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RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire!

 
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RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/22/2017 10:21:56 PM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline 		Here we go: A Russian "6th Rate" Frigate. Armed with 32 guns and ready for fast scouting and conv...oh...trade route intercepting. With all due respect, Kirk, beside a Bomb Ketch (mortar strategical attack?) this should be the smallest ship unit at our scale. For smaller ships, there are no real tasks that can be displayed with the current engine.




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Post #: 151
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/23/2017 9:09:53 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar

Regarding ships of this period I think you should use a different classification instead of rates, as you know for sure only the Royal Navy had 2nd rate ships, and in the third rate are the large 80s and 74s together with the small 74s and 64s, and there was a big difference between a 64 and a an 80s. Then there is the problem of carronades that makes rating even more misleading. Finally, within "frigate" you have everything from the 8pdrs to the 24pdrs "Superfrigates". In all I think your ship classification would benefit from some reconsideration.

First, I'm only a unit helper. Kirk is the mod creator. You are of course right for your information. But I think there must be some compromises in the sense of clarity and simplification. The vanilla game does it and take the German order of battle as a frame for (nearly) all countries. So I believe Kirk take the French OOB for land units and the British OOB for naval units. This is just as comprehensible for this epoch, as well as for the possibilities of the game engine makes sense. Hope this will help.

I agree, but at the same time, since this is a mod, I think some historical flavour would be good, without really compromising clarity. A classification by guns instead of rates would be very clear and better adapted to minor maritime powers. Just my opinion.


Again a compromise...
We could address a extended name to the localization file. Like "Frigate (32G)" and "First Rate (86G)". The "xxG(uns)" designation serves as a reference to the armament of the ship and should convey a feeling for the impact force of the unit. The abbreviation remains on the wooden counter-plate.

(in reply to Iñaki Harrizabalagatar)
Post #: 152
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/23/2017 11:54:21 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline 		Kirk-SIPRES, for my next counter works I need a decision in view of the used naval slots. I would suggest the following OOB:

Ships of the line:

Battleship= 1st Rate [106G]
Battle Cruiser= 2nd Rate [86G]
Heavy Cruiser= 3rd Rate [74G]
Light Cruiser= 4th Rate [58G]

Auxiliary ships:

Destroyer= Frigate [32G] - Fast scouting and trade route intercepting
Dreadnought= Privateer Brig [26G] - Attacking various (pirate) raiding points, accessible only for this naval unit (Supply Event or dummy Decision Event)
Torpedo Boat= Bomb Ketch [2M] – Strategic attack (range 2 hex?) on shore resources
Mulberry= Armed Merchantmen [20G] (Galleone/Indiaman/Fluyt) - Access Trading Points (Minor based trade unit for all majors via DE)

Transports:

Long Range Transport= Merchantmen [12G]
Short Range Transport= Sloop [4G]

(Carriers and Sub would not fit due to their special abilities)

Additional proposal: work on some “Trade-Points” on the maps edge for both sides (Far East, Africa, East India, South America) which will be executed by a merchant naval unit via dummy Decision Events (x MPP for 1 turn) flanked by a single Popup Event for information. (Together with the Privateer raiding points this may push the naval warfare in a different way than WW1/WW2)


Cheers


PS: We need some new and quality sound files!

< Message edited by TheBattlefield -- 1/24/2017 12:20:31 AM >

(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 153
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 12:13:26 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline 		The "Privateer" Brig...




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Post #: 154
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 5:41:42 AM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield

The "Privateer" Brig...





BRAVO

I like very much the Fortress and Harbor graphics it really gives a 19th century flavor.
For Vessels if you could differentiate 1st to 6th rate graphics. I think it was in you plans, but just in case.
something like;
1st/2nd rate (3 decks)
3rd/4th rate (2 decks)
5th/6th rate (1 deck)

Battlefield, I dont know yet the unit INDEX (I think nothink is written in the stone yet)
For Land unit I simply prepare few graphics until INDEX will be decided







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Post #: 155
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 5:43:55 AM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline 		VIVA ESPANA!!





