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RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/1/2009 11:26:58 AM   
NielsB

 

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Joined: 10/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Czert
I plyed only as mercenary and arichev top rank fairly easy (after cca 4 hours of gameply and lots of battles) , have battleship and dont see reason to continue play.
My ideas for improvment/thougts on game.


quote:

ORIGINAL: killroyishere

quote:

1. autocombat - this is most needed feature to prevent combat boring, even in battleship and admiral rank, space combat is same boring (read, same tactic) as it was in begining .with figter.


Thank you Czert for agreeing with me as this was the first and foremost thing I saw about the game when playing the demo. I wondered if the battles were the same at higher levels and you have just confirmed it for me and saved me $29.99 thanks as I was so close to buying it.

And you made highest rank in 4 measly hours? Where's the challenge? Where's the longevity? I'll save my money for BftB now.


Yeah, killroyishere, it really helps if someone knows what he´s talking about, right? The highest rank in Smugglers 4 does not mean the game is solved. The game doesn´t have a fixed objective. That's the idea of an open-ended game. Has czert won the war? No. Has the received all medals? No. Has he played as a trader, mercenary and pirate? No. Has he tried out different skill combinations? No. Even afterwards you could try to achieve higher scores than other players. And, yes, there are people still playing Smugglers 4 for almost 1 1/2 years now. That´s no guarantee though that everyone will like the game or everyone will play the game forever. And with different skills everyone will need a different time to solve a challenge in a game. But claiming 4 hours is an average play time for everyone is just ridiculous.

(in reply to killroyishere)
Post #: 91
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/1/2009 12:27:23 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Niels is spot on there. I suppose you can "beeline" for any single goal, but that's far from exploring the whole game.

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(in reply to NielsB)
Post #: 92
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/1/2009 2:06:51 PM   
jdew

 

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Joined: 10/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Niels is spot on there. I suppose you can "beeline" for any single goal, but that's far from exploring the whole game.



Yeah I agree with this. My first game is still going... as a mercenary.. and I've got about 10 to 12 hours in it. I "beelined" to a cruiser, but I think I probably should have taken a bit more time with each vessel type. The second I've just started is as a trader. I suspect both will go on many more hours with many other following "lives" to do.

Though some of the actions within the game remind me of the old game Pirates, what reminds me most of the old game is the open-ended nature... you can cruise around and do things for a long long time with no pre-set bunch of "goals". There are lots of ways to play the game and enough things to do and enough variations to keep it interesting. The real "goals" are the ones I set, which I like, not a bunch of things set by the developer... do A, do B, do C, do D... you "win", which I quickly get bored with.

From what I see, this is a game where I get a framework to do what I want... much like the old Pirates. And the framework isn't overly complex, so I can get into doing things quickly... like Pirates. From there I can play a number of ways.

And, yeah the mechanics of the old Pirates Gold was pretty simple... and the battles were rather simplistic and the sword duels were a rather pointless exercise in key smashing... but that game stayed on my PC for years and I played it a lot. And too, the mechanics of chess are really really simple but I hear people play that game a lot. So to me complex mechanics, micromanagement and the like don't necessarily make a "good" game.

I like this game quite a bit and suspect it will be on my hard drive for a long long time.




(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 93
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/7/2009 5:05:37 PM   
timmoody

 

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I enjoyed the game. Well spent money, but there are certain things I think would enhance the game:

1. Include more equipment & ships. Very few types of equipment. If you include more the player should be able to mod the ship to ones needs to a greater extend. What if each type of equipment gave you a special ability to use during combat. If you played a defensive minded character you could by anti-missile rockets instead of the more offensive one. Engine power could be used (via an option during combat) to enhance shield but making hitting the opponent harder. (these are just the first things that came to my mind, they probably do not make a lot of sense).

2. A more campaign based story with the pc in the middle. There where to many short missions imho.

3. The boarding of ships should be tweeked and made more complex. I loved the ships vs. ship fighting but the combat onboard was really dull. I know it is not really the main part of the game but you could make it more similar to the ship vs. ship combat with different abilities and stuff.

4. Maybe this was just me but I was disappointed when I got my hands on the bigger ships. I expected them to be really powerful but even the fighters managed to put me in a tought spot at certain times. (and vice versa when I had a fighter I actually managed to take down a couple of the bigger ships). the bigger ships should be able to take the smaller ones out easily unless the fighter pilot gets really lucky.


