RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (Full Version)

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Neilster -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/16/2006 8:34:49 AM)

Would it be possible to make the ends of the anchors less "blobby" and more arrow shaped?

Thanks for all the hard work.

Cheers, Neilster



dhatchen -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/16/2006 9:57:52 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Neilster

Would it be possible to make the ends of the anchors less "blobby" and more arrow shaped?

Thanks for all the hard work.

Cheers, Neilster


Ok everybody, time to pick on Steve's funny marine symbol again!!!

Actually I am just being silly. I really appreciate the fact that he even asks. I did not like the original anchour and thought that the tank tread was too square on the armour. The changes came pretty much the same day. It is interesting to see adaptability on Steve's part for even the smallest details. Lets face it, some of these details pale to insignificance when one considers the mammoth task that he has in front of him. Thanks again Openness player to input and player willingness to voice concerns is going to make this game the greatest it can be.

My vote is for the current anchour.



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/16/2006 10:58:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Neilster
Would it be possible to make the ends of the anchors less "blobby" and more arrow shaped?

Thanks for all the hard work.

Cheers, Neilster


'Blobby"? Is that a London cop who has put on a lot of weight?

Points - tried, couldn't make it happen.



c92nichj -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 7:16:33 PM)

I have another tiny tiny comment on the land units, I do not wish you to spend time on it though as it is not really important at all.

The name on the units looks to be left adjusted the XXX British ARM for example have it's name almost below it's nato symbol, personally I think it would be prettier if the name was centered with the Nato symbol.
But as I allready said, it is not of any importance at all.



Larry Smith -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 8:01:35 PM)

I'll apologize ahead of time for going off topic, but I tried my question of the WiF Discussion site and was promptly shot down. On the first page of this thread, Froonp mentioned that units could be loaned to other Major Powers. I have been unable to find any rules for this, and I wanted to read up on it if they are available (I have the latest RAW). I did search the WiF list archives, and found passing mention of "loaning" units (as opposed to Lend-Lease), from way back when CWiF was version 0.xxx to 3.xxx. I have the last version CM made available, and I haven't been able to find any "Loan" feature.
If anyone wishes to reply, just e-mail me at:
Laurence_Smith@telus.net

Thanks



Larry Smith -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 8:40:59 PM)

For captured and aligned naval units, how about borders. A captured unit would change the border colour to match the conquering nation. An aligned nation stays as is (its alignment is indicted in its home country), and ships from friendly nation that have been conquered (Greece, Netherlands, Norway; for eg. wrt the UK) would fight on with the main background colour of their new controlling country, but the border colour of their home nation.



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 9:24:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: c92nichj

I have another tiny tiny comment on the land units, I do not wish you to spend time on it though as it is not really important at all.

The name on the units looks to be left adjusted the XXX British ARM for example have it's name almost below it's nato symbol, personally I think it would be prettier if the name was centered with the Nato symbol.
But as I allready said, it is not of any importance at all.


The names are centered within the available space (height of the counter), which is needed for units with long names. The NATO symbol is placed high in the counter to make more room for the strength and movement numbers. Thus, the name is not centered with the NATO symbol.

I will probably tweak the abbreviation (always 3 capital letters) placement to center it both left to right and top to bottom (with the NATO symbol).



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 9:29:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Larry Smith

I'll apologize ahead of time for going off topic, but I tried my question of the WiF Discussion site and was promptly shot down. On the first page of this thread, Froonp mentioned that units could be loaned to other Major Powers. I have been unable to find any rules for this, and I wanted to read up on it if they are available (I have the latest RAW). I did search the WiF list archives, and found passing mention of "loaning" units (as opposed to Lend-Lease), from way back when CWiF was version 0.xxx to 3.xxx. I have the last version CM made available, and I haven't been able to find any "Loan" feature.
If anyone wishes to reply, just e-mail me at:
Laurence_Smith@telus.net

Thanks


Loaned units are not part of the rules. In over-the-board play, Germany will often let Italy move the German units that are in North Africa. Of course, any said moves are taken from the German activity limits for same. There are a lot of other places where one ally will let another ally physically move units. The simple description for this practice is 'loaning' units. In CWIF, and also in MWIF, this practice has to be formalized into the code by having (for example) Germany enter instructions that certain units are 'loaned' to the Italians. Otherwise, the program would require the German player to move them.



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 9:42:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Larry Smith

For captured and aligned naval units, how about borders. A captured unit would change the border colour to match the conquering nation. An aligned nation stays as is (its alignment is indicted in its home country), and ships from friendly nation that have been conquered (Greece, Netherlands, Norway; for eg. wrt the UK) would fight on with the main background colour of their new controlling country, but the border colour of their home nation.


I have problems with room for a border. Inside the existing counter there isn't space for a border without having it overlay some of the text. If it does overlay some of the existing text (i.e., as background, with the text appearing on top of it), then I have troubles with maintaining high contrast between the background color and the text color. White on white and black on black being two notable examples of hard to read combinations - both of which I have acheived at various times when playing around with color combinations and coding systems.

