Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with production points

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Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with production ... - 4/5/2005 1:53:25 AM

daskomodo

Posts: 43
Joined: 4/4/2005
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Here's my take on Axis strategy. It's somewhat longer than intended, but hey, slow work day and I got the PDF manual handy. This is focused solely on what you need to grab to win. Let's handle what to supply somewhere else

UNDERSTANDING HOW TO WIN
To win, you either conquer the map (good luck...) or win in terms of production.
You need 70 productions points at the end of any movement turn to win.

What's a production point? 1 Resource point (RP) + 1 Factory Output point (FP) = 1 Production point (PP)
{edit} To see your current PP total, bring up the Strategic Map screen (F9)

So, in effect, a NATIONALITY's number of PPs is the lesser of:
1) RPs that you own
2) FP x respective country output factor x status of factory

Keep in mind, Germany and Japan don't share RPs or FPs.

Let's look at each of these:

Resouces:
To count as "your" resources, you must own the area containing the resource and
be able to trace a route (through land connections or transports) back to a factory.
You can trace that route through neutral countries.
But gifts and free trade RPs DO NOT count toward your RP total (for purposes of calculating PP).
Also, keep in mind that yellow RP count as 50% (total is rounded?) and red RP are 0.
{edit} Clarification RP should be read as Resource Centers in most of the manual (except the part talking about calculating production points) These are the Resources you control, not the those you've accumulated. To see the amount you currently have, hit F7(Production Summary Screen) and look at Resource Centers.

Factories:
Each factory is affected by a nationality multiplier determining how many FP it produces that turn. This is specified in the manual (i.e. I'm too lazy to copy/paste

).

Summary: Fix your Resources and make sure they are connected.

Ok, so now let's see what needed to achieve those 70 PP. Assuming we start fresh with the 1940 scenario.

BEGINNINGS: FPs

Germany starts off with 10 German factories , 4 Italian ones
and 3 Rumania ones.

In 1940, this adds up to (10 Ger x 2 + 4 Ita x 2 + 3 Rum x 1) = 31 FP
However, assuming you repair no additional factories,
this goes up to (10 Ger x 3 + 4 Ita x 2 + 3 Rum x 1) = 41 FP
when you roll into Russia.

Japan meanwhile has 8 factories (including the one in Machuria).

(8 Jap x 3) = 24 FP

So, total Axis FP by mid-game (if no factory capacity is added): 41 + 24 = 65 FPs

Consequently, the Axis should expect to create additional 5 FPs. Where? Well, either build more factories (nah, you'll need boys and toys)
or refurbish enemy ones - Russia, France, China. France itself has 6 factory (for a total of 6 FPs) just waiting for you.

Our total is now: 47 + 24 = 71 FPs

This is a tight number to reach though, depending on the RPs that Germany
and Japan can grab respectively. Germany might need more FPs based on Japan's performance.

Summary: Conquer France, rebuild its factories.

BEGINNINGS: RPs

Still with me? Hope so

Based on FPs above, Germany should be gunning for 45 to 50 RPs, while Japan needs to put up 20 to 25.

Germany starts with 20 RPs under direct control (well, not counting Ethiopia, but just try getting there).
After grabbing the easy RPs - France (and French North Africa), Yugoslavia, Netherlands, you'll net 11 additional ones for a total of 31.
And don't forget Sardinia with its 1 RP just asking to be transported , so 32 RPs if you place a fleet in West Med.
Note we're not counting gifts or free trade, since we're trying to WIN :)

Japan has a whopping 10 Resources to her name (including Indochina).

So, Germany needs to grab 13~18 more RPs and Japan needs 10~15 more.

GERMANY RESOURCE STRATEGY

What can Germany go for? Looking at it by geography
IBERIA - 4
Spain: 3 RPs
If you're going for Gibraltar, this is a good bonus. However, you'll need to garrison this area well,
especially if the Allies grab Portugal.

Portugal: 1 RP
Easy to capture, but hard to defend. May not be worth a sizeable garrison.

EAST MED - 3
Greece: 1 RP
Might be worth the effort if you just need a few more.
Turkey: 2 RP
Activates Russia. Not recommended.

