RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR)

RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (Full Version)

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CarnageINC -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 5:14:45 AM)
HAHA, love the MLP stuff, though its hard to find on the net.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 12:11:48 PM)
Alas, I cannot strip away alot of troops from anywhere without causing THAT front to crumble. So instead we rail the other way, and will try to reform a new line further east. The decision to try to open the pocket to free those 21 units is now really biting me in the rear, and I will lose alot more troops. Well, it is the same mistake I tend to make in Witp, I want to act too soon, and am overly confident in the ability of my units... Terje

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 12:20:21 PM)
Turn 59 Overall The pocketed units are captured by the Axis, and we order our troops in the south to board trains and head east. We need to form a new line as soon as possible. We are too late however, and new pockets are formed. And as is to be expected, the game gives me two new guard divisions this turn, the fact that they are pocketed and will die next turn is a given... At Kerch it seems the Axis will not push any further as they have build a fortified area there which means they can only attack wiith two units. That is good, one less worry. Rearranging my line properly is going to cost alot of CP, which I by now am desperatley short of, so I guess it is fair to say that my aggressive behaviour is really coming back to haunt me. In the north, the Finnish are able to push one hex further east, that is all. Due to our rearranging of the line, we only make 4 attacks this turn, scoring 2 held and 2 retreats. To counter this, the Axis launch 33 attacks with the result of 4 held, 19 retreat (3 of which are partisans), 4 routs and 6 surrenders. Losses are calculated at 7.000 to 119.000 (no points for guessing which is which...) Units We order the formation of 3 rifle divisions, 1 rifle brigade and 1 rifle corps this turn. Our losses are far bigger, so we are losing more units than we are able to build. The available ammount of troops, however, increase by 111.000 this turn. Worries Can I reform the line in time?! [image]local://upfiles/11504/011B0B05874045318ED7D95738ACC545.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 10:58:46 PM)
Turn 60 Overall As was to be expected, a disasterous turn. Our losses were huge in terms of surrendered troops, and I am trying to reorganize as best I can. We only manage 4 attacks scoring 2 held and 2 retreats this turn. I am not sure I should even attack as my losses are usually higher than those of the retreating Axis forces. The Axis on their hand launch a total of 26 attacks (not a too high a number really), and have great success. 2 held, 7 retreats (3 of which are partisans) and 17 surrenders this turn is alot. Casualties are not too high as I guess those that surrender are not counted (??). 4.000 Axis troops to our 73.000 seems awfully low. Units Although we recieve a new airfield and create 6 new rifle divisions this turn, we are still in the red in terms of available units. Our losses due to pocketed units ammount to no less than; -2 rifle corps -3 cavalry corps -27 rifle divisions -3 Guard rifle divisions -1 mountain division -9 rifle brigades -3 naval rifle brigades -1 AT artillery brigade -1 AA brigade -2 AA regiments So a very substantial loss this turn. The remaining units see a strength increase of 164.000 troops this turn. Worries Can I at all make any sort of line anymore? [image]local://upfiles/11504/A51E2A9061854CF89AD6A224E5F7431C.jpg[/image]

M60A3TTS -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 11:11:28 PM)
Sounds like you lost about 41 rifle division equivalents plus 9 cav. 400k perhaps, that's a front. Not a disaster but you can't take another couple hits like that anytime soon. Units to the south will probably be ok, but beware him trying to roll up your units southwest of Voronezh. Has Stalingrad been emptied of industry?

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/13/2011 11:29:31 PM)
Nope, there are still factories in Stalingrad, will rail them out next turn. Needed the rail capacity this turn to reduce the ammount of troops on the west side of the river... Terje

Q-Ball -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 12:07:07 AM)
That's a bad couple weeks for the Red Army, but you can weather this. You were in pretty good shape before this happened, so you can easily recover. I wouldn't spend APs building new units at this point, unless almost every unit you have on the map is topped-off with men and guns.

