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RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A)

 
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RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/17/2020 10:39:18 PM   
Alamander

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista


There is nothing important in Lashio specifically to guard, you mentioned the danger of retreat into the trap yourself, and neither Lashio nor Myitkyina help China with supply in any way. Hardly any JFB goes into China from Burma direction because of those supply issues and the need for unrestricted units. If you want to keep Japan from this venture anyway, just dig in around Paoshan with all the mountains, river crossings and shorter supply routes. Not to mention Lashio needs unrestricted units you can use elsewhere (if you have the common pp houserule in place), while Paoshan you can defend with the host of restricted Chinese.

Edit: Note, it's all OK if you just want to have a battle in the unconventional location as the main reason, and want to see how Japan will deal with it


I don't really follow the logic either. If Japan wants to wade into the mountains of western China to dislodge some dug-in Chinese corps in mountainous terrain with some of their unrestricted divisions, I say, as the allies, 'More power to Ya, buddy. I'm Sure glad those unrestricted divisions are not somewhere else, anywhere else... actually."

< Message edited by Alamander -- 7/17/2020 10:41:51 PM >

(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 151
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/17/2020 11:09:35 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

Why would you defend China so forward? You make it exceedingly easy for Japan to bring supplies to your location via RR while at the same time you would still waste your China supply traversing the dirt roads. There is nothing important in Lashio specifically to guard, you mentioned the danger of retreat into the trap yourself, and neither Lashio nor Myitkyina help China with supply in any way. Hardly any JFB goes into China from Burma direction because of those supply issues and the need for unrestricted units. If you want to keep Japan from this venture anyway, just dig in around Paoshan with all the mountains, river crossings and shorter supply routes. Not to mention Lashio needs unrestricted units you can use elsewhere (if you have the common pp houserule in place), while Paoshan you can defend with the host of restricted Chinese.

Edit: Note, it's all OK if you just want to have a battle in the unconventional location as the main reason, and want to see how Japan will deal with it


For a variety of reasons. Lashio is x3 terrain, Rangoon on x2. The troops will have a bit longer to prepare for a Lashio defense and are immune to naval bombardment and aerial bombing is less effective. I want to pull IJA troops to Lashio and waste more time, if not surrounded moves to cut the road to the south are possible and also are possible from China. Lashio cannot really be interdicted with LRCAP.

It is almost impossible to defend Rangoon and retreat. It simply isn't as good a place to fight as Lashio. To encircle Lashio IJA has to go off road, or move up to Myitkyina and move south.

It gives me a fourth base build supplies in for the Mountain hold, it's runway can be built up if practicable and Hong Kong is vulnerable in Oct of 1942. It provides another vector to attack Magwe/Rangoon, Bangkok. It is only 6 hexes from Imphal, which is the closest possible practical base to fly supplies in that can reach Paoshan.

So that is some of the thinking, and a lot of it is situational plans inside of plans and certainly a lot won't work out. For example, won't be nearly as effective if Ledo falls and Japan is committed to a maximum India first strategy but it might be if it buys a month slowing down an Indian push. Looking to buy time and exploit whatever I can.

And if I can hold the mountains, think what can be done in 1943 and beyond. The Chinese can infiltrate south and threaten the Hanoi Lang Son rail line. One of my game goals is to stretch Japan's perimeter to the breaking point. Combined with a Tavoy area landing it all becomes a huge reverse trap.

I get that the opportunity cost is high, but the payoff can be big too. Certainly it beats losing all of China which is a factor in every Japanese AV I believe.




(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 152
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/17/2020 11:28:08 PM   
RangerJoe


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Even if your Chinese retreat to the mountains but can get more supplies will be a big help.

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“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
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(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 153
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:10:50 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alamander

I don't really follow the logic either. If Japan wants to wade into the mountains of western China to dislodge some dug-in Chinese corps in mountainous terrain with some of their unrestricted divisions, I say, as the allies, 'More power to Ya, buddy. I'm Sure glad those unrestricted divisions are not somewhere else, anywhere else... actually."



That is not what I am trying to accomplish.


