RE: Vietnam War AAR (Full Version)

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Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 5:39:38 PM)

Currently the game is at round 28 - in the autumn of 1968. But we are discussing to abandon the game to start a new one with reversed sides. We will se what happens.

The file size of this baby is currently at 65 mb.




Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 7:07:30 PM)

Overview - Round 14

NOTE. Lunaticus. I will post round 14 tonight and if you wish to comment on it i will leave R15 to tomorrow. We are on R30 and i have proposed we continue to R40.

Comments on R14
- I am still having some trouble with the Royal Lao army in the north (AI controlled).
- My destroyers still acting as pirates. Unfortunatly the enemies also. I was loosing huge amounts of supply and powerpoints at this stage of the game.
- In southern Laos/Cambodia i was trying to explore south to my forces in the extreme south. But unfortunatly Cambodian units forced me to abort by threatening to cut supply line.
- Around this time i also got extra industrial strenght by the Chinese who established a second depot outside Hanoi.
- The enemy seems to have launched an operation to relieve Ban Me Thuot.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/9E2DB408946A4F1080624275DBCB9962.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 7:15:41 PM)

North Vietnam

A quick look at the situation in the homeland. In have switched production to build some aircaft and some freight smugglers to replace losses in the south.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/8F906AE1173A44FAA558931202851AC3.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 7:25:20 PM)

Khe Sanh province & the highlands province

[image]local://upfiles/27522/8481837E6D384597B2C5D493BEAD8442.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 7:32:24 PM)

Ban Me Thuot province - Round 14

[image]local://upfiles/27522/1ADC61F2ADED4169A84363863C109641.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 7:35:28 PM)

Cambodian border - Round 14

[image]local://upfiles/27522/FEBB08D7120E4524BD0F824F38033CD4.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 8:17:16 PM)

We decided to play on till round 40 and then reverse sides in another game. There was a lot of interesting details that were not in this game (Monsoon season weather, Pathet Lao, Intelligence operations). And it also neaded some tweaking (a hex error that cost me several thousands of ASW losses during the game, some units being understrenght etc).  



Tufkal2 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 10:16:03 PM)

To the surprise of the American commander we held on to Ban Me Thuot, although barely. I guess the soldiers got the message of giving 100% and not retreating. The 58th Division is down to 1 US rifle and the 42nd is down to 5 auxiliary Vietnamese infantry. The staff and infrastrucuture of the 2nd CTZ survived nicely, though.
However my relieve force as well as American tactical bombers and artillery will now come into play.
The very strong (well compared to North Vietnamese units) 1st Airborne Cavalry Division will also airlift to Ban Me Thuot to take away any hope of the North Vietnamese of overrunning the defenders.
Picture shows American forces at the beginning of turn next post will show end of American turn:


[image]local://upfiles/30920/59C1089366AB41D2949031C241F045FF.jpg[/image]



Tufkal2 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (2/28/2009 10:17:08 PM)

End of 14th US turn. In the East the 7th US fleet is moving into Cam Ranh Bay to resupply.

[image]local://upfiles/30920/5D5B9A86936B492B93ADBBAC298E290A.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 8:40:51 AM)

Overview - Round 15

At this point i was considering starting a bombing campaign in the major south vietnamese cities. I had plenty of PPs. But decided to hold of. (this might have been a mistake).

At this point in the game my destroyers were costing huge losses to the US supply into Vietnam. I knew that the 7th fleet was looking for me though.

Marked my smuggling route to the south in black.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/F476CD4173D9407BACB49E4D08F2694C.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 8:47:45 AM)

Hue province - Round 15

[image]local://upfiles/27522/05D5ADD0F30F4F67A9D3344E550DC8C1.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 8:58:06 AM)

Ban Me Thuot & Pleikku provinces - Round 15

In the west an engineering unit can be seen trying to expand the Ho Chi Minh Trail. This work was soon to be interrupted.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/40A9B6211B9E4D57BEA7541D148225B2.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 9:05:43 AM)

Cambodian border - Round 15

[image]local://upfiles/27522/B15D4F99E0D04E9EA050C586FACE7A78.jpg[/image]



Tufkal2 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 5:51:47 PM)

US turn 15:
The US strategy was to pacify are by area and leave enough troops in each pacified area to be able to defend itself without needing major reinforcements. This strategy seems to be paying of as the pacified region in the delta stops the communist attack mainly by bombing everything from the air that moves (actually I several times tried to bomb some Cambodian units because they look quite similar to the commies):