SCANDINAVIA - 4
Norway: 1 RP
Similar to Greece, but more vulnerable.

Sweden: 3 RP
A big neutral garrison that will need to be replace with
your own big garrison, probably in Norway. Feeling lucky?

MIDDLE EAST - 5
Iraq: 2 RP
A good WA player will make this his last ditch line when Egypt is lost. The AI won't though.

Saudi Arabia: 1 RP
Captured Egypt? Here's a gift. WA may preemptily invade.

Persia: 2 RP
You're at Persia with a tenuous yet valid supply line? Look at the Caucusus calling for you.

RUSSIA - up to 13
"Highway to the Caucusus" - 13 RPs
If you reach the Caucucus with a defensible line, this is the total you'll get.
6 points in Caucusus make it the grand prize for your efforts.

AFRICA - up to 9 RPs
Might be fun to send some troops on a looting rampage. Just remember supplies + WA just needs a few more to stop you. And it's easier for him to get there.

My conclusion: We want 13 to 18 RPs
Spain + Middle East + Highway to the Caucusus = 3+5+13 = 21. Neat
However, remove the furthest points (Caucusus and Persia) from the equation and
you're down to 13 RP. And that's assuming you don't lose any of "your" RPs.
Lastly, if you get more than 15 RPs, plan on repairing some Russian factories.

JAPAN RESOURCE STRATEGY

America gives Japan 3 gift RPs per turn, and this weighs heavily on production. But they don't
count towards production victory. So, you need to find a way to replace them and quick.

CHINA
Coastal: 1 RP
You've got carrier airgroups, use em.

Non-Coastal: 4 or 5 RP if you conquer all of China.
Occupying a non-coastal area costs you 3 gift RPs AND triples Chinese production. All that for
1 RP and maybe 1 puny FP. The AI has it right, ignore inland China unless he counterattacks
(punish him for that).

RUSSIA EAST COAST - 3+ RPs
With a decent size force in Manchuria and your carrier groups, you can neat 3 RPs off the bat.
And you're within striking range for 3 more if Russia doesn't react quickly.
This will cost you the US gift, but you can replace that for 30 supply immediately.

SIAM - 1 RP
Siam is neutral, so you get the point for production anyway and invading it cost you the US' gift RPs. At least this doesn't trigger US entry. {edit} Grab it later when you are going for the win.

SOUTH-EAST ASIA - 10 RP
This is Indonesia,the Philippines and Malaysia.
Easy to grab and activates America. Still, easy RPs to get and reinforce.

AUSTRALIA - 4 RPs
US war + lose gift. And it's far away. But it may be a good place to pick a fight if
the US tries the indirect approach. Need to look at this option more.

BURMA - 2 RPs
US war + lose gift. But it's the closer than most and can be quickly reinforced.

INDIA - 5 RPs
Did you capture Burma? Then you might as well keep going. Just remember that your fleets
are that much further from your home isles and those incoming Americans fleets.

Our goal stated above was 10 ~ 15 RPs.
My choice: Siam + China coastal + South-East Asia + Russia = 15. Germany will enjoy a distracted Russia and you can grab south-east asia at any time (before 1943).

< Message edited by daskomodo -- 4/5/2005 3:45:51 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 2:32:18 AM

Willy Liao

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EDIT: corrected my post to note that unenterable zones (like the Sahara) don't count as neutrals. You can flow your resource points through neutral & friendly land zones otherwise. So for the sub-saharan Africa, you do need to use transport s to get your resources out of there.

< Message edited by Willy Liao -- 4/9/2005 5:45:28 AM >

(in reply to daskomodo)

Post #: 2

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 2:32:31 AM

Dalwin

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Since I have yet to win via the 70 points, I have a basic question about the mechanics of doing so. I fear I may see a flaw that makes doing so much easier than the comprehensive post above. ( I hope I am wrong in other words.)

Does it end immediately if the Axis reaches a production level of 70 or do they have to hold it for a turn? At what point in the turn is this judged?

You imply that the factory multiplier is in effect for this calculation. I believe this is correct.

