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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 3:50:34 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		While the Deathstar is busy at Wake, and most of the American Navy it seems, I am shipping tons and tons of supplies forward. 40K to the Rabaul area; 122K Guam/Saipan, 15K to Kusaie and Ponape.

I guess you trade supplies forward for time...but boy, do those 4Es eat up the supplies. It would be nice if the AA could kill more...

Home Islands will top 4 million supplies in ten to fifteen days. In the last 15 days we have added roughly 150K. The increased pace of attacks in Burma are taking its toll. I am going to scale back the bombing in China to conserve some.




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/30/2015 4:55:20 PM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 5:24:58 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline 		If your CV TFs had detected (and therefore reacted towards) each other, you would have gotten an 8-hex strike on him.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 5:45:54 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		"Lots and lots of supply"

From an Allied perspective, what you have there can be dumped into one base in a day or two and left there forgotten. As Japan, you must hit the "B" button and sort by Supply to see where you may have a 10 to 20,000 not being used.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 7:41:11 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Bombardments away!

Targets Port Blair and Trinkat.




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 7:44:45 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

"Lots and lots of supply"

From an Allied perspective, what you have there can be dumped into one base in a day or two and left there forgotten. As Japan, you must hit the "B" button and sort by Supply to see where you may have a 10 to 20,000 not being used.


Ridicule me for my lots of supply statement...but everything is relative.

BTW, I can remember a post of yours way back when you said one thing you did every turn was to hit the S key and sort by endurance every turn. Something I do every other turn or so... From that post I learned the joys of sorting the master database files.

I am still waiting to discover the joy of the tangent however.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 7:49:48 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

If your CV TFs had detected (and therefore reacted towards) each other, you would have gotten an 8-hex strike on him.


It probably would have been tough: 168 A6M5c and 70 torpedo bombers into probably 300+ CAP since he would have no strike of his own. I was hoping his planes would launch and attack Wake and my planes would fly into the depleted deathstar with only radar warning.

I am going to retire and wait for the full kb to form up: 700+ planes. And then seek a defensive engagement with much land based air.


< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/30/2015 8:58:34 PM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/30/2015 11:32:57 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		I have reinforcements heading towards the Tuang Gyi...but the Allies have amassed over 2000 vehicles there so I am having a tough time...expect more heavy air bombardments and another deliberate attack. Way too many Allied tanks.

I had thought the monsoon would slow the Allied offensive, but exactly the opposite is happening as I can't keep everyone supplied. Bitten by my own hopes!

I think the next day won't be any fun: Wake most likely falls; Tuang Gyi could depending upon die roll; Trinkat should hold and the 4th ID is on the way. At least the KB should escape and supplies reach some front line troops.

Trying a sub surge on Wake, for some odd reason I couldn't create more minisubs. Port is not damaged, 18K supplies (which will fall into the hands of the Americans). One reason I have so much supply was to keep creating new minisubs each turn, but the button, although white and active, doesn't create any. Disappointing, as I wanted to coordinate the sub rush with and minisub rush too.

Laying two minefields at Perth with nasty sub laid mines, several small minefields are going into ports in the PI, in the hopes of catching his bold submarines. So far this month, I have sunk 6 Allied subs, unfortunately, I have lost 4. But if they can net a CVE at Wake, it will be worth it.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/31/2015 2:23:45 AM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 1:16:26 AM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		New plane next month. Thank goodness it uses another engine, this will allow me to move the current engine factory over to Toko Rocket, giving me four factories researching it fully in 30 days. This means the toko rocket should enter production 3/44, at which point I will ramp up production in time for the factories coming online researching the Ki202. If I can hold on, the skies should be very crowded with a 1 range fighter in late 44. How cool would that be?








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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 11:49:52 AM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Sept 16, 1943

Lots of mines cleared at Trinkat by the E's, and Fuso bombards.

However, there appears to be a giant clash at Port Blair. The Agano runs interference and runs into two single ship destroyer task forces, and then a larger cruiser force before making good their escape for now.

