RE: Macassar is invaded!

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

RE: Macassar is invaded!

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> After Action Reports >> RE: Macassar is invaded!

Page: << < prev 103 104 [105] 106 107 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 6:46:54 PM

invernomuto

Posts: 986
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline

quote:

One way or the other, game mechanics must be changed.
- Less deadly A2A
- The ability to give attack priorities
- The ability to order attack groups to break of attacks if the enemy is too strong
(E.g Ignore losses, limit losses, recon attacks..)
- The ability to set certain hexes as off limits for bombers in order to avoid strong enemy CAP

Excellent ideas, Pzb.
Something must be done for the Uber Cap, I hope that Don and Joe are listening.

Bye

< Message edited by invernomuto -- 9/4/2006 8:48:23 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to invernomuto)

Post #: 3121

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 6:51:25 PM

Kereguelen

Posts: 1829
Joined: 5/13/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

I think Matrix has to implement some changes Chez. They have done a marvelous job at fixing this and updatingthe game, but this has mostly been based on feedback from 42-43 games. What I would like to know is how difficult it would be to actually implement them and how likely it is that action will be taken....

I agree 100 %. It is not about stoping Allies in 1944 it's all about delaying them - i'm not asking for sinking Essexs in late period war but torp or kamikaze would be nice and possibly delay Allies for couple of weeks. I understand your frustration after countless failed strikes which just producing more Allied aces and i don't think i would start another WiTP game if somethings doesn't changes in A2A combat model (the only other choice is going for AV, but i never interested in that).

Ok, the question is is there something you can do it right now. I think that your only opportunity is to do what you've done in Marians - strong and experienced CAP since fighters on escort will be eaten no matter how experienced they are. I know that means no offensive missions but it seems that this is the only way...

Recent Andy's moves showing we were right - he is moving on Borneo-Java axe. If he tries to invade Java (somehow i feels that he could skip this option and go for northern Borneo, Thailand or Malaya; Palembang is very likely target too) you could use base NW of Soerbaja (Maedion?) which can not be reached from sea. Massing 300-400 hundreds crack Georges and Franks on CAP could scare him*

Not disputing that A2A losses are sometimes a problem in the game when large numbers of planes are involved... However, during the carrier raid on Luzon and Formosa (Oct 11th to Oct 15th 1944), the Japanese (JAAF and JNAF combined) lost 438 planes in A2A combat and 366 planes were destroyed on the ground (Japanese losses on Formosa on 12th Oct alone: 193 A2A, 123 destroyed on ground). Combat losses of the USN carriers involved were 25 planes between Oct 11th and Oct 15th).

[Japanese loss figures put together from interrogations of Japanese staff officers after the war]

(in reply to pauk)

Post #: 3122

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 7:44:00 PM

ChezDaJez

Posts: 3436
Joined: 11/12/2004
From: Chehalis, WA
Status: offline

quote:

Not disputing that A2A losses are sometimes a problem in the game when large numbers of planes are involved... However, during the carrier raid on Luzon and Formosa (Oct 11th to Oct 15th 1944), the Japanese (JAAF and JNAF combined) lost 438 planes in A2A combat and 366 planes were destroyed on the ground (Japanese losses on Formosa on 12th Oct alone: 193 A2A, 123 destroyed on ground). Combat losses of the USN carriers involved were 25 planes between Oct 11th and Oct 15th).

[Japanese loss figures put together from interrogations of Japanese staff officers after the war]

There's no disputing that US CAP and flak took a very heavy toll on attackers but it seldom shot down every single plane that attacked and AFAIK it never succeeded in preventing at least few aircraft getting through. Excluding Kamikaze raids, losses were probably more on the order of 30-50% which is certainly unsustainable for an attacker.

Over Japan proper, there were at least 2 US carrier raids where the Japanese defenders managed to shoot down more than they lost.

Even Andy agrees that Allied CAP is much too effective.

