RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (Full Version)

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Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 5:52:06 PM)

9/4/44

KB & The DEI: At least for today, KB is loitering down near the DEI.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/35210C654DEA48FC836CD202C2BCE6BB.jpg[/image]



Bullwinkle58 -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 5:56:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

9/4/44

[image]local://upfiles/8143/5A3C59A821C9488DA850D81E32CC7392.jpg[/image]


Looking at this screenie, at your sub dispositions, I'm just stunned at what he lets you get away with. Air ASW from Okinawa or Shanghai and you'd be losing 2-3 subs a day either sunk or heavily damaged. I lost four sunk in the last two days in my Lokasenna game. His air ASW is blanketing, especially over shallow water.

Don't get into bad habits. [:)]



ny59giants -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 6:03:29 PM)

If John is transporting in troops, why don't you LRCAP the base to shoot them down?



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 6:06:33 PM)

9/4/44

China and Indochina: Most of my air and naval assets are focused on Formosa, so I'm not punching hard in China and Indochina at the moment. But I'm satisfied that both theaters are taking shape and will be ready when the time comes.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/840925194D0D4841862929851E362DF0.jpg[/image]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 6:08:14 PM)

Moose: I put the subs there because Allied CAP poses a hazard to John's patrols and ASW, limiting their effectiveness. He has worked air ASW pretty hard up here. I'm constantly re-evaluating whether the presence there is worth it, but these are the guys that claimed CL Nagara a week ago.

Michael: LRCAP is in place.



Lokasenna -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 7:21:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Moose: I put the subs there because Allied CAP poses a hazard to John's patrols and ASW, limiting their effectiveness. He has worked air ASW pretty hard up here. I'm constantly re-evaluating whether the presence there is worth it, but these are the guys that claimed CL Nagara a week ago.

Michael: LRCAP is in place.


As far as I know, night search can't be intercepted by CAP. Not that night search spots subs often, but it does happen. Looking at the picture also, I'd be all over those subs "like white on rice." A couple Jake or Jill ASW squadrons to spot them (with careful arc control to avoid Taichu if need be because of the CAP you mentioned) and even just some roving MLs or SCs, or low-value E's once your surface forces aren't within 3-4 hexes... lots of dead subs. A fishing (perhaps whaling) expedition. Particularly outside Wenchow.

If you sent any surface forces to deal with them, it's risking LBA strikes. If you had CVs take care of them, it plops DL 10/10 on your CVs if they don't already have it AND lets me know as the IJN player what you're up to.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

Don't get into bad habits. [:)]


I feel a disturbance in the force.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 7:45:41 PM)

If John doesn't know where my CVs are he has vastly more issues than my subs.

Again, Rocks.Papers.Scissor. John has difficulty sending in surface ships because I have big airfields at Foochow and Taichu plus Death Star. He is careful about using air ASW because of CAP provided by those same assets. He has used air ASW to some good effect and he's employed a lot of MLs, many of which have been sunk. So he avoid these waters now, by and large, though two combat TFs chanced the waters a week ago, losing CL Nagara in the process.

On the other hand, I know these waters are highly dangerous to subs, but have assumed the risk because of their importance during this campaign. Yes I can lose subs, but it's worth it to have a deterrent of some worth while this battle is raging.

I think readers sometimes make assumptions based upon incomplete information. It's not like I'm blithely using subs there; and it's not like John hasn't countered their presence. He could probably do more; I could probably do more. But neither of us is oblivious.



Bullwinkle58 -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 7:54:57 PM)

It's not the use or non-use. It's the density, the shallow water, and (I assume) lack of movement of the subs. He might not know how many you have there, but he could sure sink a bunch of them at fairly low risk. Mostly air ASW, and somewhat with dash-in, dash-out E patrols. CAP only sometimes bothers air ASW missions, especially if they're at 1000 ft.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 8:04:27 PM)

Nothing is as simple as it looks. Both of us have lost an incredible amount of patrol aircraft to enemy carriers, so we both have a shortage of platforms and probably lack in pilot quality a bit.