If the Axis only has to momentarily peak at 70 this seems extremely easy to do. I hope that have to be able to show the ability for a steady 70 and perhaps hold it until after the enemies' turns are complete.

Looking at your easily achieved figure for factory production, it is evident that if the Germans built two factories early. This will give them over 70 at the x3 multiplier.

Now, finally to my point. If they only have to surge to 70 and not show a steady state ability to produce 70, can you not underproduce dramatically one turn so that resources pile up and then have all the factories running the next turn?

As I said, I hope it does not work this way because then Germany could always win automatically when the good multiplier kicks in without fighting the Russians for more than one turn. The automatic victory option would have to be turned off in PBEM games.

(in reply to daskomodo)

Post #: 3

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 2:40:05 AM

Willy Liao

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To answer Dalwin's question, which also baffled me for a while, you need 70 sustained production points. That means you need 70 factory output PLUS 70 resource centers under Axis control on the Axis resource network.

So if you have 75 factory output of Axis in one turn, 100 points in resource pool, but only 69 resource centers on your network, you do NOT win. The victory screen F9 will only show 69 factory output, NOT the 75 production points you spent that turn. Sure, your production screen will show 75 production points being spent this turn, but you must have capability for 70 sustained production. If you repair that 70th resource, you will win.

When you win, you win & get the victory movie at the end of your movement phase (or I guess AI Axis buddy's movement phase). You don't need to hold on to it at all. I guess this also means if you forget to repair that resource in movement phase & only realize it in production phase, you might commit seppukku if you lose the resource center before your turn comes back....

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 4

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 3:08:21 AM

daskomodo

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Joined: 4/4/2005
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quote:

Does it end immediately if the Axis reaches a production level of 70 or do they have to hold it for a turn? At what point in the turn is this judged?

As stated in the manual, this is checked at the end of any movement phase. 70 Production Points is all you need.

quote:

If the Axis only has to momentarily peak at 70 this seems extremely easy to do. I hope that have to be able to show the ability for a steady 70 and perhaps hold it until after the enemies' turns are complete.

Looking at your easily achieved figure for factory production, it is evident that if the Germans built two factories early. This will give them over 70 at the x3 multiplier.

I think you are confusing Factory Output Points (FP) with Production Points (PP).
Building more factories definately nets you more FPs, but without RPs, they won't do anything for your PP count. See below. You can see your current FPs by looking at your Production screen. The number to the left of the / under the Factory is your current FP output.

quote:

Now, finally to my point. If they only have to surge to 70 and not show a steady state ability to produce 70, can you not underproduce dramatically one turn so that resources pile up and then have all the factories running the next turn?

A clarification for Resource Points (RP). -> The manuals calls them Resource Centers at some other point. Anyway, this amount refers to the Resources you control, not the those you've accumulated. To see the amount you currently have, hit F7(Production Summary Screen) and look at Resource Centers. THat's the total RP you've got = count the Resource that are in grey or red.

I will edit my previous post with this info: your current PP is given to you by bringing up the Strategic Map screen (F9). It's just that it took me a long while to figure out how that number was calculated.

To reiterate the calculation, PP = the lesser of your FP and your RP
For example, suppose Germany gets France, Netherlands, Yugoslavia and then everyone keeps hitting "Next turn" until 1943.

Germany
FP = 41
RP = 32
You have 32 PP. Nowhere close to victory, even though all your resources have been just piling up for years.

More extreme, keep clicking Next Turn until 1944
Germany
FP = 51
RP = 32
You still have just 32 PP. Your factory output is quite sufficient, but still nowhere near the resource centers required to win.

The theory behind my post was that the Axis need only pay little heed to factory output, since it easily reaches required levels for victory. The game is won by grabbing the Resource Centers you need (and insuring they are repaired

) .

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 5

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 3:20:12 AM

Dalwin

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Joined: 3/31/2005
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OK, now that I have the mechanics straight, back to the original post. Don't forget free trade. Spain and Sweden worth one each when neutral. France connects you to Spain and you will have tranports in the Blatic already so the conenctin to Sweden is also free.

