RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (Full Version)

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KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:13:28 AM)

T67 far south-west (German)


Steady advance of Italian mountain units.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/F471A6133E824C8B89A4BA97AC9F3913.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:17:53 AM)

T67 far south-east (German)


Every time I recollect Saper summer offensive of '42 my self-esteem suffer another mighty blow.


Overall Axis captured 105k prisoners, destroying 1 cav corps, 1 tank corps, 9 inf divisions and 3 mot brigades.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/9BE15131C7FD4BB08A0B626ED656AEF0.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:34:14 AM)

T67 center (Soviet)


Necessary withdrawal.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/A79C60FD045747EEAB67385003979ED4.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:35:10 AM)

T67 far south-west (Soviet)


Necessary adjustments.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/08CADA47D7F24012A2BE0CEF065D6436.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:36:28 AM)

T67 far south-east (Soviet)


Knowing how weak Saper's panzerwaffe is I decided to put some pressure on German forces assaulting Caucasus.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/43F672A5295F4B989074E261209C7467.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:52:37 AM)

T68 center (German)


During the course of heavy fighting (my troops did fight well) Saper managed to form little pocket.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/C1B69E0E43D840848A38F8BB71CC29DC.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 12:55:10 AM)

T68 far south-east (German)


It turned out that Germans are not as weak as I thought ...


This is even more tragic than previous encirclements. 4 guard cavalry corps - morale 60, 61, 61, 62.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/572AD5A613244E0BBBE3C4653A34C214.jpg[/image]



M60A3TTS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 1:32:40 AM)

Very bad for the cavalry, but you risk losing the war if you don't get out of that useless chunk of real estate that you're sitting in. He can refit his panzers during the rainy season in preparation for a winter offensive to try and trap many of those rifle divisions sitting in the open.



hfarrish -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 1:51:49 AM)


I am more interested in how we got to this point - Kamil, is it a lack of units or a lack of manpower or both? Do you mind posting some pool / force level / production pics so we can get a sense?

Amazed at what kind of distances off of rail heads the Germans are able to romp around down there. Scary.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:14:02 AM)

quote:

M60A3TTS

Very bad for the cavalry, but you risk losing the war if you don't get out of that useless chunk of real estate that you're sitting in. He can refit his panzers during the rainy season in preparation for a winter offensive to try and trap many of those rifle divisions sitting in the open.



yeah, it will be done, finally


quote:

hfarrish

I am more interested in how we got to this point - Kamil, is it a lack of units or a lack of manpower or both? Do you mind posting some pool / force level / production pics so we can get a sense?




Data is on previous page.



gingerbread -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:22:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hfarrish


...

Amazed at what kind of distances off of rail heads the Germans are able to romp around down there. Scary.


I don't think the distance is that wide - check the T56 screen shot (link) and count 40-45 hexes from there. Should be well over the Kuma.



hfarrish -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:23:22 AM)


Got it - thanks. Any sense as to why you have a 300k manpower pool sitting around? Also, what is your AP and reserve situation?

Very instructive for me in my current game so the posts are very much appreciated.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:31:30 AM)

quote:

hfarrish


Got it - thanks. Any sense as to why you have a 300k manpower pool sitting around? Also, what is your AP and reserve situation?



Shifting troops and creating inf corps for counter-attacking purposes uses up almost whole AP. I practically didn't build any units. Few mot brigades and cav divisions.



hfarrish -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:31:50 AM)


That's still 450 miles from rail...not saying there is anything wrong, just amazed at what the Germans can accomplish without HQ BUs down there - granted the forces they are facing are pretty weak.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:33:26 AM)

T68 far south-west (Soviet)


New threat arises in central part of Caucasus. Unfortunately I do not have enough units to contain it.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/565960B8A50943F68842A4F0F07591C4.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:35:11 AM)

T68 far south-east (Soviet)


Ring of encirclement was broken, but chances of rescuing trapped units are very low.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/531D2B3A57464A81BE8FD20DA428585C.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:53:48 AM)

T69 center (German)


Last turn of summer. summer of terrible defeats.


Encircled units were destroyed. Another 4 inf divisions lost, not mentioning 1 air brigade.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/D051408AF6014EA2A6EA863E45A46B9D.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:55:20 AM)

T69 far south-west (German)


Saper keeps applying pressure.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/DDD7FCC1434340EFB2FD051795CBD87F.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 2:57:39 AM)

T69 far south-east (German)


Bridgeheads were lost and cavalry was herded further south. Zero chances of mounting successful rescue operation.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/4F8A0E9840EF431AA5A6330010D31B63.jpg[/image]



hfarrish -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 3:16:31 AM)


At this point should you just pull those units back to the Volga? There really isn't anything to defend anymore, and I guess the far South has to fend for itself - maybe you can use naval transport from Astrakhan to send additional units once you fall back?



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 9:13:14 AM)

quote:

hfarrish

At this point should you just pull those units back to the Volga? There really isn't anything to defend anymore, and I guess the far South has to fend for itself - maybe you can use naval transport from Astrakhan to send additional units once you fall back?



It is last turn of summer, so I will make some attacks and withdraw during mud.



randallw -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/10/2012 10:34:50 AM)

I suspect all this movement of your units in the southeast, trying to put pressure on his flanks, causes lots of fatigue for your forward units; even if the Axis are tired your CV takes a hit for those units moving up.



veji1 -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 11:13:10 AM)

It would be nice to get an update on this game as it sounds really interesting and developps in a surprising way. I would really like to see how the Soviets can stabilize the situation an try to get on track.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 11:28:30 AM)

quote:

veji1

It would be nice to get an update on this game as it sounds really interesting and developps in a surprising way. I would really like to see how the Soviets can stabilize the situation an try to get on track.



I will try to do it today.



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:13:22 PM)

T69 far north (Soviet)


Last turn of summer, so I will show how front-line starting with far north.


Fins haven't undertaken any actions since their successful offensive undertaken several turns ago.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/B7503B541D974D118EAA370D68544056.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:15:46 PM)

T69 north (Soviet)


No action here apart from one half-hearted attack in the north.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/CCD378FE64814EC1BF8196F7322B16E8.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:19:37 PM)

T69 center (Soviet)


I am so weak, that I can launch only 3 attacks, so few even knowing Saper won't be able to launch strong counter-attacks next turn I.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/E7A861E1A42F4E6CA0D514C8CFF1D3DF.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:22:00 PM)

T69 south (Soviet)


A bit of action south of Stalingrad.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/4B843314A1D44100A63537641CA8AD85.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:24:24 PM)

T69 far south-west (Soviet)


I had to reinforce Tbilisi region, to counter threat arising in central Caucasus.

Sukhumi will be evacuated.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/E19540D8177B45B28AEF491C932DABB3.jpg[/image]



KamilS -> RE: GC41 - Saper222 (Ger) vs Kamil (Sov) (No Saper222) (9/18/2012 1:28:54 PM)

T69 far south-east (Soviet)


Great withdrawal to Volga line started, rest of troops will follow next turn. Weakening Saper's panzers had priority.

[image]local://upfiles/37480/0F8A019ABC1D44C292C1DCD7F9AB747C.jpg[/image]



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