The bombardment group fares less well, runs into one lone destroyer and a CA gets a torpedo and they expend a fair amount of ammunition for no real effect...






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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:14:27 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		The bombardment task force hits Port Blair, and does solid damage, but then is caught by the Allied cruiser force...

The IJN gets the worst of the engagement losing a destroyer...but makes good their escape, but the commanders plot a course for Trinkat away from their escorting fighters range...and also split into several different task forces further complicating air coverage. Uh Oh!




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/31/2015 1:15:09 PM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:18:39 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		In the ensuing strikes from Port Blair, in small strikes of like 6 planes, sometimes only 3 planes, the Allies manage to cause devastation on the IJN CA forces with escorting planes only over one task force...

The ugly butchers bill:




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:21:15 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Heavy air attacks everywhere...including 3 squadrons of lightnings sweeping over Rabaul, two of which are nicely coordinated.

Tough day...




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:25:50 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Port Blair:

Allied CA force is one hex outside of a 300 plane strike force...argh.

Small, one ship task forces are swarming into Great Nicobar and they don't trigger any aerial or naval interdiction.

A hoard of PT boats are inbound for Port Blair.

IJN CA forces shattered in the area...

A bleak day...




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:31:21 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Tuang Gyi falls to a three division 2000 AFV shock attack...but the defenders retreat across the jungle into the plains rather than south down the road...

How bad can this day get?

I have to wrap my head around that retreat...pretty damaging.

Allies attack elsewhere and are easily held, with one attack the Allies have a supply malus. But every attack is bolstered by Allied tanks.




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:36:09 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Wake still holds...




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 12:38:29 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		It will take a lot of work on my part to repair the damage from the last turn...

Still can't get over that retreat direction...I know retreat paths are never a given, but thru the jungle instead of down the major road to dug in troops. Oh my!

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 1:16:55 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Hats off to the Allies. The use of single ship task forces caused both my surface group and bombardment group to use up lots of ammunition and torpedoes prior to the engagement with his cruiser force plus ops points which limited their getaway. All my surviving ships have no main gun ammo left and very little secondary gun ammo left and no torpedoes left. I missed with every torpedo...but then again it is hard to hit a destroyer with torpedoes.

I was out maneuvered by far.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/31/2015 2:21:26 PM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 4:21:13 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
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Status: offline 		Retreat paths are often towards a friendly base. In this case that would be Toungoo. Going into the clear terrain would make it easier for those units to move to that base.

I just had Allied units at Ankang in China retreat into the jungle/rough towards Sian vs across the river to NE in which they were already 3/4 of the way in doing so.

Single ship TFs - IMO, they can be used excessively in situations like you just faced that borders on gamey. I would suggest that you ask your opponent that he form them into 2 ship TF so the AI will more likely target them.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 5:38:16 PM   
Lowpe


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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Single ship TFs - IMO, they can be used excessively in situations like you just faced that borders on gamey. I would suggest that you ask your opponent that he form them into 2 ship TF so the AI will more likely target them.


He is in love with single ship task forces unfortunately. I think it was a major reason why the original Japanese player quit as he kept Rangoon and Port Blair supplied via single ship task forces. His point is they are more vulnerable..which they are to subs, but nothing else really targets them.

He has used extensively: single ship pt boats as screens to prevent bombardemnts, single ship sc, am, yms, as pickets, single cargo ships running supplies. This is just more of the same tactic, I had hoped the Agano and escort would clear the way, but no joy.

This is the game I inherited, not picked. I don't like the sky high sweeps either, or super size air groups, or night bombing sweeps, but just suffer my lumps and play on. I am having fun, if it is a bit frustrating at times. I have found counters to some of those tactics...

Now that he has steamed over a slew of PT boats to Port Blair they will all break down to small task forces too, so future bombardments there are not likely. Just like all the small taskforces strung out in a line south of Ramree, or in the Marshalls prior.

I wonder why I even try shore bombardments, as I have lost so many large ships trying them.

