RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (Full Version)

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Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (2/7/2011 3:57:28 AM)

OK, understood gunnergoz. The opponents list bug has been fixed in the latest beta patch so hopefully you'll be back defending the Federation soon.



Cmdrcain -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (5/18/2011 10:36:20 AM)

Compatable with Return of the Shakturi expansion


Does it mean ONLY use with expansion or "compatiable" but can be used in nregular DW?

Cause I tried it in regular and loading theme resulted in unhandled exception error line 43 races.txt distant world types galaxy load races...

If its only for ROS then should edit so says "Only with"

If its for both then theres a problem




Dunkelseele -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 10:19:59 AM)

Hi you all!

Last post here was some time ago. I am watching ST:VOY again lately, and had to download your mod. It's absolutely great! But I am missing the Borg, playing as them would be bad-ass. So I decided to put them into the game, its not so hard after all... I am not finished yet but wanted to show you some of the resources I created so far, maybe someone want to join or help me out with some details.

Here is a picture of flagshape, faction pic and troop pic:
[image]http://www.strongground.de/bunker/images/collection1.jpg[/image]

I also edited the races.txt and dialog file, I can post them if anybody is interested. Here is what took most of the time until now, the ship images:


[image]http://www.strongground.de/bunker/images/collection2.jpg[/image]
I think most of it is not canon, but there is nearly nothing in useable information about ship classes, apart from the fact that some of them exist. So I improvised and designed some borgish ships. The cube-, diamond- and coffin-shaped ones are ripped from various movie stills. The scale is in no way representive, and will of course be adjusted heavily. This is just the level of detail I designed the ships at the moment. Because Borg-tech is a fiddely thing to draw, (even though I use generic patterns) things like the large spaceport take time.

Please tell me what you think so far, and if this is worthy of being incorporated into your great mod! :)

Best regards



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 11:13:44 AM)

Wooow, what an awesome LSP....keep at the w in wip, nicely done [sm=00000436.gif]



Kalthaniell -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 11:41:45 AM)

The ships look really good. I especially like what you did with freighters -resourceful thinking.
Don't know how does Igard feel about the borg, but I'd put that set in my mod if I were him. I can help you with the race image or some ship detail if you like.

Here's what I managed to patch up:
[image]http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x423/Kalthaniell/borgpreview.jpg[/image]

I'm not sure if the first one is borg, because it has this motherly 'resistance-is-futile- now-go-do-your-homework look', but the second one sure looks hostile. All files are of course 300x300 png's :]. I can upload them for you if you think they'd match your borg set.



Dunkelseele -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 1:52:31 PM)

Hey Kalthaniel, thanks for your effort. You're right about the queen. Thats because she was to demonstrate the sinister, dark "be-evil-by-seduction" side of the borg. I did'nt like this very much, I'm more for the old fashioned TNG borg...
The second one with Seven is way better because she represents the typical drone... it would be perfect if you could add a male drone, nothing against Jeri Ryan's screenplay but most drones you get to see in the series were male for some reason.

If you want to touch up some ships, feel free... especially the space stations look way too 2d at the moment.

I will keep working on the ships (mostly large freighter and spheres), promised. Nothing like positive feedback to get one going. :)



Kalthaniell -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 2:46:53 PM)

It's not easy to find a good male borg drone protrait. 1 out of 3 is a photoshoped face of Bush, saying the resistance is futile ;). Ater some digging I managed to make this guy:

[image]http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x423/Kalthaniell/borg2prew.jpg[/image]

He sure looks sinister. I uploaded all three versions here:

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20476577/borg1a.zip

I also want to give you an editing tip concerning your borg ships. Try not to leave any pitch black spots on any of the images. The game will trun it into alpha upon loading, and your cubes might look a bit like swiss cheese. To avoid this, when I'm done with editing the ship, I always brighten the image just a little bit, so there's no pure black colour anywhere.

Goodluck with the ships, and keep up the great work. :]



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 3:22:55 PM)

That sure is one ugly borgmorph....you two guys are scary
Keep it up [:D]



Dunkelseele -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 8:19:15 PM)

Yes, that one is perfect. It looks great ingame. ;) Thanks alot for that!
I tried to put a quick release together, you can just copy it over your "Star Trek" folder in the customization folder. Maybe you want to backup the original folder, just to be sure.

