RE: Soviet turn 19 (Full Version)

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larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 19 (4/2/2007 4:19:17 AM)

Here's some Soviet losses so far:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/6F48646FA8324CDAB51612872A5CB072.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Soviet turn 19 (4/2/2007 5:26:49 AM)

Looks like he's broken throug to the Crimea?



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 19 (4/2/2007 6:36:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work
Looks like he's broken throug to the Crimea?


Yeah....and he broke through too.



SMK-at-work -> RE: Soviet turn 19 (4/2/2007 6:45:50 AM)

Sucks to be through[:'(]



Zort -> Axis turn 20 (4/2/2007 7:06:39 AM)

I broke through (or throug [;)]) the Crimea. I was surprised because Larry usually defends there well. He still has time to get forces there but he might have to thin out another portion of his line. I got a few more holes and unless he has more units then I think he has, I might just have torn a hole in his lines in the south. But I am not killing his guys fast enough. And my losses are getting close to what they are in SMK's game.



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 20 (4/2/2007 7:30:17 AM)

I think the Crimea depends upon the isthmus defences - once the Axis is through them it's all over bar the shouting - there might be shouting for a while in the mountains in the south, but it's still just the shouting & the sov's should probably be getting their high value units out of there ASAP.

Looks like you've made a landing on the north coast of the Crimea as well? Which reminds me to check on my garrison at that port....[:)]

If your losses vs Larry are approaching your losses vs me then his strategy is superior, 'cos he's got a lot more units left alive than I have!![&o]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 20 (4/2/2007 9:29:01 AM)

Here's my losses at the start of turns 19 and 20 compared:



[image]local://upfiles/994/AFB16735C8464D3A822D01610F906EE3.jpg[/image]

Lots of advanced a/c and tanks are moving into units this turn - I received several tank brigades on T19, but left them in place - they start with 5/30 T34's and 5/10 KV-1's - after 1 turn they're all up around 24-25 T34's and 7 or 8 KV-1's and much more capable - that plus Buzz is advancing on their positions so I don't need to move them forward into combat!! [:D]

Also the air war seems to be going unreasonably well....I'm sure he must be resting for a big push....



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 20 (4/2/2007 9:41:20 AM)

And last but not least the front - lots of changes as I withdraw in the south, and a bit of a stoush around the Perekop Isthmus at hte top of the Crimea.

Buzz has also withdrawn a couple of divisions that crossed the Luga river up north by Leningrad - they were taking a bit of a hammering....



[image]local://upfiles/994/B4BDEB7466BF491CAAB1993C4B3AC4B6.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 20 (4/2/2007 1:19:05 PM)

Here's the list of historical dates for city capture posted by Snefens in another thread - so far I think Buzz is miles ahead of schedule in the south but quite a bit behind in the north with Smolensk at least a couple of turns away.

Overall the extra progress in the south is probably worth the delay in the north for the axis.
Town..............Date.......Hist Turn......My game turn
Minsk............27-Jun-41....3.............3 or 4
Smolensk.........16-Jul-41....8.............Not yet - 3-4 turns?
Zaporozhe........18-Aug-41....17............about 12 or 13?
Dneprpetrovsk....25-Aug-41....19............Ditto
Kiev.............19-Sep-41....27............8 or 9?
Orel.............03-Oct-41....30............Not yet - not far away tho
Bryansk..........06-Oct-41....31............ditto
Kalinin..........13-Oct-41....33............Not yet - still some distance off
Odessa...........16-Oct-41....34............11 or 12? (sucky naval zones [:@])
Stalino..........21-Oct-41....36............Not yet, not far away
Kharkov..........24-Oct-41....37............Ditto
Rostov...........20-Nov-41....44............Aproaching fast
Sevastopol.......01-Jul-42....108...........At the gates of the Crimea now
Voronesh.........06-Jul-42....109...........Still a wee way off, but holding it another 90 turns will be a big ask.
Voroshilovgrad...18-Jul-42....113...........Closer than Voronesh - can't see it lasting another 90 turns!
Krasnodar........18-Jul-42....113...........Too far away to tell with this one



Edit - why don't spaces give proper spacing?[&:]



larryfulkerson -> Soviet turn 20 (4/3/2007 12:19:59 AM)

Hey thanks for (re)posting the capture dates of the various Soviet cities.