I keep seeing people fear the Norway is vulnerable. Against a Human player it may be, but not against the AI. Even with only 2 infantry there, the AI never bothers with it unless it is the Russians pushing west from Frinland.

To those two infantry add one artillery if you are feeling paranoid. I prefer to put one aircraft and one fleet there to interdict the lend lease route to Russia. To me, just the ability to put 2 or 3 additional WA tranports within easy reach each turn is enough incentive to take Norway.

I don't have the map in front of me, but if I recall correctly Kiev has one factory and two resources. The shape of the zones makes Kiev very easy to hold once captured so I always rebuild these. The factory is nice for building supplies right at the front. The same is basically true for Leningrad but I forget how many resources if any are in Leningrad.

Now that I have learned that a rail connection is not needed to collect resources there is another easy source of resources available at Russia's expense. If you break through in Persia, one militia can go north into central Russia and take at least two resources. It is quitse soem time before the Russian react to this guy in their rear. When I have done this it is only lack of supplies that stops his rampage. The downside, of course, is that you would somehow have to ship 20 supplies up into central Russia to repair those resources. I picture this militia at the head of one very long mule train as you manually head out from Bagdahd moving 25 supplies overland one space at a time.

EDIT: in conclusion it looks like a big push through the Mid East and up into Russia from the south should win every time as long as you do the normal things on other fronts. As already pointed out, you can always grab Greece for that one extra point if things are close.

Repairing the factories in the Caususes is not the nightmare that repairing the ones in central Russia would be as long as the Rumanian transport is still alive. THis would make Sevastopol a high priority target.

< Message edited by Dalwin -- 4/5/2005 3:27:17 AM >

(in reply to Willy Liao)

Post #: 6

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 3:31:34 AM

Barthheart

Posts: 3194
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From: Nepean, Ontario
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dalwin

OK, now that I have the mechanics straight, back to the original post. Don't forget free trade. Spain and Sweden worth one each when neutral. France connects you to Spain and you will have tranports in the Blatic already so the conenctin to Sweden is also free....

But "free" resources do not count in your victory total. You must own the 70 factory points and the 70 resource points.

_____________________________

Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty & well preserved body,
but rather to skid in broadside, totally worn out & proclaiming "WOW, what a ride!"

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 7

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 3:35:50 AM

Uncle_Joe

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Joined: 8/26/2004
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You dont need Norway to smash the Lend Lease line across the north (atritting Transports). Submarines based in Western Germany can reach at least 3 Transports along the line and make it back to port in one turn with no upgrades. They also take less supplies, although until you up their Evasion by 1, you can still lose Subs in the process.

I hope they add a more compelling reason to want Norway. Even the hints in the manual more or less imply that its not worth taking most of the time.

My history is a little fuzzy these days, but I believe the Brits wanted Norway in '40 specifically to interrupt the flow of Swedish iron ore into Germany. The Brit 'invasion' just happened to be a little behind the Germans, so they appeared to be coming to Norway's aid, but I believe the Brits would have gone in even without the German attack.

Is it viable for the W.Allies to take a neutral Norway and interdict the flow of Swedish trade? It doesnt really seem worth the hassle though. If I read it right, Sweden only contributes 1 resource via Free Trade (3/2, rounded down). If Sweden had 4 resources, shutting down 2/turn might be worthwhile.

I *really* wish there was a breakdown summary of where you get your resources from and where you could, but arent due to broken connections or no 'trade route'. The game presents 1000 pieces of info a million different ways, but there are some serious omissions in critical areas. Resources are the key to the game and info on how they get to you is spotty.

That aside, I find your post very helpful. This game is an absolute blast and with a little more work on the AI and a few issues, they have a REAL gem on their hands. I dont think it will be quite the ground-breaker that Panzer General was way back when, but its certainly a step in the right direction!

Anyways, my hope is that they correct the lack of resource info in a future patch as well as add a little bit of value to Norway either by upping Sweden's value or some other change to make it worthwhile for either side to really want to attack early on in the game.

