in many cases where the unit was still there the following turn (whether my unit or an enemy unit).

Being out of supply has consequences as we know. Those consequences plus whatever else the unit suffered earlier during the turn sometimes result in the unit being destroyed that same turn. But not always.

Your observations of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit being destroyed are certainly true, and the observations of others of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit not being destroyed are also true.


As well as being out of supply, experience, morale, disruption and fatigue all play a factor. Japanese rear echelon units are wiped out a lot faster than an elite SNLF force which might last to the bitter end.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 12911
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 2:14:46 AM   
Lokasenna


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From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

And the bottom of the Combat Report ....








Yes, surrounded units CAN be eliminated by the surrounded status outside of the combat routine, but, like most things in this game, it's a variable chance and not a set result.

My experience is that 9 times out of 10 the surrounded units are still there the next turn waiting to be destroyed.

In fact, with large stacks surrounded, they can survive multiple turns in that surrounded condition.


What version of the game? Because Michael M fixed this quite some time ago - from what he said, the surrounded message does not kill units.

Since playing with that patch, I've never had it occur. Units killed are always wiped out by attrition or in combat.

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 12912
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 2:21:09 AM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Man, that is one good picture for your campaign!
The "troops surrounded" message usually means one or more units also gets eliminated. There might be only one or no enemy units there next turn.

IIRC Hué was the last place on the rail line up the EC of Vietnam that the Japanese held. If they retreated inland off the rail line, you can probably draw supply all the way to Vinh and load your LSTs there, shaving three or four days travel off their mission and saving a bunch of fuel too. Of course, clearing Hainan comes first.


Surrounded doesn't eliminate units, but it is bad. The only guidance I received on it was that it meant the number of disabled devices in the unit was doubled (presumably for each type of device).

I have to beg to differ - with evidence from a turn of mine this morning. The Allies invaded Pagan which was weakly held and attacked last turn, taking the base but not eliminating the enemy. But at the end of the ground combat phase of the turn (after one more combat in a different place) the text about Japanese troops surrounded at Pagan appeared, and the map for the next turn shows no IJA unit left on Pagan.
The Combat Report with overlay of the subsequent map:


What you are seeing is the confluence of two different things. A long time ago there was a discussion about the 'surrounded' message. MichaelM commented that the message indicates a unit is out of supply, and that explained what I had been seeing because I too had thought 'surrounded' meant the unit was being destroyed. I was seeing (and continued to see) 'surrounded' messages in many cases where the unit was still there the following turn (whether my unit or an enemy unit).

Being out of supply has consequences as we know. Those consequences plus whatever else the unit suffered earlier during the turn sometimes result in the unit being destroyed that same turn. But not always.

Your observations of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit being destroyed are certainly true, and the observations of others of the 'surrounded' message being associated with a unit not being destroyed are also true.


Simply being out of supply is not the only thing that triggers that message. I think there also need to have been attacks on the unit in the recent turn(s). Simply closing all the hex sides to a given hex and sitting there waiting for the "Surrounded" message... well, you'll be waiting forever. I suspect this is because the hex is still under enemy control.

A base, on the other hand, you can take control of without the units retreating away (a non-base hex is never taken over until enemy units are no longer in it). This means you will have attacked, but I suspect it really does hinge upon who controls the hex and something about the status of the surrounded unit (could be supply, could be morale, could be disruption). I suspect that if there is a valid retreat path, this is when you see the "X unit retreating towards Y base!" messages that occur after all of the land combat phase is over - the same conditions, I think.

I want to reiterate that since Michael made the fix to stop surrounded units from teleporting to home base sometimes, I've never seen a surrounded unit be wiped out without also seeing the "wiped out due to attrition" message and I've surrounded and destroyed hundreds (thousands?) of units on both sides between 4 different PBEMs since that was patched ~2 or ~3 years ago. Not one time.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 12913
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 3:34:32 AM   
BBfanboy


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That probably explains our different perspectives Loka. I have V24 of the game. For a number of reasons I balked at the next patch. I didn't have a problem with surrounded units with 0 AV left being auto-wiped out either.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 12914
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 4:01:14 AM   
Flicker

 

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I've seen the 'unit surrounded' message and if the unit is not quite dead it is certainly pining for the fjords.