Just have to play smarter. He snuck that CA force in undetected and snookered me.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 2/11/2015 11:44:02 PM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 9:22:39 PM   
Miller


Posts: 2226
Joined: 9/14/2004
From: Ashington, England.
Status: offline 		He is taking the pi$$ in my opinion. I can live with single ship supply TFs but multiple single PT boat TFs is just bull$hit to eat up your warships ammo and op points.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 10:05:26 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline 		You have these HRs, right?

There are some house rules: no xakl pickets, no 4E naval bombing low, and no bombing china strategically.

Why have no xAKL picket if you're going to have single ship PTs? The principle is not to soak your opponent's ammo with low value targets. It's established here, so just tell him you want to negotiate a stop to one ship soakers in general.

Tactically you may have to stop bombarding well defended bases also! This is not entirely the result of one ship PTs.

In looking back I also noticed (I'd forgotten) that you have Realistic R n D off. You could prioritize your air forces and forget about the navy until he's damaged, then move in. If you have planes a year or two before usual arrival dates this will get hard for him. Don't go on the offensive. Let him come to you.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 1/31/2015 11:38:17 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Sent the turn away, we will see what happens here....

Worried about Burma, now with the fall of Tuang Gyi and the retreat to the plains...juggled lots of troops around.

He is technically staying true to the few HRs we have....I really don't want to complain, and his CA force really surprised me. He has used the single ship pickets prior, and also many two ship forces to screen bases so he didn't really do something he hasn't done before. Just surprised me here and got in a good blow.

Shore bombardments are always iffy it seems depending upon perceived air threat, other ships, etc., etc.

I am sending three destroyers into Port Blair tonight, lets see what they run into...I am hoping for a torpedo attack on some ammo depleted cruisers, but I suspect there will be PT boats. I also put about 100 bombers on low night airfield attack at Port Blair, perhaps I can continue to build damage on the runways there if they fly.





< Message edited by Lowpe -- 2/1/2015 12:50:34 AM >

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 2:24:34 AM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		A look at the Bay of Bengal...




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 12:21:25 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Question for the day -- I inherited two very large Frank r factories, and making some educated guesses, I can have the plane in production June 44.

My question is should I simply make minimal amounts or even none of the Frank A and accelerate it even more?




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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 12:34:12 PM   
koniu


Posts: 2763
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From: Konin, Poland, European Union
Status: offline 		1. Frank "r" cant stop Thunderbolts can give You some chances.
2. Frank "r" gives You best chances again P-47 but "a" version is also good. Difference between them is small
3. When P-47 sweep they have dive bonus but superior climb rate allow Frank to have some payback after initial dive is over.
4. I will start producing "a" asap and switch to "r" when it arrive. Difference between them is not so big to wait another few months without Frank at all. You need any Frank model. You will feel major positive difference comparing to Tojo, Tony or other older models.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 12:38:23 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

In looking back I also noticed (I'd forgotten) that you have Realistic R n D off. You could prioritize your air forces and forget about the navy until he's damaged, then move in. If you have planes a year or two before usual arrival dates this will get hard for him. Don't go on the offensive. Let him come to you.


Looking back, I think I would have been better served dumping a ton of factories into getting the Frank a; I probably could have had the Frank r up and running in late 43. I would have had to sacrifice the Ki-100I, and gotten the Oscar IV later, but how terrible would that have been considering neither of those planes can stand up to Lightning sweeps, let alone Thunderbolts.

As it is I will be fielding a huge Ki202 force, if I make it to the end of 44; the IJN divebomber will be the Myojo which will start production Jan 44; And the Sam-J should start first quarter of 45. Army kamikaze will be the Oscar IV and Helens I guess.

It seems to me on day one you need to decide George or Jack for the Navy, and Frank A for the Army. Pick one midwar armored fighter, most likely Oscar. And then the rest of the research would go towards the last generation fighter and the Zero getting some.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 12:47:22 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: koniu

1. Frank "r" cant stop Thunderbolts can give You some chances.
2. Frank "r" gives You best chances again P-47 but "a" version is also good. Difference between them is small
3. When P-47 sweep they have dive bonus but superior climb rate allow Frank to have some payback after initial dive is over.
4. I will start producing "a" asap and switch to "r" when it arrive. Difference between them is not so big to wait another few months without Frank at all. You need any Frank model. You will feel major positive difference comparing to Tojo, Tony or other older models.


