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Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all

 
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Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/1/2016 6:09:39 PM   
Sokar408

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/13/2014
Status: offline 		So in my current game, I have 5 planets, all neatly fitting inside the "sector" posture of a fleet. So I just made one massive defensive fleet, and it worked just fine... For a while

At this point in the game, my fleet more or less ignores all attacks. There posture is "Defend" "Sector" "Auto", and I can see the posture circle on the map. However even when enemy ships lets right on top of the fleet, they just set there doing nothing. All the do is refuel.

Also I have never see this level of harassment. I have 5 systems to my name, and my computer is CONSTANTLY blipping about me being attacked by some lone escorts, against heavily armied Space Ports. This whole game has been weird after this started. What the hell do I do about it? (fleet disband and recreate has been tried)
Post #: 1
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/1/2016 6:22:11 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Postured fleets don't react to pirate attacks. Why this is who knows. They react when you're at war, and have incoming enemy fleets (red line). They should react if a ship is on top of them though. Sounds like you have a lot of pirates nearby.

(in reply to Sokar408)
Post #: 2
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/1/2016 7:10:56 PM   
SirHoraceHarkness


Posts: 400
Joined: 5/17/2015
Status: offline 		This is what the smaller ship classes are for in that you build a bunch of them and parcel them out as smaller planetary defense fleets set to patrol each colonized planet. This frees up your expensive and hard to replace capitol fleet for proper face smashing duty.

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 3
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/1/2016 10:17:43 PM   
RemoteLeg


Posts: 153
Joined: 4/21/2015
From: Canada
Status: offline 		The only difference I can see between my settings and yours is that my fleet posture is "Attack" "Nearby Systems" "Auto".
I don't see why this should make a big difference, but you might like to try these settings and see if that wakes them up.

_____________________________

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(in reply to SirHoraceHarkness)
Post #: 4
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 7:59:11 PM   
Hattori Hanzo


Posts: 734
Joined: 3/21/2011
From: Okinawa
Status: offline 		do your fleet react and attack if you de-automatize it ?

(in reply to RemoteLeg)
Post #: 5
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 8:23:25 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		they are supposed to do this regardless..

I remember people found out in tests that they do REACT if not on "auto" ..

apparently putting fleets on "auto" lets the AI take them half-way around the universe and park them to watch a inhabited planet that your AI wants you to take over...


so apparently, you are supposed to take them OFF auto mode.. and just set their attack settings/distance/posture.. (homeworld/target only/system.. and Attack when engaged/etc..



< Message edited by Blabsawaw22 -- 2/2/2016 9:25:50 PM >

(in reply to Hattori Hanzo)
Post #: 6
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 8:41:45 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Pirates are basically invisible until they attack something. Once a mine (for example) is shot at, a fleet should respond. Most always it is way too late.

Attack fleets are designed to have an attack target. Set an attack target, then the attack range. A dotted red line shows up (if you have postures showing). When you go to war, the attack fleets will carry out their mission. For example, I set an attack target of a nearby planet. I set the attack range to nearby systems. When I war with them my fleet will go to the planet and attack, and then will attack targets in nearby systems (of the attacked planet). It's clumsy and rarely used (I think). Manual control is way more efficient.

For a fleet, the attack range means nothing with out an attack target. I assume an auto attack fleet with no target will do whatever (idk I've never made one).

(in reply to Hattori Hanzo)
Post #: 7
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 9:05:09 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		I've been trying to play the game on Auto but there are so many problems..

one of the worst I've seen EVER, is the BUG that when you have a fleet in your home system on defend and want it to stay there, (not on auto!) just set to defend and homeworld and system only etc..

you get attacked, then your fleet tries to warp out of the system and chase the fleet halfway across the universe.. only to leave them with 1. no fuel. and 2. your homeworld is now not defended..

yeah.. great game.. great AI that they soooo boasted about..

haha but I still play it today after 2 years.. with bugs and all..