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Post #: 156
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 7:02:59 AM   
kirk23


Posts: 2885
Joined: 10/15/2010
From: Fife Scotland
Status: offline 		Hi guys all the land unit types highlight in RED are fixtures that I don't expect to change.


The naval units can still be decided upon,but the ones listed from 1st Rate down to the Privateer Brig, I'm happy with there addition to the game IE:

Dreadnought = 1st Rate
Battleship = 2nd Rate
Battlecruiser = 3rd Rate
Heavy Cruiser = 4th Rate
Light Cruiser = Frigate
Destroyer = Privateer Brig
MTB = Still to decide ?






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Make it so!

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 157
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 8:42:29 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield

Aye, Sir.
Vote Bomb Ketch for MTB. For overall gameplay we need to change (name and function) "Industrial" Centers to "Trade" Centers. Beside the capital this will be the cities of main harbors. So it would be nice if we field a naval unit which could endanger this recources from the sea side. A fireship would just be another (tiny kamikaze) tactical unit. My opinion. Your decision!
The Mulberry slot should go to the Armed Merchantmen. Together with the Privateer this will be "trigger" units for each side. As a result we would get five main naval actions instead of only three vanilla. 1. Fleet action. (Classic ship to ship fight) 2. Harbor blockade action. (Reducing the targets supply) 3. Trade (ex convoy) route raiding action. (Reduces convoy income) In addition: 4. Piracy action (reduces major budget) and 5. Manual trade action. (increases major budget)

Hi, Kirk. Hi, SIPRES. Do you agree with the slot allocation to the Bomb Ketch and the Armed Merchantmen? Or two more Frigates?


< Message edited by TheBattlefield -- 1/24/2017 12:41:32 PM >

(in reply to kirk23)
Post #: 158
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 10:57:52 AM   
Iñaki Harrizabalagatar


Posts: 825
Joined: 12/11/2001
Status: offline 		I will insist on the case of frigates, there is a world of difference between a 9pdr frigate and a 24pdr frigate, it would be a mistake to classify all of them equal. Besides, there is the question of carronades, a 24 pdr frigate with 42pdr carronades was a match for a light 74s.
Regarding second rate, remember that the type was only built for the Royal Navy, no other navy had the 90/98s type.

(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 159
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 11:28:51 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar

I will insist on the case of frigates, there is a world of difference between a 9pdr frigate and a 24pdr frigate, it would be a mistake to classify all of them equal. Besides, there is the question of carronades, a 24 pdr frigate with 42pdr carronades was a match for a light 74s.
Regarding second rate, remember that the type was only built for the Royal Navy, no other navy had the 90/98s type.

You are of course right.
And there is a wide range between a 2 cm and a 8,8 cm AAG. But we have one AA unit in the vanilla game. Why? Because thre are limited unit slots and only one function: Defending air attacks! Same for Frigates. We could discuss a renaming in 5/6th Rate (I vote against!). I think for this mod we do not need another ship of the line Frigate, but we need a auxiliary one. After all it will be no historical simulation. Please do not count hull types, paintings, gun inches or country specefic organisations. It will be hard enough to finalize something playable. But as far as I know Kirk, he will do his best. And we will help him. Hope this helps to understand some of the necessary decisions...
But constructive criticism is always welcome. Thanks Iñaki Harrizabalagatar!

< Message edited by TheBattlefield -- 1/24/2017 11:29:42 AM >

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Post #: 160
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 12:11:03 PM   
kirk23


Posts: 2885
Joined: 10/15/2010
From: Fife Scotland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar

I will insist on the case of frigates, there is a world of difference between a 9pdr frigate and a 24pdr frigate, it would be a mistake to classify all of them equal. Besides, there is the question of carronades, a 24 pdr frigate with 42pdr carronades was a match for a light 74s.
Regarding second rate, remember that the type was only built for the Royal Navy, no other navy had the 90/98s type.


If I had my way, every available unit type slot would be used for naval units! I love all things about the age of sail, the game is abstracted to such an extent thats its impossible to include every varation of type, yes there is a big difference between 9pdr Frigates and 18pdr frigates etc, for Frigates alone you could use up 6 or 7 unit slots in the editor. As for the question of carronades they were not usually counted with all the other cannons aboard 1st,2nd & 3rd Rates, as it was down to individual Captains decision to arm his ship with carronades or not.

