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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell

 
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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/1/2007 10:40:11 PM   
wernerpruckner


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10/10/43

tactical raids, most of them in Italy
9:36


10/11/43
I let my forces rest => all losses due to AA fire
also only tactical raids, and once again most of them in Italy

0:33

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/5/2007 11:29:06 AM   
fochinell

 

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Another few days of weather-limited attacks, culminating in yet another "lead-group-only" raid by the 8th AF. Situation at the middle of October is as follows - losses: nothing too heavy, except maybe the Spitfire Vb losses, which are unsustainable given the number of new units equipped with it that appear while they represent a major section of the allies' fighter strength, and thus take hefty losses. I've converted a couple of MAC Spit Vb sqns to the P-40, and I'll probably inflict the P-39 on the French squadrons when they appear now that the 12th AF fighter force is entirely P-40/P-38H. The relative lack of B-17 losses indicates how few major attacks have been made due to the weather (128 in total, 121 of them on one day - the Bremen UFAC massacre of 9th October '43). There have been a couple of medium strength attritonal raids (5 Groups of B-17's with heavy escort to sustain LW attrition and fatigue) but the weather has kept the 8th AF effort at less than 50% of what I expected.

Another annoying factor is the automatic upgrade, which is constantly upgrading units that I don't want upgraded. At the moment, my B-17F force of 15 Groups has about 3 out of action on any one turn as they try and upgrade to the B-17G and get re-equipped to their original type. I've got 5 Groups equipped with the B-17G which I use for bad-weather RR raids lead by the H2X B-17G's to ensure they all cruise at the same speed and don't seperate, but I don't want any more just yet to allow me to expend all those B-17F's I'll be getting before the end of 1943. If I convert the whole 8th AF to the G too early, it will restrict my ability to sustain high attrition.

Well, that was the plan until the weather sabotaged it... Still, the relative lack of combat has allowed me to equip all the 8th AF P-47 Groups with the P-47D, which I only expected to be able to do by the end of the month.




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< Message edited by fochinell -- 7/5/2007 11:45:49 AM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/5/2007 11:37:35 AM   
fochinell

 

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And now for my top Minions of Doom list.




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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/6/2007 12:04:03 PM   
Reg


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Go the Mozzies........

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/7/2007 2:04:17 PM   
wernerpruckner


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but Hajo Hermann is still one of the top aces on the Axis side

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/7/2007 2:37:24 PM   
fochinell

 

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but Hajo Hermann is still one of the top aces on the Axis side


Werner can console himself with the scores of a couple of his aces, even if they're no better than the best Mossie NI aces; meanwhile, he occupies himself swatting some Spitfires like flies in the tactical raids supporting a twin 8th AF attack on major RR targets in the Ruhr. The AS score is miserable, but the industrial and terror scores are mounting while he diverts himself from the inevitable prospect of his defeat with pointless combat against the tactical fighters. "Look at my experten!" - meanwhile the bombers go to work untroubled by either his day or night fighters, who by this point are running scared.



[Current scores AS 1, SB 9 and TERROR 11 at my end]

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/14/2007 6:09:24 PM   
fochinell

 

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21st October 1943: A typical day in the air war.

The weather in the west breaks after another run of low cloud (I usually take into account cloud altitude as well as percentage coverage before planning raids, including the basic NW to SE motion of the weather systems). The 8th AF send 300 H2S-led B-17G's to RR targets at Cologne, with full escort (7 Groups of P-47D and 3 of P-38L), and supporting raids by the 9th AF (including the first mission of their first operational P-47C escort group) and 2TAF. OKL chicken out, and take a rest day while the citzens of Cologne huddle in their air-raid shelters and mutter about Goering. Meanwhile, in Italy, cloud reduces activity to some short-range fighter-bomber raids. Stab JG 53 come up to pick off some Hurricane stragglers, but the most serious annoyance is caused by 3 Spit IX's of the Borgo wing in Corsica crashing on landing.

At night BC hit the RR yard at Hamm with 3 Group (120 Lanc III's and 144 Stirling III's) with some light NI coverage of the closest Wilde Sau bases. Again, the Luftwaffe refuses to come up to play, although the chances of a destructive raid are reduced by the propensity of the Stirling crews to attack decoy sites outside Hamm.