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 8
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 10:20:15 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		That's because of prox arrays. I never understood prox arrays, because you always see the ships and bases in the same system as you (prox or not). Now later on with stealth, then I understand prox's function, but before that they're kind of useless.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 9
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 10:25:53 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		god damn you Retreat1970! 2 years into playing.. I never thought of that either!.. you and your insight!

I'll take away the proximity arrays and see if they still warp out chase across the galaxy..

why don't you write these little things down in a better tutorial than what they have.. these are the things people need to really know.. ha.

constructor crap, supplyship crap, economy crap, fuel crap, resource smuggling crap, auto settings crap, the utmost most famous "what the hell do all the settings in the policy screen really do?!"



< Message edited by Blabsawaw22 -- 2/2/2016 11:27:20 PM >

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 10
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 10:33:19 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		No, I'm not so smart, and I have a poor memory. I do, however, play this game everyday, so sometimes I look smart.

Without a prox, fleets shouldn't be able to track hyperjumps. If they still do, then idk.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 11
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 10:50:05 PM   
Sokar408

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/13/2014
Status: offline 		All of this is nice and all. But how do I then achieve what I want. In the passed, setting a fleet to "defend" "sector" and "auto" resulted in what i wanted. That my fleet would set on their homeworld, until something, somewhere in the sector range were attacked or an aggressor should up in it, then they'd move in to chase it away. Without this ability, playing this game becomes impossible for me, because I'm literally attacked faster then the blipping sound of the message can finish. It is not possible to micro manage defense at this level.

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 12
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 11:10:28 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Build smaller fleets and park them on your colonies. 5-10 ships should do. Posture them how you want. Put them on auto, and forget.


(in reply to Sokar408)
Post #: 13
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/2/2016 11:29:49 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		also, hoping this is correct,

"auto" means you also have to put your settings in the options correctly to auto "like Fleet settings" or "attack and war" auto..

otherwise, I don't know what the AI is basing what to do with your Fleets on "auto"...

for example:

if you put a 20 ship fleet on Defend, then set to "nearby systems" and "attack system targets" .. and then you DO NOT press the "auto" key "A" on that 20 ship fleet, they still should defend the nearby systems and refuel and all that..

but if you did press the "A" key or make them "auto" now, the AI depending (this is the part that makes no sense) the AI might take them half way across the galaxy to defend or attack something else regardless of you set the posture to nearby systems and selected a homebase..

then you see how it depends on policy and settings in options...

please correct me if I'm wrong..

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 14
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 12:40:02 AM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline
quote:

if you put a 20 ship fleet on Defend, then set to "nearby systems" and "attack system targets" .. and then you DO NOT press the "auto" key "A" on that 20 ship fleet, they still should defend the nearby systems and refuel and all that..


No. A manual fleet (not automated) will only engage according to the empire settings (Menu, options, empire settings). The fleet settings (Home base, attack target, posture, and range) only work if you automate. So your fleet as described above, will not defend nearby systems.

quote:

the AI might take them half way across the galaxy to defend or attack something else regardless of you set the posture to nearby systems and selected a homebase..


No. A defense postured fleet will not respond to attacks outside its set range. Example: If your fleets range is set to home base plus system, then it will react to targets only in that system (not any nearby stars). Make sure to click the show fleet postures to on.

Hope that helps a little.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 15
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 1:02:18 AM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		Ok perhaps, I'll have to go in and try a game or two and see what they do..

but I'm pretty sure I remember not ever "auto"-ing my fleets with the "A" key with my fleets on those settings - and they did seem to follow them without me pressing the "A" key..

so you are saying that doesn't work like that?

I am really sure at-least that the attack fleet policy works without Auto.. I've set "manual" fleets to "attack when engaged" or "only nearby targets" and they for sure followed those orders without me pressing "A" auto key..


(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 16
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 1:31:59 AM   
Sokar408

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/13/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

No. A defense postured fleet will not respond to attacks outside its set range. Example: If your fleets range is set to home base plus system, then it will react to targets only in that system (not any nearby stars). Make sure to click the show fleet postures to on.

Hope that helps a little.


