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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer

 
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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/23/2017 9:27:52 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		To those who were disappointed, to get some idea which if any recent war film would you say was better than Dunkirk and why so?


What was the main issue you had with this movie?

Just with so many positive comments on the forum I'm intrigued.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/23/2017 10:39:13 PM   
Zorch

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

To those who were disappointed, to get some idea which if any recent war film would you say was better than Dunkirk and why so?


What was the main issue you had with this movie?

Just with so many positive comments on the forum I'm intrigued.

I haven't seen Dunkirk, but I'd like to recommend Warsaw '44 (Miasto 44 in polish), about the Home Army uprising. It has English subtitles. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3765326/?ref_=nv_sr_1

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 4:15:30 AM   
balto

 

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Status: offline 		HI Wodin. It was not a war movie. If you want to see a great movie, go see Manchester By The Sea or a pretty good movie Wonder Woman.

Your question about a recent good war movie, to me, they are few and far between. I hated the Brad Pitt, Sherman tank one. Last good war movie I saw was.., hmm, its been a while? Similar to a great western in that are both few and far between. But when you get a good Western or War movie - you think about it a lot and watch it again later on when it comes on rental.

But more importantly, it was a night out for some good clean fun. So a mediocre movie is not a bad thing.

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Post #: 63
RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 4:36:48 AM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: balto

It was not a war movie.

warspite1

You may not have liked Dunkirk - and fine that's entirely up to you - but how can you say it's not a war movie?

Perhaps for you its not historically accurate enough or you may believe the combat sequences are not believable, or you don't like the lack of CGI or you don't like the script or the acting or whatever - but, I confess I am at a loss, how is Dunkirk not a war movie?


< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/24/2017 4:44:11 AM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 5:19:57 PM   
RFalvo69


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Status: offline 		I'm reading "Miracle at Dunkirk", BTW, and I'm amazed by how many details Nolan was able to put in his movie. In "Dunkirk" many things happen to a small group of characters for dramatic purposes, but many, many scenes from the book (which, I guess derive from the memories of the soldiers) are there: the bombing and the strafing of the "Little Fleet" ships; the U-Boats (and torpedo boats) sinking destroyers - and what happened in their bowels with soldiers drowning while the ship was capsizing; the neat rows on the beaches... even the events on The Mole - when it is strafed and bombed - do seem to have been faithfully recreated from the book (I was amazed to discover that they actually did build pontoons using vehicles, and not only one but ten.

It is a movie, IMHO, worth watching twice: even if my eyes were, literally, glued to the screen (I don't remember even looking down once to check my backpack), there are a lot of details crammed everywhere. It is a difficult movie to absorb in a single sitting.

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Post #: 65
RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 5:37:38 PM   
warspite1


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Status: offline 		When I mentioned in my review the absence of a soundtrack on the film - more like an incessant noise - this is what I meant. Zimmer really adds to the intensity of the battle scenes with an assault on one's eardrums to complement and compound Nolan's assault on one's other senses.

Wonderful. Crank it up to the max as it winds itself up to a crescendo.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/dunkirk-music-christopher-nolan-hans-zimmer-2017-7?r=US&IR=T

< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/24/2017 7:07:38 PM >

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Post #: 66
RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 7:33:45 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

To those who were disappointed, to get some idea which if any recent war film would you say was better than Dunkirk and why so?


What was the main issue you had with this movie?

Just with so many positive comments on the forum I'm intrigued.

You made me think about this a bit, wodin. That's a good thing.

I'd have to go in the 'way back' machine to identify a war film that I thought was REALLY GOOD. There have been several that were entertaining, but not 'great'. I'd put "Dunkirk" in that batch. I'd also put "Fury" in that batch-and I am certain that the comparative will infuriate a goodly number here. I had a lot of fun with "Inglorious Basterds" too. All very watchable, but each with significant flaws that precluded greatness.

I think the last war movie that I saw that floored me was "Saving Private Ryan". I saw it several times in the theaters and afterwards. I cried, I felt nauseous, I found myself thinking-'by God that's enough! and angrily clenching my fists after watching the landing troops get slaughtered for 20 minutes. It was a visceral and transformative experience. The rest of the movie was very good too, but nothing compares to the beginning. That was the last GREAT war movie I saw.

See my previous comments regarding my greatest 'issue' with this movie.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 10:16:42 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		Hmm..see Saving Private Ryan..except for the landing sequence..didn't do it for me.I always seem to compare it to the TV series Band of Brothers which I thought superior..SPR still for me was abit Hollywood.

