RE: West Wind, Clear

RE: West Wind, Clear (Full Version)

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jwilkerson -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 6:52:09 AM)
Eh? For implementing the idea that heavy flak is not as effective when being dragged down a jungle trail than when it is deployed in optimal batteries with director commo, etc? Hey, bring on the flak! [:D]

witpqs -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 9:08:00 AM)
Sorry, I guess my joke wasn't punny enough. [NUDGE, NUDGE!] [:D]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 1:24:29 PM)
Meanwhile in the port of Rangoon... [image]local://upfiles/1562/E621646F4DB84961AFBCA41D3651A466.jpg[/image]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 1:25:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nikademus quote: ORIGINAL: jwilkerson Yeah looks like 100s at least of heavy flak - a.k.a. the NE Indian Mobile Flak Army is comming to town! (sorry for the bad advice - I let thoughts of reality get in my head waaaay too often - and also I haven't played NikMod in a full PBEM campaign either - in the GuadMod - we didn't have huge stacks like this) Its possible to 'abuse' the change by uber-stacking. Players should decide if or what restrictions they want to do on stacking AA units , same as with air units. That or try bombing at a higher altitude. 11k is rather low against a well defended target. Do you have any suggestions for a reasonable houserule regarding flak?

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 3:56:37 PM)
still fighting... [image]local://upfiles/1562/3803B1A957204BC19452F4E86509974F.jpg[/image]

Nikademus -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 5:13:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund quote: ORIGINAL: Nikademus quote: ORIGINAL: jwilkerson Yeah looks like 100s at least of heavy flak - a.k.a. the NE Indian Mobile Flak Army is comming to town! (sorry for the bad advice - I let thoughts of reality get in my head waaaay too often - and also I haven't played NikMod in a full PBEM campaign either - in the GuadMod - we didn't have huge stacks like this) Its possible to 'abuse' the change by uber-stacking. Players should decide if or what restrictions they want to do on stacking AA units , same as with air units. That or try bombing at a higher altitude. 11k is rather low against a well defended target. Do you have any suggestions for a reasonable houserule regarding flak? It varies...depending on the situation (i.e. what playing styles and house rules are in effect) After all it doesn't make alot of sense to overly restrict AA stacking if there are no govenors on stacking airpower for max effort pinpoint strikes. (i.e. Ye Olde 200 plane fighter "sweep" or 200+ plane CAP or 200+ bomber raid at low alt) If other restrictions are in play i've seen players agree on a max limit of 3-5 AA units per base. Atoll situations might call for more restrictive rules though one workaround for carrier aircraft (DB vulnerability) is to use TB's as high alt level bombers. Allied especially can still be effective here against a strong base if they attack high enough.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 5:30:48 PM)
Well, we have the "base size x 50"-rule in place regarding how many planes can be stacked in a base hex. With that in mind, would you say that 3-5 flak units per hex is a reasonable houserule?

2ndACR -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 5:59:35 PM)
I try for 2-4 in most bases using Nik mod. I have found that 3 Japanese AA regiments can pretty much butcher (damage) any allied strike. I mainly place 1 for forward bases, 2-3 for major bases behind front lines but within allied air range and max 4 in the in range but must protect at all costs. Kendari, Java, Rangoon, Hong Kong etc. But then again, it does not take long at 6,000 feet to learn that it is suicide to do so very often. Sure would be nice to see CAP hit an outgoing raid ala BTR after they get shredded by flak. I would love that.

Nikademus -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 6:03:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund Well, we have the "base size x 50"-rule in place regarding how many planes can be stacked in a base hex. With that in mind, would you say that 3-5 flak units per hex is a reasonable houserule? its reasonable though the Home Islands may want to exclude after mass B-29 raids become possible. ultimately its up to the players. You might first try bombing from above 11k. Even against a larger stack your losses will decrease dramatically at the higher alts, esp if Allied. (like for example 20k) Another tactic that can be effective if the base has a port (and is bombardable) is the one-two punch. First bombard from the sea....that heavily disrupts any flak units usually which then greatly reduces flak for the a2a phase same turn.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 6:16:02 PM)
Yeah, Ive had that happen to me at Akyab. Cost me something like 100 Oscars torched on the ground.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 6:18:12 PM)
Hmm, I think I might try one of those against Chandpur actually. Ive got one supply convoy for Akyab forming around Singapore, and I thought I would escort it with the KB and 4-5 BBs. I could do a bombardment run on Chandpur while I unload at Akyab, and then send in 200 Helens from Mandalay. If I do it right and disrupt the flak, I could either send in the Helens at 6k on runway strikes, or perhaps even try a port attack...Ive seen lots of ships at Chandpur harbor....