M60A3TTS -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 12:40:29 AM)
It's rather hard to tell, but it looks like you still have a fair amount of stuff in the far north along the Leningrad and Northwest Fronts.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 1:42:39 PM)
Unfortunately the units in the north consist largely of mere divisions and brigades with low CV. They work as long as I can deploy them in depth, but if I am to remove some of them, the Axis will easily penetrate the front line and encircle even more troops. I do not see how else to solve the Q-Ball, I need more units to close the gaps in the "line", since all Uncle Joe gives me at the moment is airfields, I think I need to build more units?! Terje

M60A3TTS -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 2:23:57 PM)
I think you need to keep in mind the old adage "He who defends everywhere defends nowhere." The Axis is unlikely to break through in the north or surround much because that generally requires mobile units that are not currently deployed there. I have yet to see an AAR where the 1942 Axis Offensive has panzers attacking along the Leningrad Front, and for good reason. There is nothing of strategic importance to the Axis in the area, it only weakens the Finns by attacking. Don't be afraid to take it down to two lines there, and you can even put a unit in every other hex along the second line. Supporting airpower for that area should be like 3 airbases; just enough to provide air defense and maybe supply partisans.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 2:56:49 PM)
Turn 61 Overall A rather slow turn, the Axis is now hampered by their rapid advance, and they too need to reform. As a result the Axis only launch 9 attacks this turn, scoring 1 rout, 2 surrender and 6 retreats (of which two were partisan attacks). We are still trying to reform the line, and it seems we are likely to succeed, but it will be thin. Just because we can, we launch 2 attacks, and score 2 retreats. However the Axis losses are lower than ours in these attacks, so I am not sure about their value. Losses are reported at 26.000 Axis troops to our 96.000. Units This turn I decided to spend my precious CP on forming 2 rifle corps and 1 Guards rifle corps. It seems to me that the formation of rifle corps is crucial to form units that have some chance to inflict damage to the Axis and to hold against an Axis attack. So the only new unit on the map, is yet another airfield, which I really do not need at the moment. Our losses this turn were 1 cavalry corps, 1 cavalry division, 2 rifle divisions, 2 rifle brigades and 1 AA regiment. These were units that were encircled last turn, so no shock there. Our remaining units grew by 101.000 troops this turn. Industry Just to be on the safe side, evacuation of factories from Stalingrad is started. We empty Southern Stalingrad by moving the 3 armaments factories there, and from the main centre of Stalingrad, we move out 36 T-60 M1941 factories as well as 9 vehicle factories. We will need atleast one more (probably two more) turns to empty the city. Worries I am now not sure wether to spend my CP on building new units (badly needed), form existing units into corps (they atleast do not surrender on the line, and usually do not rout), or reassign HQs (also badly needed at this time, but can be avoided by slowly reshuffling my forces). [image]local://upfiles/11504/586ECE4281A44D8EBDC527936C8015B5.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 3:01:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS I think you need to keep in mind the old adage "He who defends everywhere defends nowhere." The Axis is unlikely to break through in the north or surround much because that generally requires mobile units that are not currently deployed there. I have yet to see an AAR where the 1942 Axis Offensive has panzers attacking along the Leningrad Front, and for good reason. There is nothing of strategic importance to the Axis in the area, it only weakens the Finns by attacking. Don't be afraid to take it down to two lines there, and you can even put a unit in every other hex along the second line. Supporting airpower for that area should be like 3 airbases; just enough to provide air defense and maybe supply partisans. True, what you say do make sense, yet the Axis has allready attacked up north, trying to pierce my line. The only reason it failed was that I had a three layer thick defence. There are a few panzer divisions in the north, so if I am to weaken that front, that means I will have to fall back on a line from Moscow and northwards. This could be done if I were certain of my units survivability in the open, but seing as they are mostly divisons and brigades, I am not. They are in level 2-3 forts now, and still they can be pushed back (but then they only retreat, they do not rout). But I will take a look at the defences there and see what I can redeploy, but I doubt it is much... Terje

M60A3TTS -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 3:21:24 PM)
When you say panzers in the north, are you referring to the few west-northwest of Moscow on Turn 56? That looked like a local attempt to get in between Northwest and Western Fronts. You haven't posted a recent screenie, so it's not clear how things look now. It appeared at that time you had more than enough units on Northwestern Front to shift around and thicken the carpet where it was thin. I would generally recommend the Soviet player look to evacuate much of Stalingrad's industry in the relatively quiet late winter and early spring months. It avoids you being forced to commit railcap to troops and industry at the same time when this sort of thing occurs. Look at Larry's game vs fanfarer, he had the same issue.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/14/2011 5:14:03 PM)
He have some panzer divisions attached to AGN that is operating alongside the Finnish troops. Also remember at the time of the breakthrough, pretty much every front was at the same depth, and that I have been moving units south. It just seems to me that a USSR rifle brigade or division is not capable of holding anything unless dug in, and that is what I fear if I weaken the north too much. Start to fall back from my fortified areas and I will likely be killed in the open allowing the Axis to destroy units there as well, hence increasing the lack of available forces I have to fight back with. That being said, I see your point, but I also fear my low ability troops in the north will be slaughtered... It's a damned if I do and damned if I don't situation as I see it. [:)] Terje