I hope the developers see this as constructive criticism and not just whining. The game was good and I will probably continue playing it.

Btw, I found a patch on nielsbauergames.com, but after installing it I could no play the game. Is there a patch on the way?

(in reply to jdew)
Post #: 94
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/7/2009 5:21:51 PM   
jwarrenw13

 

Posts: 1897
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From: Louisiana, USA
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I'm enjoying the game a lot. Just tooling around in my fighter in the solar system, upgrading my fighter and fighting pirates and doing missions to make more money. I play about 30 minutes a night most nights as a way to wind down after everything else, and I keep wanting to go one more turn. Great game.

If I could have one thing, it would be just more options, more variety.  The more variety the better.  Like in the spaceport bar, there appear to be two things that happen, you get some information or you drink.  Maybe I just haven't hit other options yet.  I could see several things added there, for example.  Option to have a partner of the opposite sex, or same sex if that's your thing.  Bar fights.  Random events happening.  On and on. 

The more variety the more fun.

And now I have to figure out how to deal with those nasty EMP pulses.  Gotta read up on that.  It seems I have no way of countering them at present.  And that is not a complaint.  I've just reached one of those points where I have to figure out how to deal with something new.  That makes the game a lot of fun.



< Message edited by JW -- 11/7/2009 5:22:55 PM >

(in reply to timmoody)
Post #: 95
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/7/2009 5:35:22 PM   
Slocket

 

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quote:

how to deal with those nasty EMP pulses.


It is not very clear what to do, but the message says get "EMP Resistance" SKILL after you first get hit by one in the tactical battle.

Oddly, the description for that message SKILL is to remove the nasty MARK effect as one would if using a CLOAK device to escape. ??  Dual use I guess....

I guess it also gives you EMP Resistance too. Even though that is not what it says. Confusing.

(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 96
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/8/2009 12:08:29 PM   
Hanal

 

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By the way, does the AI ever attempt to board your ship? Have not seen it done in my game thus far....

(in reply to Slocket)
Post #: 97
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/8/2009 3:02:52 PM   
sabre1


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From: CA
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My ship has never been boarded nor attempted by the AI.

(in reply to Hanal)
Post #: 98
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/8/2009 3:20:20 PM   
LarryP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sabre1

My ship has never been boarded nor attempted by the AI.


Same here.

(in reply to sabre1)
Post #: 99
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/8/2009 5:18:16 PM   
jwarrenw13

 

Posts: 1897
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From: Louisiana, USA
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Meanwhile I finally made enough money to upgrade to a stripped down corvette.  Now I just have to make some money to upgrade it and then go marauding throughout the galaxy.  I don't feel my stripped down corvette is very formidable right now, though I find I can easily take out pirate fighters (even if they do hit me with EMP pulses) and continue making money.

But I have a nagging question about EMP pulses.  Rulebook says only destroyer and above have weapons that can create EMP pulses, but I'm getting hit by EMP pulses from fighters.  Undocumented rules change or am I misreading something?  Again this doesn't bother me because the unexpected is very interesting and I'm playing the game in a very light manner.  In fact I really had not cracked the rules book until this morning to read about EMP pulses.

And apparently I need a certain combat trait to be able to get equipment to counter EMP pulses.  Is that right?

(in reply to LarryP)
Post #: 100
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/8/2009 6:36:17 PM   
Rob Brennan UK


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From: London UK
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Yup , i think its in the mercenary combat option tree. Main central thread if youknow what i mean. Its a skill like any other and you need it active to avoid emp pulses so it will change your tactics a bit but its well worth it.

IIRC you need one 'point' from both sides of the tech tree before you access the central one. Bit vague on the description here, apologies, but dont have the game open atm .

Good Luck

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(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 101
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/9/2009 6:37:33 AM   
Slocket

 

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Joined: 11/7/2009
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The pirate / criminal faction skill tree does give you the EMP ability; so even those pirate fighters can be hitting you with honest EMP pulses without cheating. It is in the skill tree. You can learn it too.

I think the point is as explained in the manual, you get more loot by disabling the cargo ship if your a pirate. Plus the more cargo space you have to haul away loot, the more plunder you get.

So pirates would naturally want to EMP your ship....but I thought they would perform a boarding action, then leave you alone minus your cargo maybe. Or they just blow your ship up after they board you -either way I have not seen the AI do a boarding action; since they leave you dead. Dead men tell no tales. So maybe that is why.