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 7:01:04 PM)
Heh, today he tried to sweep the mines at Dutch harbor. A force of 5-6 MSWs started sweeping the mines...under the barrels of my CD unit. 5 MSWs sunk. I doubt he will be trying that again. He also bombed the base with SBDs and LBs...all in all he lost 6 planes to flak. Bad turn for him, good turn for me.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 7:44:14 PM)
Still fighting... [image]local://upfiles/1562/AF283C70D7164E26A99901EDD094AD5A.jpg[/image]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 9:12:38 PM)
SA-2 is leaving port at Singapore. This time it will be a smaller convoy. Just 10 ships carrying supplies and 4 minelayers...and an escort of 6 carriers, 4 BBs including the Yamato, 6 CAs and 30 Destroyers. Man, these SA-convoys are really feeling like the Pedestal convoys, or the PQ-runs. It brings excitement to an otherwise rather dull period of the war. In other news, the allied ground forces entered Akyab yesterday...we shall see if there comes an attack today. I suspect not, Im betting we will see a bombardment attack first. Should give a good indication as to what we can expect here.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 9:13:31 PM)
Oh, I almost forgot... [image]local://upfiles/1562/AA4B7129AE30463DB9D207F50AE686B4.jpg[/image]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/27/2008 9:51:09 PM)
Akyab...looks like I'll manage to hold it for now... [image]local://upfiles/1562/2B0423050B6D416BBC34D3D4D33CB977.jpg[/image] AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 09/21/42 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ground combat at Akyab Allied Bombardment attack Attacking force 77768 troops, 780 guns, 4 vehicles, Assault Value = 1712 Defending force 97597 troops, 979 guns, 327 vehicles, Assault Value = 1720 Japanese ground losses: 28 casualties reported Allied ground losses: 104 casualties reported Guns lost 10

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 1:38:10 PM)
Another bombardment attack today by the allied forces at Akyab. No losses for me. I think akyab is pretty safe for now with fort lvl 9, plenty of supplies and all those units. Im going to pull out the tank regiments from there when my supply convoy has unloaded their supplies. I want to build up a operational reserve for this area. Right now I am in the process of building up reserves on the strategic level, Im gathering that reserve at Manilla, I will let you know what those units are in a few days when they are in place. I am also moving all my Bettys from frontline bases and instead Im keeping them at Truk and Manilla. The idea is that I wont waste a Betty wing in a suicide run against the CV CAP as soon as I spot one of his TFs, instead I will mass my Bettys and attack in force the day after. I am also building up local reserves for the Burma theater and for the Coral Sea theater. Meanwhile the withdrawal from Noumea and the outer perimeter continues.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:09:39 PM)
October is just around the corner. And with that comes both the B-24D and the P-38G... That means Timor and New Guinea are vunerable to invasions from mid October...

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:12:43 PM)
Myself I have to wait until November for the Tojo... I wonder why the dates are so different for Nikmod and CHS. In CHS I get the Tojos in July. Also, in this game I have recieved a wing of 36 Tojos in August...they are still "organizing" off-map. I mean whats the point really?

jwilkerson -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:14:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund October is just around the corner. And with that comes both the B-24D and the P-38G... That means Timor and New Guinea are vunerable to invasions from mid October... The Battle for Timor, or where ever he first lands nearby, is an important one. Due to lack of nearby airbases, he will probably have to commit the carriers unless you leave him an easy hole. So you will have a chance to hit with "rock paper scissors (LBA, Carriers and Surface). I've had success against multiple opponents in this area. But you need to arrive on the scene with all of your players before he captures the hex. So you need to base the fleet somewhere in the area. I've calculated that Palau or Ulithi would be good spots, but I've actually never based the fleet there, not sure why.

Ron Saueracker -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:18:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund Meanwhile in the port of Rangoon... [image]local://upfiles/1562/E621646F4DB84961AFBCA41D3651A466.jpg[/image] Does the ship art improve with repairs?[;)]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:19:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jwilkerson quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund October is just around the corner. And with that comes both the B-24D and the P-38G... That means Timor and New Guinea are vunerable to invasions from mid October... The Battle for Timor, or where ever he first lands nearby, is an important one. Due to lack of nearby airbases, he will probably have to commit the carriers unless you leave him an easy hole. So you will have a chance to hit with "rock paper scissors (LBA, Carriers and Surface). I've had success against multiple opponents in this area. But you need to arrive on the scene with all of your players before he captures the hex. So you need to base the fleet somewhere in the area. I've calculated that Palau or Ulithi would be good spots, but I've actually never based the fleet there, not sure why. Hm, Im basing the Combined Fleet at Singapore. Then Im moving 3 BBs and 6 CAs to Truk for the defence of New Guinea. I figure the combination of LBA and these fleet units should be enough here. I have lvl 4 or higher airbases at Lae, Gilli Gilli, Thursday Island, Rabaul and Kavieng. Is it close enough to base at Singapore, or do I have to move them closer? Say Soerebaja?