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Post #: 12915
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 4:15:39 PM   
Canoerebel


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2/1/45

Enemy Counterespionage or Vomitos de Informacion: John sent this email with the new turn: Are you seriously looking at making another Amphib Landing in China/Manchuria/Korea?  Wow.  Roll the dice Sir.  I’ve got anywhere from 600—3,100 AV at the coast ports.  This could be interesting to watch.

John is an excitable young man, so sometimes he blurts the first thing that comes to his mind. Sometimes the comments strike me as genuine (as when he said Ningpo "wasn't important"). Sometimes the comments strike me as the false bravado of a worried player (as when he threatened utter mayhem if Death Star dared to steam pass Formosa, many months ago, and it proceeded to do so with impunity).

I think this is the false bravado of a worried player. Apparently he doesn't realize I've had detection on many of his bases for a long time. I know there are many holes in his defenses. My major concern is that he has a mobile (strat mode) reserve force at a central location, waiting to train into the invasion beach. He failed to do that before (Formosa) much to the chagrin of some of his experienced readers (who commented in my AAR). They've probably tutored him well since then, so I'm expecting something of the sort. Which is why I hope: (1) my para-assaults will knock those units out of strat mode (assuming he is guessing the right beach) and (2) the overwhelming weight of USN bombardment TFs against clear terrain will prove effective.

This is not cakewalk. It could prove very nettlesome and turn ugly. But I'm going to work it, as getting an advanced airfield in Korea would be a major step in the right direction. If John does outguess me, I'll pick up my troops and proceed with Plan B. I hope Plan B won't be necessary.

(in reply to Flicker)
Post #: 12916
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 5:07:10 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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2/1/45

KB East: Target appears to be the sea lanes around Fiji and Pago Pago.




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 12917
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 5:40:21 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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2/1/45

Fancy Pants: Allied forces rapidly closing on Suchow, a key base in the center of the plains. I need the airfield. Too, taking it will allow reinforcements to move by strat mode all the way from Nanchang and Shanghai.

Down south, the Allies extinguish opposition at Kukong, freeing up a large number of units to serve elsewhere.

And Hong Kong is cracking fast.

Funnel Cakes: Looks like D-Day Gunzan will be tomorrow. This is a complicated landing, with the prospect of enemy reinforcments...plus how to configure carrier fighters to defend the carriers and the invasion shipping against the big enemy airfields. Kyushu and southern Honshu are pretty close.

I have my fighters set lower than I used to. Hellcat-3s at 8k; Hellcat-5s at 10k; Corsair-1As at 12k; Corsair-1Ds at 15k. All fighters are fresh and will be set to range 1 or 2 (haven't decided yet how close DS will come to the beach, but probably 1 hex).

I suspect that John has carriers up here - probably enough to hold 300 to 450 aircraft. But the bulk of his carriers are in SoPac or near the Carolines. This allows me to configure DS for defense. I have relatively few strike aircraft (mostly CVE Avengers set for ASW duty). If full KB was up here this particular aspect of the invasion would play out much differently.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 11/10/2017 5:42:02 PM >

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Post #: 12918
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 6:20:24 PM   
crsutton


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I think the biggest weakness of his raiding operations is that you almost all the time know where his carriers are and can operate with impunity. At this stage the Japanese should not be revealing his had so much. My opponent is a master at hiding his carriers. I have superior forces but it drives me to distraction.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

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Post #: 12919
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 6:24:15 PM   
Canoerebel


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I agree: Fleet-in-Being should be a big part of every player's repertoire. I suspect John's readers have prodded him, but he's stubborn.

But there's always a chance that the table turns and he ends up scoring a big strike here. A few weeks ago, a strike of something like 6 Judys and 5 Franks came against Death Star with its umpteen zillion fighters....and one Judy managed to plant a hit on CA Pensacola. That still has me shaking my head....and it makes for unrestful contemplations as I plan this invasion.

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 12920
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 6:50:37 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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1945 requires a change in mindset. A 40 VP CA is a who-cares when you're reaping five-figures a month in strat. Ditto him cruising about plinking transports. It just doesn't matter.

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The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12921
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 7:08:43 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
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It might matter, a bit. As you noted a week or two ago, the cumulative affect of losing ships (or whatever) does impact the bottom line. John's going to score some points here and there, but I don't need to give him any more assists.

The thing about the little Judy raid that somehow penetrated Death Star to score a hit on Pensacola....what happens when 1,000 kamikazes, bombers and escorts show up? Can DS CAP handle the threat? I think so, but I don't know for sure. John will never have a better chance to strike than tomorrow, so perhaps we'll find out.