Chez

_____________________________

Ret Navy AWCS (1972-1998)
VP-5, Jacksonville, Fl 1973-78
ASW Ops Center, Rota, Spain 1978-81
VP-40, Mt View, Ca 1981-87
Patrol Wing 10, Mt View, CA 1987-90
ASW Ops Center, Adak, Ak 1990-92
NRD Seattle 1992-96
VP-46, Whidbey Isl, Wa 1996-98

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3123

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 9:10:58 PM

Przemcio231

Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline

Well i wounder if the Jap players are crying when their Zero Cap is killing everything in the Early part of the War... any way im playing one game as Japan and im in June 1943 as for now my planes are quite good ageainst US Navy and Lightnings... i never faced Mr. Corsair Trough as im keeping my distance from this Menace

leatly i shoot down about 100 US Navy Fighters Loseing 60 A6m3a the Bettys got through and put a figh into Essex and Hornet

most of the bombers made it through CAP unscratched but the AAA damaged many of them

_____________________________

Pinky: Hey Brain what are we goeing to do this evening?
Brain: The Usual Pinky we will try to take over the World;)

(in reply to ChezDaJez)

Post #: 3124

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 9:19:29 PM

aztez

Posts: 4031
Joined: 2/26/2005
From: Finland
Status: offline

The so called UberCAP works both ways. KB is pretty much untouchable in early part of the war too! Not to mention the Zero bonus which is total bs too.

It works both ways in Stock... You get some you lose some.

One way of avoiding UberCAP is to play with NikMod or CHS scen. 159/160. I guarantee that those air to air fights are far from anykind of UberCAP issues.

< Message edited by aztez -- 9/4/2006 9:21:09 PM >

(in reply to Przemcio231)

Post #: 3125

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 9:48:43 PM

Kereguelen

Posts: 1829
Joined: 5/13/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChezDaJez

There's no disputing that US CAP and flak took a very heavy toll on attackers but it seldom shot down every single plane that attacked and AFAIK it never succeeded in preventing at least few aircraft getting through. Excluding Kamikaze raids, losses were probably more on the order of 30-50% which is certainly unsustainable for an attacker.

Over Japan proper, there were at least 2 US carrier raids where the Japanese defenders managed to shoot down more than they lost.

Even Andy agrees that Allied CAP is much too effective.

Chez

Hi,

the results of a single game give not enough evidence for complete deductions(IMHO).

In my own PBEM (Oct 1943 currently) my adversary managed to penetrate my CAP with some Betties when I invaded Port Moresby some months ago. He suffered heavy losses (due to lots of P-38Gs and Wildcats providing LRCAP over the Invasion TF), his escorts (Zeros and some army planes) were slaughtered by my CAP but the Betties still managed to torpedo one DD and an AK. And I did not shoot down every single enemy plane, even some Japanese fighters survived.

There're many AAR's out here were you can see similar results.

K

(in reply to ChezDaJez)

Post #: 3126

Macassar falls! - 9/4/2006 10:04:23 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

The Jap ac are always described as incredible manouverable, but the US ac usually got much
better mvr ratings. 200 80 exp Randys should be good bomber interceptors when mixed up with George
and Jacks!

True, the US carriers caused mayhem against Jap installations in mid 1944. But the raids mentioned
here were among the most devastating of them all. In 'this world' such losses are normal

The Jap death star
of 42 is much vaunted, but it's far from as indestructible as the Allied version from late 43 and onwards.
After loosing 5000 ac I have yet to score a single hit on an enemy CV over the last year!

Unfortunately it's not possible to change the A2A model in an old game. So we have to fight out the war
with what we got. I'm yielding ground slowly in the DEI: the eventuall loss of resources and oil will hurt,
but this is inevitable. We must prepare the inner defensive perimeter for an all out Allied offensive from
late 44 and 1945.