I'm sure I'm in a minority but I did like This Red Line, also a lower budget film called When Trumpets Fade. The German films Downfall and Stalingrad I really enjoyed aswell. Also Cross of Iron:)Non WW2 When We Were Soldiers surprised me in a good way.


The old black and white Dunkirk movie is well worth watching!

Hacksaw Ridge was decent

< Message edited by wodin -- 7/24/2017 10:17:54 PM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 11:43:49 PM   
Curtis Lemay


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Status: offline 		Band of Brothers and The Pacific are now the standard to beat.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/24/2017 11:47:23 PM   
Challerain

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

To those who were disappointed, to get some idea which if any recent war film would you say was better than Dunkirk and why so?


What was the main issue you had with this movie?

Just with so many positive comments on the forum I'm intrigued.

You made me think about this a bit, wodin. That's a good thing.

I'd have to go in the 'way back' machine to identify a war film that I thought was REALLY GOOD. There have been several that were entertaining, but not 'great'. I'd put "Dunkirk" in that batch. I'd also put "Fury" in that batch-and I am certain that the comparative will infuriate a goodly number here. I had a lot of fun with "Inglorious Basterds" too. All very watchable, but each with significant flaws that precluded greatness.

I think the last war movie that I saw that floored me was "Saving Private Ryan". I saw it several times in the theaters and afterwards. I cried, I felt nauseous, I found myself thinking-'by God that's enough! and angrily clenching my fists after watching the landing troops get slaughtered for 20 minutes. It was a visceral and transformative experience. The rest of the movie was very good too, but nothing compares to the beginning. That was the last GREAT war movie I saw.

See my previous comments regarding my greatest 'issue' with this movie.


I guess this is where I get lost. In an earlier post you said that Dunkirk didn't express the scope of the operation. I'm not sure how part of a landing at one of 5 D-Day beaches and then a single squad traipsing across France in SPR does if Dunkirk doesn't.

I'm with Wodin on this, other than the first 20 minutes, SPR is a mediocre film with a silly plot.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 2:31:53 AM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		Saving Private Ryan was a great movie because those first 30 minutes put the viewer on the beach (any of the beaches, but Omaha will do). The rest of the movie had its ups and downs but did a fine job of portraying combat. (For that same reason, Titanic was a great movie because the viewer was there, on the ship, experiencing the horror, even while grimacing at parts of the plot.)

Great war movies of the past 25 years: Blackhawk Down, Gettysburg, Schindler's List (I consider it a war movie), Enemy at the Gates. Very good: Letters from Iwo Jima.

I agree with Chickenboy that Fury and Dunkirk were comparable in quality. Fury showed the grittiness of land combat; Dunkirk portrayed some of the drama of the great evacuation from France. But neither are great movies. They're "okay." The viewer watches with varying degrees of interest....but the viewer is not landing at Omaha Beach, is not in a death camp, is not crossing a mile of pasture land leading to Cemetery Ridge, and is not on Titanic's C deck.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 6:20:40 AM   
warspite1


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Status: offline 		This is a great thread. It encapsulates just how difficult it is to please everyone in terms of what makes a great war film – just like how impossible it is to make a war game to everyone’s taste .

Re wodin’s point:

quote:

Hmm..see Saving Private Ryan..except for the landing sequence..didn't do it for me.


I would agree with that. The opening sequence makes that film memorable, the final battle was good, but the rest of the film … it was okay. The film has to be seen as one of the best – but only because of that opening sequence. Take that away and…..

Picking up on Challerain’s point

quote:

I guess this is where I get lost. In an earlier post you said that Dunkirk didn't express the scope of the operation. I'm not sure how part of a landing at one of 5 D-Day beaches and then a single squad traipsing across France in SPR does if Dunkirk doesn't.


I am assuming this is down to the title. Dunkirk perhaps suggests it’s going to be a telling of the entire story, whereas Saving Private Ryan would have had the same expectation had it been called D-Day? Personally I don’t downgrade SPR because it didn’t show the full scope of D-Day - because that wasn’t what the film was about.

But equally I don’t downgrade Dunkirk, because it didn't show the full scope despite the title, because I don’t care. I didn’t know what exactly to expect going into the film in terms of what it covered. It quickly became apparent it wasn’t going to be an historic overview of the evacuation – and that was fine, because what I was presented with was brilliant in my view for what it was.

But the biggest shocker (sorry Canoerebel) was this (although acknowledging this is not a war film)

quote:

Titanic was a great movie because the viewer was there, on the ship, experiencing the horror, even while grimacing at parts of the plot.