Am I making a mistake by invading Korea? I suppose its debatable, like everything. The thing is, I KNOW I can use an airfield to good effect in achieving the final victory. And I THINK Death Star is up to the task (part of the equation - if John loses 750 aircraft in return for 375 points of Allied shipping, it works out fine for auto-vic purposes). I do wish I had enough experience to better gauge whether I'm taking the wrong chance here. That's part of playing deeply and learning new things.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 12922
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 7:42:29 PM   
BBfanboy


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Your map shows DS and herd five hexes from Gunzan. Assuming max speed progress of six hexes per turn, the Amphibs will only have the last unload phase of the day to unload troops. The bridgehead will be small and vulnerable. He can set a shock attack at the beginning of the turn following.

I am uncertain whether it would be better to wait until the following turn to start unloading or whether getting a few ashore next turn will be better. Your thoughts?

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12923
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 7:58:28 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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I'll have to double check, but nearly all of my amphibs are APA and AKA that will make good speed. There are LSTs carrying tanks that will make six hexes.

But there's no worry about a shock attack. That couldn't occur until the evening of Day 2, after which the Allies will have had another full day to unload.

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 12924
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 8:33:57 PM   
HansBolter


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

2/1/45

Enemy Counterespionage or Vomitos de Informacion: John sent this email with the new turn: Are you seriously looking at making another Amphib Landing in China/Manchuria/Korea?  Wow.  Roll the dice Sir.  I’ve got anywhere from 600—3,100 AV at the coast ports.  This could be interesting to watch.

John is an excitable young man, so sometimes he blurts the first thing that comes to his mind. Sometimes the comments strike me as genuine (as when he said Ningpo "wasn't important"). Sometimes the comments strike me as the false bravado of a worried player (as when he threatened utter mayhem if Death Star dared to steam pass Formosa, many months ago, and it proceeded to do so with impunity).

I think this is the false bravado of a worried player. Apparently he doesn't realize I've had detection on many of his bases for a long time. I know there are many holes in his defenses. My major concern is that he has a mobile (strat mode) reserve force at a central location, waiting to train into the invasion beach. He failed to do that before (Formosa) much to the chagrin of some of his experienced readers (who commented in my AAR). They've probably tutored him well since then, so I'm expecting something of the sort. Which is why I hope: (1) my para-assaults will knock those units out of strat mode (assuming he is guessing the right beach) and (2) the overwhelming weight of USN bombardment TFs against clear terrain will prove effective.

This is not cakewalk. It could prove very nettlesome and turn ugly. But I'm going to work it, as getting an advanced airfield in Korea would be a major step in the right direction. If John does outguess me, I'll pick up my troops and proceed with Plan B. I hope Plan B won't be necessary.



I was wondering if you had considered Moppo. It's not a good choice if one is looking to exploit into and conquer Korea being disconnected from both rail and road nets, but is ideal if you only want a fighter base (good size potential) in range of the HI and being off the travel networks makes it very difficult to counterattack with a mobile reserve.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 11/10/2017 8:36:03 PM >


_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12925
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 9:22:02 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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Joined: 2/24/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

It might matter, a bit. As you noted a week or two ago, the cumulative affect of losing ships (or whatever) does impact the bottom line. John's going to score some points here and there, but I don't need to give him any more assists.

The thing about the little Judy raid that somehow penetrated Death Star to score a hit on Pensacola....what happens when 1,000 kamikazes, bombers and escorts show up? Can DS CAP handle the threat? I think so, but I don't know for sure. John will never have a better chance to strike than tomorrow, so perhaps we'll find out.

Am I making a mistake by invading Korea? I suppose its debatable, like everything. The thing is, I KNOW I can use an airfield to good effect in achieving the final victory. And I THINK Death Star is up to the task (part of the equation - if John loses 750 aircraft in return for 375 points of Allied shipping, it works out fine for auto-vic purposes). I do wish I had enough experience to better gauge whether I'm taking the wrong chance here. That's part of playing deeply and learning new things.



I don't think Korea is a mistake. It directly supports the strat bombing effort in the same ways an Hokkaido plunge does.

At this point my comments here should be construed as "have a beer" comments., or "cup of coffee" if you like. Not advisory; just observational. You're doing fine, and better than fine, and I guess that's the heart of my comment above. You are volunteering for carpal tunnel when all you need to really do is burn him down. You can table the land war, table the southern map, table Indo-China and Malaysia, and just bomb and be done.