Here's the Soviet turn 20 minimap moves movie from turns 16 thru 20:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/C7E7B41AB3394E76994E1DEBE0EC8D5B.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 20 (4/3/2007 12:20:24 AM)

Here's some of the Soviet losses so far:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/03213FBD2525400F9DE1A3E5A097C7E6.gif[/image]



Zort -> Axis turn 21 (4/4/2007 3:33:23 AM)

Sorry of the skipped losses on turn 20 but as can be seen below they are getting high. But in comparison between these two games and the last game Larry and I played they are similiar.

Game 1 - Larry - mod 3 German HRS losses 25027
Game 2 - Larry - mod 4b German HRS losses 26421
Game 3 - SMK - mod 4b German HRS losses 27246

In game 2 I have been slugging it out against Larry's wall of units and he has been filling the holes. I haven't taken as many production cities as against SMK so his replacements have been higher.

In game 3 SMK is always on the attack so my guys have not had time to rest or reequip. But he has now almost a 100 units less the Larry and can't put up a line across the country. Which might give me the opportunity to take more production cities. And with his losses so high there is an excellant chance he is going to run out of pool rifle squads soon.

But none of this says I am going to win. Losses are really high, stuck my head in the bear a few turns ago against his air force and was lucky to have any planes left.

[image]local://upfiles/13081/36F7A19BDF3B4FE8A9C9F4CD775941AF.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 21 (4/4/2007 4:24:40 AM)

I'm sure Larry's losses will start rising now he's having to actually fight!! ;)



Telumar -> RE: Axis turn 21 (4/4/2007 5:11:40 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

I'm sure Larry's losses will start rising now he's having to actually fight!! ;)


And there is that inviting bulge near Smolensk..did i mention it before? [8|]



Zort -> RE: Axis turn 21 (4/4/2007 5:17:15 AM)

yea and I keep forcing his guys to stay and fight.....well that's my story.



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn 21 (4/4/2007 6:34:19 AM)

i'm sure the Smolensk bulge has been mentioned once or twice before..but Zort's story keeps changing!! [:D]



larryfulkerson -> Soviet turn 21 (4/4/2007 8:20:55 PM)

Here's the Soviet turn 21 minimap moves movie from turns 17 thru 21:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/2E9DD3D922D141388E0723C28FE2E714.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/4/2007 8:21:27 PM)

Here's some Soviet losses so far:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/04DF49C2A44B477DB751C38B9E37C77B.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/5/2007 12:43:45 AM)

One thing that's worth mentioning is that Buzz is very hot on partisans - I think I've had 4 units so far in the game, and they've all been crushed within a turn or 2 of forming - I also suspect a couple have arrived and been destroyed in Buzz's turn so I never saw them!

You can see a few rings of units well behind the German lines in Larry's animation above so it looks like Buzz is doing the same to him.



Zort -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/5/2007 3:40:53 AM)

Yea partisans are a nuisance. In my first game Larry cut my supplies to the center with them and almost did it this game. I had just completed a cross connect to the center from the north when this partisan comes up and cuts the rail line.

Well turn 22 were big losses for me especially with Larry. Even with all that div art that SMK is complaining about!!!, I still haven't broken Larry's line significantly. That Smolensk pocket is getting smaller, he has had most of his losses the last couple of turns of units dieing in place. Even a bridging engie died that was dug in on the first attack. He has the following production centers in danger, Sevastopol and Smolensk. I haven't be able to kill his units fast enough so he has been able to fill the holes. This turn he lost almost 6.5k rifle squads but can replace them (he lost over 4k last turn I think). I don't think I'll get him whiddled down before mud.

With SMK he has far fewer units, told me I had caught some of his retreating units before they could get back and so they might die next turn. He has cities in trouble, Smolensk, Stalino and Kharkov.

I have lost most of my brandenburgers dropping behind the lines to disrupt the art and have been frantically repairing rail lines so my guys will get into supply.