Don't think Java can be defended Pauk, 150 enemy P38Js escorting 150 4Es is enough to smash any of the bases
there regardless of how many fighters we field. We have to save our strength for later. The further north Andy
advances, the stiffer the opposition will become. I'm only using mediocre fighter formations to oppose the enemy
now.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 08/20/44

Invasions

Andy really brought in a lot of troops for the Macassar invasion. Overkill, but that's
a good thing. The troops will be fatigued after they finally suppress the stubborn defenders.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 1053 encounters mine field at Macassar (30,69)
TF 1053 troops unloading over beach at Macassar, 30,69

Allied Ships
MSW Gladstone
MSW Geelong
MSW Cootamundra
MSW Ararat
APD Walsh
APD Bates
APD Dickerson
APD Noa
APD Overton
DD Harrison
DD Black
DD Aulick
LCT LCT-475, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

Allied ground losses:
22 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Coastal Guns at Macassar, 30,69, firing at TF 1053
99 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Allied Ships
LCT LCT-475, on fire, heavy damage
DD Charles Badger
LCT LCT-378
CLAA San Diego, Shell hits 1
LCT LCT-370
LCT LCT-368
DD Bennett
LCT LCT-472
LCT LCT-469, Shell hits 2, on fire
LCT LCT-465, Shell hits 1
DD Aulick
DD Abbot
LCT LCT-373, Shell hits 1

Japanese ground losses:
3 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Allied ground losses:
437 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 1061 encounters mine field at Macassar (30,69)
TF 1061 troops unloading over beach at Macassar, 30,69

Allied Ships
DE Wyman
DE Wileman

Coastal Guns at Macassar, 30,69, firing at TF 1061
2 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Allied Ships
CL Adelaide

Allied ground losses:
42 casualties reported
Vehicles lost 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 1053 encounters mine field at Macassar (30,69)
TF 1053 troops unloading over beach at Macassar, 30,69

Allied Ships
MSW Gladstone
MSW Geelong
MSW Cootamundra
MSW Ararat
APD Walsh
APD Daniel T. Griffin
APD Dickerson
APD Noa
APD Goldsborough
DD Harrison
DD Bradford
DD Black
DD Bennion
LCT LCT-471, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

Coastal Guns at Macassar, 30,69, firing at TF 1053
14 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied ground losses:
86 casualties reported
Vehicles lost 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Coastal Guns at Macassar, 30,69, firing at TF 1061
TF 1061 troops unloading over beach at Macassar, 30,69

2 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Allied Ships
DD Hudson

Allied ground losses:
60 casualties reported

Bombardments

Naval bombardment of Macassar, at 30,69

Allied Ships
BB Colorado
BB California
BB North Carolina

Japanese ground losses:
71 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air Combat

A flight of Zekes on kami missions got through the Spits on high altitude CAP
after loosing 12 of their numbers. They all missed their targets....These were 40 exp
pilots. Still not usefull for kamikaze attacks. Will try 50 exp next time.

Day Air attack on TF, near Macassar at 30,69

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zeke x 27

Allied aircraft
FM-2 Wildcat x 52
F6F Hellcat x 19
F4U-1 Corsair x 9
Spitfire VIII x 12

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zeke: 27 destroyed

Allied Ships
BB California
BB Colorado
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground Combat

Ground combat at Macassar

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 28046 troops, 259 guns, 63 vehicles, Assault Value = 707

Defending force 5638 troops, 49 guns, 6 vehicles, Assault Value = 146

Allied max assault: 1316 - adjusted assault: 1016

Japanese max defense: 82 - adjusted defense: 107

Allied assault odds: 9 to 1 (fort level 4)

Allied forces CAPTURE Macassar base !!!

Japanese aircraft
no flights

No Japanese losses

Japanese ground losses:
166 casualties reported
Guns lost 4
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
485 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Sampit

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 3959 troops, 43 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 89

Defending force 3465 troops, 39 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 68

Allied max assault: 148 - adjusted assault: 6 - out of supplies?