< Message edited by Uncle_Joe -- 4/5/2005 11:26:55 AM >

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 8

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 5:36:33 AM

Grotius

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How do you tell which countries might or might not give you free trade? If it's in the manual, I can't find it. I know that Japan gets its 3 resources from the USA until Japan goes too deep into China, but that's all I remember.

(in reply to Uncle_Joe)

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RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 6:55:19 AM

Uncle_Joe

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I *believe* Free Trade resources are offered in 'player order', so essentially its Germany, Japan, Russia, China, WAllies. If Germany is 'connected' to a Neutral with resources, it gets 1/2 if the Neutral's resource value rounded down. If Germany doesnt get them, then Japan can. Then Russia etc.

(in reply to Grotius)

Post #: 10

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 7:08:19 AM

Dalwin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Uncle_Joe

I *believe* Free Trade resources are offered in 'player order', so essentially its Germany, Japan, Russia, China, WAllies. If Germany is 'connected' to a Neutral with resources, it gets 1/2 if the Neutral's resource value rounded down. If Germany doesnt get them, then Japan can. Then Russia etc.

one question I have been having on free trade is whether it is for the whole neutral nation or an a province by province basis. Even though there is only one province to most of the neutrals, how about Turkey? Is it worth 1 or zero in free trade? I believe the manual uses the word nation, but almost all the economics and things like connecting to transport are on a province by province basis.

(in reply to Uncle_Joe)

Post #: 11

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 7:33:03 AM

Uncle_Joe

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Well, I generally am getting 3 per turn when I play Germany. I'm guessing that's 1 for Sweden (3/2=1), 1 for Spain (3/2=1), and 1 for Turkey (2/1=1). The only thing you need to collect all three is just a Transport in the Baltic for Sweden. So, I would guess it is per nation, not per region as I never have anything connecting eastern Turkey on its own. It also appears that each nation offers individually and the rounding is done per nation, not as a total or I would expect to be receiving 4 ((3+3+2)/2)=4.

I would have prefered for Sweden to be 4 and Spain to be 2. That would give one extra resource (but one that doesnt count for victory), but it would make Sweden and the Baltic more important which I think would give a better feel. Still, 1 for Norway and 1 for Swedish trade isnt a bad haul in the long run.

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 12

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 7:40:36 AM

Willy Liao

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It appears the resources come for trade come out of the resource pool. So if you get down to one point in the pool for Sweden, they can't trade with anyone else because they will offer only zero (one-half of one rounded down). THen the next turn starts and it goes to 1+3 = 4 with half (2) being offered to the Germans, then the Japanese etc. For a neutral with only one resource center, you'd be offered one resource point every other turn with this scheme, since on even turns they'd have 2 points in their pool, allowing them to trade away one point, bringing it back down to one point in their pool on odd turns.

(in reply to Uncle_Joe)

Post #: 13

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 8:19:04 AM

Uncle_Joe

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Hmm, thats interesting. The rule book does say 'resource pool', so that is probably correct. I was wondering why it didnt fluctuate the turns I was checking in my last game.

I'm guessing because I didnt take out France on turn 1 (wanted to see how much England would pile in and then try and take out more units). Because I didnt, I wasnt adjacent to Spain until turn 2, so it was likely that the constant 3 was because I had Turkey giving me 1 and then Sweden/Spain alternating between 0 & 2 and 2 & 0 always giving me a total of 3 on my screen.

I suppose that means that Sweden is basically contributing 1&1/2 resources per turn on average. Thats fairly substantial and probably worth the investment to take and hold Norway. Otherwise, a few Allied aircraft stationed in Norway might make a mess of your trade fleet in the Baltic. I'll have to see what I can do as the WAllies about taking Norway and using it attack the German trade.

(in reply to Willy Liao)

Post #: 14

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 8:26:49 AM

Dalwin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Uncle_Joe

Hmm, thats interesting. The rule book does say 'resource pool', so that is probably correct. I was wondering why it didnt fluctuate the turns I was checking in my last game.

I'm guessing because I didnt take out France on turn 1 (wanted to see how much England would pile in and then try and take out more units). Because I didnt, I wasnt adjacent to Spain until turn 2, so it was likely that the constant 3 was because I had Turkey giving me 1 and then Sweden/Spain alternating between 0 & 2 and 2 & 0 always giving me a total of 3 on my screen.