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/15/2011 8:47:32 AM)
Turn 62 Overall I need winter! Once more my divisions show their weakness as 6 of them rout, allowing the Axis to seal off yet another pocket. That is going to cost me 60% of my armoured forces next turn. Our two attempts to break the pocket is repelled as we score "held" on both attacks. There are no more reinforcements anywhere, and to cover a huge gap I have only some 30 units, all divisions and brigades, so my hope to form any line is not great. The Axis launch a total of 30 attacks this turn, scoring 24 retreats (3 of which are partisan attacks), 3 surrender and 3 rout. Among those retreats are 4 in the Finnish sector... Losses are reported at 24.000 to 122.000 this turn. Units I order the formation of 1 Guards rifle corps and the creation of 4 new infantry divisions. The units that were too far to the west are killed off, and we lose 2 rifle divisions and 1 rifle brigade. Our net gain in troops are 77.000 this turn, a low number. Worry Can I hold anywhere untill winter? [image]local://upfiles/11504/65315A9B1FEC41AFA2AD25E99C3F7F94.jpg[/image]

Kronolog -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/15/2011 9:08:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: terje439 4.000 Axis troops to our 73.000 seems awfully low. Remember that your losses include those suffered from combat and attrition, while the numbers for the axis only includes combat related losses. If you want a fairer ratio you should add about 20 000 additional Axis losses, which I believe is their standard weekly attrition.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/16/2011 9:46:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kronolog quote: ORIGINAL: terje439 4.000 Axis troops to our 73.000 seems awfully low. Remember that your losses include those suffered from combat and attrition, while the numbers for the axis only includes combat related losses. If you want a fairer ratio you should add about 20 000 additional Axis losses, which I believe is their standard weekly attrition. But still, my aerial attacks alone should do about that much damage. Add the various attacks and the number seems off to me. Terje

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/16/2011 9:53:45 AM)
Turn 63 Overall I could not find any attacks worth making this turn, so instead the time was spent on rearranging the frontlines as much as possible this turn. The situation is still shaky, but we are slowly getting there it seems. My available reserves now, are down to the divisions created last turn... The Axis decided to launch no less than 53 attacks this turn. The score was 4 held, 23 retreats (of which 6 were against partisan units), 3 rout and 13 surrender (all from the pocket that was formed). Most of the retreats actually helped me as they sent units towards the rear which will help me readjust my line. Losses were heavy on our side with no less than 202.000 casualties. The Axis losses were reported at 29.000 men this turn. Units I decided that I needed to rearrange the fronts, so no new units were created this turn. Although I recieved the usual airfield. The losses this turn are significant though; -7 tank corps -1 guards rifle division -4 rifle divisions -3 tank brigades -2 rifle brigades -4 airborne brigades The only good thing I guess is that even with such horrendous losses we are able to increase the total strength in our units. Not by alot, but 3.000 more troops at the end of the turn is better than a negative number. Worries Will the Axis cut through my divisions and create another pocket or will my no-good divisions hold this time? [image]local://upfiles/11504/15BE95C337A548DFA183CD1EEF679DF3.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/17/2011 12:49:47 AM)
Turn 64 Overall Why do I keep trying to place divisions on the line?! Once more my divisions rout and allow the Axis to form a small pocket. And of course the one "held" result the Axis scored gained me 2 guard divsions. And yes, they are INSIDE the pocket... In the south the Axis rout the defenders of Rostov, which was expected, but gave our troops across the river one more turn to dig in. Hopefully the Axis will halt their advance in the south as I think Stalingrad will be too far before mud and winter sets in. In the air we took a real beating this turn with a total of 1005 aircrafts lost, of which 800 were fighter-bombers and tactical bombers. The Axis lost a mere 150 airframe, so we are around 7:1 in losses. Not good. 3:1 is what I hope for, 7:1 is too much in favour of the Axis. After all battles are resolved, losses are given at 30.000 Axis troops to our 105.000. Units Beside the usual airfield we also recieved a NKPS unit this turn. Now all I need to do is to push the Axis west again... I order the formation of an armoured corps, 2 rifle divisions, 1 rifle brigade and 3 armoured brigades this turn. At the same time I lose 2 rifle divisions and 1 AA regiment. In terms of number of troops, our armed forces grew by 84.000 this turn. Worries Will I be able to shorten the line without loss of units? [image]local://upfiles/11504/41DC23AD73274ADF8938E80C8B73A0C1.jpg[/image]

M60A3TTS -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/17/2011 2:48:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: terje439 Overall Why do I keep trying to place divisions on the line?! You tell us. Stacking them like that is one of the quickest ways to let the game get away.