Japanese max defense: 53 - adjusted defense: 54

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 3)

Japanese ground losses:
64 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

Allied ground losses:
88 casualties reported
Guns lost 7
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Pamakasan

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 170 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 14

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 0

Allied max assault: 14 - adjusted assault: 16

Japanese max defense: 0 - adjusted defense: 1

Allied assault odds: 16 to 1 (fort level 0)

Allied forces CAPTURE Pamakasan base !!!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The fall of Macassar was expected

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to aztez)

Post #: 3127

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 10:08:10 PM

2ndACR

Posts: 5665
Joined: 8/31/2003
From: Irving,Tx
Status: offline

Ubercap comes from placing all your fighters on 80-90% CAP. Let him place 50 or 60% CAP and I am willing to bet that some a/c start getting thru. No guarntees of course, but it sure would help some. I know for a fact that Andy is using 80+ CAP on his CV's. I got this from looking at the a/c totals he was putting up and not from reading his AAR. Plus other comments he has made elsewhere.

I think if he would just drop his CAP to 60% everything will be much more enjoyable for both sides.

I never run my CV's as the IJN with over 60% CAP. I will place long range CAP over them at times to boost numbers. And I almost always get leakers in the early days of the war.

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3128

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 10:23:23 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

To penetrate a CAP of 300 Hellcats, you need at least a 300 ac strike. This is difficult to achieve, especially a balanced
one were 200 fighters and 200 bombers participate.

Fighters on LRCAP are not as effective as usual CAP, and is easier to penetrate.
P47s are just as lethal as Corsairs, 40 of either type is enough to cause staggering losses exceeding 50%
on even a formation of 200 highly experienced Zekes.

A 1-6 loss ratio would be acceptable if the casualty rate was lower. 100 Zekes should be able to swamp 20 enemy
Corsairs and cause losses in the 1-1 region. 10 Zekes and 7 Corsairs would be a logical casualty list from such
an engagement, and then it would be out of the question to continue on to shoot down incoming bombers afterwards.

A raid with 100 Zekes and 100 bombers that was intercepted by 100 Corsairs would perhaps results in 30 Zekes being
shot down for 7-8 Corsairs, and it would be natural to expect that as many as 75% of the bombers would bomb their targets.
Interceptions never takes place after the attack runs in WitP.

Such a A2A model would require fewer highly experienced pilots, something disbanding 'training camps' and reducing
skill gains for pilots would achieve.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kereguelen
Hi,

the results of a single game give not enough evidence for complete deductions(IMHO).

In my own PBEM (Oct 1943 currently) my adversary managed to penetrate my CAP with some Betties when I invaded Port Moresby some months ago. He suffered heavy losses (due to lots of P-38Gs and Wildcats providing LRCAP over the Invasion TF), his escorts (Zeros and some army planes) were slaughtered by my CAP but the Betties still managed to torpedo one DD and an AK. And I did not shoot down every single enemy plane, even some Japanese fighters survived.

There're many AAR's out here were you can see similar results.
K

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3129

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 10:24:08 PM

Rob Brennan UK

Posts: 3685
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: London UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2ndACR

Ubercap comes from placing all your fighters on 80-90% CAP. Let him place 50 or 60% CAP and I am willing to bet that some a/c start getting thru. No guarntees of course, but it sure would help some. I know for a fact that Andy is using 80+ CAP on his CV's. I got this from looking at the a/c totals he was putting up and not from reading his AAR. Plus other comments he has made elsewhere.

I think if he would just drop his CAP to 60% everything will be much more enjoyable for both sides.

I never run my CV's as the IJN with over 60% CAP. I will place long range CAP over them at times to boost numbers. And I almost always get leakers in the early days of the war.

come to Timor Scotty

PzB . i think your doing a marvelous job considering the age of the game. Nikmod i think may really help japan in the later years. and it certainly stop KB uber cap early on so i suspect similar results with US late war . LBA will become much more important as extra LR cap i think. which means they wont be escorting bombers and the game slows down some.

_____________________________

sorry for the spelling . English is my main language , I just can't type . and i'm too lazy to edit :)

(in reply to 2ndACR)

Post #: 3130

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 10:32:41 PM

ChezDaJez

Posts: 3436
Joined: 11/12/2004
From: Chehalis, WA
Status: offline

quote:

There're many AAR's out here were you can see similar results.

But how many are using the stock game and scenario?

I know Nik's mod has toned down A-A. I haven't tried CHS or RHS.