I suppose that means that Sweden is basically contributing 1&1/2 resources per turn on average. Thats fairly substantial and probably worth the investment to take and hold Norway. Otherwise, a few Allied aircraft stationed in Norway might make a mess of your trade fleet in the Baltic. I'll have to see what I can do as the WAllies about taking Norway and using it attack the German trade.

You raise a good point. Depending on which version of the history books you decide to believe, Hitler's main reason for invading Norway was to protect the Swedish iron ore traffic which provided something like 1/6 of Germany's total iron.

Since the Swedish ports on the Baltic freeze over in winter, the iron was actually railed north to the Norwegian port of Narvik and then shipped south along the Norwegian coast. The game does not reflect the important of Norway in gaining Swedish trade directly, but your idea of the Allies putting a few planes in Norway to bomb the Baltic fleet has the same end result.

This means that taking Norway may not be simply about the one resource in Norway, but rather about the 3 (or 3 1/2) total for Scandinavia.

(in reply to Uncle_Joe)

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RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/5/2005 3:01:51 PM

VonTed

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This post should be stickied!

Very well done analysis for Axis victory.

(in reply to Dalwin)

Post #: 16

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/6/2005 11:27:29 PM

daskomodo

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Based on the analysis of how free trade works, Norway seems to be more valuable than at first glance.

An Allied occupied Norway costs Germany 2 RP (1 from Norway, 1 from Swedish free trade) and leaves Finland vulnerable to Allied invasion (for a loss of another Axis resource).

(in reply to VonTed)

Post #: 17

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/14/2005 12:07:42 PM

5cats

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Yup, this little game offers many interesting insights to history :)
Like: why invade Yugoslavia? (answer: resources! also, nothing better for the troops to do)
Uncle Joe is right, Churchill was loading the troops himself to invade Norway when the Germans beat him to it. The Allies invaded & violated a LOT of neutralities and international laws, but they wrote the history books eh?

_____________________________

No Will but Thy Will
No Law but the Laws You make

(in reply to daskomodo)

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RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/14/2005 10:36:54 PM

willgamer

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From: Huntsville, Alabama
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quote:

This post should be stickied!

Very well done analysis for Axis victory.

Please!

_____________________________

Rex Lex or Lex Rex?

(in reply to 5cats)

Post #: 19

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/26/2005 7:26:03 AM

f15eagle

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Playing the '41 campaign with only Germany, I am consistently able to achieve an auto victory by the end of '43 on normal difficulty. The key, in my experience, has been to focus all of my attention on Russia with the goals of securing Leningrad and Moscow, then pushing for the Caucasus. Getting there either through Stalingrad or across the Middle East will work, but getting and repairing those 6 RP's is usually enough to put me over 70. Holding Moscow usually isn't a problem because I usually push some troops into Persia, which keeps a large number of Russia's forces tied up in the southeast.

The only thing I worry about on the Western Front is sub attacks on WA transports. The supplies I save by only fighting on one front are enough to not only maneuver my troops in the East where I need them, but to repair infrastructure. There's nothing more frustrating than capturing a bunch of RP rich territories only to come up short on the supplies to repair them. Careful calculation and conservation of supplies, especially on the turn you capture Caucasus, will allow you to repair enough RP's to give you the win instantly.

Tactically, I focus my air power on damaging or destroying Russian artillery and aircraft. Because I focus my research on armor, fighters, and artillery, I have no problem going heads up with Russian armor and infantry. Taking their artillery out makes it that much easier.

I have tried this strategy with auto victory turned off and am still able to achieve a decisive victory, but totally eliminating Russia without having human control over Japan is nearly impossible. It's just too much of a strain on my resources to keep pushing troops East while protecting against a WA invasion of France.

Just my thoughts. Let me know how this works for you.

(in reply to willgamer)

Post #: 20

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/26/2005 6:43:57 PM

daskomodo

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Kinda hard to win with Production Points with auto-victory turned off, no?