< Message edited by Slocket -- 11/9/2009 6:38:34 AM >

(in reply to Rob Brennan UK)
Post #: 102
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/9/2009 9:10:11 AM   
NielsB

 

Posts: 41
Joined: 10/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: timmoody

I enjoyed the game. Well spent money, but there are certain things I think would enhance the game:

1. Include more equipment & ships. Very few types of equipment. If you include more the player should be able to mod the ship to ones needs to a greater extend. What if each type of equipment gave you a special ability to use during combat. If you played a defensive minded character you could by anti-missile rockets instead of the more offensive one. Engine power could be used (via an option during combat) to enhance shield but making hitting the opponent harder. (these are just the first things that came to my mind, they probably do not make a lot of sense).

2. A more campaign based story with the pc in the middle. There where to many short missions imho.

3. The boarding of ships should be tweeked and made more complex. I loved the ships vs. ship fighting but the combat onboard was really dull. I know it is not really the main part of the game but you could make it more similar to the ship vs. ship combat with different abilities and stuff.


What you mention is mostly part of my "to-do" list. However instead of an an adventure-like storyline I am rather going to work on the feedback you get from the war + maybe some personal missions like you had to do in pirates (find your long lost family, etc.).

quote:


4. Maybe this was just me but I was disappointed when I got my hands on the bigger ships. I expected them to be really powerful but even the fighters managed to put me in a tought spot at certain times. (and vice versa when I had a fighter I actually managed to take down a couple of the bigger ships). the bigger ships should be able to take the smaller ones out easily unless the fighter pilot gets really lucky.


The basic idea of the ship design & encounter design is like this: You can encounter +-1 ship class in the game. Everything smaller will be no challenge or value at all, so consequently you do not encounter them. Anything larger and you would stand no chance. However within this +-1 ship class difference you are challenged depending on your skill, game character and ship. A smuggler fulfilling some combat missions is supposed to be fine with attacking the same class or a lower class of ships. A mercenary with a combat specialized ship however is supposed to try his best at the +1 ship class. Defeating a +1 ship class will bring very high rewards.

quote:


Btw, I found a patch on nielsbauergames.com, but after installing it I could no play the game. Is there a patch on the way?


The version you got from MatrixGames is the newest version. The patch available from my website is for previous versions.

(in reply to timmoody)
Post #: 103
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/18/2009 12:38:52 AM   
jwarrenw13

 

Posts: 1897
Joined: 8/12/2000
From: Louisiana, USA
Status: offline
Finally upgraded to a destroyer and added the boarding shuttle.  That is fun.  Now I'm chasing and capturing pirates by boarding their ships.  Also captured some droids.  The game does add new layers of interest every time you buy a bigger ship.

I'm think a career as a trader would be a completely different challenge if you stuck to the trading ships rather than combat vehicles without a lot of cargo capacity.    

(in reply to NielsB)
Post #: 104
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 11/18/2009 3:35:03 PM   
jdew

 

Posts: 60
Joined: 10/30/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JW

Finally upgraded to a destroyer and added the boarding shuttle.  That is fun.  Now I'm chasing and capturing pirates by boarding their ships.  Also captured some droids.  The game does add new layers of interest every time you buy a bigger ship.

I'm think a career as a trader would be a completely different challenge if you stuck to the trading ships rather than combat vehicles without a lot of cargo capacity.    


I agree. The game does add layers every time you buy a bigger ship and as you get to select new skills and buy new equipment. I find the skill selection to be a particularly crucial decision.


As for traders, I tried a trader career for something different and I find it almost completely different from pirate or merc. As a trader, I found myself thinking defensively.... selecting trading and defensive skills and equipment. Here, I'd just do doing trading missions. Combat was something to be avoided. Luckily, the AI doesn't board so I didn't have to load up on marines and droids.

In an update or patch I'd like to see the AI do some boarding.... at least at a higher level of difficulty or later in the career, if not from the start... since that would make a trader career quite a bit riskier.


(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 105
RE: First Impressions & Feedback Thread - 6/3/2010 6:12:18 AM   
Drifter

 

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Not much has been posted for a while, so I thought a newbie could add a few words. I have about 55-60 hours of time spent on the game. That's about fifty cents an hour, can't complain about overall value. I think I'll now move on to something else, however.