(in reply to Alamander)
Post #: 154
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 8:54:59 AM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled


quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Festung Lashio is a pretty key point to my Burma Defense.

How do you plan to supply it when Rangoon is gone?

Hopefully supplies from Paoshan will filter there. The slightly better route is to air drop supplies into Bhamo or Lashio itself. Lashio is almost impossible to LRCAP to stop transports.

...

If Japan goes for an amphibious invasion of India, putting the KB in the Bay of Bengal, I will of course invade the Marianas & the Jimas no matter what I have to steam thru to get there. I will have some restricted units prepping for this from day 1 too.

Why would you want to waste Chinese supply on Burma roads for India protection? In my book Burma is usually a lost cause and a place for delaying action at most to let mobile Chinese march into India. After that India is protected nicely from that direction by terrain and lack of supply on the Burma side, as well as RR fast reaction possibilities on the India side. Hardly any JFB ventures into India from here, they all choose amphibious route and for a good reason.
Edit: I remember some AARs where Allies overcommited to Burma defense only to be encircled a bit later by Calcutta landings and massacred.

IMO Japan is perfectly capable of letting you into Marianas in mid 42 and then isolating and squishing you in late 42 when they are back from Bengal. They still have a lot of time and a capable carrier arm, while you don't. Not to mention distances to home bases.


Its a balance I think

I'm too cautius in my current game, because I was too aggressive in the game before that!

But it depends entirely in 1942 on what the Japanese player is aiming for.

If he's going for a 1942 win, then he's got to knock out China or Oz or India and sink the US carriers.

Surviving 1942 is the aim of all Allied players first and foremost I feel.




knocking out China AND India AND sink the US carriers has resulted in a 6.5:1 in my ongoing game and you only need a 4:1, way easier to achieve and Allied players often tend to forget this.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 7/18/2020 8:58:39 AM >


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Post #: 155
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 9:13:56 AM   
Yaab


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That is why holding Bombay is crucial. It is the biggest port in India, thus all Indian surplus of supply/fuel/res piles up there from the start.

(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 156
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 1:54:27 PM   
RangerJoe


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Karachi might be easier to hold.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 157
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:11:52 PM   
Lowpe


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Pretty much sure almost all my starting PP are going to be used in China on Dec 7 preturn.

Here is a look at the highest AV unit of the Chinese Infantry. Some units have Fatigue at 60. Disablements often are 50%. This makes moving a killing experience.

There is 23,000 AV at start in China, but at 35 morale and 35 experience and supply constrained, plus many infantry units are sadly lacking in support squads which hampers off base defense. Guns are in short supply.

I am convinced that my grasp of supply mechanics will allow me to send supply where I want it for the most part. The supply graphic shows against the AI I can increase supply 40K thru the first 9 turns of the game. Against a player it won't be as strong...Hong Kong supply is counted in this number, but I didn't ship or fly in any supply...simply thru local supply and manipulating stockpile & demand at bases. My test isn't ideal yet, as supply was getting destroyed by IJAAF air raids on some bases notably Changsha.

So, with a decent grasp on supply and several ideas on how to get more there, then, getting the Chinese Army into fighting trim is the next area to work on. The establishment of recovery areas is extremely important and this means changing leaders, and I expect to spend almost all the starting 100 PP doing this on day one. Morale, experience, disablements, and fatigue, support squads (selectively) need improvement fast.

A recovery area will further be broken down into rear area (where supply is stockpiled) and combat area which could be one hex away from enemy units.

High Inspirations and High Admin skill leaders are in great demand, and will be prioritized. I have identified the top 15 large combat unit leaders and they will be re-assigned to make hopefully a great impact on the Chinese Army.








FYI the Chinese training level is 45.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 7/18/2020 3:37:07 PM >

(in reply to Alamander)
Post #: 158
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:22:21 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Karachi might be easier to hold.


One of the best ways to secure India is to put up a hell of a fight in China. Even if China is ultimately lost, if you can delay an India operation till after April...allowing those troops to recover morale, prep to 100, and better fighters and forts to be built.

We shall see.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 159
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:26:58 PM   
Encircled


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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled


quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Festung Lashio is a pretty key point to my Burma Defense.

