RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (Full Version)

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Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/8/2011 5:22:09 PM)

Good points, but I wonder whether Chungking can be taken here. CF has 45 LCUs there and must have built at least decent forts. My wild dream is that he actually comes hard against the southern pincer and the northern one takes Chungking on the fly, but I doubt he'll make this error. I suppose you could imagine a follow up Op to go for Chungking after Red Dragon, and even leaving the base uncaptured but neutered a la Rader is possible. I have a few qualms about Japan's ability to do that IRL.

I definitely concur that Kweiyang and Kweilin are KEY points on the map. I'm also closely following jrcar's AAR, where a similar offensive had taken Kweiyang.



PaxMondo -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/8/2011 9:28:48 PM)

From a game perspective, I suspect it can.

I'm basing this guess on the fact that Gary's alorithm's tend to go flat at both ends. So 45 div's might not be that beneficial. Remember, I'm talking about the game mechanics, not whether it would be possible. (Of course, how would they pack 48 divs into that city and it environs anyway?)

I think, you walk up with your big stack, hit it hard with ground attack aviation, you will be able to drop the forts down and take it. That many div's he won't be able to recover enough damaged squads everyday.


Just my opinion ...



Mike Solli -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/8/2011 11:20:10 PM)

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.



rjopel -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 12:52:40 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.


Depends on the Scenario. Some only have 200, some have 350. I think it should be 350, that's what scen 1 is. I know the 8 Dec start I'm playing is 200 and it sucks.



witpqs -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 2:35:41 AM)

I believe the official GC changed from 200 to 350 or 360 with the large official patch that updated scenarios.



rjopel -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 2:58:20 AM)

Not all the official scenarios got updated. Scen 6 8 Dec start did not get updated.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 3:00:30 AM)

June 22 & 23, 1942

Wuchow falls on the 23rd. Just an appetizer, but this allows the main force to move on the more important objectives.

Subs

Shark misses a DMS escorting a convoy near Cam Ranh Bay.

Our scout sub in the Bay of Bengal is not spotted by Allied air patrols. Operation Barracuda is greenlighted and Cribtop Intel estimates that surprise is likely.

4th Fleet

No change.

SE Fleet

CF's B-17s don't return to Horn Island. Our Nick group will rest a day or so and then head for NW Oz to jump the smaller B-17 group attacking Daly Waters.

14th Army

Our forces prepare to depart the central PI to clean up a few occupied bases in the DEI (Celebes remnants and Pamakasan).

16th Army

Sawoe-eilanden invaded on the 22nd and occupied on the 23rd.

25th Army

No change.

15th Army

Indes Fleet slips past enemy subs near Phuket without being spotted or attacked. So far, so good.

China

On the 22nd, a brigade crosses the river into Ningsia and SAs to clear out an enemy corps. We force a retreat with 104:1 odds, casualties 1136(50) vs 37(0).

On the 23rd, Wuchow falls to a DA. Odds are 7:1 against level 2 forts, 4 LCUs retreat toward Kukong, casualties 6603(331) vs 952(1). On to Kweilin!



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 3:03:08 AM)

A note on the Chungking discussion. The 45 LCUs present no doubt include HQs, base forces and several shattered "zombie corps" from the various surrenders. So we would guesstimate that only about 2/3rds are combat ready units. Still a tall order, but perhaps not impossible.



witpqs -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 3:06:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rjopel

Not all the official scenarios got updated. Scen 6 8 Dec start did not get updated.


I remember reading that some were missed.



ny59giants -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 3:10:42 AM)

In China, I would.....bomb bases, especially Chungking to destroy supply and any enemy LCU in clear terrain regardless of whether it is in a base or not. CFs supply situation will be the deciding factor here as he probably has the troops to hold you off.

The old OOB has China getting only 220 Rifle Squads per month. If you started with the newer OOB patch, then it is either 300 or 350 per month. The question again is supplies to feed all those mouths.

Logistics....Logistics [;)]



Mike Solli -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 4:30:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I believe the official GC changed from 200 to 350 or 360 with the large official patch that updated scenarios.


I checked. It's 350 a month. That's my goal - kill >350 squads a month.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 6:28:35 AM)

Well, we got 381 yesterday, so June is good. [:D]



crsutton -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 4:18:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.


It has been raised quite a bit in the betas so should be more in the official patch. but it is never enough. The problem is that you need supply to take replacement and there is never enough supply. I at times have had over 1,500 Chinese squads in my pools but the rate of units taking replacement is pitifully slow. The major Chinese source of troops is destroyed units that come back to Chungking at 1/3 OOB strength-which is usually stronger than they were.



