RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (Full Version)

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Walloc -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 2:59:40 PM)

I have a feeling TD would have liked a historical reinforcement schedule.. [:D]

Smiles,

Rasmus



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 3:25:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Walloc

I have a feeling TD would have liked a historical reinforcement schedule.. [:D]

Smiles,

Rasmus


Nah [sm=00000622.gif]

As you can see, attacks should really be possible. I have chosen a small portion of the front, early november. NE Stalingrad: Marquo had boldly sent the poor hungarians to meet the unkown. Didn't he know I have gathered in this area tank armies and cavalry corps? In the middle of that formation there was a German unit... as if that was going to save them! Needless to say the Germans were trashed as well [8D] 9 retreats, 1 held (in fact 3, the same hungarian unit held three attacks).

[image]local://upfiles/11562/9138E0B36BA1492187A9DC9D86F84C26.jpg[/image]



CarnageINC -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 3:37:06 PM)

Hey TD!  Its good to see you around the forum again [;)].  Looks like quite the battle your facing, good luck sir.



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 3:47:24 PM)

The good (or funny) thing is that he had panzer units in the vicinity... but I suspect they turned southwards... which leaves his trashed units in the north rather defenseless...

I will let him advance if he wants to... retreating my forces to the two flanks, ral lines that is. Empty space, no rail line. He is not going anywhere unless he takes the rail line in the east (Astrakhan) or the one in the west, both defended...

Hey Carnage, yes, it has been a tough struggle. Still, given that this is virgin territory (I never got to these dates), let's see where we are are in spring [:)]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/CB30B3CCE1E940E4BE904B100D75ABD6.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 3:55:48 PM)

In the south I should be planning this:

[image]local://upfiles/11562/9C4EDD94E0D34B22864E7B6261EC3F00.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 4:08:47 PM)

In fact his whole position lies on two rail lines... not that far. Should I be able to advance 4 or 5 hexes, I might succeed [sm=00000622.gif]

Or, the threat alone might invite him to sort of retreat. Or reinforce that part of the front, of course.

[image]local://upfiles/11562/80BF8C4755DB47AB9C7600150C8232D0.jpg[/image]



Schmart -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 6:09:58 PM)

You need to find the weak spots in his front, but I like the idea of massing your armour in the sentre (Saratov). Use them to drive a giant wedge west into his lines. This will unhinge his positions north and south of the wedge. Secondary offensives just east of Rostov (driving north) and east of Moscow (driving south) should make his positions completely untenable. He will either retreat, or you will destroy those fronts piece-meal.



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 9:20:32 PM)

Schmart, yes, I indeed have to attack these weak spots. Anyway, attacking from Moscow should be harder, as that is where he is more strong. Now on the last 3, 4 turns he has started pulling back his forces but he was massing both infantry and armored forces.

Moscow area. As you can see he is adjacent to West and North Moscow hexes. But of course I have one Guards Rifle Corps in each hex.

In theory I should be pulling back part of these Rifle Corps and use them to trash his forces in the aforementioned weak spot (no matter the command penalties, as I cannot afford to reassign them to other HQs [;)]). We will see.

During the summer the area was a miasma of sh*t. A command chaos. Now it's 100% fixed at the frontline at least. No command penalties, no overloaded armies.

[image]local://upfiles/11562/76299F68217840DD942E24620DF5C4B5.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 9:27:15 PM)

This is how the front looks like. The north. You can see the tank brigades gathered around Yaroslav. No APs = no more tank corps [:(]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/6AEEA27BD2E84F93B4D27D9A46353B8E.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 9:29:52 PM)

The center

[image]local://upfiles/11562/41A0A41A7D6B42DE88E4A1B34AB31DAA.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 9:36:04 PM)

And the last one (you already saw the south). In theory I should bring quite many forces to this place. Mostly weak German regiments here... no match for massed attacks.

But of course, as 76mm put it, Marquo has to know he is weak here. Therefore he might reinforce this part. Oh well, then he will weaken another place...