How do you plan to supply it when Rangoon is gone?

Hopefully supplies from Paoshan will filter there. The slightly better route is to air drop supplies into Bhamo or Lashio itself. Lashio is almost impossible to LRCAP to stop transports.

...

If Japan goes for an amphibious invasion of India, putting the KB in the Bay of Bengal, I will of course invade the Marianas & the Jimas no matter what I have to steam thru to get there. I will have some restricted units prepping for this from day 1 too.

Why would you want to waste Chinese supply on Burma roads for India protection? In my book Burma is usually a lost cause and a place for delaying action at most to let mobile Chinese march into India. After that India is protected nicely from that direction by terrain and lack of supply on the Burma side, as well as RR fast reaction possibilities on the India side. Hardly any JFB ventures into India from here, they all choose amphibious route and for a good reason.
Edit: I remember some AARs where Allies overcommited to Burma defense only to be encircled a bit later by Calcutta landings and massacred.

IMO Japan is perfectly capable of letting you into Marianas in mid 42 and then isolating and squishing you in late 42 when they are back from Bengal. They still have a lot of time and a capable carrier arm, while you don't. Not to mention distances to home bases.


Its a balance I think

I'm too cautius in my current game, because I was too aggressive in the game before that!

But it depends entirely in 1942 on what the Japanese player is aiming for.

If he's going for a 1942 win, then he's got to knock out China or Oz or India and sink the US carriers.

Surviving 1942 is the aim of all Allied players first and foremost I feel.




knocking out China AND India AND sink the US carriers has resulted in a 6.5:1 in my ongoing game and you only need a 4:1, way easier to achieve and Allied players often tend to forget this.


Yup

Surviving 1942 and not losing (especially in Scen 2) has to be the allied aim

Yeah, there are AARs where the allies have sunk the KB in '42, but that only happens if the Japanese player is going big and the allied player is ready for it.



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(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 160
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:36:24 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled


Surviving 1942 and not losing (especially in Scen 2) has to be the allied aim

Yeah, there are AARs where the allies have sunk the KB in '42, but that only happens if the Japanese player is going big and the allied player is ready for it.




In this game, the ground war will be pretty different because of the 2 day turns.

(in reply to Encircled)
Post #: 161
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/18/2020 2:48:47 PM   
RangerJoe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

Surviving 1942 and not losing (especially in Scen 2) has to be the allied aim

Yeah, there are AARs where the allies have sunk the KB in '42, but that only happens if the Japanese player is going big and the allied player is ready for it.


In this game, the ground war will be pretty different because of the 2 day turns.


I have never played anything other than one day turns. But I can see that land combat can get pretty deadly if the first turn is bad and if reinforcements arrive on the second turn but there is still combat. Air would be something else as well.

Hopefully, you will have a battleship like the Arizona survives intact while the KB hangs around Pearl Harbor so you can charge out and wreck havoc upon the KB. Let slip the Dogs of War . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 162
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:02:10 AM   
Lowpe


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I have given Japan pretty much the ok to do anything on pre-turn except hunt American Carriers.

It seems very difficult to head south with Force Z and survive. Perhaps switching the initial routing to coastal to insure Force Z gets a whack at any Mersing landing might be the better option.

I would really like to save Force Z, but not real sure how to go about that and be successful.

I could have chosen a Singapore first defense...but if the Japanese prevent a consolidation of forces in Malaya then the defense would be short lived indeed. The early capture of Singapore is I am sure a goal of the Empire.

There is a free unit of Marmon Herrington armored cars at Singapore, if I can I am going to ship them to Palembang to strengthen the defense there.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 7/19/2020 12:03:24 AM >

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 163
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:17:23 AM   
jdsrae


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This is a fun and interesting time pre-start.
The guessing and second guessing about what the enemy will do.
They will probably do something different!

_____________________________

Currently playing my first PBEM, no house rules Scenario 1 as IJ.
AAR link (no SolInvictus): https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4684655

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 164
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 2:23:03 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jdsrae

This is a fun and interesting time pre-start.
The guessing and second guessing about what the enemy will do.
They will probably do something different!