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:20:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund Meanwhile in the port of Rangoon... [image]local://upfiles/1562/E621646F4DB84961AFBCA41D3651A466.jpg[/image] Does the ship art improve with repairs?[;)] Hehe, well, I have this mod now...not sure how I installed it really, but there it is. Anyway, do you have the file for me? [;)]

Ron Saueracker -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:24:34 PM)
[:)]Leaving for Greece next week. I'll send the files before I go. Send me your email.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:29:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker [:)]Leaving for Greece next week. I'll send the files before I go. Send me your email. your bloody PM inbox is full! stevehortlund@hotmail.com

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:57:48 PM)
Im expecting some action tomorrow Here is the situation around SA-2. The CVs will remain at their present location, all Zeros are on CAP, all VALs are ordered to hit the Chandpur airfields, Kates are on naval attack in case he tries something funny. So, transports escorted by BBs will enter Akyab. CAs will bombard Chandpur. Bombers from Mandalay and the CVs will hit the airfields of Chandpur. Bombers from Akyab will hit the port of Chandpur. The idea is that they will arrive after the 4 CAs do a bombardment run on the base to disrupt the AAA there. Lets see how this works out. Disaster might strike if my CAs fail to bombard the port before the aircraft takes off. [image]local://upfiles/1562/C2F93157F3CF4AC6A3F56E14274A2923.jpg[/image]

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 5:58:24 PM)
Oh, the ring is the defensive CAP over Akyab, and the bases the CAP comes from.

Hortlund -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 6:37:05 PM)
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 09/28/42 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TF 20 encounters mine field at Akyab (30,29) Japanese Ships DD Asagiri, Mine hits 1, on fire DD Tokitsukaze CL Kiso, Mine hits 1 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Naval bombardment of Chandpur, at 30,25 Allied aircraft no flights Allied aircraft losses Wellington III: 4 destroyed A-20B Boston: 2 destroyed SB-2c: 2 destroyed Japanese Ships CA Aoba CA Mogami CA Ashigara CA Nachi Allied ground losses: 1481 casualties reported Guns lost 20 Vehicles lost 5 Airbase hits 23 Airbase supply hits 7 Runway hits 127 Port fuel hits 1 Well, the first part of the plan worked pretty well... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Air attack on Chandpur , at 30,25 Japanese aircraft A6M3 Zero x 8 D3A Val x 22 Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 23 Ki-30 Ann x 53 Japanese aircraft losses D3A Val: 3 destroyed, 16 damaged Ki-30 Ann: 8 destroyed, 36 damaged Allied Ships MSW Maryborough, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage MSW Baroda, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage MSW Cuttack, Bomb hits 1, on fire, heavy damage Port hits 7 Aircraft Attacking: 27 x Ki-30 Ann bombing at 2000 feet 11 x Ki-30 Ann bombing at 2000 feet 7 x Ki-30 Ann bombing at 2000 feet 19 x D3A Val bombing at 2000 feet And here comes the port attack... we still take heavy losses from the flak. Divebombers are always more vunerable... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Air attack on Benares , at 28,18 Allied aircraft Martlet II x 29 Spitfire Vb x 16 P-40E Warhawk x 112 No Allied losses Japanese ground losses: 6 casualties reported Airbase hits 3 Runway hits 24 Here are his fighters... But then nothing...no massive raid from my carriers...no 200 bomber strike from Mandalay. Well, I guess the allies got lucky again. (&#%�

Nikademus -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/28/2008 8:12:16 PM)
Yes, the DB's are always going to take it on the chin to a degree due to the hard coded altitude they take flak at (2000 feet) I recommend never using them against a base with heavy AA defense. If using 1E's, only use the Torpedo bombers at max altitude. If the exp level is still high or elite, you'd be suprised at the respectible # of hits they can acheive. I used that tactic for the Marianas scenerio when using TF-58 vs a distant atoll target. TBM's are esp good at this being also armored and durable.

jwilkerson -> RE: West Wind, Clear (2/29/2008 4:43:11 AM)
Agree, my typical attack profile with KB against land targets is Kates at high, Vals on ASW and/or Naval and Zeros on CAP, escort or sweep as indicated by expected enemy air opposition. I rarely if ever send KB to attack a Land target that is out of reach of LBA. The combo of LBA and KB is effective - KB by itself risks too many plane/pilot losses for the typical payback.

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