In other words, a typical day of attritional conflict by the Allies while the Axis cringe in hiding waiting for their fatigue and morale levels to recover. Nothing exciting to report except the SB score creeping up to 10.

35 lost out of 2298 sorties for the Allies. Zero out of 7 for those workaholics in the Luftwaffe.



< Message edited by fochinell -- 7/14/2007 6:11:35 PM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/15/2007 6:30:19 PM   
wernerpruckner


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22nd October 1943:


well rested Bf109G-6 and G-6/R6 units of the Luftwaffe and the Aeronautica Nazionale Repubblicana attacked a huge fighter bomber force....and it became the day of the Kittyhawk fiasco

0:77 losses, and most of them Kittyhawks

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/15/2007 7:29:41 PM   
fochinell

 

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the day of the Kittyhawk fiasco

Werner's gloating is entirely justified - 68 out of 96 P-40's from the 57th and 78th FG's lost attacking Cacina Vaga AF.



There were 3 sqns of P-38H high escorts plotted, but they helpfully turned back at the Genoese coast as the P-40's started to go down, trapped in the usual strafe AF/damaged-by-flak/bounced-while-crippled cycle.



Some days even a Galactic Dark Lord needs a little lovin'.




< Message edited by fochinell -- 7/15/2007 7:30:54 PM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/15/2007 7:45:54 PM   
von Shagmeister


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Hi Gavin,

You'll be pleased to hear that "fighter-bombers" are no longer arbitrarily dead meat in air to air combat.

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/15/2007 7:51:39 PM   
wernerpruckner


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oooohhh noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
don´t tell him that  - because the next rematch is me as Allied horde versus Gavin´s puny Messerschmitts

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/15/2007 8:13:38 PM   
Hard Sarge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: von Shagmeister

Hi Gavin,

You'll be pleased to hear that "fighter-bombers" are no longer arbitrarily dead meat in air to air combat.


the only trouble is, the P-40 is not a fighter-bomber



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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/16/2007 11:59:07 AM   
fochinell

 

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the only trouble is, the P-40 is not a fighter-bomber

Yeah, the problem here was the propensity of fighters on a bombing mission to get sucked into a repeating strafe cycle, ignoring the 50-plus Bf 109's bouncing and killing their squadron mates after they got damaged by Flak on each strafing run of an empty AF. The P-40's should suffer when bounced by 190's and 109's, but this kind of massacre is just like shooting fish in a barrel. Also lost some Spit Vb's in the next turn when returning to base while red and therefore unable to fight back when attacked.

The killer was the fact that I knew the P-40's would attract a response, and so added some P-38H high escort to cover them (longer endurance, therefore should be able to fight when the P-40's go bingo fuel and would otherwise get slaughtered). Then these heroes turned back before reaching the combat.

Ah well, managed to get the 8th AF to hit Huls RUBBER and Munster RR last turn for minimal losses (a dozen B-17F's out of over 300).

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/18/2007 11:40:38 PM   
17poundr


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Wow! That looks like a pretty juicy game to me!!! 

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/21/2007 6:58:57 PM   
madflava13


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Any action lately??

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/22/2007 9:48:17 PM   
wernerpruckner


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hi madflava 13,
 
last three turns was mostly coastal attacks - nothing really important was hit
 
score is 1/11/11
I had never so much ready pilots at this time in the game !!!

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/23/2007 1:02:42 PM   
fochinell

 

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OK, here's the data for the end of October 1943. Action has been heavily constrained by the weather (no missions on 31st October, for example), and has mostly devolved down to ineffective FB strikes in Italy to keep Axis fatigue up and inflict some losses, while the 8th Af has hit RR yards in the Ruhr and Cologne. A couple of CHEM sites were hit in the last week, with the 8th going to Paris to hit the Kuhlman factory after hitting the Ludwigshafen factory, while 5 Group made a rare visit to the major Ammoniawerke site outside Leipzig. The HB units of the 12th AF have been very quiet due to the poor weather.

A couple of new Spitfire squadrons have joined the OB, while the 12th AF P-40 Groups have entirely re-equipped with the P-47C now that it has been replaced by the P-47D in the 8th and 9th AF.