Right now, I'm losing 5-10 patrol aircraft every turn to KB CAP. It's unsustainable, and it's been happening for weeks, but to me it's worth it to know the exact location of John's carries. We're probably at the penultimate moment of the game, so expending subs and patrol aircraft and DDs is a worthwhile expense.

I know what you're saying, but if John started attending to my subs more carefully, then I'd move them pronto, as I've done before. From John's perspective, this may not be a hugely high priority.

I have similar sub groupings around Miri and around Boela - protected by LBA.



Lokasenna -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 8:14:49 PM)

I suppose if all of his ships are nowhere nearby, what's the point in hitting subs?

I'd still be doing it for VP purposes. Each sub is 10-11 VPs.



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 10:07:26 PM)

If your AE at Taichu is one of the Lassen class (5400 ton capacity), it can reload any allied BB, including the Iowas. But because of ops point limits it will not be able to handle many in a day. The Nav Support will help with some of the replenishment, especially reloading supplies on the AE.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/29/2017 10:21:49 PM)

Auxiliary ships at Taichu.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/DEBC18F883A5453DA3A7962CBD62B789.jpg[/image]



GetAssista -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/30/2017 1:20:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
If your AE at Taichu is one of the Lassen class (5400 ton capacity), it can reload any allied BB, including the Iowas. But because of ops point limits it will not be able to handle many in a day.

Allies can afford to travel with a dozen of those AEs at once. Guaranteed 1-turn reload to whatever BB force. With modest-sized port and support using "Load tender" during the turn after the reload is very sustainable. I had no trouble with 6 AEs, size 3 port and 200 navsup supplying once-a-turn bombardment of 6 BBs.



HansBolter -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/30/2017 1:31:51 PM)

I have never grouped a dozen, but I typically concentrate 4 AEs and 8 AKEs at any major action locale.



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/30/2017 6:40:37 PM)

Those two AEs are a good start. But always check the BBs themselves - each of them, not a sample - to ensure that all the main gun magazines are full. If the AE/AKE do not have enough ops points left to replenish the entire magazine for that turret, they will load nothing until next turn. I.E. if the magazine needs six "shots" worth of 14" shells and you have ops points on the AE for four "shots" to be loaded, none will be.

I think the sequence is: the AE goes to the BB with the lowest index number in the database, it checks the first turret's magazine and loads it, then it checks the next ship, checks its first turret and loads, etc. so that each ship has some ammo. If there are enough ops points left after going through the ships, the AE starts again with the second turret on the first ship, etc.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 2:01:08 PM)

9/5/44

Peep Show II: Allied armies on Formosa underway. RN BB TF replenished at Taichu and will bombard Kagi tomorrow. No enemy CAP.

China: Enemy armies close to coastal bases yet, but it isn't clear whether they'll enter. Lack of movement dot info.

Indochina: John's Vinh invasion force is already encountering trouble - 10th Division failed to brush aside the much weaker, battered Lushai Brigade, and 116th Div. plus other Haiphong units can't dislodge Allied stack at that base.



[image]local://upfiles/8143/C6299191ED0D44C7A23F8AA16BEC7B10.jpg[/image]



Xilana -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 4:56:08 PM)

?Is the unit(s) cut off north of Amoy? What's up there in composition?



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 7:05:52 PM)

You must be reading John III's AAR. He's a half step ahead. I just ran the turn and John's moved an unit between my division and Amoy. But it's not cut off. It has the hexside leading to the SW (where the enemy unit is) and it'll keep moving that way (it's already marched 15 miles). At the same time, two units are moving north from Amoy to open that hexside. So unless I've miscalculated, my units should move into Amoy in good order.

John's had trouble grasping hexside control in the game. It cost him dearly in Burma.

I've got a lot going on, so I can't post for the next turn yet. But I've run it, did my part, and sent it back to John. So I'm a day behind. I'll post in more detail later.