See it as a third party addon for the mod, so I gave it a title. "Borg Incursion". :D
Modified 'about.png' inclusive. I fixed the brightness of the ships and some errors, it should run now smoothly - apart from not being complete (ships/stations missing, not balanced etc.).

Download and try here: http://www.strongground.de/bunker/images/StarTrek_BorgIncursion.rar




Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 8:29:49 PM)

cheers, thank you for your effort [sm=00000436.gif]



Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/24/2011 11:48:07 PM)

Thanks, Dunkelseele. These are great looking ships! I totally agree with all your choices for the ships, except for maybe the resupply ship. I was thinking maybe something a bit special for that.

I agree also about the Borg Queen. I never liked the idea of her. She was only there to make it easier for the writers IMO. It helped them convey to the mass audience what the Borg were all about, at the same time changing what the Borg were. It always seemed to me that she made the Borg seem softer. Not because she's a woman, of course, but because it made the Borg look like they were dependant on her. When Picard released all that green slushy all over her, all the other Borg just gave up and died! She was actually more of a liability than a boon.

These ships are definately good enough to make it into the mod. I wouldn't do much different, but maybe I'd redo the bases to comply with my 3D view that use.

There are a couple of big problems I have with putting the Borg in the game as it stands :-
  • I hate the way DW scales these ships. I can't play with a Borg cube that's smaller than a Ferengi Marauder.
  • I don't feel that the game can properly represent the Borg. They shouldn't be able to trade or colonise or engage in diplomacy. We need something different for them.
Fantastic stuff though, Dunkelseele. Thanks for sharing.



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/25/2011 8:19:50 AM)

quote:

I can't play with a Borg cube that's smaller than a Ferengi Marauder


roflmao, that would indeed totally kill what this game has best to offer - immersion



Kalthaniell -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/25/2011 1:13:09 PM)

quote:

I don't feel that the game can properly represent the Borg. They shouldn't be able to trade or colonise or engage in diplomacy. We need something different for them.


I think I know what you mean. I once tried to make a race of orcs similar to one from warhammer 40 000. I did not want them to sign trade treaties but to attack everyone and everything around. I set thier bias towards all other races to maximum, and decreasd thier loyality and friendliness while rising thier agressivness. I guess Dunkelseele could do the same with the borg but the constant problem with the race I created, was that they were getting anihilated all the time. No matter how much stronger I made them ,they'd always loose thier ships by sending them to attack anything or anyone withing sensor range. If someone could balance the race stattistics, maybe the Borg could be more like the ones from Star Trek movies. :]
Not sure how to solve the other problem though. If I could I would made the game display ship images in the resolution of GSB, and the planets images in the resolution from X3. I wonder if it would slow down the game... ;)



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/25/2011 1:20:01 PM)

quote:

I wonder if it would slow down the game


Depends on the life expectancy of each of us [;)]



Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/25/2011 3:09:30 PM)

Here's another link to the tech support thread where ship scaling was tested, discussed and explained by Elliot. I hope he's still working on a way to mod the scale. Perhaps someone should give it a little bump just to let TPTB know we want it.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2513492



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/25/2011 3:52:16 PM)

Ah, it's one of your threads. You're entitled to bump it, I think everyone will agree it needs more visibility.
If not, I'm with the finger on the trigger [:)]



cookie monster -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 2:51:39 AM)

It seems to me that if you want a cube of a certain size then the base design must be of a certain size.

As Elliot said a size 1000 design is twice as large as a 500 design.

I guess that he has the drawing code set to multiply the scale by design size.

So if you wanted a massive cube make a custom design of 1500 size then the scale factor will be multiplied by the design size to give a very large image.

You could then adjust the design size to get the cube scaled ingame.

Notice how the World Destroyer is full of cargo bays as a size packer to get the design size to a truly massive in game image size???

So you could pack your cube with space packers (cargo bays) to get the necessary size and scale while still having it's military strength at your chosen level.

Sounds good to me![:)]



cookie monster -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 3:13:00 AM)

If you look here you might be able to understand the drawing code.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff433989.aspx

In source rectangle he's not drawing the whole image (null) he's drawing the non transparent pixels.

Scale is directly influenced by design size. This factor scales all images according to design size.

Which means all designs which have lots of large components ie (World Destroyer) will lead to a larger image drawn.