Chez

_____________________________

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3131

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/4/2006 11:57:34 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Andy has promised to lower his CAP settings and not stack too many carriers.
Still, anything more than 200 fighters on CAP including Corsairs means that I may just as well stay home

Thanx Rob, the game has its charm - but it's a bit tough to conquer India only to be grounded by a CAP that
doesn't allow me to hurt the enemy's invasion fleets

<G>

I play my Allied game with Niks mod, no carrier battles yet but it's pretty impossible to prevent bombers from penetrating
a CAP. Will try to train as many high exp fighters like the Frank, Jack and Georges backed up by Tonys and Zekes as possible and
hold them back until I can use them with max effect.

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to ChezDaJez)

Post #: 3132

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/5/2006 2:20:39 AM

pauk

Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kereguelen

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

I think Matrix has to implement some changes Chez. They have done a marvelous job at fixing this and updatingthe game, but this has mostly been based on feedback from 42-43 games. What I would like to know is how difficult it would be to actually implement them and how likely it is that action will be taken....

I agree 100 %. It is not about stoping Allies in 1944 it's all about delaying them - i'm not asking for sinking Essexs in late period war but torp or kamikaze would be nice and possibly delay Allies for couple of weeks. I understand your frustration after countless failed strikes which just producing more Allied aces and i don't think i would start another WiTP game if somethings doesn't changes in A2A combat model (the only other choice is going for AV, but i never interested in that).

Ok, the question is is there something you can do it right now. I think that your only opportunity is to do what you've done in Marians - strong and experienced CAP since fighters on escort will be eaten no matter how experienced they are. I know that means no offensive missions but it seems that this is the only way...

Recent Andy's moves showing we were right - he is moving on Borneo-Java axe. If he tries to invade Java (somehow i feels that he could skip this option and go for northern Borneo, Thailand or Malaya; Palembang is very likely target too) you could use base NW of Soerbaja (Maedion?) which can not be reached from sea. Massing 300-400 hundreds crack Georges and Franks on CAP could scare him*

Not disputing that A2A losses are sometimes a problem in the game when large numbers of planes are involved... However, during the carrier raid on Luzon and Formosa (Oct 11th to Oct 15th 1944), the Japanese (JAAF and JNAF combined) lost 438 planes in A2A combat and 366 planes were destroyed on the ground (Japanese losses on Formosa on 12th Oct alone: 193 A2A, 123 destroyed on ground). Combat losses of the USN carriers involved were 25 planes between Oct 11th and Oct 15th).

[Japanese loss figures put together from interrogations of Japanese staff officers after the war]

It seems that you missing one important thing - Japanese pilots in PzB's game are veterans/crack ones. I really doubt that Turkey shot would occur in real life if Japan had his Samurais. Anyway, i'm not asking for 1:1 loss ratio, all i ask is "having a chance to hurt Allies - and that doesn't means i think Japan should sink 5 Essexs in 1944".

Using historical data is fine, but doesn't suits the purpose in this game where PzB kicked out the Brits and have free training grounds in China.....

_____________________________

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3133

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/5/2006 2:23:01 AM

pauk

Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Przemcio231

Well i wounder if the Jap players are crying when their Zero Cap is killing everything in the Early part of the War... any way im playing one game as Japan and im in June 1943 as for now my planes are quite good ageainst US Navy and Lightnings... i never faced Mr. Corsair Trough as im keeping my distance from this Menace�leatly i shoot down about 100 US Navy Fighters Loseing 60 A6m3a the Bettys got through and put a figh into Essex and Hornet�most of the bombers made it through CAP unscratched but the AAA damaged many of them�

You must be one of top Japanese players. Rest of us really sucks....

_____________________________

(in reply to Przemcio231)

Post #: 3134

RE: Macassar is invaded! - 9/5/2006 2:25:53 AM

pauk

Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kereguelen

In my own PBEM (Oct 1943 currently) my adversary managed to penetrate my CAP with some Betties when I invaded Port Moresby some months ago. He suffered heavy losses (due to lots of P-38Gs and Wildcats providing LRCAP over the Invasion TF), his escorts (Zeros and some army planes) were slaughtered by my CAP but the Betties still managed to torpedo one DD and an AK. And I did not shoot down every single enemy plane, even some Japanese fighters survived.