_____________________________

Make it so!

(in reply to Iñaki Harrizabalagatar)
Post #: 161
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 2:05:04 PM   
Iñaki Harrizabalagatar


Posts: 825
Joined: 12/11/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23



As for the question of carronades they were not usually counted with all the other cannons aboard 1st,2nd & 3rd Rates, as it was down to individual Captains decision to arm his ship with carronades or not.

Yes, they were not counted until 1817, but in battle having 8x42pdr carronades added to your 24pdr battery counted very much! :)
It was a technological advantage almost exclusive to the Royal Navy for much of the period, I think it should be reflected somehow.

(in reply to kirk23)
Post #: 162
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 5:25:01 PM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

Hi guys all the land unit types highlight in RED are fixtures that I don't expect to change.


The naval units can still be decided upon,but the ones listed from 1st Rate down to the Privateer Brig, I'm happy with there addition to the game IE:

Dreadnought = 1st Rate
Battleship = 2nd Rate
Battlecruiser = 3rd Rate
Heavy Cruiser = 4th Rate
Light Cruiser = Frigate
Destroyer = Privateer Brig
MTB = Still to decide ?







Hi Kirk,

I am fine with the OOB you choose, and its now clear wich "Index" will be used in order to synchronize Graphics vs Programm.

I just have 2 questions.

- Rockets is for Congreve Arty isnt it?

- I didnt see any Partisan unit in the OOB?
I see you use Militia for Partisan slot (for me Militia is LANDWHER, Conscript, Opolchenie, ect)
Most Armies use Militia troops (usually poorly equiped and short trained)

I think you should add some Guerilla/Partisan unit (in case you got an empty slot)
this unit could behave same as current Partisan unit in current WW2 version (Civilian in arms, harrassing rear guards and supply lines)








(in reply to kirk23)
Post #: 163
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 7:06:01 PM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

Hi guys all the land unit types highlight in RED are fixtures that I don't expect to change.


The naval units can still be decided upon,but the ones listed from 1st Rate down to the Privateer Brig, I'm happy with there addition to the game IE:

Dreadnought = 1st Rate
Battleship = 2nd Rate
Battlecruiser = 3rd Rate
Heavy Cruiser = 4th Rate
Light Cruiser = Frigate
Destroyer = Privateer Brig
MTB = Still to decide ?







Hi Kirk,

I am fine with the OOB you choose, and its now clear wich "Index" will be used in order to synchronize Graphics vs Programm.

I just have 2 questions.

- Rockets is for Congreve Arty isnt it?

- I didnt see any Partisan unit in the OOB?
I see you use Militia for Partisan slot (for me Militia is LANDWHER, Conscript, Opolchenie, ect)
Most Armies use Militia troops (usually poorly equiped and short trained)

I think you should add some Guerilla/Partisan unit (in case you got an empty slot)
this unit could behave same as current Partisan unit in current WW2 version (Civilian in arms, harrassing rear guards and supply lines)









Agree!

The 1st Rate has now a more "Victory" style.
I have tried around with the gun numbers. I vote for this one. Indicates firepower in relation to other ships and will be raised by naval research. Check?




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(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 164
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 7:49:15 PM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield


quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

Hi guys all the land unit types highlight in RED are fixtures that I don't expect to change.


The naval units can still be decided upon,but the ones listed from 1st Rate down to the Privateer Brig, I'm happy with there addition to the game IE:

Dreadnought = 1st Rate
Battleship = 2nd Rate
Battlecruiser = 3rd Rate
Heavy Cruiser = 4th Rate
Light Cruiser = Frigate
Destroyer = Privateer Brig
MTB = Still to decide ?







Hi Kirk,

I am fine with the OOB you choose, and its now clear wich "Index" will be used in order to synchronize Graphics vs Programm.

I just have 2 questions.

- Rockets is for Congreve Arty isnt it?