Baelfiin -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/17/2011 4:13:14 AM)
If you are looking for advice or comments I would recommend that whatever is in that red circled area get the heck out by whatever means necessary. Dont stop for stragglers. Use rail movement if you can and save whatever can get out. That single line is just a bunch of Hiwis waiting to happen. The latest version the germans are much much tougher than they used to be in '42. Can't tell what kind of relative CV's you have but you might be able to take some shots on the Italians and Rumanians. You dont have to try to advance just hit them and get a win, it will start wearing them down and get you some experience and progress towards guards. Plus it feels good to blast the axis whenever possible. Looking at those concentrated panzers is a nightmare, if they can get two sides against you they can pretty much move any pile that you can put together. I am not sure they can be stopped cold at all, just slowed down. Maybe later on in december/january when you can have a decent amount of corps in the line.... I'm gettin ready to go into summer '42 right now as the russian and it is going to be ugly ugly ugly for my guys.

janh -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/17/2011 10:31:42 AM)
Terje, I think you have to add depth to your defense. You keep stacking units high, but once he cracks one of your stacks, your rear is pretty inviting for encirclements and deep strikes. Perhaps adding a second line even with breaks in between strongpoints, and even some units a choke-points in their rear would be good. Even if you stack them like this, their combat power won't suffice; of course, if you detach units rearward, he might attempt more headling assaults, but these will at least be costlier than the pockets.

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/19/2011 12:50:45 PM)
Turn 65 Overall As allready spotted by the members of the forum, I was one turn too late once more, and yet another pocket forms. The German panzers in the north have vanished, most likely they are placed on trains and bound for the sentral front. The Axis scored 1 held, 17 retreats (of which 8 were against partisans), 5 surrender and 1 rout this turn for a total of 16 attacks on the line. It is more than enough for them as they sealed a new pocket, and also sealed it at the right spot. This means I am unable to reopen the pocket. We launch no attacks, but instead try to form consecutive pockets as we should have long ago (seems I'm a slow learner). In the end, losses are reported at 184.000 Soviet troops compared to 28.000 Axis troops. Units Severe losses once more, this time around we lose; -4 armoured corps -2 guards rifle corps -1 guards rifle division -2 rifle sivisions -2 naval rifle brigades -4 rifle brigades The only units that arrive this turn are 1 airfield, 1 cavalry division and 1 rifle division. Beside this, we order the creation of 2 rifle corps and 1 tank corps. Reinforcements - losses = 15.000 this turn, might even go into negative next turn... Worries I think I might have given the Axis -43 as a campaign season as well... [image]local://upfiles/11504/013FD9D637034C82A4FA9273570DCF13.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/20/2011 4:51:32 PM)
Turn 66a Overall The attempt to defend in depth to the best of our ability failed, although no pocket is formed. So I try to pull back and reform. As a result, we make no attacks this turn, while the Axis launch a total of 45 attacks. They manage 2 held, 23 retreats (5 against partisans), 13 surrender and 7 routs. The losses report once more seems bugged, as losses are reported as 0 to 63.000 of our troops. Units We order the formation of one Guards Rifle Corps and 4 rifle divisions this turn, and Stalin gives us yet another airfield. Have alot of empty airfields by now though. On the other hand we lose alot this turn; -2 armoured corps -1 Guards Rifle corps -2 rifle corps -3 cavalry corps -1 Guards Rifle division -18 rifle divisions -11 rifle brigades. That brings our total losses for the past 7 turns up to a staggering 149 units. In comparison, during the first 7 turns we lost 289 units, but that was when we were completely out of position. If the losses are to be believed, our units gained a net increase of 161.000 troops this turn. Worries Nothing new here I suppose. Now we just hope for the mud to arrive. [image]local://upfiles/11504/7688E5DD4613491B8B90E89E877D7843.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/20/2011 4:52:57 PM)
Turn 66b Explanation The last one was a start of the turn picture, this is end of the turn. Only one stack seems in real danger, but I am not happy about the available units defending towards Moscow. [image]local://upfiles/11504/96BCBE0D74044321ACE599C7F58BE8B3.jpg[/image]

Baelfiin -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/20/2011 5:22:27 PM)
Terje I feel your pain. I think you might be in trouble again however. I cant see what the CV's look like but here is what I see as the danger area: [image]local://upfiles/20920/DDEB057C44A64CDA8DEA9EDE2D1BD2BE.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/21/2011 12:57:25 PM)
Could not agree more, however my units did not have any more MPs this turn, so all I can do is hope for the best [X(] Edit Sorry did not see the writing in red there. No chance for me to attack, they still show a defensive CV of 40+. no way for me to tackle that without attempting a 1:2 roll with unmodified CV which is a no no for me atm. Terje

