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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 12:54:48 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		May 16th, 1943

No night bombing.

Lots of submarine actions...IJN minelaysers (with ASW ratings) torpedoed and sunk in the CentPac; an xak sunk returning to Singers. The SS Mingo reportedly sunk off Balikpapen.

Morning strikes in Burma: Lots of Allied ships sighted in Akyab, but severe storms over Magwe prevent any flights, and two supporting strikes of Kates are underescorted and fly in only to get destroyed by local CAP. Ugh.

Hit me, I violated my rule on big strikes only again!




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 12:58:12 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		The Allies bomb Prome, where I have moved a relatively large squadron of Jakes to help with spotting, but then in a surprise the planes at Magwe fly, a break in the clouds...

The first strike is fighter heavy and bomber light...




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/30/2014 1:58:56 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:00:57 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		The Betties are escorted thru no problem, only to target an xak first....




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:07:10 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		But they finally find a big boy...

Interestingly, quite a few of the fighter squadrons ended up sweeping in the combat report...

Subsequent followup attacks go thru...Betties try to torpedo the Whipporwill (AM) and miss.

Some nube, me, left one squadron of Betties on bombing and they miss the CL Java...

Helens fly in last, half retreat because they are unescorted and afraid of the 1 remaining P40 on CAP, but the 11 that strike hit an xak once.

So, not great...but another British BB with torpedo damage...




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/30/2014 2:19:32 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:12:09 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Burma...

Ships at Akyab, IJN subs all around, what to do next....

What will the Allies do next...

I really dislike the limitation on sighting reports.

Probably 50+ float on the BB from two good torpedo hits; two xaks probably toast too. Other than Kates and Oscars, plane losses very light.






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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/30/2014 2:18:14 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:16:11 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		I count 30 enemy subs in my shipping lanes across the Empire...only going to get worse.






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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:22:05 PM   
MrBlizzard


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Status: offline 		Have you tried using land based B5N2, well trained in ASW, at 2000 feet? i find them very useful in sinking enemy subs too close to main bases and chokepoints.

< Message edited by MrBlizzard -- 9/30/2014 2:24:11 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:22:18 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Other news:

3-1 deliberate attack at Changsha (China) knocks forts down to 3, should have the base in 2 weeks or less. Still 50 Chinese fighters there, but my sweeps don't fly.

Finally my second Irving NF factory repairs to 30. Took two months to get 1 point repaired.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:25:14 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Have you tried using land based B5N2, well trained in ASW, at 2000 feet? i find them very useful in sinking enemy subs too close to main in bases.


I used 2/3rds of a squadron in Burma on naval strike, but the rest are all on ASW. And they are pretty well trained now, too.


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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:37:37 PM   
MrBlizzard


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Status: offline 		When I find some subs too close I put all the kate sentai in ASW setting also the sectors and the distance to match the sub position. In this way I manage to have several attacks each turn. After few turns the subs are gone, sunk or damaged.
ASW exp is ~65.

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 1:43:20 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

When I find some subs too close I put all the kate sentai in ASW setting also the sectors and the distance to match the sub position. In this way I manage to have several attacks each turn. After few turns the subs are gone, sunk or damaged.
ASW exp is ~65.



I will give it a go, I don't do any of that...perhaps a high inspiration leader will help too (more planes in the air)

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/30/2014 2:44:39 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 4:28:59 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		I pulled back most of air force from Burma, anticipating heavy night strikes on Magwe or heavy sweeps and bombing during the day or both.

I did move 150 Zeroes and 30 Betties to strike from Chiang Mai...maybe they will get lucky.

Allies moving more troops into Rangoon, probably base forces to use the air field more or infantry to kick me out of the hex.

I reserved the most damaged division at Changsha and attacked deliberately again at Changsha.


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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 4:38:28 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Okay folks!, guess where the Allies will hit me next:

Kuriles?

Wake Island?

Marshalls?

Solomons?

New Guinea?

Darwin: no choice, I am abandoning it now.

Lower SRA?

Invasion Indochina?

Upper SRA (Sumatra)?

Cocos Island?

And for the truly bold: Bonins? Hokkaido? Marianas?


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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 4:44:46 PM   
mind_messing

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Okay folks!, guess where the Allies will hit me next:

Kuriles?

Wake Island?

Marshalls?

Solomons?

New Guinea?

Darwin: no choice, I am abandoning it now.

Lower SRA?