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 7:44:41 PM)

I can't see John contesting Kagi. Formosa was neglected until you were almost ready to move on it. You kept it pretty isolated so supply may be an issue.
Most of all, the IJA does not have all that many engineers and I think he would use those to build forts at Takao and Taihoku rather than Kagi. I'm predicting a cakewalk.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 8:06:05 PM)

John just moved Guards Mixed Brigade to Kagi, giving him three mixed brigades. He may have moved a division too, but I didn't get confirmation of that. His troops have been repeatedly battered by effective 4EB strikes for months and one recent BB bombardment (another goes in tonight). Kagi is probably low on supply and forts probably aren't uber (damage kicked in just when he would've decided to ramp up fort building). Against that will come four fresh and powerful Allied divisions, arty, tanks, combat engineers, and repeated bombardments and bombings. I don't expect real trouble at Kagi, but I'll know more day after tomorrow.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 8:25:11 PM)

9/6/44

Peep Show: A day of strong bombing runs against the enemy, even as the Kagi-bound army gets underway.

China: John thinks he has the Allies on the run and in a fix; I think he's misinterpreted what's going on. We'll know who's right in a few more days.

Indochina: Some lights and smoke and noise, but nothing that alarms me.

KB: I'll post a screeny and details later, but KB is loitering south of Babeldaob. John has a plan but it doesn't involve Formosa. What it is, I don't know.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/A51B3B0A9E294AA09264253FB83DFB09.jpg[/image]



Xilana -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 9:18:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

You must be reading John III's AAR. He's a half step ahead.


Respectfully negative on that! I'm not familiar with ZOC for hexes but I note your green dot is essentially surrounded by the picture with the two red dots to either side. Reminded me of the very early Kessel formation maps at Stalingrad. Hopefully we won't see that scenario unfold!

I've followed several AAR's over the years; I always make a rule to only read one side to prevent making a slip for op security of the player's involved. I appreciate your (plural) sharing your battles to the masses and appreciate the level of involvement to play this game. I would never wish to compromise.



Lokasenna -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 9:32:15 PM)

But then they could do the Kessel Run and we could time them...



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 10:01:54 PM)

Note that my green dot is moving to the SW, towards Amoy. I control the hexside and can exit unless John's unit to the SW crosses into the hex through that hexside first. I have a head start, so let's see who wins the race. If I do lose, I do control several other hexsides.



apbarog -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 10:23:51 PM)

Your unit is moving to the SW into a hex that John already occupies. When you arrive, you will control the hexside you will have passed through, but he will control all of the other hexsides. If you cannot kick him out of this hex, he could move into the hex from the same way you did, and then control every hexside, leaving you no escape. You could open up a different hexside into this hex by moving there with a different unit, from a different direction.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 10:27:03 PM)

That would be true if I wasn't moving two units NW from Amoy. By crossing that hexside, I'll open a route of egress.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/671F48EF2DCE48B1ADBC16DB3DEA90F2.jpg[/image]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/1/2017 10:44:25 PM)

I think something major is afoot with John's carriers. I'm thinking on it but haven't come up with a solid hunch yet. I do know that I'm glad KB isn't making things dicey around Formosa.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/A44CB05874094435B75D41AFCA725FC4.jpg[/image]



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/2/2017 2:06:49 AM)

The only reason I can think of for him to park his CVs SE of Singapore is that he fears a massive strike by 4EB there. You did burn him once during the battle of Sumatra.



Lokasenna -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/2/2017 11:25:10 AM)

Option 6: maybe he's trying to go east and then northeast to get out from under your eyes in the sky.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (7/2/2017 12:58:19 PM)

Keeping track of Japan's mobile and powerful asset is always important, but especially so now for two reasons. The second reason is knowing whether KB might make things complicated around Formosa. The first I can't disclose until later - perhaps several weeks from now - but it's critical.



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