Whilst I’m glad you added the last part of the sentence, from a personal perspective I cannot agree less. This film was truly Pearl Harbor on ice(berg). What was wrong with Titanic? I don’t know where to start. The oh so predictable plot – as you say – made one grimace at best, but positively hurl chunks at worst (you can only be happy and free and enjoy life if you are a poor, salt of the earth type, and you are a scumbag with a rod stuck firmly between your cheeks if you are rich. zzzzz yeah that's original blah blah blah. There was no proper recognition of the bravery and heroism – and there was much that could have been celebrated - aboard the ship that night (except of course for the ubiquitous Molly Brown – natch). The director used a real life officer, Murdoch – a hero in his Scottish home town of Dalbeattie, and whose descendants are alive today – and showed him as a bribe taking coward who shot himself – although only after he shot an Irish steerage class passenger for no good reason first (again, natch) when there is no reliable evidence to support that it happened and certainly no evidence at all that, if it did, it was Murdoch. English (Scottish) officer shoots Irish immigrant - that'll get 'em through the box office and to hell with fact. This was Hollywood – Josef Goebbels styleee. Even the director, Cameron admitted that he should not have portrayed Murdoch in this way – but that’s easy to say £2bn dollars later when the damage is done…. Hideous.

But you redeem yourself!! You mention Schindler’s List. There is something we can agree on. Best. Film. Ever. Made. FACT .


< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/25/2017 6:22:34 AM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 12:18:29 PM   
goodwoodrw


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Status: offline 		Saw this picture today. My son and I went to the Imax theatre in Melbourne, truly a great experience. Sound, photography and music mind blowing. Loved the aerial combat or more so the aerial scenes. It's not SPR or a BTF it's a different type of war movie, just like Schindler's List was a different type of war movie.
Not to mention what they are, but there is a couple of scenes that frighten the crap out of me.
I would recommend this movie to most, if it is 100 minutes of blood, gore and endless action then you may be a little disappointed, but you want to see a movies great sound, photography, fantastic music and some very human elements of war (fear, pride, fortitude etc etc) then do yourself a favour go and see it soon.
Warspite In will be interested in your comparison between Imax and normal theatre.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 12:37:33 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		Schindlers List is fantastic film..forgot that one!

As for SPR it's not a totally bogus plot..it's loosely based on a true event...a soldier was pulled out the line as he was the last son..but how it was portrayed in the film is fiction to what really happened (I think they had read Ambrose Citizen Soldiers and it's mentioned in the book, that's were they got the inspiration)

Regeneration is another great film..can't believe I forgot that one!

The film with Tom Cruise about the attempted assassination of Hitler was better than I thought it would be..just. Fury was OK until one tank vs a near German regiment part.

Love Peter Jackson to make a WW1 movie!

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 2:01:14 PM   
RFalvo69


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB
Warspite In will be interested in your comparison between Imax and normal theatre.


I haven't seen it in a normal theatre, but I noticed that the trailers are in "widescreen" (don't ask me about the format ) while IMAX has more space above and below (almost 4:3 at my screening). This makes both the claustrofobic scenes and those where the characters experience "tunnel vision" even more realistic, IMHO.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 3:04:28 PM   
pkpowers

 

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Status: offline 		It was so loud in Imax i think we had hearing damage. (It got better )

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 3:22:48 PM   
wings7


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pkpowers

It was so loud in Imax i think we had hearing damage. (It got better )

Yell out in the theater a few times "turn it down" a few times...they will get the message.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 4:34:37 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Saw this picture today. My son and I went to the Imax theatre in Melbourne, truly a great experience. Sound, photography and music mind blowing. Loved the aerial combat or more so the aerial scenes. It's not SPR or a BTF it's a different type of war movie, just like Schindler's List was a different type of war movie.
Not to mention what they are, but there is a couple of scenes that frighten the crap out of me.
I would recommend this movie to most, if it is 100 minutes of blood, gore and endless action then you may be a little disappointed, but you want to see a movies great sound, photography, fantastic music and some very human elements of war (fear, pride, fortitude etc etc) then do yourself a favour go and see it soon.
Warspite In will be interested in your comparison between Imax and normal theatre.
warspite1

I will let you know . In 'normal' mode the Stukas were loud and scary enough, so I am expecting 'Stukas on steroids' tomorrow

And then there's the soundtrack Really looking forward to my first taste of imax!


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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 5:08:42 PM   
pkpowers

 

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Status: offline 		The gunshots sounded like right behind the seat. The merlin engine in spitfire sounded beautiful. That was true music.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 8:29:55 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pkpowers

The gunshots sounded like right behind the seat. The merlin engine in spitfire sounded beautiful. That was true music.
warspite1

There is something about the sound of the Merlin engine. Beautiful indeed, just indescribably beautiful.