Invasion Indochina?

Upper SRA (Sumatra)?

Cocos Island?

And for the truly bold: Bonins? Hokkaido? Marianas?




Any chance of a global map before I place my bets?

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 4:54:57 PM   
Lokasenna


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Status: offline 		I'll lay my chips down on the Marshalls.

I'll put my extra credit marker on Port Blair/western coast of Malaysia (Tavoy/Moulmein).

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 5:21:31 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Port Blair is already British. It always was.

Here is the map.

Marcus Island is a choice too.








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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 5:35:11 PM   
mind_messing

 

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Status: offline 		Looking at the map, Wake and Marcus. He can advance in the center through the Marshalls, so I think you need to watch for the big right hook to Wake and Marcus that will expose the Marianas.

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 7:42:02 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

Looking at the map, Wake and Marcus. He can advance in the center through the Marshalls, so I think you need to watch for the big right hook to Wake and Marcus that will expose the Marianas.


Okay: Wake and Marcus are both 6K Atolls very far from friendly air bases.

What are American worries:

Within Betty/Nell strikes but not much else. IJN KB is a worry.

Atoll: Limited to 6k troops defensively, Wake known to have the fearsome Wake CD unit (although they are elsewhere in this this game).

Solutions: Grab Ailinglaplap or elsewhere in the Marshalls and bomb Wake to negate the CD guns. Or, cushion your invasion force with lots of battleships and hit the defenses with carrier planes and other naval bombardments as you can. Provide air CAP over Wake.

To maximize offloading do you need to be there for two phases? Probably.

Divert the KB to the other side of the Empire. Or, depending on date, this would be a good place to fight the KB. Allies know the KB would come from the west most likely: Day 1 inv fleet spotted, day 2 invasion, day 3 move American carriers west of Wake looking for a carrier engagement as the KB is moved into position to strike at the landing? You could make this quite nasty by flooding the area with subs too.

Japanese Steps:

So, defenses: one AA unit. CD unit. Infantry to fill out the island. Mines. Mini subs: ideal placement for mini subs as they can't be scouted ahead of time (still they will all die like flies). Good search radius to maximize early warning. Glen equipped sub in likely gathering spot for invasion?

Prep a division to take the base back?

Standby IJN surface group to hit the base? Where could they be based at? Fast, with lots of torpedoes? Or heavy as in super heavies? How would they have air coverage on the way out.

Just let them take the islands and not commit any ships?

What am I missing?




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 7:45:57 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

I'll lay my chips down on the Marshalls.

I'll put my extra credit marker on Port Blair/western coast of Malaysia (Tavoy/Moulmein).


Marshalls are kind of lost with the solid Allied air control. He simply hasn't moved quickly at all for some reason...perhaps simply waiting for the Essex or BBs to repair or prep. Maybe he is worried about the KB which is known to be in the area. I will give some more thought to this later today...especially for your extra credit pick.

Would it be gamey to fly out splinter parts of the more expensive units in the Marshalls/Nauru area?


< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/30/2014 9:16:42 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 8:17:56 PM   
mind_messing

 

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So, defenses: one AA unit. CD unit. Infantry to fill out the island. Mines. Mini subs: ideal placement for mini subs as they can't be scouted ahead of time (still they will all die like flies). Good search radius to maximize early warning. Glen equipped sub in likely gathering spot for invasion?


I think that's the best you can do. Make the Allies bring the big hammer to take the islands and hope for the best. A bad roll on the attacking units, a few mine hits on amphibs or a plucky mini-sub hit or two on BB's. Throw in some PT boats if you can, and perhaps a bunch of the 1 VP tuna-boat SC's to mess with Allied TF's.

When it comes to fighting the Allies at sea from 1943 onwards, you need to go in with everything, or you shouldn't go in at all.


< Message edited by mind_messing -- 9/30/2014 9:19:28 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 8:30:40 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing
When it comes to fighting the Allies at sea from 1943 onwards, you need to go in with everything, or you shouldn't go in at all.


So, do you advocate massing the entire surface fleet at this point in time?

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 8:35:12 PM   
mind_messing

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing
When it comes to fighting the Allies at sea from 1943 onwards, you need to go in with everything, or you shouldn't go in at all.


So, do you advocate massing the entire surface fleet at this point in time?


To oppose a significant Allied invasion of a vital strategic target, yes.

Do you think Wake and Marcus are vital strategic targets?