If this is true, then what I have been doing all along should be working. I have it on Defend, Sector, and Auto, and what them to do exactly that. Respond to attacks within the that range (the large blue circle as shown on the map). Yet it isn't. By all accounts it seems like I'm doing the right thing, but not getting the right outcome *tears hair out*

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 17
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 1:57:43 AM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline
quote:

If this is true, then what I have been doing all along should be working. I have it on Defend, Sector, and Auto, and what them to do exactly that. Respond to attacks within the that range (the large blue circle as shown on the map). Yet it isn't. By all accounts it seems like I'm doing the right thing, but not getting the right outcome *tears hair out*


It may be working as intended. Your fleet won't react to incoming pirates in its range. It will react to incoming enemy fleets (empires).

quote:

I am really sure at-least that the attack fleet policy works without Auto.. I've set "manual" fleets to "attack when engaged" or "only nearby targets" and they for sure followed those orders without me pressing "A" auto key..


Yes.

(in reply to Sokar408)
Post #: 18
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 2:36:47 AM   
Sokar408

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/13/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

quote:

If this is true, then what I have been doing all along should be working. I have it on Defend, Sector, and Auto, and what them to do exactly that. Respond to attacks within the that range (the large blue circle as shown on the map). Yet it isn't. By all accounts it seems like I'm doing the right thing, but not getting the right outcome *tears hair out*


It may be working as intended. Your fleet won't react to incoming pirates in its range. It will react to incoming enemy fleets (empires).

quote:

I am really sure at-least that the attack fleet policy works without Auto.. I've set "manual" fleets to "attack when engaged" or "only nearby targets" and they for sure followed those orders without me pressing "A" auto key..


Yes.


But they did earlier on, so why not now? Like I said this wasn't a problem until this game, about 30 years into it. I have a feeling we are speaking passed each other somehow. But I appreciate you putting up with me. I guess I'll just have to try and figure it out :)

Speaking of somethings I have an off-topic question if you see this. Can pirates discover whats in temples? I always try to rush to be the first to discover the temples, but most of the time I just find "empty" temples. I'm always starting in pre-warp btw.

< Message edited by Sokar408 -- 2/3/2016 3:45:20 AM >

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 19
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 4:54:05 AM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		Retreat1970, this is the part that bothers me..

quote:

The fleet settings (Home base, attack target, posture, and range) only work if you automate. So your fleet as described above, will not defend nearby systems.



what we just agreed on is true though I thought.., didn't we just say manual fleets will follow attack target/posture/range settings when the fleet is not on Auto..,

or I'm just thoroughly confused and misunderstanding you..

off to play Distant Worlds for 3 hours.. god..

< Message edited by Blabsawaw22 -- 2/3/2016 7:21:08 AM >

(in reply to Sokar408)
Post #: 20
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 2:41:43 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline
quote:

At this point in the game, my fleet more or less ignores all attacks. There posture is "Defend" "Sector" "Auto", and I can see the posture circle on the map. However even when enemy ships lets right on top of the fleet, they just set there doing nothing. All the do is refuel.

Also I have never see this level of harassment. I have 5 systems to my name, and my computer is CONSTANTLY blipping about me being attacked by some lone escorts, against heavily armied Space Ports. This whole game has been weird after this started. What the hell do I do about it? (fleet disband and recreate has been tried)


This is your first post. I'm sorry if I can't explain things well, but I'll try. Check empire settings (menu, options, empire settings). In there is the default engagement stances for manual, and automated ships. This is how ships will react to targets within a system. For me I have engage system targets for all. Ships and fleets, auto or not, will engage anything within the system they're in. Check and see what your default engagement stances are.

To your second issue, lone escorts attacking means pirates. What I have been trying to say is automated fleets do not react to incoming pirates. The pirates become "visible" to automated fleets when they attack something. Then your fleet may respond. Or may not. In my experience fleets vs harassing pirates just doesn't happen. It sounds like for you it doesn't matter though because you have defenses at the colonies, and lone pirates won't stand a chance.

quote:

I am really sure at-least that the attack fleet policy works without Auto.. I've set "manual" fleets to "attack when engaged" or "only nearby targets" and they for sure followed those orders without me pressing "A" auto key..