CWIF used horizontal stripes: bottom third of the counter for loaned units, and center third of the counter for lend lease units.

I am trying to avoid both of those for the same reason given above.

Though showing the original ownership of the units would be nice, I decided that it is much more important to know who currently owns the unit. Therefore I am going with the color of the new owner for captured units. I am leaving units that belong to aligned countries untouched because the interactions of multiple aligned minors can be tricky. The Balkan countries notedly disliked each other and there are rules in the game to that effect.

Territorials are handled differently. Those units, usually part of the Commonwealth or France, use the colors of the controlling major power rather than their own. Again, this is simply to make understanding who controls what units easier.



Larry Smith -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 10:00:07 PM)

Thanks for the reply. Explains why I was shot down of the Yahoo forum-the guy probably missed that I was talking about CWiF.



Froonp -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 10:12:34 PM)

I'm not really sure of what you are describing by "being shot down", but I replied to you on the WiF discussion list, without shooting you down I think.

Cheers !

Patrice



Froonp -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/17/2006 10:14:41 PM)

quote:

I have the last version CM made available, and I haven't been able to find any "Loan" feature.

You have it when you right click on a unit.



mlees -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/18/2006 12:40:33 AM)

Please refer to post #260...

There appears to be a "sea-area border graphic fragment" at the south tip of the hex containing the N. Ireland minor port of Derry (1 hex west of Belfast)...

Is that to indicate what sea area that port borders? Or is it a glitch?



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/18/2006 1:54:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

Please refer to post #260...

There appears to be a "sea-area border graphic fragment" at the south tip of the hex containing the N. Ireland minor port of Derry (1 hex west of Belfast)...

Is that to indicate what sea area that port borders? Or is it a glitch?


Good eyes. Can you find the second one?

The logic that is confused concerns the fact that the two hexes in question are both coastal hexes which border on different sea areas. Usually I want a sea area boundary drawn there. However, I do not want one when the connecting hexside is "all land".

I am aware of these glitches and I am trying to figure out the code that draws in the sea area boundaries. I spent 4 hours on it yesterday with no good result. However, I also spent another 6 hours on two other problems that have been driving me nuts, and solved those two - finally. It's just that sea area boundary code that remains an enigma. I have set it aside for now and will take another look at that code when I am fresh and less irritated with it.



mlees -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/20/2006 10:09:16 PM)

quote:

Good eyes. Can you find the second one?


Yes. SW corner of the minor port of Inverness, northern Scotland.

It just occured to me that this was the "Unit" thread, not the "Map" thread. My apologies.

So far, I am pleased to see the attention to detail here, as with the map. WiF FE had some of the best looking (especially SiF and PiF) counters in the board game collection I have, and I give kudos to you for trying to "port" that to the computer version.

I am not color blind, so I cannot help settle those types of questions. In regards to the non-elite German SS units, I can get used to any color for the unit-strength digits, but I think I prefer the red digits outlined in white.

If I may, is there a rough ETA yet on scanning the ship and aircraft images to the counters yet?



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/20/2006 11:25:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

If I may, is there a rough ETA yet on scanning the ship and aircraft images to the counters yet?


Not directly under my control, but I am working on correcting that.



Anendrue -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/23/2006 7:13:08 AM)

This is a catch up post as I have been out of pocket for many months. After skimming the posts on counters I am curious why the counters were not given a lifted 3d tyoe of view? This is easily obtained by using a single line of pixel shading on each side of the rectangle or square used for the counter. Typically a darker shade on the left and bottom and a lighter shade on the right and top.

Of course I am assuming that the screen shots will be typical of MWiF. If this has been previously covered, my apologies.




Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/23/2006 10:03:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: abj9562

This is a catch up post as I have been out of pocket for many months. After skimming the posts on counters I am curious why the counters were not given a lifted 3d tyoe of view? This is easily obtained by using a single line of pixel shading on each side of the rectangle or square used for the counter. Typically a darker shade on the left and bottom and a lighter shade on the right and top.

Of course I am assuming that the screen shots will be typical of MWiF. If this has been previously covered, my apologies.





This has come up several times previously. The status boxes at the top of the counters, the outlining that is done for selectable units, and the general lack of space make it very difficult to design and implement - and therefore unlikely.



Anendrue -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/23/2006 11:08:10 PM)

Thanks for the info. BTW I appreciate the work your doing and it seems to be absolutely great. I can't wait to get a copy.



Hairog -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 12:21:50 AM)

This game looks great and I can't wait for it to come out. The graphics depicted are just super except for one thing. I can stand the depiction of the little airplane on the counters. Maybe there are constraints I'm not aware of but this little graphic is ugly. I don't know if these will show up but here is a 3 pixel wide graphic




[image]local://upfiles/751/CEBE66FDB9D14195947426725FD3EDB2.jpg[/image]



Hairog -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 12:23:30 AM)

and here is a 2 pixel wide graphic.