Also note that Leningrad and Moscow seem important, but have minimal resources. Best focus your efforts in southern Russia (with some forces up north to keep him honest)

(in reply to f15eagle)

Post #: 21

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/26/2005 6:48:11 PM

James Ward

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Leningrad is good to take because you get the Finns. Plus you can cut off lend lease by taking the 2 northern provinces which makes taking Russia even easier.

(in reply to daskomodo)

Post #: 22

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/26/2005 6:54:48 PM

daskomodo

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Joined: 4/4/2005
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Yes, you're right, I shoudn't have put Leningrad there. Must have been distracted. But obsessing over moscow can be unhealthy.

(in reply to James Ward)

Post #: 23

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/27/2005 12:53:27 AM

MrQuiet

Posts: 805
Joined: 4/2/2005
Status: offline

quote:

I am consistently able to achieve an auto victory by the end of '43 on normal difficulty

But normal difficulty is not very difficult. No?

Just $.02
-MrQuiet

(in reply to f15eagle)

Post #: 24

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/27/2005 9:53:21 AM

f15eagle

Posts: 28
Joined: 4/26/2005
Status: offline

quote:

But normal difficulty is not very difficult. No?

Just $.02
-MrQuiet

Just getting out of bed in the morning is like a "Challenging" level task, so I'll celebrate achieving a victory on normal level in WaW. The AI is good enough that I feel pretty good about winning in a straight up fight. To those of you who win consistently on the harder levels, salute.

_____________________________

"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him."

-G.K. Chesterton

(in reply to MrQuiet)

Post #: 25

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/27/2005 9:57:13 AM

f15eagle

Posts: 28
Joined: 4/26/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Kinda hard to win with Production Points with auto-victory turned off, no?

For experimentation's sake, I loaded an autosave from before I got the auto victory and just played through to the end to see what result I could achieve. Just wanted to see a couple of alternate endings to the same game. Hope that clarifies my statement.

_____________________________

"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him."

-G.K. Chesterton

(in reply to daskomodo)

Post #: 26

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 4/28/2005 5:09:54 AM

Grifman

Posts: 156
Joined: 7/6/2002
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: 5cats

The Allies invaded & violated a LOT of neutralities and international laws, but they wrote the history books eh?

I'm not aware that they covered this up, maybe you just don't read good history books :)

(in reply to 5cats)

Post #: 27

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 5/1/2005 8:15:34 PM

TOCarroll

Posts: 215
Joined: 3/28/2005
From: College Station, Texas
Status: offline

I am astounded at the diversity of stratagies available to both players. The game is as easy to play as "Axis & Allies", but has more workable choices than "Advanced Third Reich" (Which is a favorite boardgame). The designers ability to use simpler rules is incredable. Example: Not allowing factories to be destroyed forces the player to alocate scarce resources if he wants to keep the bad guys from getting the extra capacity. The seperation of production into Population, Resources and Factories works very well. The list goes on.... Five Stars !

Prussian Tom

(in reply to Grifman)

Post #: 28

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 5/3/2005 1:36:11 AM

5cats

Posts: 291
Joined: 4/14/2005
Status: offline

Not so much covered up, but "spun" differently.
They didn't "invade" neutrals, they "liberated" them (from their neutrality I suppose)
The USA didn't supply aircraft to Britian in 1940, they "stored them near the Canadian border" (we Canadians came across, pushed them into Canada and flew them back to the airbases)
etc etc
I love history books! Reading between the lines is my favorite part!
And yes this is a 5 star game! Simple enough to be fun, complex enough to remain fun after 20 games

(in reply to TOCarroll)

Post #: 29

RE: Axis: Some thoughts on winning the war with product... - 5/4/2005 12:11:42 AM

daskomodo

Posts: 43
Joined: 4/4/2005
Status: offline

I do remember reading in a book about a US officer/diplomat threatening Sweden to stop sending supplies to Germany, otherwise, some bombers might get "lost" and wind up bombing Stockholm.
(sorry, I can't recall where I read it, so I can just paraphrase)

Might be fun to put that policy into effect.

(in reply to 5cats)

Post #: 30

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