- I didnt see any Partisan unit in the OOB?
I see you use Militia for Partisan slot (for me Militia is LANDWHER, Conscript, Opolchenie, ect)
Most Armies use Militia troops (usually poorly equiped and short trained)

I think you should add some Guerilla/Partisan unit (in case you got an empty slot)
this unit could behave same as current Partisan unit in current WW2 version (Civilian in arms, harrassing rear guards and supply lines)









Agree!

The 1st Rate has now a more "Victory" style.
I have tried around with the gun numbers. I vote for this one. Indicates firepower in relation to other ships and will be raised by naval research. Check?






I am OK with those

here is some interface file tweak for decision event graphics








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(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 165
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 7:52:15 PM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline 		and the 8 majors pack
to be installed in the Interface folder of the MOD

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Post #: 166
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 8:47:54 PM   
kirk23


Posts: 2885
Joined: 10/15/2010
From: Fife Scotland
Status: offline 		I have taken your advice regarding Militia and Partisan units both are now in the game.

SIPRES a great many thanks for creating superb graphics for the the mod


If you and TheBattlefield agree I think its only fair that when the mod is released, all our names will be on it, since it clearly is fast becoming a joint effort.









Attachment (1)

< Message edited by kirk23 -- 1/24/2017 8:48:20 PM >

_____________________________

Make it so!

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 167
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/24/2017 8:53:30 PM   
kirk23


Posts: 2885
Joined: 10/15/2010
From: Fife Scotland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield


The 1st Rate has now a more "Victory" style.
I have tried around with the gun numbers. I vote for this one. Indicates firepower in relation to other ships and will be raised by naval research. Check?





TheBattlefield your ship graphics are beautiful, and its a great idea to display the guns as per research level increase.

_____________________________

Make it so!

(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 168
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 10:52:03 AM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

I have taken your advice regarding Militia and Partisan units both are now in the game.

SIPRES a great many thanks for creating superb graphics for the the mod


If you and TheBattlefield agree I think its only fair that when the mod is released, all our names will be on it, since it clearly is fast becoming a joint effort.










Thanks Kirk

Maybee we could organize tasks vs MOD members

Here is the following stuff I can handle or help:

Graphics

LAND UNIT Graphics (2D) --> on going....
Interface Graphics --> on going....
Flags file(s) Graphics --> (Majors completed) minors on going....
Media graphics Png --> not started yet

Data

LAND OOB (but only from 1805 sorry)
Country Data (Nations and Cities names as per 1803-1805)
Diplomacy historic Informations (1803 to 1815)

Programm

Sorry I have no clue about decisions, events, ect....
I dont have any SC1/SC2 background, just started playing SC3


Battlefield did already start a good work on the following :

SEA UNIT Graphics (2D)
MAP Graphics (to be more 19th century oriented)
I Feel he can help or advise for Programming as he already knows the SC engine.


We still miss a "sound files" member
and Maybe 3D sprites?


What do you both think about

Christophe






(in reply to kirk23)
Post #: 169
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 11:08:58 AM   
OxfordGuy3


Posts: 1041
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23



As for the question of carronades they were not usually counted with all the other cannons aboard 1st,2nd & 3rd Rates, as it was down to individual Captains decision to arm his ship with carronades or not.

Yes, they were not counted until 1817, but in battle having 8x42pdr carronades added to your 24pdr battery counted very much! :)
It was a technological advantage almost exclusive to the Royal Navy for much of the period, I think it should be reflected somehow.



Maybe just in stronger stats for English 1st rates r better starting tech?

(in reply to Iñaki Harrizabalagatar)
Post #: 170
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 1:22:42 PM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: oxford_guy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iñaki Harrizabalagatar


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23



As for the question of carronades they were not usually counted with all the other cannons aboard 1st,2nd & 3rd Rates, as it was down to individual Captains decision to arm his ship with carronades or not.

Yes, they were not counted until 1817, but in battle having 8x42pdr carronades added to your 24pdr battery counted very much! :)
It was a technological advantage almost exclusive to the Royal Navy for much of the period, I think it should be reflected somehow.



Maybe just in stronger stats for English 1st rates r better starting tech?