The top-scoring allied fighter units are:

8th AF - 78th FG (P-47D) 82 kills, 56th FG (P-47D) 75 kills, 20th FG (P-38L) 70 kills, with 19 Sqn leading the RAF 8th AF wing with 32 kills. The 8th has seven P-47D groups, three P-38L groups and the two Spit IX sqns.

9th AF - Two new P-47D Groups have only flown about 2 missions apiece for zero kills, so the two RAF Spit IX squadrons have the kills, with 66 Sqn leading on 14 kills. With two P-47 groups joining the two Spit IX squadrons, the 9th can stop draining escorts from 2nd TAF which should allow my sweep and escort options to open up a bit.

2nd TAF - 222 Sqn (Spit IX) in the Hornchurch wing leading with 22 kills, with 416 RCAF (Spit IX) tied with 132 Sqn (Spit Vb) on 20 kills. There are now 11 Spit Vb sqns and 9 Spit IX sqns available.

The four FC Spit Vb sqns are lead by 616 Sqn with the grand total of 2 kills. Yee-hah!

12th AF - The fighter groups continue to languish, with the re-equipment of the four P-40 Groups in Corsica with P-47C's only taking place a few days ago with no impact on their scores (3 with 1, the new 324th FG with zero), while the four P-38H groups based around Naples lead the way - just- with the 81st FG on 6 kills.

The main fighter force remain the P-38 squadrons based in Sardinia, with only two groups (the 325th and 31st) remaining on P-38H's while the rest are all using the L. The three leading units are 95th FS on 29 kills, the 71st FS on 25 kills, and the 48th FS and 308th equal on 22 each. The 308th is the top-scoring P-38H unit.

Med Air Command has 8 P-40 squadrons doing fighter-bomber work (4 in Corsica, 4 around Foggia) with zero kills, 7 Spit Vb squadrons (3 in Corsica, the rest at Foggia) and 11 Spit IX squadrons (8 in Corsica, 3 in the south). The leading scorers are all Spit IX units in the Borgo wing, with 145 Sqn on 13 kills, 92 Sqn on 11 kills and 1 SAAF sqn on 10 kills.

On the night-fighter front, there are two Mossie NF XIII squadrons (both in 100 Group), and 7 Squadrons plus 3 Flights of Mossie NF II's operating in the UK. The leading units are 68 Sqn with 21 kills, 605 Sqn with 16 kills, and B Flight of 25 Sqn with 12 kills. None of the NF units in the MTO (1 sqn plus 1 flight MAC, 4 Sqns in the 12th AF - all Mossie NF II) have been active yet.






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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/23/2007 1:15:46 PM   
fochinell

 

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OK, here are the total aircraft losses at the end of October '43. Overall losses are 3556 Allied (1069 Flak) and 1742 Axis (30 ground). That's got to be the lowest level of ground losses of all time, and the favourable exchange ratio (less than 2 Allied aircraft lost in air combat per Axis aircraft destroyed in air combat) can't disguise the overall lack of quantity; I need to kill more of Werner's pilots than I've managed in October '43.

The overall lack of substantial action over the past two weeks of game time should be apparent in the detail of the aircraft losses. The only plus point is that the high level of Spitfire attrition has abated a little and the Spit Vb situation is no longer critical. One of the main problems with them are the new units arriving, so I sometimes stick them with surplus P-39's to fill out with new pilots and then gain exp and lose fatigue before re-equipping them with Spitfires and resting selected Spitfire units by exchanging their Spits for Airacobras. This time round I haven't had to bother with that as the weather is so bad that operational wastage is about half of what I expected.

The P-38 and P-47 situation is similar; I've been able to get the P-39 and P-40 out of the 12th AF early due to the availability of the P-38H and P-47C, which in turn has only been possible due to the low level of activity limiting attrition. The P-39 should return in Med Air Cmd with the new French squadrons as a specialised ground strafer (maximum expendability, mes infants! ) and the P-40 will stick around for a long time to come as MAC's main FB (3 x 500lb bombload is quite useful).