[image]local://upfiles/30920/3E0E2C6A780D42AEB747C7B933E45B42.jpg[/image]



Tufkal2 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/1/2009 6:01:56 PM)

US turn 15: In the center I take the opportunity to follow the retreating North Vietnamese into the jungle. The terrain is really unnice to my units and the commies can move much better around. However I do have the troops to win - using concentrated air power and concentrating ground forces - in one area at the time. The 9th Divison takes the lead North with the 1st Airborne Cavalry and the 3rd Marines securing the flanks.
The defenders of Ban Me Thuot will need several rounds of rebuilding to be useful for anything more than garrision duty.
At this point I drastically reduced shipment of infantry into Saigon but asked LBJ to send over more and more bombers ....

[image]local://upfiles/30920/9D4167B2C87647FD95499F25C108149A.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/5/2009 7:21:49 PM)

Overview - Round 16

Forgot to mark the borders on this one.
- In the north the Lao Royal army is pressing against my lines.
- In the Pleikku province the ARVN have crossed the river on the bride recently built by my engineers. Also the Cambodian army is pressing against the Khmer Rouge.
- On the Cambodian border strong US infantry forces strike at my scouting party towards Chau Phu. 1 FNL division and 1 Khmer Rouge division are crushed.

NOTE. Sorry im not giving to much details on production, losses etc. This part of the game was played a couple of weeks ago. Details are starting to fade a little already. Hope the AAR is entertaining anyhow.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/C291CA988FB84049B665885386FA4ECD.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/5/2009 7:29:58 PM)

North Vietnam, Laos border - Round 16

[image]local://upfiles/27522/A844C42AFEE44B3AB0D2FC7E0D95971D.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/5/2009 7:35:00 PM)

Khe Sanh province - Round 16

- Dont remember what happened my fighters in Tchepone. Either they died by an aerial attack or i moved them south/north.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/5608F4164A6D4796A5CD18DCE2380518.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/5/2009 7:43:12 PM)

Pleikku province & Northern cambodian border

Hmm... i mistakenly recorded changes as from 16b to 16a. So this means, more or less, that all arrows should be reversed. The 42 unit in the nortwest retreated to the tunnel system. The Pink units in the south moved against the enemy etc.

[image]local://upfiles/27522/04506A987608405E9C56873616B0CBAB.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/5/2009 7:47:29 PM)

Southern Cambodian border - Round 16

[image]local://upfiles/27522/2DEAB2881B064153ACC82D9794E71DA6.jpg[/image]



Joshuatree -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/6/2009 10:00:13 AM)

Quote: "Hope the AAR is entertaining anyhow."

Well it certainly is, but I'm even more suprised at the capabilities of Vic's game engine. It has no trouble at creating a Vietnam scenario, or a "War of the Ring" scenario, or..., quite an achievenment really.



Tufkal2 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/6/2009 11:09:10 AM)

US 16th turn:
We continue the push North towards Pleiku and Kontum. US has much stronger firepower and air support so we should be able to advance a bit here.
The DRNV has hordes of cheap units which can strike quickly and everywhere. The greatest danger for the US is therefore that while US advances on one front the DRNV advances on the other fronts and retakes some South Vietnamese territory. This happened a lot in the first 10 turns or so but with the buildup of US airpower this was much better controllable.

[image]local://upfiles/30920/2BC5467F3D5F458DBDBCF97A35574B72.jpg[/image]



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/6/2009 11:35:20 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joshuatree

Quote: "Hope the AAR is entertaining anyhow."

Well it certainly is, but I'm even more suprised at the capabilities of Vic's game engine. It has no trouble at creating a Vietnam scenario, or a "War of the Ring" scenario, or..., quite an achievenment really.



I have to agree. I have played this game for 1 year and three months now, pretty much every week. Havent tired yet. Am currently working a little bit on a "space marine scenario". As far as i can se there is more or less no limit to what the engine can do.

I have to admit though that i was hoping for a little bit more encouragment from people at the forum. As Seille & George said it actually takes a lot of work to put together a descent AAR. Now this is in no way as ambitious as their AAR. But it still takes 10-30 minutes to put together a round or so. Maybe people isnt interested in the Vietnam war :(




Jeffrey H. -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/6/2009 7:39:43 PM)

Awww c'mon Grymme. Don't feel bad. I've followed every post of this thread but I've stayed out of commenting because I don't feel as though I have much to add.