Definitely a possible option for ships. The visualization of naval fire power (by means of a "cannon number") enables a comprehensible representation of country specific differences in the basic combat values of the same unit types. These are all fine adjustments, which should only be done at the end of the mod development. We will see.

< Message edited by TheBattlefield -- 1/25/2017 1:23:31 PM >

(in reply to OxfordGuy3)
Post #: 171
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 2:02:19 PM   
OxfordGuy3


Posts: 1041
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield


The 1st Rate has now a more "Victory" style.
I have tried around with the gun numbers. I vote for this one. Indicates firepower in relation to other ships and will be raised by naval research. Check?





TheBattlefield your ship graphics are beautiful, and its a great idea to display the guns as per research level increase.


IFor what it's worth, agree, great changes here

(in reply to kirk23)
Post #: 172
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 2:05:19 PM   
OxfordGuy3


Posts: 1041
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

I have taken your advice regarding Militia and Partisan units both are now in the game.

SIPRES a great many thanks for creating superb graphics for the the mod


If you and TheBattlefield agree I think its only fair that when the mod is released, all our names will be on it, since it clearly is fast becoming a joint effort.










Thanks Kirk

Maybee we could organize tasks vs MOD members

Here is the following stuff I can handle or help:

Graphics

LAND UNIT Graphics (2D) --> on going....
Interface Graphics --> on going....
Flags file(s) Graphics --> (Majors completed) minors on going....
Media graphics Png --> not started yet

Data

LAND OOB (but only from 1805 sorry)
Country Data (Nations and Cities names as per 1803-1805)
Diplomacy historic Informations (1803 to 1815)

Programm

Sorry I have no clue about decisions, events, ect....
I dont have any SC1/SC2 background, just started playing SC3


Battlefield did already start a good work on the following :

SEA UNIT Graphics (2D)
MAP Graphics (to be more 19th century oriented)
I Feel he can help or advise for Programming as he already knows the SC engine.


We still miss a "sound files" member
and Maybe 3D sprites?


What do you both think about

Christophe



I don't have any of these skills, but happy to help where I can - proof-reading, testing, suggestions for improvement (which of course the Mod creators have the right to ignore!) etc. If there's anything else I can help with, let me know


< Message edited by oxford_guy -- 1/25/2017 2:06:05 PM >

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 173
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 3:30:43 PM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: oxford_guy

quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

I have taken your advice regarding Militia and Partisan units both are now in the game.

SIPRES a great many thanks for creating superb graphics for the the mod


If you and TheBattlefield agree I think its only fair that when the mod is released, all our names will be on it, since it clearly is fast becoming a joint effort.




Thanks Kirk

Maybee we could organize tasks vs MOD members

Here is the following stuff I can handle or help:

Graphics

LAND UNIT Graphics (2D) --> on going....
Interface Graphics --> on going....
Flags file(s) Graphics --> (Majors completed) minors on going....
Media graphics Png --> not started yet

Data

LAND OOB (but only from 1805 sorry)
Country Data (Nations and Cities names as per 1803-1805)
Diplomacy historic Informations (1803 to 1815)

Programm

Sorry I have no clue about decisions, events, ect....
I dont have any SC1/SC2 background, just started playing SC3


Battlefield did already start a good work on the following :

SEA UNIT Graphics (2D)
MAP Graphics (to be more 19th century oriented)
I Feel he can help or advise for Programming as he already knows the SC engine.


We still miss a "sound files" member
and Maybe 3D sprites?


What do you both think about

Christophe



I don't have any of these skills, but happy to help where I can - proof-reading, testing, suggestions for improvement (which of course the Mod creators have the right to ignore!) etc. If there's anything else I can help with, let me know



I think the core tasks are quite well organized!