Many thanks.

So not much will change, any airfield within Thunderbolt range is pretty much destroyed. I have pinned all my hopes on this game on the Ki202 being able to slug it out with the Thunderbolt. I just need to stall long enough to get them.

My progression should have been Oscar; Frank a; Ki202. I should probably not have researched Tojo or Tony. But really, what fun is that in researching only very few planes. I get a lot of enjoyment out of having different planes, and figuring out how to use them. Who would have thought that the KAI Dinah would make for a very effective spoiling night fighter for example? Or Petes? I think I am a PDU off kind of guy.


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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 1:55:49 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: koniu

1. Frank "r" cant stop Thunderbolts can give You some chances.
2. Frank "r" gives You best chances again P-47 but "a" version is also good. Difference between them is small
3. When P-47 sweep they have dive bonus but superior climb rate allow Frank to have some payback after initial dive is over.
4. I will start producing "a" asap and switch to "r" when it arrive. Difference between them is not so big to wait another few months without Frank at all. You need any Frank model. You will feel major positive difference comparing to Tojo, Tony or other older models.


This depends a bit on your HRs. If you have any kind of altitude resrictions the 'r' may be better than you think. I think it's a major upgrade from the 'a.' Maybe it'll be different in your game, but it reminds me a bit of a lot of the last versions of other airframe developments.

The final A6M8 doesn't look a lot better than earlier versions, but it is noticeable. The J2M5 doesn't seem better on paper, but it's performance is again remarkably different than earlier models. I've heard the same about the final George, but didn't get to use it.

While the 'a' isn't an offensive plane from mid-44 onward, the 'r' can give you a chance there before the Ki-83 or some other late war monster arrives. You aslo get a to more of them than he gets P-47s, and you won't see a lot of Thuds on CAP.

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 3:05:35 PM   
Encircled


Posts: 2024
Joined: 12/30/2010
From: Northern England
Status: offline 		Single T/Fs of PT boats are bang out of order.

They are only there for one thing, to soak up OP points, and hence is really, really gamey.

Single ship supply is different, as at least you can sometimes deal with them.

You really need to mention it btw!

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RE: Destination Wake Island - 2/1/2015 3:41:05 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert
This depends a bit on your HRs. If you have any kind of altitude resrictions the 'r' may be better than you think. I think it's a major upgrade from the 'a.' Maybe it'll be different in your game, but it reminds me a bit of a lot of the last versions of other airframe developments.

The final A6M8 doesn't look a lot better than earlier versions, but it is noticeable. The J2M5 doesn't seem better on paper, but it's performance is again remarkably different than earlier models. I've heard the same about the final George, but didn't get to use it.

While the 'a' isn't an offensive plane from mid-44 onward, the 'r' can give you a chance there before the Ki-83 or some other late war monster arrives. You aslo get a to more of them than he gets P-47s, and you won't see a lot of Thuds on CAP.


Hm...food for thought.

I see how the final George is better; but unfortunately I don't have any altitude restrictions which makes the first George very valuable. The first George has a high altitude, and I have all of them flying over major bases at 41K -- otherwise I couldn't stop the Lighting sweeps. Oscar IV and Tojo IIc fill out the lower defense (soon to be Ki100-I). I have done very few sweeps...except against the Chinese.

Maybe a better thought would be to get the final George sooner, I am using that motor for the Sam J, plus I like planes with lots of guns and the final George is hard to beat until Sam-J comes along. I could easily get the final George very early, and not change any of my Army research. Choices and supply!

Pisanuloke is almost level 9; and once she gets there, I am going to try and protect that base so we will see how Georges very high, and Oscars very low with Tonies in the middle will work against three plus Thunderbolt sweeps. Uh, maybe I will rethink that and just use it for traps.


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