You don't because the amateur shrink in me senses anticipatory nostalgia. This is soon over, and you and John move on. Maybe forever in game terms, maybe for just years. So the more you do every turn, the more complexity you add, the longer the goodbye lasts. Sweet.

I also wish he had tried a mass kami effort. I REALLY want to see what can be done in those terms with current patches. It's been years since I faced them. There would be carnage, yes, and that was his last, best chance to play a real VP game and stave off defeat past August and the Decisive marker. But he doesn't seem to want to play. I think it would have been good for you too, as obvert will sure as all hell hit you with mass kamis.

I'm going to follow your game with obvert to see if you got bad habits from this one. John lets you get away with a lot of cheese (in a baseball sense of the word, to confuse the Brits here ) that obvert will punish. The picture of your checkerboard subs in shallow water, week after week, month after month, just amazes me for one example.

In RL the Allies didn't stop fighting in China once the strat bombing began. So I get it. But if your wrists start barking . . .

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The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12926
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/10/2017 10:25:19 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
You're exactly right in so many things, Bullwinkle, right down to my wrists hurting. It's taking me 2 to 5 hours every turn now. And the maps for the AAR take an additional 30 to 45 minutes. But I enjoy it.

And part of the reason for this invasion is because I need to see what kamikazes are capable of doing. I seriously considered aborting to the second target - John has no airfields to speak of up there; but I need to see how maximum power is handled on both ends of the equation.

The one place I'd quibble with you is about the level of complexity needed - or not? - to finish the game. I'm only scoring about 3k to 5k strategic points per month (not "five digits"). At this rate, victory would be five to eight months away. But I think if I work everything hard, victory may be three months away. More problematic is that I may face issues with my bomber pools. I'm counting on Strategic Bombing...but taking precautions in case it proves to be an issue.

In addition to strategic bombing, I'm scoring a lot of points by wiping out enemy units and by taking and building good bases. Those are efficient ways to rack up points.

I think destroying enemy ships is also becoming pretty efficient. I've pulled the right levers a good bit lately, because John has been rather desperate to shove convoys in tight places. That should continue as the Allies consolidate gains.

So, yes, I'm obsessing over the complexity of the game...learning, learning, learning, enjoying, enjoying, enjoying....and cognizant that these points may become vital before it's all said and done.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 12927
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/11/2017 12:55:43 AM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
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CR, I don't know what you know, only what I've read in your AAR. I think Korea is a good decision. Especially getting in now when you know at least a major portion of his carriers are elsewhere. Heck, even the ones you worry about being close might not be quite close enough to influence the next two days.

_____________________________


(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12928
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/11/2017 1:53:51 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
The turn has been sent to John. The invasion is supposed to look like this:

1. Amphibious assault divided into fast and slow TFs that will proceed to the beaches, accompanied by two combat TFs, minesweepers, ASW.
2. Death Star takes position one hex to the NW with all fighters set to range two or three. I'm expecting bleed-over CAP to handle the invasion beach.
3. B-24Js from Ningpo to target ground troops at Gunzan.
4. Transports to drop paratroops at three rail junctions (this will happen late in the day). The paratroops may evaporate but there's a chance they'll throw enemy units out of Strat mode, hindering Just in Time reinforcements.
5. I'll be marginally surprised if John triggers an all-out naval attack or aerial assault tomorrow. I think he's just a little unsure yet what's happening and where....and I think this caught him by enough surprise that he'll have to scramble to put everything together. I expect mostly small naval craft, a modest number of strike aircraft, and probably railed-in reinforcements.
6. No bombardments tomorrow. I'm saving the big boys for the next day, when John's reinforcements will be in the open terrain.

I think this invasion caught John by surprise and leaning towards China. He has some divisions way up there and recon suggests that the Gunzan garrison is down considerably from what it was several weeks ago. But I may be wrong. If John's email message this a.m. was genuine, I am wrong. But I think he was blowin' in the wind.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 12929
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 11/11/2017 2:03:21 AM   
MakeeLearn


Posts: 4278
Joined: 9/11/2016
Status: offline
Kido Butai OR

Nana-san-ichi Butai!!!

RHS mod has Unit 731 ?



Mukden/Changchun a possible large concentration of troops.

< Message edited by MakeeLearn -- 11/11/2017 2:14:11 AM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 12930
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