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Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 3:14:42 PM   
republicofpepsi

 

Posts: 68
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		Can someone comment on what is planned for the future of Distant Worlds? Will we see more expansions to the current engine, or is there a 'new from the ground up' Distant Worlds in our future? No specifics, I just want to know that Distant Worlds will have a long future ahead of it.

In my opinion, Distant Worlds is one of the gems in the Matrix collection. There is nothing else out there that matches the complexity and 'living universe' of Distant Worlds.
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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 4:10:28 PM   
Tyrador


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Status: offline 		Ever heard of Stardrive?

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 4:24:53 PM   
Wolfe1759


Posts: 798
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From: Shropshire, UK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?


I had hopes for this but it seems to be getting lukewarm at best reviews / forum comments from what I've seen so saving my money to spend on Shadows instead.

P.S. don't mean to derail this thread with a DW vs. SD discussion - that discussion might make an interesting thread in it's self however.

< Message edited by Wolfe -- 4/30/2013 4:27:14 PM >

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 5:08:33 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: republicofpepsi
Can someone comment on what is planned for the future of Distant Worlds? Will we see more expansions to the current engine, or is there a 'new from the ground up' Distant Worlds in our future? No specifics, I just want to know that Distant Worlds will have a long future ahead of it.

In my opinion, Distant Worlds is one of the gems in the Matrix collection. There is nothing else out there that matches the complexity and 'living universe' of Distant Worlds.


Thank you for the compliments.

We're about to release Distant Worlds: Shadows, the next expansion. The current plan is to have a modder-focused expansion after that and then start work on Distant Worlds 2. This is subject to change though. If Shadows and the modder-focused expansion do very well we may look at extending DW 1 a bit further, but we'd really like to do a new engine to show what we can do.

Regards,

- Erik


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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 6:26:14 PM   
CyclopsSlayer


Posts: 583
Joined: 2/11/2012
Status: offline 		Tried SD, and it is rather like a snack. Meanwhile DW is a 4 course meal.

I play both, when I want light mindless entertainment SD comes in handy. If I want to be challenged DW all the way. If only there was a way to convert all those now antique Mods to work with Legends all would be perfect.

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Post #: 5
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 7:04:10 PM   
republicofpepsi

 

Posts: 68
Joined: 10/14/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?


I own it, but in my opinion it is just a different scale of game. The civilian economy and resource production tree in Distant Worlds is unmatched in other space 4x's. My only wish for Distant Worlds is for that resource tree to be a little more apparent and difficult...like the Anno series.



Thank-you Erik for the followup. I look forward to years of more Distant Worlds!

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Post #: 6
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 8:21:07 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		I hope Shadows and the Mod expansion is just "right" in success, then.

I think a new engine and an option to "reset" the total package price would be quite good. As long as "DW2" can be thrown together in a reasonable amount of time. Hopefully some reuse will be possible.

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 8:54:56 PM   
republicofpepsi

 

Posts: 68
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		I agree, it is time for a new engine. A new engine and the ability to visualize the production chain better. In turn, we should have to fight more often for resources. In most games its either feast or famine. I hate to belabor my Anno comparison, but something akin to that.

I just hope the new engine remains 2D in imagery but is something that can take the burden off the CPU and onto the GPU. (Something like AI War's engine change) 3D killed my previous favorite 4X (Space Empires).

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 8:56:58 PM   
ASHBERY76


Posts: 2136
Joined: 10/10/2001
From: England
Status: offline 		I think DW could still use another expansion adding sophisticated internal politics and diplomacy based on the Paradox game model.Claims and A war goals system like in EU3/4 would be a perfect fit for this game.More immersion to the living galaxy adding many monsters types,random events and planet specials.

< Message edited by ASHBERY76 -- 4/30/2013 8:57:42 PM >

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 9:07:15 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		I am no graphics programmer, but 2D in a 3D engine would probably be nice. It just have to be easy for Elliot (and modders) too.

I don't mind the graphics at all but some things would not hurt:

- Faster
- Better scrolling
- Away with media player reliance.