PaxMondo -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 7:02:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.


It has been raised quite a bit in the betas so should be more in the official patch. but it is never enough. The problem is that you need supply to take replacement and there is never enough supply. I at times have had over 1,500 Chinese squads in my pools but the rate of units taking replacement is pitifully slow. The major Chinese source of troops is destroyed units that come back to Chungking at 1/3 OOB strength-which is usually stronger than they were.

Not sure if this is accurate. The beta's are exe only changes, no data changes. To change the squad rate requires a data change.



crsutton -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 9:41:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.


It has been raised quite a bit in the betas so should be more in the official patch. but it is never enough. The problem is that you need supply to take replacement and there is never enough supply. I at times have had over 1,500 Chinese squads in my pools but the rate of units taking replacement is pitifully slow. The major Chinese source of troops is destroyed units that come back to Chungking at 1/3 OOB strength-which is usually stronger than they were.

Not sure if this is accurate. The beta's are exe only changes, no data changes. To change the squad rate requires a data change.



Dunno but it showed up in my ongoing game well after the last official patch.

And here is one for you. I have two scen 2 games going as the Allies. One in 4/44 and the other 10/42. Same historical start same settings. In the 4/44 game the Chinese squads bumped to 350 per mo at least six months ago (real time) while in the other slower game they remained at 200. I was just about to go on the tech support forum to ask about it but noticed recently that the second game has bumbed to 350 per month as well. This had to happen in the last 10-20 turns. Perhaps the change is date sensitive in the game as well. Both games have been patched up at relatively the same pace.



Crackaces -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/9/2011 10:16:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

How many squads do the Chinese get a month? I think I heard 200. Not sure.


It has been raised quite a bit in the betas so should be more in the official patch. but it is never enough. The problem is that you need supply to take replacement and there is never enough supply. I at times have had over 1,500 Chinese squads in my pools but the rate of units taking replacement is pitifully slow. The major Chinese source of troops is destroyed units that come back to Chungking at 1/3 OOB strength-which is usually stronger than they were.

Not sure if this is accurate. The beta's are exe only changes, no data changes. To change the squad rate requires a data change.



Dunno but it showed up in my ongoing game well after the last official patch.

And here is one for you. I have two scen 2 games going as the Allies. One in 4/44 and the other 10/42. Same historical start same settings. In the 4/44 game the Chinese squads bumped to 350 per mo at least six months ago (real time) while in the other slower game they remained at 200. I was just about to go on the tech support forum to ask about it but noticed recently that the second game has bumbed to 350 per month as well. This had to happen in the last 10-20 turns. Perhaps the change is date sensitive in the game as well. Both games have been patched up at relatively the same pace.


I do see that a change in TO&E occurs 6/43 ..that last until 1945 ... in my game scenario this change stays at 200 squads ..



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/10/2011 3:20:17 AM)

June 24, 1942

Great info gents - I appreciate how active the thread is as Red Dragon continues.

Had my 5 year old daughter viewed today's replay, she would have deemed it "SOUPER, DOOOPER slow, Dad." Thus, we will report only on the 3 active Operations.

Operation Kraken

The CVE Raiders, AMC scouts and Oilers will RV tomorrow well east of Tokyo for re-fueling. Then we head toward California.

Operation Barracuda

Our subs in the Bay of Bengal are completely undetected. It appears that Cribtop Intel was correct in its guess that CF does not have much nav search in the region. Indes Fleet is even with Rangoon and will move to Point Luck tomorrow. Moon is 89%, so we should go in with a full moon or at most 1 day off.

Operation Red Dragon

Just marching today, but bombing of Kweilin reveals excellent news. The reinforcement LCUs that CF rushed over from Liuchow - are base forces! [X(] Oh my. We may have hit a soft spot in the enemy lines! Our armor is now 1 hex SW of Kweilin (map). We could march on either Kweilin or Liuchow, but will go for Kweilin first. So far this is looking very good.

In the central front, we are going to use a (hopefully) clever ploy to try to fully isolate the partially isolated enemy stack near Changsha. More on that as it develops.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/10/2011 5:06:11 AM)

Ok, the turn is away. Cribtop Intel's best guess on enemy dispositions is as follows:

Wuchow stack - defeated already; 1 HQ, 2 Corps, 1 Engineer.

Kweilin - 2 base forces confirmed; believe 1 Corps moved in today (both new LCUs came from Liuchow). Japanese armor will arrive in the hex on the 26th.

Liuchow - 2 LCUs, composition unknown. We will bomb and recon tomorrow to determine.