Yep, you are right, JFBs are fairly creative and unpredictable at their openings.


When I played scenario 2, I managed a 20+ IJA invasion in Jan of 1943 and that is late and of course China going away in 1942 makes almost anything possible.

A big focus will be improving Allied recon early on to minimize surprises and preplanned counterpunches against a hyper aggressive Japan. Now if Japan establishes their perimeter and turtles, a much different game is going to be played out. Either is fine by me....but figuring it out a high priority.

A fair number of medium bombers will be tasked with recon duties, submarines not involved with running supplies, laying mines, or interdicting will be used for intel purposes. I want to get a handle on how Japan operates.



(in reply to jdsrae)
Post #: 165
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 2:43:50 AM   
RangerJoe


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If the Allies drop supplies on a Soviet beach, will they declare war?

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 166
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 2:44:24 AM   
phebron


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Against the computer I have good luck sending Force Z at full speed to Batavia. It will only go about 8 hexes since there is only one naval movement phase on turn 1.

< Message edited by phebron -- 7/19/2020 2:45:35 AM >

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 167
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 4:17:23 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

If the Allies drop supplies on a Soviet beach, will they declare war?



We are allies...all the while the war rages, the Japanese let merchant ships go into Russia.


< Message edited by Lowpe -- 7/19/2020 4:21:27 AM >

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 168
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 4:20:31 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: phebron

Against the computer I have good luck sending Force Z at full speed to Batavia. It will only go about 8 hexes since there is only one naval movement phase on turn 1.


Pbem is a different animal. There is a narrow area where portions of the KB can strike. A potential counter is to do night naval search and patrol where I think the Carriers might show up hunting POW and hoping to the rng gods for a night encounter.



(in reply to phebron)
Post #: 169
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 5:12:11 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista



quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred
No supply spoilage wastage for first week of a scenario nor for supply transit between bases.

Alfred


Woah, this one is new to me. Is it hardcoded for every scenario out there? Might explain some of the strange results in my spoilage tests


Yes.

Introduced in Patch 6, Tweak #39.

Alfred

(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 170
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 5:14:50 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

If the Allies drop supplies on a Soviet beach, will they declare war?



We are allies...all the while the war rages, the Japanese let merchant ships go into Russia.



Only Japan can force an early Soviet activation.

Alfred

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 171
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 5:20:33 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

I have given Japan pretty much the ok to do anything on pre-turn except hunt American Carriers.

It seems very difficult to head south with Force Z and survive. Perhaps switching the initial routing to coastal to insure Force Z gets a whack at any Mersing landing might be the better option.

I would really like to save Force Z, but not real sure how to go about that and be successful.

I could have chosen a Singapore first defense...but if the Japanese prevent a consolidation of forces in Malaya then the defense would be short lived indeed. The early capture of Singapore is I am sure a goal of the Empire.

There is a free unit of Marmon Herrington armored cars at Singapore, if I can I am going to ship them to Palembang to strengthen the defense there.







Changing the threat tolerance level to "Low" is more hopeful. Of no real value if Historical" start is in play, so in this case if you are allowed to do so, changing the level has a small chance of saving Force Z.

Alfred

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 172
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 10:56:04 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Changing the threat tolerance level to "Low" is more hopeful. Of no real value if Historical" start is in play, so in this case if you are allowed to do so, changing the level has a small chance of saving Force Z.

Alfred


+1!


Big believer in low threat tolerance setting. I plan on making liberal use of "low" threat tolerance, especially in the early days when most night experience is in the 30s and 40s.

I have played around with creating training task forces, with a high leadership task force commander to increase experience gain, patrol orders, but without combat it seems not much more effective than just creating a task force and letting it sit in a hex.

I am looking to prioritize gaining night experience, so my primary SAG usage will be with that in mind, looking to ambush convoys, night bombardments (which isn't nearly as effective as surface combat in raising experience), and if I find IJN SAG I hope the low threat tolerance will cause them to runaway very quickly, and not get into drawn out slugfests where the IJN enjoys a 30 point experience advantage.