[image]local://upfiles/11562/4E3974B467244A6F8581CBC136E6DA75.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 9:38:36 PM)

And the new units I am creating. Many of them already sent to the front (experience minimum on the 40s now).

[image]local://upfiles/11562/ED5094B6AC5B4068A4335A842DADF03A.jpg[/image]



glvaca -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 10:41:51 PM)

Actually, you should keep them in reserve until they are about 50 morale as then experience will keep on rising even at the front.
Don't want to be nitpicking, but its very important... [;)]



glvaca -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 10:56:45 PM)

I like your planned operations. I'm not sure and perhaps this is already your plan, but maybe you should stagger them, the first with the aim to draw his reserves were they are the least useful. When that goal has been achieved, you launch the others.
In the plan you outlined, I would first strike his most Eastern front (East of Panza), he's probably not in really good supply there, so he won't be able to easily rail in reinforcements.
Most likely, if you cause enough trouble, he will send in panzers hopefully from the Stalingrad area which will (hopefull) make the operation there feasable.
Once the panzers arrive East, start the Stalingrad operation. Untill then, I'd be silent as a mouse [:)]
Speed is crutial, blow a hole and exploit, you need to get those rail links. Make sure you have infantry to hold the flanks, preferrably Inf. Corps.

Anyway, the order is flexible and should be where you expect the most results.
Good luck tovarischi!



glvaca -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/7/2012 11:02:25 PM)

OH, and without having the complete picture obviously, I'd strip the Moscow front and to the West to the minimum that you consider safe. Once you gain the initiative, it's crutial to make a fist, strip failure and reinforce success.
Much better to have a good solid (2 units per hex) 30+ CV then 5-6 single divs. Whatever you can spare put them in reserve 5-10 hexes from the front. in strong hedgehoc defensive points on rail lines. Once you firmly have the initiative, rail them to were they are needed for offensive action.



76mm -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/8/2012 12:16:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus
Anyway, attacking from Moscow should be harder, as that is where he is more strong.


Harder, but very possible...buff up those corps with sapper and assault gun SUs, add some ArtDivs, and you'll be able to push him around at will up there. You need to be able to do this to instill a little fear in him, and meanwhile build up weaker, but still fairly strong, assault armies that can attack at weak points along the front.

At this point, your strongest efforts should crush his defenders, and you need to start the war of attrition, and Moscow is as good a place as any to do it.



Aurelian -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/8/2012 1:27:14 AM)

As 76mm says. Grind him down, and the dam will burst in time..

It isn't pretty. But it will work.



76mm -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/8/2012 8:10:50 AM)

I would consider attaching several ArtDivs to a spare Army HQ or an airborne corps up by Moscow, and using this massed artillery (3-6 ArtDivs) on as-needed basis for attacks up there. With two sapper regiments per rifle corps and 3-6 ArtDivs, almost nothing will be able to hold against you.

Frankly, his defensive CVs near Moscow look positively puny, I was regularly facing CVs of 60, 80, even more than 100.

I would definitely start attacking with a view to (i) ramping up the war of attrition and (ii) forcing him to pull back (and thus abandon fortifications). If you let him sit still too long and dig in, you will find it VERY difficult to dislodge him later on, this is what happened to me.

EDIT: Another thing, personally, I would try to avoid any overly-ambitious offensive plans at this point, as they probably won't work, as I don't think your forces are strong enough to maintain a sustained offensive if he can focus his reserves. And why not leave those Axis allies hanging out there past Stalingrad, attacking there might only encourage him to shorten his lines, which I'm not sure is what you want at this point.



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/8/2012 8:14:39 PM)

Hmm, I have a big problem with this war of attrition and attacking in Moscow area. First of all that is where he is stronger. On the other hand there are plenty of places where massed attacks must be irresistible (first blizzard or not, it's irrelevant). Just look at the trashed Hungarians this turn, and it's not even winter [;)]

Then of course the terrain lost. Will I accept this state of affairs: that is German troops 30 hexes east of Kursk (historical line by 1943)? If I do that I'd better give up right now and admit defeat because I will hardly (or should I say "never") get to the Reich.