I hope the mod expansion is a way to prepare the core items for an engine upgrade. I don't want a reinvented DW, just a "fresher" one, so bringing the logic core along would not hurt at all...


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Post #: 10
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 9:58:58 PM   
Buio


Posts: 247
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CyclopsSlayer
Tried SD, and it is rather like a snack. Meanwhile DW is a 4 course meal.

I play both, when I want light mindless entertainment SD comes in handy. If I want to be challenged DW all the way. If only there was a way to convert all those now antique Mods to work with Legends all would be perfect.

I don't think it is a fair comparison. To get Distant Worlds up to course meal level you need all expansions, which costs 696 SEK here in Sweden. Stardrive costs 230 SEK. Stardrive is in its infancy while Distant Worlds soon has it's third expansion.

If you browse the web for Distant Worlds reviews from 2010 when it was released, it didn't get as high praise back then. But it shows you what continued support for a game can do. Another example of games that has improved a lot with continued support is Fallen Enchantress: Legendary Heroes, which is an enormous amount better than the original Elemental game. Endless Space is also coming along fine, looking forward to the expansion.

I like both games. I think Stardrive has the potential to become great with time. It's already good in my opinion. As for Distant Worlds, I'm really exited for the Shadows expansion.


< Message edited by Buio -- 4/30/2013 10:01:39 PM >

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 10:03:30 PM   
Cauldyth

 

Posts: 752
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I think DW could still use another expansion adding sophisticated internal politics and diplomacy based on the Paradox game model.Claims and A war goals system like in EU3/4 would be a perfect fit for this game.More immersion to the living galaxy adding many monsters types,random events and planet specials.

Hear! Hear! I want my Paradox-style politics in space!

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Post #: 12
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 10:57:02 PM   
madflava13


Posts: 1530
Joined: 2/7/2001
From: Alexandria, VA
Status: offline 		I just picked up Legends myself... Been away from this game too long. Enjoying it immensely!

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Post #: 13
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 4/30/2013 11:35:04 PM   
Antiscamp


Posts: 345
Joined: 5/14/2012
Status: offline 		Some detailed internal politics with political factions, problems and decisions would be a great idea to continue building on Distant Worlds. Also, more attention to diplomacy in conjunction with such an updated political simulation would be nice to see. I see lots of interesting possibilities for a strategy game of this magnitude in that political/diplomatic department.

I am also really glad to hear that Distant Worlds 2 is being planned!

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 12:01:37 AM   
republicofpepsi

 

Posts: 68
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		As much as developers try, I've really never seen a good diplomacy mechanic. A simple update would maybe to be to introduce some randomness as to whether AI's like you or not. Would make for some interesting unlikely ally games.

I do hope that Distant Worlds 2 would incorporate some sort of jump in/out multiplayer. So someone could open their game up and allow a friend to take over a specific AI for a bit. Distant Worlds and other epic 4X's are almost impossible to play to full term...but a drop in/out mechanic like the original SOTS would be fun. It would need some server defined rules so that a random person couldn't change the diplomatic settings so that your strong ally wouldn't turn on you because a player popped in...but it would give a big boost to "AI" if at times you were fighting a real person if only for an hour or so. With Shadows, a new player could spawn as a pirate faction, etc.

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Post #: 15
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 12:09:18 AM   
Simulation01


Posts: 540
Joined: 5/12/2010
Status: offline 		I've wanted more diplomatic depth for a long time but, none of the expansions have delivered it. I don't really know why this is and, I'm not saying I don't like the added tech, component, concept depth either...I just want diplomacy that is more than the equivalent of body gestures and grunting. I just think that for some reason civilization simulations whether in space or terrestrial based all seem to skimp on diplomacy and it's irritating/infuriating since diplomacy is key to a civilizations survival.

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Post #: 16
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 12:45:21 AM   
Mad Igor

 

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Joined: 6/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?

you probably never played one of those games,cuz if you had,you would never compare them.
next time do your homework b4 talking.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
we'd really like to do a new engine to show what we can do.