Wish I was as good as Karri and not lose as much but I am still learning. Guess I have a few years to go!!

[image]local://upfiles/13081/2F460B4733004265941F584C4DA7A2F9.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/6/2007 7:02:54 AM)

I've gotten 797 units on board at the start of T22, so if I've got "far fewer" than Larry then he must have a thousand!![&o]



Zort -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/6/2007 7:07:26 AM)

Well Larry had 869 on turn 21 and you have 797 on turn 22...hmm 90 less units is a lot as can be seen by the big empty places in your lines[;)]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Soviet turn 21 (4/6/2007 11:58:37 AM)

By now you will have noticed that even your lines have big empty spaces in them too....mostly discovered by tank brigades[:'(]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 23 (4/6/2007 5:55:38 PM)

Here's the number of Soviet units from my ( Soviet ) turn 23

[image]local://upfiles/16287/52004115FEB94854BE69DC62A85DA459.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 23 (4/6/2007 9:34:09 PM)

Here's some Soviet losses so far in my game with Buzz:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/1F8A964D474E47369B26D87720DC9C60.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Soviet turn 23 (4/6/2007 9:34:58 PM)

Here's the Soviet turn 23 minimap moves movie from turns 19 thru 23:

[image]local://upfiles/16287/B09108E041D24FE7800BDCDA529B09F0.gif[/image]



Zort -> Axis turn23 (4/6/2007 9:58:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

By now you will have noticed that even your lines have big empty spaces in them too....mostly discovered by tank brigades[:'(]

What tank brigades? Most just seem to disappear when the italians attacked them.[:D] You did force me to detrain an inf division there to plug the hole. I expect to see those brigades again soon. But the loss of Kharkov and Smolensk should slow down some production but I think you have a lot of tanks in the pools. Now rifle squads is a different matter.



Zort -> RE: Axis turn23 (4/6/2007 10:09:51 PM)

Well my losses have finally matched. Attacking Larry's strong line is really hurting me. I haven't fought this one correctly. Should have massed for a big attack to open one big hole vice many small ones. Larry has been able to cover those holes with units. I have only been killing 10-15 a turn, over 6k rifle squads but not making any headway. Did punch a hole south of Bryansk but expecting a bunch of guys to cover it this turn.

As for SMK, his counterattacks have continued to hurt so most of my forces are still in the red. His tank brigades did find a hole but I had units coming in and they killed all but one in the hole. It stopped my advance so I decided just to kill guys this turn. So the soviet units that I had stopped from retreating north of Smolensk mostly died and the ones defending Smolensk on the wrong side of the river died. SMK in the south went after my hungarians on my side of a super river and the hungarians got some combat training in killing them. Took Kharkov and killed most of or surrounded the defenders there.


[image]local://upfiles/13081/9CFDE07D01C54DE980C5F4ACA337B56A.gif[/image]



SMK-at-work -> RE: Axis turn23 (4/7/2007 6:58:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zort


quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

By now you will have noticed that even your lines have big empty spaces in them too....mostly discovered by tank brigades[:'(]

What tank brigades? Most just seem to disappear when the italians attacked them.[:D] You did force me to detrain an inf division there to plug the hole. I expect to see those brigades again soon. But the loss of Kharkov and Smolensk should slow down some production but I think you have a lot of tanks in the pools. Now rifle squads is a different matter.



Well they were straight off the trains from the factory, so all they had was 5 KV's, 5 T34's and 5 T60's each.
And yes - they're all due back on T30...except for the one you had surrounded and which has fought its way out, and hte one you didn't catch, and the half dozen coming behind them....;)

Smolensk was recaptured, so won't count lost this turn at least. Kharkov hurts of course, but hey - you can't fight a great patriotic war without losing a few cities here and there! :p



larryfulkerson -> RE: Axis turn23 (4/7/2007 8:13:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work
Smolensk was recaptured, so won't count lost this turn at least.


Unless I misunderstand the TOAW/FitE rules any cities that Buzz captures subtracts for the replacement rate even if you recapture them. So I'm afraid that maybe your replacement rate will still reflect the loss of Smolensk next turn even though you own it now.

Somebody correct me if this is wrong.




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