Or six of them - even better




Attachment (2)

< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/25/2017 8:37:21 PM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/25/2017 9:18:42 PM   
stuart3

 

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Status: offline 		Just got home from watching Dunkirk in IMAX. The sound was absolutely incredible right from the opening gunfire. Christopher Nolan shows that you don’t have to cover the screen in fake blood (I don’t think there was any) in order to get the message across.

Having said that, I am glad that I had read a review that explained how the very different time scales of the land, air and sea components were spread equally across the length of the action. Without that, I think I would have struggled about how the spitfires were still flying the same patrol and the small boat nowhere near the French coast while the army had already had two or three night scenes.

If I had to have a quibble, it would be about the incredible buoyancy of the two spitfires that ditched in the Channel. My understanding is that they would have been much more likely to dive straight to the bottom, taking their pilots with them.

I am definitely considering a second viewing.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/26/2017 1:03:58 AM   
goodwoodrw


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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Saw this picture today. My son and I went to the Imax theatre in Melbourne, truly a great experience. Sound, photography and music mind blowing. Loved the aerial combat or more so the aerial scenes. It's not SPR or a BTF it's a different type of war movie, just like Schindler's List was a different type of war movie.
Not to mention what they are, but there is a couple of scenes that frighten the crap out of me.
I would recommend this movie to most, if it is 100 minutes of blood, gore and endless action then you may be a little disappointed, but you want to see a movies great sound, photography, fantastic music and some very human elements of war (fear, pride, fortitude etc etc) then do yourself a favour go and see it soon.
Warspite In will be interested in your comparison between Imax and normal theatre.
warspite1

I will let you know . In 'normal' mode the Stukas were loud and scary enough, so I am expecting 'Stukas on steroids' tomorrow

And then there's the soundtrack Really looking forward to my first taste of imax!


The bullets through the hull frightened the crapper out of me.
The Stukas, wow in fact the sound WOW. I just thought it was a great movie. I'm glad I read a little about the movie before going, because I think would have been a bit confused with the time line. But saying that, my 20 year old son knew very little about Dunkirk, didn't read much about the movie before going, but he loved it.He said he had no trouble following what was going on, I guess kids of today are smarter than me. One comment he did make was he loved the violins, what friggin violins

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/26/2017 4:12:22 PM   
Poopyhead

 

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Status: offline 		For 76 years we've all been told that:

- Hitler was an idiot for stopping Guderian (twice) from driving his panzers through to the coast...almost ensuring the evacuation's success.

-Goering was a pompous fool for thinking that the Luftwaffe alone could keep the Brits from evacuating...which it could not.

-The French never got any credit for the success...even though their holding operation made it possible.

So...a horrible plan to move the BEF into Belgium precipitated a near disaster that was averted due to German incompetence and heroic French resistance.

Maybe someone should tell that story.

http://www.thewrap.com/dunkirk-fact-check-how-many-rescued/

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/26/2017 4:27:06 PM   
warspite1


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Status: offline 		That kind of depends on what book one reads....

quote:

So...a horrible plan to move the BEF into Belgium precipitated a near disaster that was averted due to German incompetence and heroic French resistance.....maybe someone should tell that story


I take it from the way you've phrased your post you actually believe it was a British plan?? Well it wasn't and a) it wasn't just the BEF that moved into Belgium - the cream of the French Army moved with them b) whose plan was that? Well it begins with Maurice and ends with Gamelin and c) whose Breda variant - which called for Allied troops to move beyond the Dyle was the reason there were no French reserves when the Germans breached the Meuse? Well it begins with Maurice and ends with Gamelin.

quote:

The French never got any credit for the success...even though their holding operation made it possible.


The French - along with the British and, for a while, the Belgians - all played their part in holding the Germans at bay. After the Belgians surrendered the French and the British (in smaller numbers) held the perimeter around Dunkerque. French forces were instrumental in the evacuation being capable of happening (the plan of evacuation still had to be executed - and for which the land roles were reversed - the Royal Navy provided the bulk of the ships and aircraft). I have no wish to bash the French, many of whom fought so bravely, but in addition to your false point about the march into Belgium, you singularly failed to mention - in your list of what we have been told - the truth about what led to the debacle in the first place - the crossing of the Meuse and the inability of the French to adequately defend that major river crossing. To fight the war to a WWI timetable, to fail to defend the river and adequately patrol its east bank, to fail to lay sufficient mines, to fail to man key crossing points and strongpoints, and to fail to extinguish the initial tentative bridgeheads over the Meuse.