I'll let Werner post a picture of the bombing damage now








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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/23/2007 5:41:47 PM   
Hard Sarge


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over all looking good :)

the Spit trouble should not be so bad in ours (we got a number of different ones in there, so losses in one area should not hurt another area as bad :)

(off hand, Vbs, Vcs, VIIIs, IXs plus some HF IXs, LF IXs and the VII and XII)
(I know you know Galvin, I just saying to the gang :)

FBs and some of the lesser fighters should now defend themselfs much better

the Raid turns red and heads for home slaughter is gone (it can still get hammered) but there is a chance for a returning to base fighter, to pick a fight (before it could only defend)

one works out nice is the Tiffies, you can plot them to sweep a AF and then assign Tiffies to escourt them (which if you remember the rules, adding one or two to close escourt can have good bennies, just don't add too many, as the Flak will have a chance to wake up)

on my end, I can't do anything about the weather, and on the other end, they say the code of the weather looks good, but on the other hand, Weather was the big hangup in the ETO, even the MED where they thought it was going to be sunny 80-90% of the time, turned out to be bad info/dreams




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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/30/2007 3:28:54 PM   
fochinell

 

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3rd November 1943 - 2nd Schweinfurt. 96/2527 Allied losses/sorties; 42/1227 Axis.

3 major BBFAC's hit by the 8th AF, with only 3 out of 416 B-17F's lost! Bombing results indifferent - one plant significantly hit, the others with marginal damage.

OKL concentrate on the escorts, and the Allies lose 28 P-47D's (almost all from the 8th AF) returning with bingo fuel. However, the supporting tactical raids by the 9th AF and 2nd TAF covering the 8th's return over Belgium inflict some useful casualties for the loss of 12 Spit IXs and a few Vb's. The major problem is the loss of 23 out of 72 2TAF Mitchells south of Aarshot. However, fully 20 of these go down after what looks like another "return over enemy territory after making friendly coast" fiasco. To my suprise, they take about 1 fighter down per 2 Mitchells lost, which is much better than their usual defensive score when unescorted.

BC send 3 Group with Lanc IIIs and Stirlings to hit the RR yard at Cologne Nippes for zero NJG response, while only some limited fighter attacks take place in the MTO. The 31st FG in the 15th AF upgrade to the P-38L, leaving one group in the 15th on the P-38H (the four in the 12th AF will stick on them well into 1944), while the B-24D is phased out of the 15th in favour of the B-24J and passed on to 205 Group to begin replacing their Wimpeys.


< Message edited by fochinell -- 7/30/2007 3:29:12 PM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/31/2007 11:44:54 AM   
fochinell

 

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4th November 1943. 73/2133 Allied losses/sorties, 56/972 Axis.

In the ETO: Tactical strikes by small forces of B-17's and the Tac Air in Belgium; again OKL concentrates on the escorts, with 14 P-47D lost but no B-17's. BC hit Frankfurt am Main PORT with 4 Group; no NJG resistance, and only 3/216 Halifaxes lost.

MTO: Tactical strikes, all ignored apart from 19/64 A-20's lost on a strike on Rimini RR (pushed the Bostons out a little too far that time; their range, lack of defensive armament and fragility make the Marauder a better bet for provoking fights) supporting the main 15th AF attack on Venice PORT, which misses both primary and secondary due to cloud cover. OKL has shifted most of their forces in Italy north of the Po river, and the major combat takes place against this raid, with 8/96 B-24J going down and 20 P-38L lost.

Overall a limited allied success; this is the kind of moderate level of attrition I need to impose on the LW between the major attacks. Weather permitting...



< Message edited by fochinell -- 7/31/2007 11:47:46 AM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/31/2007 6:13:21 PM   
17poundr


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Your game sounds just like a game I would love to play!!! Now, can you give me a link to it here on matrix so I can go and order it, or do you think it's for people who have the patience to learn about 50 different air control commands to pilot a plane, because Sturmovik is just about my limit in learning flight controls...

And I do think that the idea of creating your own campaigns, so that you get to choose where and when with what is bombed sounds great!!!

So, please somebody give me a link to order this game please!!!

Mr Poundr.




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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/31/2007 7:21:22 PM   
17poundr


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Hey guys, I tried to get to order this game, it IS the Gary Grisby air war strategy game that they say is not available yet isnt it???