There're many AAR's out here were you can see similar results.

K

PzB, you should learn how to use your Betties, i knew there is something wrong with you

EDIT: sorry for hijacking this outstanding AAR

< Message edited by pauk -- 9/5/2006 2:31:10 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Kereguelen)

Post #: 3135

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/5/2006 10:13:00 AM

pauk

Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

Don't think Java can be defended Pauk, 150 enemy P38Js escorting 150 4Es is enough to smash any of the bases there regardless of how many fighters we field.

Oh, that means that even crack Franks and Georges can't stop P-38J on the escort duty? In that case, placing fighters on Java would be mistake, i agree.

Can you post your industry screen when you find time? You have to be prepared for loss of the Palembang and you will have only 750 oil (Japan starts game with 750 oil) available for your industry. That means you can run 4500 HI and this small amount has to be carefully expended - mainly for ac engines and ac production.

As for the Randy, this fine ac should do fine against unescorted bombers, so keeping them in second line (important) bases seems like good decision....

_____________________________

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3136

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/5/2006 7:09:56 PM

castor troy

Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

Don't think Java can be defended Pauk, 150 enemy P38Js escorting 150 4Es is enough to smash any of the bases there regardless of how many fighters we field.

Oh, that means that even crack Franks and Georges can't stop P-38J on the escort duty? In that case, placing fighters on Java would be mistake, i agree.

Can you post your industry screen when you find time? You have to be prepared for loss of the Palembang and you will have only 750 oil (Japan starts game with 750 oil) available for your industry. That means you can run 4500 HI and this small amount has to be carefully expended - mainly for ac engines and ac production.

As for the Randy, this fine ac should do fine against unescorted bombers, so keeping them in second line (important) bases seems like good decision....

Franks and Georges (if exp 75 or better) should definetely be able to stop at least the same experienced P38 pilots. In my stock PBEM my Tojos and Tonies are shooting down P38s in a 1:3 kill ratio (in favour for the Japs!) if defending their own base against long range fighters. Though the average exp. of the daitais is 80 or better. So Franks should do better than Tojos.

(in reply to pauk)

Post #: 3137

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/5/2006 9:02:58 PM

AmiralLaurent

Posts: 3351
Joined: 3/11/2003
From: Near Paris, France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pauk

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

Don't think Java can be defended Pauk, 150 enemy P38Js escorting 150 4Es is enough to smash any of the bases there regardless of how many fighters we field.

Oh, that means that even crack Franks and Georges can't stop P-38J on the escort duty? In that case, placing fighters on Java would be mistake, i agree.

Can you post your industry screen when you find time? You have to be prepared for loss of the Palembang and you will have only 750 oil (Japan starts game with 750 oil) available for your industry. That means you can run 4500 HI and this small amount has to be carefully expended - mainly for ac engines and ac production.

I think that the problem is that crack Japanese fighters may have 1 to 1 loss ratio, but then will be tired and unable to stop the bombers and then will have serious losses on the ground, then following raids will crush them.

As for the oil situation, PzB will have the 750 initial centers plus the Chinese oilfields of Sian and Lanchow (200) plus the Burma and India ones, that will turn for the Indian HI.

For me Palembang area should be defended with at least as much energy than Mariannas.

(in reply to pauk)

Post #: 3138

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 12:00:12 AM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Please excuse Pauk San Samurai Przemcio231, he's very touchy regarding issues that concern the welfare of the Empire

P-38Js are extremely capable ac, especially when flown by good pilots. They make it very difficult to prevent
a large number of 4Es from crushing our airfields. I have spent weeks on reorganizing my best fighter units
afterwards. Morale gets zapped and the last damaged ac is stuck with 19 pilots for days on end...

Attaching a screenshot of our industry for August 1944 compared to that of July.
2 oil convoys with 170k crude are incoming, so the slight decline in oil reserves should be only temporary. Otherwise our
stocks have increased, especially resource and HI.