Are we talking about the same thing? Engagement stances or posturing? Posturing only works on auto. Engagement stances works all the time, but in a system only. So setting this to nearby targets doesn't mean nearby stars, it means targets near your ships.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 21
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 9:16:18 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		Ok Yeah I'm probably not being clear either then..

I understand what you say about pirates attacking.. that is no problem for me..



Perhaps I basically don't know what Automating fleets do.

1.A)I was under the understanding, that automated fleets are used for whatever the computer AI wants to do..(especially depending on if you have fleet automation on in the Menu Settings..)

1.B) I was under the understanding with automation on, The AI could take your fleet that you set to Defend a system, and tell it to defend another system and the blue circle showing defense will now change to the new home system it is defending..
or if sets an an attack it would be red circle.. ok make sense?

I am saying with Automation on the fleet the AI can assign new orders to the fleet and take away where you positioned them and set their range/posture or homeworld to defend another System altogether as the AI deems a new place for the fleet..

is that correct?



now,

2. I was also under the understanding that If you create a fleet and do not press "A" key to automate them.. so now we have a "manual" fleet. good. everybody is clear. BUT- if I set Posture to Nearby System and Defend, they should still defend the nearby system! correct!?

I think while playing that is what happens.. they still go off and defend a nearby system IF A "enemy fleet is detected incoming" message appears! I think that is what triggers them to go wait and defend..(this could be pointless but just saying) I may have Long range scanners that allow incoming fleets to be detected like that..

but the point is, Manual or NON-automated fleets still follow Posture orders (nearby systems etc..)

If I am wrong then ok.. I am wrong.. I will play a game right now and set a fleet to manual and defend nearby systems and start wars with everone.. If my Manual fleet moves, then Postures orders work with Manual and don't need to be automated right?

sorry for the long message.. But I want to get to the bottom of this!













Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Blabsawaw22 -- 2/3/2016 10:22:43 PM >

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 22
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 9:31:35 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		This post is the ultimate guide to posturing. It's old but still applies.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2973167&mpage=1&key=posture

It will most definitely explain posturing way better than I ever could.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 23
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 10:21:13 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Do you have attacks against enemies checked? If it is then you're automating war and attacks, which means the AI using your fleets and ships for whatever. So you think you are posturing fleets, but the AI will override that to what it wants.

< Message edited by Retreat1970 -- 2/3/2016 11:57:47 PM >

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 24
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/3/2016 11:41:17 PM   
Blabsawaw22

 

Posts: 285
Joined: 12/5/2014
Status: offline 		That maybe what I mean about when I "auto" my fleets, the AI just moves the defend and attack locations that I set..

So I never automate my fleets..

maybe I have War and attacks clicked.. I'll have to see..

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 25
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/4/2016 12:48:35 AM   
HerpInYourDerp

 

Posts: 118
Joined: 5/7/2015
Status: offline 		Pirates can't investigate ruins afaik, btw. If you're constantly finding empty temples et al., then it just means the regular AI empires are still beating you to the punch.

(in reply to Blabsawaw22)
Post #: 26
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/4/2016 2:03:15 PM   
Retreat1970


Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
Status: offline
quote:

Manual or NON-automated fleets still follow Posture orders


After some testing this is true, but after the mission my fleets wouldn't return to base unless automated. Do yours?

(in reply to HerpInYourDerp)
Post #: 27
RE: Fleet posture all set. Fleet doesn't react at all - 2/4/2016 3:13:39 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		It is consistent with what I experienced quite a long time ago. Automated fleets return "home", manual ones do not.

Which is correct in my mind. Deciding to go home (or to automatically refuel) is a different order than picking up an attack order due to posture settings.

That being said, manual fleets heading off due to postures is mostly an annoyance to me, but at least I am quick to set them to defensive and minimum range.

(in reply to Retreat1970)
Post #: 28
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