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/21/2011 10:11:18 PM)
Turn 67 Overall Comrade Baelfiin said it first. Luckily, only a few units is trapped, and we are able for the first time in ages, to make a front atleast two units deep all across. With the rediculus German defensive CV, we make no attacks this turn either. Our airforce try to bomb some airfields and some units but inflict only minimal losses on the enemy whilst losing 300 planes. By now the Axis is keeping their mre vulnerable units like airfields and HQs in fortified areas, and it seems they have alot of AA guns in them now. The Axis launched 30 attacks this turn, for 1 held, 4 rout and 25 retreats (4 against partisans). As a result, losses are reported at 3.000 to 97.000, or 32.3 : 1 in favour of the Axis. That should mean that by simple math, I need an OOB containing no less than 130.000.000 men [:D] Units We recieve the usual airfield, which I really do not need, but I'll take it. The creation of 1 armoured corps and 4 rifle divisions is ordered, against this, we only lost 1 AA regiment this turn. With rather light losses (for me/this season), our forces grow by 93.000 troops this turn. Worries I am running low on AA units in the pool, and LW is allready a big problem. [image]local://upfiles/11504/7AF03A650C5B47B8979FF0FA674D5142.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/22/2011 10:41:59 PM)
Turn 68 Overall A quiet turn, something we apreciate. We see that more and more fortifications are being built by the Axis, so it might be that he is preparing for winter. Our airforce once more took to the skies and was slaughtered again. 10 : 1 in losses is demoralizing to say the least, but not much to do about that. I need more level bombers as it seems they perform much better than our tactical bombers. I found no spots on which to launch an attack, so none were performed. The Axis too were very modest this turn with a mere 9 attacks. They managed to score 5 retreats (4 against partisans) and 4 surrenders, the latter being units trapped last turn. Apart from that, the Axis has not even bothered to advance into the empty hexes left by us as we withdrew to reshape the line last turn. Operation Annoyment seems to have paid off beyond hope as most Axis controlled ports now have atleast a unit, but usually a unit and a fortified area in them. Units While the enemy did not launch many attacks, he did finish off some pockets, so we lose onr rifle corps, two rifle divisions, three tank brigades and two rifle brigades this turn. We do of course recieve the usual airfield this turn too. The only units created this turn is two rifle divisions as we spend the remaining 40 CP on reforming our fronts, something that is badly needed in the area Stalingrad - Moscow. Due to few reported losses, our units grew by 142.000 troops this turn. Intel From : OKH To : AH Walther Model killed by aerial attacks. Worries None for now. Question The last patch was supposed to fix the chain-killing of generals by aerial attacks, yet this turn it happened again. So, is it fixed and I just got lucky, or has anyone else seen this again since the last patch? [image]local://upfiles/11504/7EC43C76841C4C208AF51A9609ED7B69.jpg[/image]

terje439 -> RE: Disaster in the making. Oloren (axis) vs Terje (USSR) (11/24/2011 11:25:07 AM)
Turn 69 Overall The Axis made only one attack on the line, and 6 attacks on my partisans this turn, all scoring retreat results. The attack on the line was a minor concern as that allowed the Germans to cross the Oka. However that also ment that we could move a few divisions and a rifle corps to the area, and counterattack. The attack succeeded, and we pushed the Axis back across the Oda. Apart from that we only did aerial attacks this turn. Most of our movement was aimed at reforming the line in terms of trying to get to a position where our fronts are all nicely formed up, and not mixed in all across the line. This takes time, but every turn sees us closer to our goal of distinct fronts. Things are looking a little brighter. Losses were light, with reports claiming 2.000 Axis casualties to our 63.000. Still not a good ratio, but it will have to do for the time being. Units Finally a turn with no units lost. As to new units, we get some presents from Stalin this turn in terms of a cavalry and an infantry division, and of course the usual airfield. We also order the formation of a rifle division, a rifle brigade and a combined arms army. The remaining 20 CP are spent on rearranging the frontline. This will most likely be the norm for the coming turns, spend some CP on units and some on rearranging the frontline. Reports claim a net increase in troops strength of 123.000 this turn. Worries Nothing stands out at the moment. [image]local://upfiles/11504/5DECA8591C5E4DA487A4FBDE7A98DDA5.jpg[/image]

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