I hope it's like when toaw-3 was just arround the corner and obviously copies of toaw-acow wouldnt be sold anymore as the toaw-3 game would be hitting the 'shop' anytime, but people were still writing about their toaw scenario gaming experiences, and somebody who didnt know all of this would have been just as confused as I'm right now yes???

I hope so, if not could some kind soul just give a link to the game you guys are talking about, as it shure sounds like a game I want to have!!!

Thanks for the juicy accounts of your battles!
Yours truly,
Mr Poundr.

ps, anybody wishing to pbm a toaw-3 game, please contact me!




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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 7/31/2007 9:29:15 PM   
Hard Sarge


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okay just in case

the ARR is from the old game, and it may be HARD to find, EBay or something

our game is a remake of BoB and BTR and is still being worked on, so can not be ordered yet




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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/1/2007 8:02:30 AM   
Reg


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quote:

ORIGINAL: 17poundr

Hey guys, I tried to get to order this game, it IS the Gary Grisby air war strategy game that they say is not available yet isnt it???

I hope so, if not could some kind soul just give a link to the game you guys are talking about, as it shure sounds like a game I want to have!!!



17Pounder,

There is a used copy of the original game on EBay if you are interested. Just go to ebay.com and type the item number '190136389525' into the search field.

I think there were a couple of people who will part with copies if you go through the past posts on this forum as well. (Unfortunately I'm not one of them - I still enjoy playing mine).

We are all looking forward to the revamped version when it finally gets released. (Are we there yet?? Are we there yet??....... )


< Message edited by Reg -- 8/1/2007 8:12:31 AM >


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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/1/2007 11:55:50 AM   
fochinell

 

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5th November 1943. Allied: 18/939, Axis: 3/66

MTO: Some light tactical strikes in northern Italy. Bad weather plus the inability of the mediums to hit anything when they do bomb means zero bombing results for a suprising 7 RAF Mitchells lost to Flak.

ETO: A relatively successful Typhoon strike on Ghent RR and a less successful low-level Mossie strike on the ARM site near Rotterdam. 2 Mossies lost for no real damage. No LW opposition as Werner's pilots cower in fear, desperately trying to recover their morale and fatigue before risking combat with the Allied horde.

5 Group hit Brunswick in a concentrated raid (all bombloads within the city area) but lose 8/312 Lancs to the two Gruppen of Bf110G-4's that come up to play in the bright moonlight on the return leg. Lots of corkscrewing Lancs for a while. A couple of rear gunners fend off some 110's, but none go down until the NI's claim 3 as they come home to land.

The 4th FG and 19 Sqn stand down to re-equip with Mustangs, the Thunderbolts going into the pool for wastage and the Spits get shipped to Italy to re-equip 93 Sqn in MAC, whose Spit Vb's in turn disperse amongst the under-strength Spit Vb units.


< Message edited by fochinell -- 8/1/2007 11:56:43 AM >

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/3/2007 4:27:58 PM   
fochinell

 

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6th November 1943: Allied 26/1575, Axis 12/310

Another low-energy day. 205 Group have begun re-equipping their last Wellington X squadrons with surplus B-24D's, so the Wimpey is now out of the game except for the 192 Sqn RCM detatchments in BC, who normally fly 6 sorties or so every night mixed in with the bomber stream.

MTO: More tactical strikes dodging the weather (the 15th AF raid gets cancelled), with the 324th FG hitting the Adriatic AFs with their expendable P-38H's (I need the L's for LR escort work, for which they are critical for until the P-51D comes on stream in quantity), and the 12th AF P-47C's sweeping Cacina Vaga AF again. 8 P-47C's go down in the north for about half that number of 109G-6's, with another 109 going down over the Adriatic.

ETO: Yet more tactical stuff including two B-17F raids on Belgium, with nil LW resistance encountered. Suprise, suprise, and I get the lead group weather 'feature' again, with only two out of four scheduled groups flying. BC active, with 6 Group hitting Vorhalle in the Ruhr for a decent raid; most squadrons hit the urban area, with a couple hitting open country or creeping back into Hagen. One Gruppe of 110G-4's scramble, and lose 3 aircraft to the NI's. The Wild Sau units are active but get no kills despite the bright moonlight. 3/288 Halifaxes lost.