Nanning - 4 LCUs, composition unknown. Assumed to be similar to Wuchow.

For the home gamers, that means we are probably facing 2 defeated KMT combat units, plus 1 at Kweilin, 1 at Liuchow and 2 at Nanning. 6 Chinese infantry units ain't gonna stop us. Cribtop HQ is not getting cocky, but we are feeling good about Red Dragon.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/12/2011 5:26:26 AM)

A little behind on updates as I had to put up Christmas trees and decorations, go on a family Christmas deal last night and prepare for my hunting trip next weekend.

I'll catch up tomorrow. Also, tomorrow's update will see the Operation Barracuda attack go in, so fingers crossed.

Also, I'm just posting this now so that Michael a/k/a nygiants59 can go ahead and begin the taunting about tonight's disaster of a Cowboys game. I am asking Santa to cancel the rest of December for ever so that the Cowboys can avoid being the hot team that fades in the last month of the regular season AGAIN! [8|][:-][sm=vomit-smiley-020.gif]



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/14/2011 8:06:25 PM)

Sorry, readers, but RL has temporarily delayed updates. I'll try to catch up tonight.



SqzMyLemon -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/14/2011 9:54:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

In China, I would.....bomb bases, especially Chungking to destroy supply and any enemy LCU in clear terrain regardless of whether it is in a base or not. CFs supply situation will be the deciding factor here as he probably has the troops to hold you off.

The old OOB has China getting only 220 Rifle Squads per month. If you started with the newer OOB patch, then it is either 300 or 350 per month. The question again is supplies to feed all those mouths.

Logistics....Logistics [;)]


Chinese supply is the key, kill the supply and the rest will take care of itself. In hindsight, I'd be bombing every supply producing base still occupied by the Chinese. I'd contest every Chinese base you can that produces resources with a holding force to prevent resource production. Kill the supply by any means. A large Chinese force in rough terrain with adequate supply will cause you nothing but heavy losses dislodging it. All your actions should be focused on forcing the Chinese to use up as much supply as possible. Starve them and it won't matter if they get 200 squads or 1000/month. As ny59giants says, logistics will win you China.

Crush 'Em!



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/14/2011 10:21:43 PM)

Sqz, that is precisely the plan. Your comments are well taken.



ny59giants -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/14/2011 11:02:50 PM)

How 'bout those Cowboys?!? [sm=innocent0009.gif][sm=innocent0009.gif]



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:04:41 AM)

June 24 and 25, 1942

Was wondering when you'd stop by to gloat, nygiants. Can't blame you. Of course, the 'Boys still control our own destiny. All we have to do is win 2 of 3 including the Giants game in New York. Yeah, right. Worst thing is I think we're actually talented this year and we still lose in December.

Let's resume talking about my ultimately doomed war effort. So much more uplifting than Cowboys football. [:D]

Subs

A Pete from the Barracuda force spots an Allied sub near Bassein. Cribtop Intel is concerned surprise is lost, but we opt to continue the bombardment approach as our ships show no DL. Tough tradeoff between not flying ASW patrols and losing surprise or getting torpedoed by a sub you could've chased off.

4th Fleet

Analysis of our patrol arcs using the Z key shows a hole near Ocean Island. We will plug it with a newly "Jakeified" patrol unit.

SE Fleet

No change.

14th Army

No change.

16th Army

Komodo invaded. Resistance by large, poisonous lizards is significantly less than anticipated.

25th Army

The Z key analysis mentioned earlier shows another hole consisting of pretty much the entire west (map) coast of Sumatra. We desperately need more 4E patrol groups.

15th Army

We can't quite get to the necessary 7 hexes to hit Chittagong tomorrow night. DL for our ships is nil, so we'll close up to 6 hexes out just to get a little closer for the main event.

China

Chinese bombers make a rare appearance at Kweilin. As anticipated, the 3rd enemy LCU to march into Kweilin is a KMT corps, and they DA, destroying the paratroops who bravely held the railroad station for days. However, the new enemy unit is not sufficient to dislodge the tank regiments that will arrive in the hex tomorrow. This stalemate serves the operational purpose of preventing reinforcement by rail from the central front. Still no reaction to Red Dragon other than shifting of some local units from Nanning.

5th Fleet

Umnak Island makes level 4 airfield.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:08:37 AM)

June 26, 1942

Subs

Gato duds on a CS convoy near Toyohara. First sub attack in these waters of the war.

4th Fleet, SE Fleet, 14th Army

No change.

16th Army

Komodo occupied. Katherine makes level 2 airfield and our Nicks will try for the "washing machine Charlies" that regularly bomb Daly Waters tomorrow.

