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RE: PBY's with depth charges

 
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RE: PBY's with depth charges - 10/4/2019 9:56:21 PM   
BillBrown


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Here is a link to the entire thread about aircraft load filters. https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3185771&mpage=1&key=filter

(in reply to tacticon)
Post #: 31
RE: PBY's with depth charges - 10/5/2019 5:25:08 AM   
Ian R

 

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From: Cammeraygal Country
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Thanks Bill, I can now explain how a calculated my Skyraider loadout filters with more precision:

2- naval (torpedo)

4 - alt naval (bombs)

17 = 1 (city attack) + 16 (port attack)

40 = 8 (ground unit attack) + 32 = (airfield attack)*

(64 = ASW , not relevant)

* Note if you do this and set them to 12k altitude, they dive bomb and release all their ordnance, including the HVSRs; it might be more gentlemanly to send then in a 1000ft.



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Post #: 32
RE: PBY's with depth charges - 10/5/2019 5:42:13 PM   
inqistor


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Joined: 5/12/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tacticon

So, what if we changed the accuracy of all bombs to 25%. Now any combination of 4000lbs worth of bombs yield the same real effect over time. 100lb bombs would still be worthless against hardened or armored targets but would more consistent in hitting soft targets. I know a lot of this is speculation and conjecture, but I would rather run this by the gallery and find out what the collective wisdom is before I waste my time running tests.

When MichelM was hunting bugs during beta, he repaired code for bombarding. From his rough description, procedure looks like this:
1. Every bomb in single plane is checked for hit, until actual hit is scored
2. Then remaining bombs are checked, until first miss
3. That ends bombarding for that plane, after first miss remaining bombs are not checked anymore
So, more bombs plane carries, the greater chance for actual hit, but not necessarily more, than ONE BOMB.

I vaguely recall my tests from years ago:
Any bomb below 250kg will probably only damage plane on airfield.
Size of bomb doesn't matter during Ground Attack. 15kg, or 800kg kill squad the same.
Damage to airfield is made by number of hits only (although I have not checked if larger bomb can score more than one hit). So obviously, more bombs the better.

And, according to manual, actual loses in fuel, and supply is calculated based on bomb effect.

(in reply to tacticon)
Post #: 33
RE: PBY's with depth charges - 10/6/2019 5:00:10 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: inqistor

quote:

ORIGINAL: tacticon

So, what if we changed the accuracy of all bombs to 25%. Now any combination of 4000lbs worth of bombs yield the same real effect over time. 100lb bombs would still be worthless against hardened or armored targets but would more consistent in hitting soft targets. I know a lot of this is speculation and conjecture, but I would rather run this by the gallery and find out what the collective wisdom is before I waste my time running tests.

When MichelM was hunting bugs during beta, he repaired code for bombarding. From his rough description, procedure looks like this:
1. Every bomb in single plane is checked for hit, until actual hit is scored
2. Then remaining bombs are checked, until first miss
3. That ends bombarding for that plane, after first miss remaining bombs are not checked anymore
So, more bombs plane carries, the greater chance for actual hit, but not necessarily more, than ONE BOMB.

I vaguely recall my tests from years ago:
Any bomb below 250kg will probably only damage plane on airfield.
Size of bomb doesn't matter during Ground Attack. 15kg, or 800kg kill squad the same.
Damage to airfield is made by number of hits only (although I have not checked if larger bomb can score more than one hit). So obviously, more bombs the better.

And, according to manual, actual loses in fuel, and supply is calculated based on bomb effect.

Maybe one wrinkle on the idea that more bombs is more important than larger bombs - forts. Small bombs hardly ever hit paydirt if forts are 4+, IME. Big bombs and battleship caliber shells can smash their way through some of the fort protection and cause damage/destruction. For airfields, I picture the forts as being things like revetments that isolate hits from damaging several aircraft, but if the bomb/shell can move the dirt in the wall of a revetment there is a greater chance of damaging multiple aircraft. All of this is abstracted into the weapon effect/fort damage reduction effect algorithms, of course.

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(in reply to inqistor)
Post #: 34
RE: PBY's with depth charges - 10/23/2019 6:53:31 AM   
Yaab


Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: inqistor

quote:

ORIGINAL: tacticon

So, what if we changed the accuracy of all bombs to 25%. Now any combination of 4000lbs worth of bombs yield the same real effect over time. 100lb bombs would still be worthless against hardened or armored targets but would more consistent in hitting soft targets. I know a lot of this is speculation and conjecture, but I would rather run this by the gallery and find out what the collective wisdom is before I waste my time running tests.

When MichelM was hunting bugs during beta, he repaired code for bombarding. From his rough description, procedure looks like this:
1. Every bomb in single plane is checked for hit, until actual hit is scored
2. Then remaining bombs are checked, until first miss
3. That ends bombarding for that plane, after first miss remaining bombs are not checked anymore
So, more bombs plane carries, the greater chance for actual hit, but not necessarily more, than ONE BOMB.

I vaguely recall my tests from years ago:
Any bomb below 250kg will probably only damage plane on airfield.
Size of bomb doesn't matter during Ground Attack. 15kg, or 800kg kill squad the same.
Damage to airfield is made by number of hits only (although I have not checked if larger bomb can score more than one hit). So obviously, more bombs the better.

And, according to manual, actual loses in fuel, and supply is calculated based on bomb effect.



That would partially explain why some big bombing missions score so few hits.

I have only recently realised that the SAME number of bombers carrying the SAME number of bombs and flying at the SAME will consistenly hit/kill MORE squads in Clear weather. Go to castor troy new AAR and analyse his bombing missions against Chinese LCUs. Day after day, same bomber formations bomb the hapless Chinese. However, while Clear weather eqauls heavy losses for the Chinese, the Overcast/Moderate weather curtails the losses, while Thunderstorm weather sometimes completely reduces the losses to zero.

Now think about 100 Wirraways flying at 15,000 feet carrying 2 x 100 lb bombs in Thunderstorm weather. Since 100 lb bomb has a much lower accuracy than 500 lb bomb, and the Weather further reduces the accuracy, the MichaelM bombing code further reduces bombs' chance to hit. Thus you can have those dismal light bomber raids which never really hit anything or 2Es raids on extended range with lighter bombs which are equally ineffective.

On the other hand, if you fly against the same target in Clear weather at 2000 feet and 8 x 500 lb bombs, your bomber becomes a veritable death machine, because each bomb has now greatly augmented chance of successful hit.

I know players observed this behavior in naval attack missions, but I have never noticed the same pattern in ground attack missions against LCUs until now.

EDIT: Actually, resting your bombers in Thunderstorm weather would be optimal - you do not expend supplies for no gain and rest your pilots.


< Message edited by Yaab -- 10/23/2019 12:53:39 PM >

(in reply to inqistor)
Post #: 35
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