Extreme care will be taken with the Iboat horde around Pearl. The best ASW ship at Pearl is the long legged Taney. But her experience at night is in the 20's!. We have got some serious training to do to get these rookies up to speed.





< Message edited by Lowpe -- 7/19/2020 11:28:55 AM >

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 173
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 11:24:38 AM   
Encircled


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My novel way of gaining night experience in my current game was getting every cruiser torpedoed so they learnt experience the old fashioned way.

Looking forward to seeing how two day turns work.

I'm so OCD that I couldn't even begin to contemplate the possibility of even considering it!

_____________________________


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Post #: 174
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 11:33:55 AM   
Lowpe


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Got an email from my honorable Japanese opponent, he is now searching for specific bases that he has forgotten where they are.

I think that is something every WITP AE player has spent time on! Not to mention all the funny dual locations, Batan/Bataan, Christmas Island x2, etc. etc.

The optimist in me would like to see a turn this night. However, I don't want Japan to rush, and have of course told him to run many sample first turns to make sure he doesn't make any day 1 blunders due to the game engine. I don't want to start the game off on a disappointing note.


(in reply to Encircled)
Post #: 175
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 11:42:53 AM   
Lowpe


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Perhaps one of the more frustrating challenges an AFB player faces, is understanding devices and which pool they pull from.

US supplied Chinese Infantry units pull from different pools...American 40mm Bofors (not the Chinese pool with pitiful production), but they pull from Chinese pools for the 105mm artillery gun.

Interesting to note that the American 40mm Bofors is more accurate than the Chinese Bofors.

It took me using tracker to discover this, otherwise it would be hard to pull that data from the game itself sans using the editor.

Or is there an method in the game to figure it out? Anyone know?




(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 176
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:01:26 PM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Changing the threat tolerance level to "Low" is more hopeful. Of no real value if Historical" start is in play, so in this case if you are allowed to do so, changing the level has a small chance of saving Force Z.

Alfred


+1!


Big believer in low threat tolerance setting. I plan on making liberal use of "low" threat tolerance, especially in the early days when most night experience is in the 30s and 40s.

I have played around with creating training task forces, with a high leadership task force commander to increase experience gain, patrol orders, but without combat it seems not much more effective than just creating a task force and letting it sit in a hex.

I am looking to prioritize gaining night experience, so my primary SAG usage will be with that in mind, looking to ambush convoys, night bombardments (which isn't nearly as effective as surface combat in raising experience), and if I find IJN SAG I hope the low threat tolerance will cause them to runaway very quickly, and not get into drawn out slugfests where the IJN enjoys a 30 point experience advantage.

Extreme care will be taken with the Iboat horde around Pearl. The best ASW ship at Pearl is the long legged Taney. But her experience at night is in the 20's!. We have got some serious training to do to get these rookies up to speed.






Two things to point out.

1. The threat tolerance level primarily refers to the threat posed by enemy aircraft. Set to "Low" instructs the TF to avoid venturing into any territory where there is an enemy air presence. The enemy air need not be dominant. Of course, the traits of the TF leader can, to a certain extent, negate the setting in part or in full. A meek and mild mannered TF leader, one with a low Aggression rating, is much more likely to follow orders and not enter enemy air space. Never, ever, appoint Halsey to a TF with a Low" level threat setting.

Even with a Low setting, a TF led by a meek and mild mannered leader may move into enemy air space because it doesn't know enemy air is in the area. Or the only way home is through transiting the least enemy air controlled air space. Hence just as important as the leader is having a high MDL in the area of likely operations.

The threat tolerance level doesn't really apply to deciding to attempt to decline battle when TFs bump into each other. Then the TF leader traits are the main factor in play in assessing the known relevant data to decide whether to decline or accept combat.

2. Shakedown cruises have different experience caps for ships based on type. TF leadership is irrelevant. It is a question of time spent at sea. Once the cap is reached, only engagement in actual combat will raise the ship's experience level. A ship which is in a TF which is involved in combat but it itself does not fire or is fired upon in that combat, does not increase it's experience level. This is why a Bombardment TF is not as efficacious as a Surface Combat TF in raising ship experience levels as generally speaking fewer ships in a Bombardment TF receive actual return fire than do ships in a Surface Combat TF.