Regards,

- Erik


you haz my wallet.(if only i had one.lolololo)

< Message edited by Mad Igor -- 5/1/2013 12:49:00 AM >

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Post #: 17
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 2:23:27 AM   
Cauldyth

 

Posts: 752
Joined: 6/27/2010
Status: offline 		Well, I'm guessing (I'm no AI programmer) that the problem with complex diplomacy is that it's fuzzier than other aspects of the game. An AI can be pretty damn good at tweaking an economy to be optimal, since it's just optimizing numbers. Diplomacy, on the other hand, is messy.

But nevertheless, it's always at the top of my list of desires. Perhaps that's why I like CK2 so much.

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Post #: 18
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 3:49:30 AM   
Hawawaa


Posts: 108
Joined: 11/21/2010
Status: offline 		Eric as long as there is more expansions for DW you have my money! (same for DW2)

I only want to beg you for coop/multiplayer. I understand that single player gamers outnumber the multiplayer gamers player base. They should be made happy first. But at the very end please add multiplayer. (begs and throws money)

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 3:52:32 AM   
Simulation01


Posts: 540
Joined: 5/12/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cauldyth

Well, I'm guessing (I'm no AI programmer) that the problem with complex diplomacy is that it's fuzzier than other aspects of the game. An AI can be pretty damn good at tweaking an economy to be optimal, since it's just optimizing numbers. Diplomacy, on the other hand, is messy.

But nevertheless, it's always at the top of my list of desires. Perhaps that's why I like CK2 so much.




I haven't played CK2 but, from what I've seen on Youtube it places too much emphasis on diplomacy between noblemen within your own empire. I'm not too fond of the idea of having to bribe the Duke of York to defend York in my name.

I do however like the idea of being able to give/sell units, form larger multiparty alliances like NATO, negotiating demilitarized zones, having multi-empire negotiations, conducting joint wargames with allies to build ties, generate experience and, to intimidate rivals.

I would also like to be able to build embassy's and, consulates. Sign secret treaty's. Arms limitations treaty's.


This is not diplomacy related but, the idea of having biological and nano weapons would be nice. Spreading plague to the worlds of your enemy's would be a cool touch.

A lot of this stuff has been mentioned years ago now and, we still haven't seen it. Don't get me wrong...I love what we have I just don't know why we haven't been thrown a bone on some of this stuff...including artificial world construction, star destroying, wormholes, jumpgates etc...etc...

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 4:28:23 AM   
Veloxi


Posts: 126
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?

It's no Distant Worlds my friend.

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 9:18:10 AM   
Tyrador


Posts: 170
Joined: 1/29/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Igor

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?

you probably never played one of those games,cuz if you had,you would never compare them.
next time do your homework b4 talking.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
we'd really like to do a new engine to show what we can do.

Regards,

- Erik


you haz my wallet.(if only i had one.lolololo)


I'm playing it right now! Before you write, I suggest you to use brain more often.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Veloxi


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tyrador

Ever heard of Stardrive?

It's no Distant Worlds my friend.


Well done captain obvious!

< Message edited by Tyrador -- 5/1/2013 9:37:57 AM >

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 10:42:09 AM   
VorteeX

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Thank you for the compliments.

We're about to release Distant Worlds: Shadows, the next expansion. The current plan is to have a modder-focused expansion after that and then start work on Distant Worlds 2. This is subject to change though. If Shadows and the modder-focused expansion do very well we may look at extending DW 1 a bit further, but we'd really like to do a new engine to show what we can do.

Regards,

- Erik



Whatever you do is good idea with new engine. For DW1 still better, visual, ship design left to do. But please please don't sacrifice game complexity to make new engine. DW sink this way into many other failure games

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 11:57:37 AM   
republicofpepsi

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VorteeX

Whatever you do is good idea with new engine. For DW1 still better, visual, ship design left to do. But please please don't sacrifice game complexity to make new engine. DW sink this way into many other failure games



I agree, it is Distant Worlds wargame like complexity that makes it stand out from the crowd.

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Post #: 24
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 1:43:03 PM   
Cauldyth

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Simulation01
I haven't played CK2 but, from what I've seen on Youtube it places too much emphasis on diplomacy between noblemen within your own empire. I'm not too fond of the idea of having to bribe the Duke of York to defend York in my name.