I am very impressed with the scenario so far, it really looks like one of your best efforts. I'm jsut watching to see how it develops and how the scenario changes with each round of testing.

Personally I find the subject of the Vietnam war a little too touchy to enjoy a scenario or game of it, but I'm sure plenty of people would.  



SSFSX17 -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/7/2009 2:53:09 AM)

I noticed that the Capitalist player has been putting a lot of emphasis into bombing North Vietnam. To this, I must ponder, "Hey, Hey, LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?"



Jeffrey H. -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/7/2009 4:19:40 AM)

A guy at our game club, the club founder, is a Vietnam vet. He's a Marine gunnery sergeant. After years of gaming meetings, I guess it was the weather that got him talking to me about Khe Sahn. It was a thick foggy night and cool. He said that we was on a patrol one night outside the wire and one of the patrol memebers had stopped to take a pee. While peeing the pee-er who was the medic, noticed an NVA soldier essentially a few feet in front of him. The medic panicked and emptied an entire magazine into the NVA soldier.

The problem was that they were outside the wire and essentially surrounded. And the enemy now knew their position. He said that the base artillery put up a barrage around them that amounted to a 3 sided box with the open side pointing back to the base. The artillery guys kept up the protective barrage all night long until next daylight and the group of Marines slipped out on the open side of the box after daylight.






Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/7/2009 4:08:35 PM)

Jeffrey. Srry if you thought i meant it personally against you. It was just a general complaint. Right now i am working on a monster map of afghanistan. 200*180 hexes. Maybe that would suit you better :)



Jeffrey H. -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/7/2009 6:21:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Grymme

Jeffrey. Srry if you thought i meant it personally against you. It was just a general complaint. Right now i am working on a monster map of afghanistan. 200*180 hexes. Maybe that would suit you better :)


No problem, I think the scenario you made is excellent and I'm really impressed. I haven't even made one yet, so you are like the kung-fu master of this stuff compared to me.

I just wanted to let you know that I beleive there are a fair amount of 'lurker' types out there who read and appreciate the efforts of people like you, but you just don't hear about it.



Silicor -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/8/2009 6:30:41 AM)

I love reading the aar's and this one is so different in feel to the others.  Very interesting.  I'd also be curious about the changes you are making to the scenario resulting from the playtest.



Grymme -> RE: Vietnam War AAR (3/8/2009 11:31:38 AM)

Overview - Round 17

- In the north i cut of Laos forces and starve them to death.

- My expedition towards Cambodia is turned around and they head home.

- During this round the US decides to start a second strategic offensive. 30 strategic bombers appear in Guam and are imediatly set in to bomb Pleikku and Kontum. This seems like an coordinated effort with their offensive into Pleikku province. Taking part in the US offensive seem to be the ANZAC SAS regiment, the main ANZAC mechanized brigade with attached artillery, the Thai Military assistance group, one ARVN infantry division and 2 unidentified US units (one is probably the 3rd Marine Division.

- In my round i imediatly start to apply international pressure to stop the bombing campaign. After 2 unsuccesfull atempts i stop the offensive in its track (this is what i had saved more than 50 PPs for. This cannot change the fact that my forces loose supply at a very crucial stage. Well played Lunaticus!

-Still having some 20 PPs left (and knowing there will be no more bombing offensive for some time) i decide to play a little offensive campaign myself. In Saigon, Hue and Nha Trang specially assigned FNL commando units attack and blow up supply facilities, factories and officies hurting the ARVN war efforts and causing severe infrastructural damage.

NOTE. Thanks Silicor. The scenario is more or less finished. Some aspects of the scenario was changed and added after this game. For example. Weakening of some US events, implementing the Pathet Lao Guerilla, Montagnard rebels, Thai Mercenaries, US special intelligence OPs, minor tweaking of some rules, beefing up some SFTs that was not really used in gameplay (Helicopters and PT-boats), changing some industrial capacities, removing the "road-over-sea"-places that caused a little bugging and lots of ASW losses, implementing some other victory conditions etc .

Sabotage in major cities
The DRVN player can play actioncards to try and sabotage the cities Saigon, Nha Drang and Hue. There is a 50 % chance for a 1 000 points of structural damage. Each card cost 4PP to play. Sabotage cards are reusable.


[image]local://upfiles/27522/4F07A7F7C7554BFB872E9A3D59FA7D82.jpg[/image]



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