Alfred

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 177
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:02:02 PM   
DesertWolf101

 

Posts: 1445
Joined: 11/26/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Changing the threat tolerance level to "Low" is more hopeful. Of no real value if Historical" start is in play, so in this case if you are allowed to do so, changing the level has a small chance of saving Force Z.

Alfred


+1!


Big believer in low threat tolerance setting. I plan on making liberal use of "low" threat tolerance, especially in the early days when most night experience is in the 30s and 40s.

I have played around with creating training task forces, with a high leadership task force commander to increase experience gain, patrol orders, but without combat it seems not much more effective than just creating a task force and letting it sit in a hex.

I am looking to prioritize gaining night experience, so my primary SAG usage will be with that in mind, looking to ambush convoys, night bombardments (which isn't nearly as effective as surface combat in raising experience), and if I find IJN SAG I hope the low threat tolerance will cause them to runaway very quickly, and not get into drawn out slugfests where the IJN enjoys a 30 point experience advantage.

Extreme care will be taken with the Iboat horde around Pearl. The best ASW ship at Pearl is the long legged Taney. But her experience at night is in the 20's!. We have got some serious training to do to get these rookies up to speed.







Couple of questions -

Would the low threat tolerance really help Force Z avoid the KB when the KB threat would be through its air strikes? Maybe I am mistaken, but I thought routing control was the setting that dealt with avoidance of air threats.

If you create an SAG and dock it (so it doesn't waste fuel), does it still gain experience or does it need to be undocked?

Thanks!

Edit: On the first question, just saw Alfred's latest post. Looks like I was mistaken on threat tolerance. The question that I am now left with is how routing control figures into this?

< Message edited by DesertWolf101 -- 7/19/2020 12:06:46 PM >

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 178
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:03:49 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Perhaps one of the more frustrating challenges an AFB player faces, is understanding devices and which pool they pull from.

US supplied Chinese Infantry units pull from different pools...American 40mm Bofors (not the Chinese pool with pitiful production), but they pull from Chinese pools for the 105mm artillery gun.

Interesting to note that the American 40mm Bofors is more accurate than the Chinese Bofors.

It took me using tracker to discover this, otherwise it would be hard to pull that data from the game itself sans using the editor.

Or is there an method in the game to figure it out? Anyone know?






Yes.

Use the nationality filters on the devices pools screen.

Alfred

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 179
RE: Hell Hath Frozen Over (Scout1 (J) vs Lowpe (A) - 7/19/2020 12:06:49 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Changing the threat tolerance level to "Low" is more hopeful. Of no real value if Historical" start is in play, so in this case if you are allowed to do so, changing the level has a small chance of saving Force Z.

Alfred


+1!


Big believer in low threat tolerance setting. I plan on making liberal use of "low" threat tolerance, especially in the early days when most night experience is in the 30s and 40s.

I have played around with creating training task forces, with a high leadership task force commander to increase experience gain, patrol orders, but without combat it seems not much more effective than just creating a task force and letting it sit in a hex.

I am looking to prioritize gaining night experience, so my primary SAG usage will be with that in mind, looking to ambush convoys, night bombardments (which isn't nearly as effective as surface combat in raising experience), and if I find IJN SAG I hope the low threat tolerance will cause them to runaway very quickly, and not get into drawn out slugfests where the IJN enjoys a 30 point experience advantage.

Extreme care will be taken with the Iboat horde around Pearl. The best ASW ship at Pearl is the long legged Taney. But her experience at night is in the 20's!. We have got some serious training to do to get these rookies up to speed.







Couple of questions -

Would the low threat tolerance really help Force Z avoid the KB when the KB threat would be through its air strikes? Maybe I am mistaken, but I thought routing control was the setting that dealt with avoidance of air threats.

If you create an SAG and dock it (so it doesn't waste fuel), does it still gain experience or does it need to be undocked?

Thanks!


The routing setting deals with the movement path.

Alfred

(in reply to DesertWolf101)
Post #: 180
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