Nah, I would never advocate CK2-levels of internal and external diplomacy, that's an entire game unto itself. CK2 is almost entirely focused on that aspect, and de-emphasizes everything else. It would be out of place in DW.

I'd love to see EU3/Victoria2 type international diplomacy though, especially something like war goals and the crisis system in the new Victoria 2 expansion. Imagine a Crisis event forming because the Ackdarians have a disputed system in Teekan space. The tension percentage grows over time as it remains unresolved, and the other major races can align themselves with one side or the other, or remain neutral (at a cost in prestige or an equivalent). As the powers align on either side of the issue, it will either be resolved peacefully as one side sees they're being outnumbered and gives in to demands, or erupt into full scale war between the two factions if the tension reaches 100% without resolution.

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Post #: 25
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 7:57:57 PM   
ASHBERY76


Posts: 2136
Joined: 10/10/2001
From: England
Status: offline 		Indeed Cau the system would be perfect.The game already has a underused reputation mechanic in place and with war goals and a casus belli system included would improve the simulation a great deal.I wonder in Elliot has ever played those Paradox games.

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RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 8:56:35 PM   
Cauldyth

 

Posts: 752
Joined: 6/27/2010
Status: offline 		Another thing I love about the Paradox games is the concept of limited war, which is what Ashbury is referring to when he mentions war goals and casus belli.

Casus Belli: A "case for war" that is essentially a widely recognized grievance you have which would justify you going to war. If you have a casus belli, then no one will fault you for being the instigator of a war - after all, you have a good case for it. Declaring a war without a good case for it earns you a reputation as an aggressive jerk, and other empires will not like you for it (after all, if you're continually going to war for no good reason, who's to say they aren't next on your hit list?).

War Goals: When war does break out, the war has an explicit goal to it which is not simply the complete annihilation, subjugation, or annexation of your opponent. In the example I mentioned in my earlier post, if war breaks out because of a disputed colony, the war goal will be the transfer of ownership of that colony. The casus belli used to start the war determines what the war goal will be. Over the course of the war, you can occupy enemy planets, but that doesn't mean you get to keep them when the war is over. The stated war goals did not include you annexing large parts of your neighbour, so you need to withdraw your troops once the war is over.

It's the one thing I really wish 4X games would borrow from Paradox. I'm tired of all wars being wars of annihilation. I want border disputes, and more limited engagements.


< Message edited by Cauldyth -- 5/1/2013 8:57:47 PM >

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Post #: 27
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 9:45:56 PM   
republicofpepsi

 

Posts: 68
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		I love the idea of complex diplomacy but I think the core resource mechanic needs the most work. It is also the component that makes DW unique. We need more feedback from the private industry and UI cues to help us see what has gone wrong or what we need...which also means we need more limited resources.

I'd like to see private industry expanded even further. It would be neat to see private industry exert political pressure on us. "Protect our shipping better or we'll go on strike!" (Shipyards produce at 50%). In a dream world...it would be neat to see Private industry compete for defense contracts. As new technology comes out competing companies submit designs, etc.

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Post #: 28
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 10:15:05 PM   
Plant


Posts: 418
Joined: 4/23/2013
Status: offline 		In a universe where you can blow up planets on a whim, discover Ancient Guardians, explore an epic past, and the return of aliens from an another galaxy, a casus belli system which is essentially only relevent to medieval European states on Earth seems a bit out of place.

This is a game of Galactic Empires. The politics of imperialism and colonialism of modern era realpolitik is the most appropriate. Though it could do with some expansion, such as greater checks on the ability of "good" governments' ability to wage war, but the current reputation mechanic and overall diplomacy does it's job well. Does diplomacy need an overhaul? I caution against asking for more features such as complicated diplomacy, when a better AI in certain areas or a clearer economic system would improve gameplay immensely.

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Post #: 29
RE: Future of Distant Worlds - 5/1/2013 10:33:24 PM   
ASHBERY76


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From: England
Status: offline
quote:

Casus belli is a Latin expression meaning the justification for acts of war


Sorry but this does not go obsolete for any age,time or galaxy.

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