Kirk is the boss:

- Mod related decision maker
- Map and country development
- Map lettering
- Scripting
- OOB and unit naming
- Unit development, placement and balancing
- Manual
- Applause reap in success and hold his head in case of failures


SIPRES as main designer and Kirks Deputy:

- Finalize all unit graphics
- Customize the game menu graphics
- Create / customize all necessary flags, badges and insignia
- Backup for Kirk in all historical questions and what else he needs

I would then be responsible for the following areas:

- Naval unit sheets
- Sea unit oriented (dummy) events
- Customized resource sprites
- Customized symbol sprites
- Customized sound files (possibly music files and calligraphy font, if Hubert can fix the bugs)
- Backup for Kirk with questions and problems regarding all scripts, troubleshooting, game balancing and whatever else may happen



PS: I really think "3D" units in this mod would be dispensable. Our "2D" units combine the best of both presentations. A clear indication on the start screen (first Popup Event for strategic notes?), in the manual / readme and in the forum should be sufficient. My opinion...

(in reply to OxfordGuy3)
Post #: 174
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/25/2017 10:26:05 PM   
OxfordGuy3


Posts: 1041
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheBattlefield


quote:

ORIGINAL: oxford_guy

quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES


quote:

ORIGINAL: kirk23

I have taken your advice regarding Militia and Partisan units both are now in the game.

SIPRES a great many thanks for creating superb graphics for the the mod


If you and TheBattlefield agree I think its only fair that when the mod is released, all our names will be on it, since it clearly is fast becoming a joint effort.




Thanks Kirk

Maybee we could organize tasks vs MOD members

Here is the following stuff I can handle or help:

Graphics

LAND UNIT Graphics (2D) --> on going....
Interface Graphics --> on going....
Flags file(s) Graphics --> (Majors completed) minors on going....
Media graphics Png --> not started yet

Data

LAND OOB (but only from 1805 sorry)
Country Data (Nations and Cities names as per 1803-1805)
Diplomacy historic Informations (1803 to 1815)

Programm

Sorry I have no clue about decisions, events, ect....
I dont have any SC1/SC2 background, just started playing SC3


Battlefield did already start a good work on the following :

SEA UNIT Graphics (2D)
MAP Graphics (to be more 19th century oriented)
I Feel he can help or advise for Programming as he already knows the SC engine.


We still miss a "sound files" member
and Maybe 3D sprites?


What do you both think about

Christophe



I don't have any of these skills, but happy to help where I can - proof-reading, testing, suggestions for improvement (which of course the Mod creators have the right to ignore!) etc. If there's anything else I can help with, let me know



I think the core tasks are quite well organized!

Kirk is the boss:

- Mod related decision maker
- Map and country development
- Map lettering
- Scripting
- OOB and unit naming
- Unit development, placement and balancing
- Manual
- Applause reap in success and hold his head in case of failures


SIPRES as main designer and Kirks Deputy:

- Finalize all unit graphics
- Customize the game menu graphics
- Create / customize all necessary flags, badges and insignia
- Backup for Kirk in all historical questions and what else he needs

I would then be responsible for the following areas:

- Naval unit sheets
- Sea unit oriented (dummy) events
- Customized resource sprites
- Customized symbol sprites
- Customized sound files (possibly music files and calligraphy font, if Hubert can fix the bugs)
- Backup for Kirk with questions and problems regarding all scripts, troubleshooting, game balancing and whatever else may happen



PS: I really think "3D" units in this mod would be dispensable. Our "2D" units combine the best of both presentations. A clear indication on the start screen (first Popup Event for strategic notes?), in the manual / readme and in the forum should be sufficient. My opinion...


For my part, I see no need for 3D units if you have nice land counters (looking good so far - would love to see how the English look, though!) and the ship models that have been shown here

(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 175
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/26/2017 5:31:40 AM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline 		You are both right about 3D sprites
Its not a priority and even can be done really much later after the MOD will be completed (kind of option patch)

(in reply to OxfordGuy3)
Post #: 176
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/26/2017 5:52:40 AM   
SIPRES


Posts: 398
Joined: 7/23/2015
Status: offline 		Here is French Army reworked

added:
Garnison/Regiment unit with Barrack dress
Unit size display for infantry
Guard Unit with darker Blue Background
Militia (French National Guard) Unit
Modified French engineer graphic
Add H and L text display for Light/heavy cavalry
modified Arty's colors (olive green was use by french), the plan is each major will have custom gun colors
modified Siege Arty graphic
Add Coastal gun fort
add congreve batterie (even if used only by british, I will made graphic available for each nations)