My experience in this genre goes back to the original Reach for the Stars on Apple II GS and Pirates, both of which kept me going for hundreds of hours on 512K floppys. All of the Wing Commander/Privateer games were great, as were MOO I-III, XCOM I-III, Alpha Centauri, Civ I-IV, Galactic Civ I, right up through Europa Universalis I-III.

This game feels very close to Pirates in many ways, but is not as much fun. I could happily go back to Pirates and try to sail a brig around a galleon and capture it, or do a sword fight with sabre vs. a cutlass; however, I don't really want to do any more of this Smugglers IV combat, with stationary images and pushing a limited number buttons to put up a shield, fire a torpedo, or try to escape a losing fight. It was fun, as in beer-and-pretzels fun, for a while, but there is just too much of it, and it is too much the same.

After a few short plays of getting the feel of the game, I began as a pirate, and made it to admiral, had a planet all my own to retire too, and some half million points. It took forever to get enough money together to buy, and trick out, a ship powerful enough to take on a Maurader. Capturing enough 'bots was expensive, because of the number of marines lost in each combat boarding. After some 8-9 boardings, I finally had captured 18 'bots, and with their help, got past the large number of combat crew on the bridge of a Marauder, and I was in business. Once that ship was beefed up, combat was no problem, and I could take on fleets and make some good money.

Next time, I sent out as a mercenary, and took over a Stonewall more quickly, beefed it up, then took over a Gettysburg. Once that was upgraded, it is easy to take out star systems and rake in 2.5 million as payment. I was able to get my faction to control about 12-14 planets at any one time, but if I took over a star system at one end, a star system at the other end quickly fell. I finally gave up, and retired with about 1.5 million points.

Last time was a pure trader, never even tried to board a single ship. I was as defensive, and as full of cargo space, as possible. It took forever to get going. The early ships have so little space, and the missions take far too long. Missions to deliver 200 units of cargo can require 15-20 trips. With an eye at the later promotions, you have to go for defensive benefits from the early promotions, so you are hard pressed to take easier, higher paying missions that require fighting. Once I had the necessary drives to exit my original system, I did much more trading runs than missions. The cash starts to build up at a good rate then, and before long, I had the biggest ship money could buy, some 1800 units of space, and just ran up the trading, unless a decent mission became available. With some $25-30 million cash in hand, I retired, at age 60, as an admiral, again with my own planet, and 4.5 million points. My faction held only 2-3 planets at the end, however.

Some changes I would like to see: I wish merchants could more easily avoid combat. Even cloaked and with fast engines, combat comes far too often, and with weaker guns, it takes a while to whittle down all opponents. If not for the ability to re-generate shields, I don't see how I could have survived as a merchant. For combat missions in general, I wish there was some way to control my final destination. As a mercenary, if I go after a pirate who is wanted for cash, and just before I encounter him, I get intercepted, I can be in big trouble. I will very likely win the interception fight, but am down to half shields, or even less, and am immediately thrown into combat with the enemy ship I had been headed for, and his ship is at 100% health and all set for a romp. There should be some option to return to a planet, or at least change direction, after every combat. Also, I can't seem to find a way to repair my ship on a planet. A few times I was really limping along, landed on a planet to hire crew, and hoping I would not be intercepted when I left. More than once, after lift-off, I was killed, because I was too weak after battles like the one mentioned above. Trading missions do not reward the time and money spent to fulfill them. In later stages, you are asked to supply 2000-3000 items. Often, the planet that wants the items is paying very little for the item. Even to find 2000 engines, diamonds, etc. at a break-even cost may require visits to as many as 6-7 star systems, and even with a huge cargo ship, will require at least two trips out of and back to the star system in need. All of that time, you are constantly intercepted, and fighting long battles, all for very little reward. In the earlier trading missions, your ship simply does not have the cargo space to allow you to complete the mission without multiple runs, and you may not have the cash to purchase the cargo, either.

My final thoughts? A good game, fun, but it becomes too repetitive. It is a nice, easy, casual game. It is very close to the old Sid Meier Pirates in many ways, though not as addictive. Maybe a bit like Galactic Civilizations I (very) Lite. This is NOT Wing Commander, or Privateer, and most certainly not Sword of the Stars. So take it for what it is. I received my money's worth. Next up? Not sure, Maybe Galactic Civ II, Europa Uniersalis' new addition called Heir to the Throne, or Matrix's own Distant Worlds.

(in reply to jdew)
Post #: 106
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