The large infantry reinforcements have not done anything to the manpower pools, they have actually increased as well.
Is this a bug?

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 08/21/44

Invasions

70 fighters on LRCAP over Pamakasan shoots down 8 Coronados and we immediately
land troops to wipe out the enemy bridge head.

TF 32 troops unloading over beach at Pamakasan, 24,66

Japanese ground losses:
56 casualties reported
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air Combat

These 35 Jacks were flown by 75 exp pilots.
Enemy P38s still broke through and savaged the Judys!

Day Air attack on 24th USA/B Division, at 26,62

Japanese aircraft
J2M Jack x 35
D4Y Judy x 21

Allied aircraft
P-38J Lightning x 13

Japanese aircraft losses
J2M Jack: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged
D4Y Judy: 7 destroyed, 1 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
P-38J Lightning: 2 destroyed

Allied ground losses:
3 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Aircraft Attacking:
14 x D4Y Judy bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground Combat

Again our heroic troops inflict heavy casualties on the enemy!

Ground combat at Macassar

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 29011 troops, 237 guns, 133 vehicles, Assault Value = 676

Defending force 4458 troops, 14 guns, 5 vehicles, Assault Value = 111

Allied max assault: 1238 - adjusted assault: 852

Japanese max defense: 63 - adjusted defense: 73

Allied assault odds: 11 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
183 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

Allied ground losses:
576 casualties reported
Guns lost 6
Vehicles lost 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Industry August 1944

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by PzB -- 9/6/2006 12:01:25 AM >

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to AmiralLaurent)

Post #: 3139

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 12:10:09 AM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Here's an overview of Sasebo, our main supply port.
Stocks of oil and resources are plentyful

Hopefully we can prevent our industry from falling behind for another 6-8 months...
Our oil and HI output in the Home Islands, Burma, India and China should keep us afloat in
an emergency!

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3140

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 12:14:42 AM

Mike Solli

Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline

Watch your unloading of oil and resources there. I'm not sure what happens if you try to unload oil or resources and there's 999,999 in port.

I track my oil/resource levels pretty closely and try to increase the levels in each level. Currently I have 7 months of reserves at each region.

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3141

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 12:34:34 AM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

True Mike, actually I wasn't aware of how much resources and oil I had in Sasebo.
It's usually distributed out, but I've been bringing in all the reserves my ships can carry over the last two months.

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Mike Solli)

Post #: 3142

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 12:39:08 AM

Mike Solli

Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline

I usually spread the convoys out a bit. You are right though about the movement of resources and oil. Sasebo seems to be the last place the AI moves resources and oil from though.

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3143

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 1:56:21 PM

Przemcio231

Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline

quote:

Please excuse Pauk San Samurai Przemcio231, he's very touchy regarding issues that concern the welfare of the Empire

Well the Welfare of the Empire under my Command is assured

Any way PzB what are your experiences with G4m2 as those will appear in Production in a month

I plan to start the AAR with Zeta but when we reach 1944 or some action will be taking place

_____________________________

Pinky: Hey Brain what are we goeing to do this evening?
Brain: The Usual Pinky we will try to take over the World;)

(in reply to Mike Solli)

Post #: 3144

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 8:32:28 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

As far as I know the G4M2e Ohka carriers doesn't work... They only achieve near misses.
Like so many other wonder weapons...real and imagined

Must admit that I feel the bugs favor the Allies by a margin though!

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 08/22/44

Sub/ASW Attacks

Sub attack at 33,50

Japanese Ships
AK Heiei Maru #7, Torpedo hits 1, on fire : empty, slight damage
PG Kaikei Maru
PG Tamo Maru #6
MSW Kaiyo Maru #3
MSW Choun Maru #6
MSW Wa 14
MSW Wa 12
MSW Wa 10

Allied Ships
SS Haddo
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air Combat

Our training camps are at full capacity again. We're finally receiving numerous
new interceptor units. In a little while we should be able to cause Andy's aviators
a lot of grief again!