25th Army

No change.

15th Army

Final preparations are made for Operation Barracuda. Our ships are in position with no DL. It appears that CF has no nav search missions in the Bay of Bengal. 100% moon tomorrow night. Banzai!

China

Bombing of Liuchow confirms Cribtop Intel's suspicion that there is only 1 Corps and 1 HQ present there. An armored car unit dashes into Changsha to capture a hexside and frustrate any attempt by CF to withdraw his partially encircled army by the easiest route. Chaos here remains our friend.

5th Fleet

The Operation Kraken force has re-fueled at sea and will begin sailing due East. Hopefully our CVEs will again have good luck on a raid.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:31:12 AM)

June 27, 1942

Operation Barracuda does well on the naval side, but the air elements are grounded by bad weather. Damn.

Subs

Grampus duds on an xAK near Tokyo. Second attack in home waters in as many days.

Cribtop HQ recently launched several sub wolf packs. They will move to their targets and cover a large sea area hoping to flood the zone and really nail enemy convoys before moving on. Initial targets are the waters off Karachi, the passage between the west coast of India and the Bay of Bengal, and an area east of Fiji that Funafuti based search planes indicate is CF's sneaky convoy route into Suva. Let's see if the new strategy pays off.

4th Fleet

Moving a base force to Ocean to plug the gap.

SE Fleet

We'll soon get two more bases up and building on Bougainville, which will be a major second line bastion in the Solomons after Munda Point. MKB's ships are repairing nicely, all air groups at 100%.

Over the past several days we've had SigInt, often of the "heavy" variety, in Melbourne and Adelaide. Is CF preparing his first counter-offensive in the Pacific here? We'll keep watch and order a third wolfpack to focus on the eastern entrance of the straits between Oz and Tasmania.

14th Army

We tediously divide up a 60 point SNLF to meet various garrison requirements. This will allow a regiment to move on Pamakasan and Bali. Lots of resources flowing home from the PI now.

16th Army

DA Corunna Downs forces the surrender of the much traveled Broome base force. 12 Nicks jump 2 B-17s at Daly Waters and only 1 of the enemy makes it back to base.

We've now pulled much of the excess fuel out of Balikpapan and can switch to a maintenance mode here. Still a horde of oil, of course, but that's moving too.

25th Army

We are closing in on Padang, the last enemy held base in Sumatra. Still a few more hexes to go.

15th Army

The Operation Barracuda fleet hits Chittagong pretty hard on a clear night with a full moon, damaging 35 Hurricanes and destroying 8. Good damage to the airfield and other facilities too (for example, 40 runway hits, 13 supply hits, hundreds of fires, etc). Sadly, the clear night gives way to a stormy morning and neither the Zero sweeps nor the IJAAF bombing raid goes through. A real shame because we caught CF by surprise here. The Zeros would've hammered a depleted CAP and then the bombers turn damaged Hurris into dead Hurris. That was the theory anyway. Still, not a bad Op, and we'll follow up tomorrow by air if CF doesn't rail out his survivors.

China

Recon shows only 4 units at Tuyun and 1 at Kweiyang, while no enemy troops have left the Chungking reserve. Nice. So far the biggest opposition to Red Dragon are the poor south China roads. However, this is an effective delay for the enemy that we knew was inevitable. We have to win the race to Kweilin and Liuchow.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:38:20 AM)

June 28, 1942

Not much happened today, most of it bad.

16th Army

Tanahdjampea (really?) invaded.

15th Army

Rains again stop the Zero sweepers, but the IJAAF bombers decide to go in. Joy. Fortunately the enemy's CAP was cut from about 60 to 43 by the bombardment yesterday, and our Oscar Sentai does pretty good work protecting the bombers. Still, we suffer losses (14 aircraft, mostly Sallys with few Oscars thrown in). We did have a sub in the hex and that seems to cut our pilot losses, which is a silver lining. Ugh. Such are the perils of trying to co-ordinate in the monsoon season.

Plan for tomorrow is to sweep with Zeros and let the bombers rest.

The Operation Barracuda fleet elements have moved past Rangoon without incident and will retire to Singers.



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:39:11 AM)

Yay, my first double post in forum history. [:D]



Cribtop -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 7:41:00 AM)

Program Note

I'm off to the far West Texas desert for work for 2 days and 2 days of deer hunting. I'll be back Monday.



PaxMondo -> RE: Wait, I can't read Cuttlefish's new AAR? - Cribtop (J) vs CF (A) (12/15/2011 2:03:05 PM)

How many tags do you have? With the drought, I'll bet gonna be scarce ...



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