You also fail to mention the spectacular luck that the Germans received on a number of occasions during the campaign - not limited to a) the fact that Guderian's request for a devastating aerial bombardment that shattered the French on the Meuse was overruled by von Kleist in favour of a less effective one. Why were the Germans lucky? The Luftwaffe officer ignored Kleist* and went with Guderian's plan. b) Guderian's resignation was accepted (again by Kleist* I believe who, along with a number of senior generals were far from happy with the plan to send the panzers to the coast) but fortunately again for the Germans, a compromise was worked out.

No one knows exactly who was responsible for the halt order, but it is believed it actually emanated from von Rundstedt - not Hitler - and took into account that the tanks needed R+R for the remaining liquidation of French resistance still to come.

*Need to check if this was Kleist. EDIT: Yes it was Kleist. Bruno Loerzer - Commander of Luftflotte II and Guderian had agreed upon the devastating rolling raid (developed over Poland) to neutralise the French defenders on the Meuse. Kleist countermanded the order - but Loerzer, luckily for the Germans, decided it was too late to change Guderian's plan....

< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/27/2017 6:37:39 AM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/26/2017 6:52:10 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		Events in War are always alot more complicated than it may look, hence why we still have a constant supply of new books coming out WW1 and WW2.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/26/2017 9:48:42 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Saw this picture today. My son and I went to the Imax theatre in Melbourne, truly a great experience. Sound, photography and music mind blowing. Loved the aerial combat or more so the aerial scenes. It's not SPR or a BTF it's a different type of war movie, just like Schindler's List was a different type of war movie.
Not to mention what they are, but there is a couple of scenes that frighten the crap out of me.
I would recommend this movie to most, if it is 100 minutes of blood, gore and endless action then you may be a little disappointed, but you want to see a movies great sound, photography, fantastic music and some very human elements of war (fear, pride, fortitude etc etc) then do yourself a favour go and see it soon.
Warspite In will be interested in your comparison between Imax and normal theatre.
warspite1

I will let you know . In 'normal' mode the Stukas were loud and scary enough, so I am expecting 'Stukas on steroids' tomorrow

And then there's the soundtrack Really looking forward to my first taste of imax!


The bullets through the hull frightened the crapper out of me.
The Stukas, wow in fact the sound WOW. I just thought it was a great movie. I'm glad I read a little about the movie before going, because I think would have been a bit confused with the time line. But saying that, my 20 year old son knew very little about Dunkirk, didn't read much about the movie before going, but he loved it.He said he had no trouble following what was going on, I guess kids of today are smarter than me. One comment he did make was he loved the violins, what friggin violins
warspite1

I really enjoyed the film in the Imax. The noise was just ... noisier! The soundtrack was even more noticeable too.

It was also good to watch the film second time around - knowing this time how the timelines intermingle - and the film, excellent first time round, was even better the second time.

And they must do something about that air quality in the cinema - once again I seem to have got something in my eye on a couple of occasions....[bottom lip has now stopped quivering ]


< Message edited by warspite1 -- 7/26/2017 9:53:51 PM >

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/27/2017 6:41:35 PM   
wodin


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Status: offline 		DAmn I forgot to mention another great war film which I think hasn't been mentioned yet...Waterloo.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/28/2017 2:32:17 AM   
goodwoodrw


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Status: offline 		Steiger Napoleon yes good movie especially for its time

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/28/2017 5:18:33 AM   
radic202


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I have a question for those who have seen it. It is impossible for me to go see it at the theaters as I am hearing impaired and without subtitles on the big screen and my hearing aids will capture all the bombs and gun shots I will never hear any spoken words over the music and the likes. So I need to wait until it is released on Blu ray where I can read the subtitles in the comfort of my home.

Anyhow, my question is this:

Is it strictly about the UK Forces on the evacuation part? Or do we see the Canadian, Aussie and Kiwis Commonwealth troops as well? I am sure the French are present as they were the main reason the evacuees had time to "evacuate" stalling the Germans push to the see.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

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RE: New Dunkirk Trailer - 7/28/2017 5:58:15 AM   
stuart3

 

Posts: 193
Joined: 9/4/2014
Status: offline 		This isn't the history of the Dunkirk evacuation. It is the story of one spitfire patrol with three pilots with English accents, one small boat from the south coast of England with three local civilians as crew, and two English soldiers desperately trying to jump the queues on the beaches in order to to get home.

There are a lot of khaki clad soldiers in the background. One soldier reserved the queue he was in for the Grenadiers. Other than that you can make your own assumptions about which nationalities the background soldiers represented.

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