Day Air attack on Kweiyang , at 41,35

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 122
J2M Jack x 48
G4M2 Betty x 50
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 36
Ki-61 KAIc Tony x 144
Ki-84-Ia Frank x 35

No Japanese losses

Allied ground losses:
25 casualties reported

Airbase hits 8
Airbase supply hits 4
Runway hits 271
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kweiyang , at 41,35

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zeke x 384
J2M Jack x 26
D4Y Judy x 62
B6N Jill x 36
B7A Grace x 26
G4M1 Betty x 26
G4M2 Betty x 44
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 36
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 35
Ki-84-Ia Frank x 108

No Japanese losses

Allied ground losses:
12 casualties reported

Airbase hits 24
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 529
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground Combat

Ground combat at Macassar

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 29824 troops, 216 guns, 202 vehicles, Assault Value = 649

Defending force 3907 troops, 10 guns, 5 vehicles, Assault Value = 91

Allied max assault: 534 - adjusted assault: 224

Japanese max defense: 51 - adjusted defense: 21

Allied assault odds: 10 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
596 casualties reported
Guns lost 6
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
108 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Pamakasan - all our strike ac stayed home...have to try again tomorrow!

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 1507 troops, 24 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 43

Defending force 460 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 23

Japanese max assault: 23 - adjusted assault: 11

Allied max defense: 20 - adjusted defense: 9

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese Assault reduces fortifications to 0

Japanese ground losses:
16 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Allied ground losses:
21 casualties reported
--------------------------------------------------------

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Przemcio231)

Post #: 3145

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 10:02:23 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

I have noticed that I can't draw replacement aircraft and pilots to air units in bases with less than 20k supplies!
It isn't always like this, and it makes me wonder.... Most annoying. Does anyone know the reason for this and whether this
is how it should be?

Got some plans for the last phase of the war: If Andy lands anywhere near Formosa or Okinawa I will pull all my base force units
in China closer to the coast and make it possible to launch massive strikes against the enemy. There aren't that many large aviation
units in the Home Islands, surprisingly few actually. Shouldn't there be more 'fixed' base forces in the major cities?

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3146

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 10:04:33 PM

LittleJoe

Posts: 610
Joined: 8/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

I have noticed that I can't draw replacement aircraft and pilots to air units in bases with less than 20k supplies!
It isn't always like this, and it makes me wonder.... Most annoying. Does anyone know the reason for this and whether this
is how it should be?

Lol i noticed this in my pbem, i was pretty sure it wasnt like that pre 1.8, although i think having a Air HQ at the base means you dont have to have 20k supplies.

_____________________________

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3147

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 10:07:39 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Unfortunately Air HQ doesn't have anythign to do with it either...dropped down to 19991 supplies on Clark Field with Air HQ and
suddenly I didn't get any replacements anymore *grumble*

Not long ago I pulled replacement ac from an isolated base in Northern NG with 190 supplies with no Air HQ.
Me thinks this may be an issue...

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to LittleJoe)

Post #: 3148

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 10:14:51 PM

LittleJoe

Posts: 610
Joined: 8/4/2004
Status: offline

Hmmm im pretty sure im drawing supplies from Tarawa with has under 20k, i suppose its kind of realistic, in the sense that an isolated base in Northen NG would not be able to replace pilot or plane losses.

But it obviously doesnt always work like that, as the Allied side can do the same to a newly conquered base thats still has Japanese holdouts and is hundereds of miles from the nearest Allied base, as long as they throw enough supplies at it.

_____________________________

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 3149

RE: Macassar falls! - 9/6/2006 10:36:59 PM

Speedysteve

Posts: 15998
Joined: 9/11/2001
From: Reading, England
Status: offline

IIRC if the airgroup is also in range of the HQ (Base HQ I believe) then they can also draw planes and pilots.

_____________________________

WitE 2 Tester
WitE Tester
BTR/BoB Tester

(in reply to LittleJoe)

Post #: 3150

Page: << < prev 103 104 [105] 106 107 next > >>

All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> After Action Reports >> RE: Macassar is invaded!