Dunkelseele -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 7:21:42 AM)

Hey thanks, nice to hear you like my ships. Theyre not final, and will look a bit better when done. Good to get some positive feedback from the godfather of the TRSE-Mod itself. [:D]

To add my two cents to the re-ignited discussion about ship-scaling and Borg-presence in the mod:
@Igard: To set the data files just like Kalthaniell said would probably work well. I set them at -50 bias at the moment against all and from all races. Nobody likes them and they like nobody - just like the movies/series. ;)
Scaling problem is a bit thougher...
@cookie monster: You could make the ship bigger with size-placeholders (cargo bays) als mentioned, but then the Borg need the ability to build ships the size of 1500... and the default-designs must be full of placeholders by default, not only when the player creates then. I dont know how to change standard blueprints of the ships for AI players... and I dont know if editing technologies is possible, but if yes, this would be a workaround. Not a pretty one, but a working one at least.

But then again, if we plea to elliotg, maybe he adds that function to the game. ;)



cookie monster -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 8:46:41 AM)

Edit the ship in as necessary for the AI.

It doesn't sound too bad.

Update the design as necessary and spawn a new one.

No other way I can think cos of the ship size build tech requirement.



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 9:04:46 AM)

quote:

But then again, if we plea to elliotg, maybe he adds that function to the game. ;)


We also have a modders wishlist aside from the general one so you can put your request, afaik it's not already there.
Since Elliot is inclined to provide more modding support we should use the bridgehead and expand [:)]



Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/26/2011 11:48:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dunkelseele
Good to get some positive feedback from the godfather of the TRSE-Mod itself. [:D]


Oh, I'm just a lowly centurion with too much time on his hands.[:)]

What I'll do is just copy your link to the Borg patch to the OP as 'Dunkelseele's Borg Expansion'. Just makes it easier for people to find. I'm probably in the minority (or the only one) who doesn't fell like the game is ready for the Borg yet. I'm a purist, I'm afraid to say.

@cookie monster, Some good ideas yet again. I hope Erik or Elliot is reading.

@Data, It's all on the masterlist already. See section 3. and section 4.c. Very comprehensive that masterlist, you know.[;)]



tjhkkr -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/27/2011 10:59:13 PM)

The borg ships are nice, and they give me the creeps.



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/28/2011 7:47:01 AM)

Good, we need that in our games.....don't let them capture you [:)]



Dunkelseele -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/29/2011 1:35:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Igard
I'm probably in the minority (or the only one) who doesn't fell like the game is ready for the Borg yet. I'm a purist, I'm afraid to say.


You don't have to legitimate... I myself think it's just a very rough workaround, but still this feels better to me than not having the Borg at all.

I just noticed you are playing ST:O with TNG-movie uniforms too... good choice. [:D]

quote:

ORIGINAL: tjhkkr
...and they give me the creeps.


That's exactly what they should do. ;)



Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/29/2011 7:48:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dunkelseele

I just noticed you are playing ST:O with TNG-movie uniforms too... good choice. [:D]



Just switched to the new Jupiter uniform (yeah, I'm a sucker for the c-store[8|]). They're miles better than the stock STO unis.



tjhkkr -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/30/2011 8:08:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Igard
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dunkelseele
I just noticed you are playing ST:O with TNG-movie uniforms too... good choice. [:D]

Just switched to the new Jupiter uniform (yeah, I'm a sucker for the c-store[8|]). They're miles better than the stock STO unis.


More Star Trek lingo for us Force Sensitive Jedi to try to figure out... [;)]
I honestly do not know what a Jupiter uniform is or what a stock STO unis.



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (6/30/2011 8:36:02 PM)

I don't either but I sure hope the pack a phaser bigger than a lightsaber [:D]



Igard -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (7/1/2011 12:55:10 AM)

Just talking Star Trek : Online. The Jupiter uniforms are a new range of uniforms to replace the shoddy, boring uniforms they designed for the games release.

You guys should check it out. If you're a Trek fan, then you'll like the game. And they're gonna improve ground combat! An MMO with FPS style combat! I can't wait for it.



Data -> RE: [REL] TRSE Star Trek Mod v1.5 (7/1/2011 7:29:37 AM)

I remember that I've tried it for a while but I've got fewer and fewer moments these days. If you praise it it will certainly make it to my short list. [:)]



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