[image]local://upfiles/751/A0F386B2C0A44BC5A227AC0441723F30.jpg[/image]



Hairog -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 12:26:24 AM)

As I said maybe I'm not aware of all the constraints for the graphics on the counters but if you could I would revisit the plane graphics. The ones on the board game were one of the best parts of the game.



Caranorn -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 1:12:14 AM)

As I understand it, the game artist is working, or will work on ship and air graphics, identical or similar to those of the board game. So what you have seen so far in Steve's Screenshots are just placeholders (dating back to CWiF).



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 3:08:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hairog

This game looks great and I can't wait for it to come out. The graphics depicted are just super except for one thing. I can stand the depiction of the little airplane on the counters. Maybe there are constraints I'm not aware of but this little graphic is ugly. I don't know if these will show up but here is a 3 pixel wide graphic




[image]local://upfiles/751/CEBE66FDB9D14195947426725FD3EDB2.jpg[/image]


I made the change to your bitmap, simply because it was better. Thanks.

My artistic skills are very limited. Would you like to try one for fighters? This one seems more appropriate for bombers. I am working with 22 by 22 bits in monchrome.

What Caranorn says is true, but I want to have medium resolution and low resolution images available too - for all air and naval units.



Hairog -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 10:03:33 AM)

Here are some fighter ideas.



[image]local://upfiles/751/DE2D726C8ECE45999351C447464C9737.jpg[/image]



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/28/2006 10:50:41 AM)

Thanks.

I'll make the changes tomorrow for the fighters and post some screen shots of both. [Eyes no longer focus.]



Dreadnought1979_slith -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/30/2006 11:39:51 PM)

Where are the screenshots of the ships and planes [sm=00000613.gif]......(cant wait to see them) Its very important to me that they look quite similar to the board game. the pictures of the boardgame brought more atmosphere to the game.




Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (1/31/2006 12:24:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dreadnought

Where are the screenshots of the ships and planes [sm=00000613.gif]......(cant wait to see them) Its very important to me that they look quite similar to the board game. the pictures of the boardgame brought more atmosphere to the game.


I have the artist working on the map icons at the moment (e.g. cities, ports, resources, and factories). The first set of icons he prepared were beautiful but 1/4 size. Increasing the number of pixels by making them full size, should make them even better. And then I'll post them so everyone can comment on them.

The high resolution air and naval units are next in his queue. I want to see a few examples first to make sure what he provides I can readily integrate into the existing mechanics of rendering the units on the screen. It shouldn't be too hard to do, just require a high level of precision to get the very best from 96 by 96 pixels (high resolution size, 24 bit color).

As anyone who reads this forum frequently will tell you, when I have them, you will see them.



tigercub -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (2/3/2006 2:26:41 AM)

I must say it`s all looking very good shannon great work a pat on the back!



Shannon V. OKeets -> RE: Unit Depictions on Screen (2/3/2006 2:54:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tigercub

I must say it`s all looking very good shannon great work a pat on the back!



Thank you. They more people I make happy, the more copies of the game will be sold.

-------------------

Here is a screen shot I promised someone a while back. I have been waiting for something else that would be interesting to show at the same time. Two birds with one stone and all that.

The changes are:
(1) The fighter icon to go with the bomber icon. These are intended only for medium to low resolution counter depictions.

Spiffed up Setup Units form.

(2) The buttons now work so you can select subsets of the unit lists. In this case I have FTR and ARM depressed, so only those unit types are shown in the form. When all the buttons are up, then all the units are shown. Multiple buttons can be depressed at the same time. For example, the HQ units could be added to the displayed units in the form by depressing the HQ button.

(3) Colors for the buttons. The air unit buttons are blue. Note that there are only fighters (FTR) and land based bombers (LND) available to be set up. There are no air transports (ATR), naval air (NAV), nor carrier planes (CVP) to be set up in Europe/Africa for the USSR. The last is a reference to this Group's Set Up Area. The land unit buttons are a dark maroon. The naval unit buttons are green. If you wanted to switch to setting up the naval units, you would press the "Show Naval" button and the land units would disappear to be replaced by the naval.

(4) If there were no naval units then the button would read "No Naval" and be disabled. If there are neither naval nor land units, then the buton would read "Only Air".

(5) The 3 units with the labels "In Stack" underneath them are being positioned on the map. Now, the Screen Capture function removes the cursor from the screen shot, or you would see that the leftmost units (a stack of 3) are under a cursor and moving around with the cursor. The 2-6 mechanized, 4 GD, is shown twice. Once it is dropped on the map, it (and its 2 friends) will be removed from the list above.

(6) I have changed the meaning of the ARM button to only include Armor and Mechanized units. This is because only those units receive armor shifts when attacking and can advance two hexes on a successful blitz attack.

[For those who are curious, these are the light colored rivers.]

[image]local://upfiles/16701/4AB7FA5575A04928BB743F847F4557F5.jpg[/image]



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