There will be plenty of time to grind the Hitlerite hordes (1943-44). But to me accepting this very disadvantageous frontline in 1943 is NOT, and will never be an option. It's defeatism LOL I should have you all shot by a firing squad. I'll kill to push the killers [8D] So be it.



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/8/2012 8:47:43 PM)

But the aforesaid does not mean I will not attack at all near Moscow. As a matter of fact I attack every single time I can (the thuggish thing, I can't help it. And it's perfect for a good laugh). Especially true after the tough summer (Marquo truly deserves the stick now!). I had attacked east of Moscow, now I gathered again the deadly combo of Guards Rifle and Tank Corps and... bingo. An odd German division in the west end held though [8D]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/2E17B4D79EE1498B9B2DB6CA44B6AE18.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/13/2012 10:14:05 PM)

Turn 76
26 November 1942

Well, the Big Offensive is here. So to speak! I guess some monocles might be dropping in the German High Command but -to be honest- that should be all... for now... Still, these attacks more or less prove that an offensive is indeed possible. So I will persevere.

As I had said, planned, I brought rifle divisions to the chosen area. This turn, another Tank Army arrived from Moscow (they discretely left the area, now only one tank army there). Which means now I have 3 tank armies in Marquo's weakest place...



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/13/2012 10:19:30 PM)

And here's the First Guards Tank Corps harvested. They have been inmediately put to some use but the attack (west of Moscow) failed. Oh well [:D]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/0969AE3230F146C888EC26C3A31B5B3F.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/13/2012 10:25:10 PM)

But other attacks were successful in this Moscow area. so as you can see, I keep attacking, no matter what. Tank and Rifle Corps were gathered again and four German divisions were trashed [8D]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/510A94634C5F4934803DD62F995CFCB5.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Dabai Tovarischi! (5/13/2012 10:28:39 PM)

East of Moscow, same thing, Rifle Corps and divisions unleashed and a single division was smashed.

[image]local://upfiles/11562/5193DBB69DE84C919F25AB35180FB21D.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/13/2012 10:35:51 PM)

In Marquo's "weakest" place I also was really weak. A mere thin line and sometimes with some gaps here and there. Now you can see I am starting to mass the forces here. German regiments should be terrorised [8D] Yes or yes!

[image]local://upfiles/11562/2C711EE0F9D44A748A2047E60D9BA8A2.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/13/2012 10:39:34 PM)

More terrorism [8D]

[image]local://upfiles/11562/27DE1AF907D140A8A1283F6791C6E6EE.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/13/2012 10:44:16 PM)

And the southern part of this "weak" area.

[image]local://upfiles/11562/4BA366DA1594437D902C127F2D6CBA49.jpg[/image]



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/13/2012 11:05:49 PM)

And needless to say I haven't forgotten the Hungarians! Some of them were forced to cross the Volga again, others routed. And hehehe, Marquo is bringing some armored hordes. The thing is they are welcome! I don't think they will strike, but if they do that... Tank and Guards Cavalry Corps are waiting.

[image]local://upfiles/11562/B2602CBD096448B8890BFFD6A9D2D018.jpg[/image]



randallw -> RE: Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/16/2012 8:53:33 AM)

Be warned that this period is about when rifle divisions convert to another TOE, with some rifle squads replaced with upgraded squads with a lower experience level. Counter CVs will drop.



TulliusDetritus -> RE: Death to Marquo's Hitlerite Hordes! (5/16/2012 6:51:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: randallw
Be warned that this period is about when rifle divisions convert to another TOE, with some rifle squads replaced with upgraded squads with a lower experience level. Counter CVs will drop.


CV drop or not, the pixeltroopov will carry on with the plan (aka advance towards the general direction of Kursk) or they will drop dead. No surrender! [8D]

Anyway, good to know, thanks [:)]



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