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 8:44:40 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing
Do you think Wake and Marcus are vital strategic targets?


Wake, no...Marcus, at this point...maybe, but not really. He could get a lot of search from Marcus.

But I was more interested if you felt that focusing the fleet was a generic goal for mid 43 and on. Certainly as the perimeter shrinks it is easier to do.



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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 10:08:42 PM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing
Do you think Wake and Marcus are vital strategic targets?


Wake, no...Marcus, at this point...maybe, but not really. He could get a lot of search from Marcus.

But I was more interested if you felt that focusing the fleet was a generic goal for mid 43 and on. Certainly as the perimeter shrinks it is easier to do.





Agree about Wake's utility. Without 100% of the Gilberts, Wake isn't very useful to you (or him, IMO, unless you're using it heavily).

I wouldn't go for Marcus in his position, not even if I took Wake first. It's just too far. I'd want at least the Marshalls first to have a Port of Last Resort for damaged ships, and even that's a long haul with a cripple.

The Marshalls have several ports that would be instrumental for a future CENTPAC push. He probably won't go for the SRA without owning Darwin, I should think, so that leaves east or west. East seems more obvious, and easier, and faster - for him.

EDIT: I missed responding to the DC hits against the sub. 2 hits can sink a USN sub, but in most cases won't. You really need 3 to be sure. 2 hits and you're looking at 50-60 System at most, 60-80 Float. The crews and COs tend to be good enough to get the minor float taken care of, and the sub will limp back to port.

If you're lucky, you may be able to run the sub down with an ASW TF - and catch her on the surface, unable to dive. That's happened to my subs before, on each side.

< Message edited by Lokasenna -- 9/30/2014 11:11:32 PM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 9/30/2014 11:57:11 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Thanks m-m & Lok. These kind of posts help me analyze my position a little better and although I can't stop the Allies, I can feel a little better.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 10/1/2014 9:07:24 AM   
MrBlizzard


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Status: offline 		From this month he is refilling his CVs with Hellcats, so a pacific assault become probable from july I'd say. If I were him I'd prepare for both Burma coast (Tavoy) and central pacific ( Nauru, kusaie or marshalls, depends where you are weaker and if you're playing with stacking limits).
And then attack first at Tavoy; if you move KB to Burma I'd attack also in the pacific; else I'd wait to be a little stronger and attack anyway even with KB present, before the end of '43.
But this is me, I think much depends from his style of playing.

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 10/1/2014 10:29:53 AM   
Lowpe


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Allies bomb at night Magwe; no planes there and the AA does a good job. No lasting damage.

Subs swap xak: IJN gets on near Diamond Harbor; Americans get one near Singers.

The Betty strike in Burma skips the BB; and goes for Whipporwill! Again!

Alliied 4es bomb Raheng in Burma, and Nauru in the Marshalls.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 10/1/2014 10:35:16 AM   
Lowpe


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Changsha attack goes well...the end is near here.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 10/1/2014 10:41:40 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

From this month he is refilling his CVs with Hellcats, so a pacific assault become probable from july I'd say. If I were him I'd prepare for both Burma coast (Tavoy) and central pacific ( Nauru, kusaie or marshalls, depends where you are weaker and if you're playing with stacking limits).
And then attack first at Tavoy; if you move KB to Burma I'd attack also in the pacific; else I'd wait to be a little stronger and attack anyway even with KB present, before the end of '43.
But this is me, I think much depends from his style of playing.


Mr. Bliz: Thanks! You think I have until July?

His playing style is ruthlessly aggressive!

Nauru seems to be getting a lot of attention...bombardment runs; aerial bombing on of the airfield. It is amazing to watch the supplies drop from the heavy bombing.

Everybody likes attacking me at Tavoy. It is a conspiracy


< Message edited by Lowpe -- 10/1/2014 11:45:47 AM >

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RE: Burma Bungle! - 10/1/2014 11:18:22 AM   
MrBlizzard


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Status: offline 		Well..Allied should get 180 hellcats\month, then it depends how many he likes to keep on a single CV and if wants to fill also CVL and CVE with them. If he puts only on CV and CVL he could need (but I don't remember if he has lost some CVs) 2 months production so may and june.
Yeah trying to put in bag a huge army like Burma one could be very inviting
PS but give a look to starting date for hellcat, maybe I don't remember well!

< Message edited by MrBlizzard -- 10/1/2014 12:19:57 PM >

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