Let me know if you see any others changes or improvements to be done as I want to use the French file as a template to then deploy the same style for all others nations





Attachment (1)

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 177
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/26/2017 7:19:40 AM   
OxfordGuy3


Posts: 1041
Joined: 7/1/2012
From: Oxford, United Kingdom
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES

Here is French Army reworked

added:
Garnison/Regiment unit with Barrack dress
Unit size display for infantry
Guard Unit with darker Blue Background
Militia (French National Guard) Unit
Modified French engineer graphic
Add H and L text display for Light/heavy cavalry
modified Arty's colors (olive green was use by french), the plan is each major will have custom gun colors
modified Siege Arty graphic
Add Coastal gun fort
add congreve batterie (even if used only by british, I will made graphic available for each nations)

Let me know if you see any others changes or improvements to be done as I want to use the French file as a template to then deploy the same style for all others nations






Would the Cavalry units also need the III/X/XX/XXX indicators top left also be used to show the unit size? It looks like there would be space for this, at least for the heavies, or are independent Cavalry units only going to be one size?

On a busy map, I'm not sure that there is going to be enough visual distinction between the X/XX/XXX sized units - in the vanilla WWII game this is achieved by having the box for the INF Armies (XXXX) white, whereas for Corps (XXX) this is a lighter shade of the national colour. I guess one way this might be achieve is to colour the X/XX/XXX differently, dependent on size (e.g. white/yellow etc. - though yellow is used in the example for some special unit indicators), though finding a colour that works and doesn't get "lost" in all the national colours may be tricky (BTW if using white as above for the X/XX/XXX text, what colour would be used for Austrians for this - black?)

Also would the text colour for "H" and "M" need modifying for the red English units and what about the yellow symbols for the Spanish?

I really like these counters, but just have the above concerns about clarity, although maybe in practice it's not going to be a problem

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 178
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/26/2017 9:12:18 AM   
TheBattlefield


Posts: 507
Joined: 6/11/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SIPRES

Here is French Army reworked

added:
Garnison/Regiment unit with Barrack dress
Unit size display for infantry
Guard Unit with darker Blue Background
Militia (French National Guard) Unit
Modified French engineer graphic
Add H and L text display for Light/heavy cavalry
modified Arty's colors (olive green was use by french), the plan is each major will have custom gun colors
modified Siege Arty graphic
Add Coastal gun fort
add congreve batterie (even if used only by british, I will made graphic available for each nations)

Let me know if you see any others changes or improvements to be done as I want to use the French file as a template to then deploy the same style for all others nations







Since Kirk probably organize the cavalry uniformly as "divisions", markings to the unit size would be identical and therefore without statement value! The tank units of the Vanilla version do not carry any names to the troopsize and the cavalry in this mod somehow replaces the tanks. It would have to be considered, if at all, an "task-related" marking. However this might look...
(I suggest here that heavy cavalry contain the cuirassiers and guard cavalry, so heavy storm attack against infantry as a main feature. Medium cavalry probably dragoons and so on so balanced values. Light cavalry rather lancers and hussars, I think of fast attacks against cavalry, artillery, wavering infantry and reconnaissance.)


Edit: Just as a quick idea .... A small golden breastplate for the heavy cavalry, a pistol crossed with saber for the middle and a spearhead crossed with a saber for the light cavalry? Something like that...















< Message edited by TheBattlefield -- 1/26/2017 9:42:34 AM >

(in reply to SIPRES)
Post #: 179
RE: The Rise and Fall Of An Empire! - 1/26/2017 12:10:14 PM   
Hairog


Posts: 1645
Joined: 7/11/2000
From: Cornucopia, WI
Status: offline 		Sorry if this has already been brought up. My search function isn't working in this forum.

Have mobile supply depots been discussed and how your are going to model them? I suggest that they were key to Napoleonic warfare.

_____________________________

WW III 1946 Books
SC3 EAW WW Three 1946 Mod and Naval Mods
WarPlan and WarPlan Pac Alpha and Be

(in reply to TheBattlefield)
Post #: 180
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