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RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/5/2007 12:53:34 PM   
fochinell

 

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7th November 1943. A: 54/1455, X: 45/987. Another day of moderate attrition by tactical attacks.

MTO: More tactical fighter strikes across the Adriatic and northern Italy, with one long-range P-38H attack on Ferrara AF up the length of the Adriatic taking heavy casualties (16/96 P-38H lost for 4 claims).

ETO: Tactical strikes to Belgium. 72 2 Group Mitchells actually do some damage to Schaffen AF, and the 64 9th AF B-26B's do similar damage to Tilburg RR for no resistance. The LW finally stir themselves as another joint B-17F raid comes in behind the tactical forces to hit Schaerbeek and Brussels RR, doing some useful damage and taking and inflicting substantial losses in fighter combat in return; 29/288 fighters lost, for 1/124 B-17F and 46 enemy claimed. 15 P-38L and 14 P-47D lost in total this turn, but I'm happy to have OKL soak up their efforts on the fighters for heavy casualties in exchange.

BC attack Mannheim at night, but guess what, yes, another "lead group only" raid, and 43 out of a planned 338 Lancasters from 1 Group hit the target for one loss. The raid is too small to provoke any NJG reaction, so no NI claims either.



< Message edited by fochinell -- 8/5/2007 12:55:12 PM >

(in reply to fochinell)
Post #: 148
RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/5/2007 2:06:30 PM   
fochinell

 

Posts: 287
Joined: 11/19/2005
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8th November 1943: A: 108/2071 (29 AA), X: 90/788 (16 grnd). Major losses for a relatively moderate level of Allied activity

MTO: The first 15th AF raid for days returns to Venice PORT, and a major battle against the LW fighters in northern Italy follows. The P-38L escorts are overwhelmed off the mouth of the Po on the inbound leg, and several Gruppen manage to repeatedly attack the bombers. The gunners defend themselves well, and the bombardiers follow this with total destruction of the port, despite losing 26 bombers from the formation before reaching the target. 10/128 fighters lost, 30/96 bombers for 79 e/a claimed. The supporting tactical raids from the 12th AF and MAC in Corsica do little damage, but their escorts catch a few returning interceptors, claiming 15 e/a for 8 bombers lost to Flak. The A-20C raid to Ravenna RR does less well, hitting an invisible road junction north of the target, but avoids major combat. 10 P-38L and 30 B-24J lost in total. Yee-hah! Other than that some FB attacks on the Adriatic AF's around Spilt and the Baltimores hit an POWER FAC near Rome.

ETO: Some substantial strafing for the first time in ages, as the bombers are grounded by the weather. Heavy Spit Vb losses from the FC sweep up the Seine valley (28) but some e/a claimed, and I suppose several caught on the ground by the ground loss total. A Typhoon raid to the Pas de Calais FAC's fails to find the target, and hits Dunkirk VSITE on the way out, at the price of 16 lost

BC hits the Hamm RR yards with 3 Groups Lanc III's and Stirlings for minimal casualties - no NJG resistance as usual - and a reasonably concentrated raid.



< Message edited by fochinell -- 8/5/2007 4:22:45 PM >

(in reply to fochinell)
Post #: 149
RE: AAR swift vs fochinell - 8/6/2007 11:52:48 AM   
fochinell

 

Posts: 287
Joined: 11/19/2005
Status: offline
9th November 1943. A: 15/506 (7 aa); X: 12/319 (6 grd).

ETO: Weather clamps down over the Channel. Not even BC flying.

MTO: Weather limiting activity again. Some more tactical FB strikes around Split, and strikes and sweeps in NW Italy, the main result being 14 P-47C from the 12th AF being lost. 205 Group return to action after re-equipment with Halifax II's and Liberator D's, with a mediocre full-strength raid on Budapest doing too much agricultural bombing. Axis a/c losses have increased to 260 in the past week, despite the weather, which means the allies are slowly getting back on track to inflicting 1,000 losses per month instead of the miserable total of less than 600 in October 1943.

< Message edited by fochinell -- 8/6/2007 11:54:35 AM >

(in reply to fochinell)
Post #: 150
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