RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES

RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (Full Version)

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Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (6/28/2017 4:13:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist How did you do this? Is it actually possible to move axis allies airbases over the no move line? I did not know until now that the Romanian army even has maps of the area to find the airbase. In the first version I played the whole Rumanian Level Bomber force flew up to bomb Leningrad on turn 1! I guess that bug has gone (or has it?). You can see this and all the battle results screens from your Soviet side files too - have fun at the Finns commanding the Centre Air Force and Luftwaffe suddenly taking over the Finnish fighters in Karelia. I have not looked at the commands of Soviet air missions in this game but I assume you have similar crazy command assignments. At best I assume this is just a presentation bug - the Rumanian air commanders are not really having their ratings applied to Northern Luftwaffe operations. But I do not know for sure. I suppose you could test how the victory loss count works for different commanders after one of these funnies. quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist I get a "thanks", only a "thanks"? Just wait, I will teach you to say "oh no" or "we are all lost" instead. About the game you deserve much more than thanks. Within the game you just get my cruel and hideous laugh.

Hortlund -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (6/28/2017 4:13:20 PM)
Turn is in the dropbox now. I think we'll have to shoot one of our front commanders for not being at his command post.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (6/30/2017 7:03:09 PM)
Just to follow up the theme of odd command assignments. Soviet turn 6 saw the Hungarians take over the Rumanian air force [image]http://i.imgur.com/YFqPUfw.png[/image] Clearly this was necessary as the Rumanians are now busy commanding the Hungarian air force [image]http://i.imgur.com/mfM1z5b.png[/image] Do not say the AI has no mischievous sense of humour - it is replete with historical irony

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/4/2017 3:20:57 PM)
Message for Stelteck At the moment the system is refusing to send you private messages as it says your storage is full - may want to delete a few so we can PM you again. I think Olga has been sending you too many messages! [:)]

Stelteck -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/4/2017 4:04:39 PM)
I cleared it !!! [;)]

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/6/2017 7:27:18 PM)
Turn 7 in dropbox. I did n't hear any planes but I can still hear Sardaukar and EwaldvonKleist whispering "We may have stolen an army and bombed a neutral with a stolen air force - but we did not break no....." Inform the staff at the Hermitage that we require their best champagne for the welcome party. Herr General Stelteck insists on the French plonk.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/9/2017 1:46:33 PM)
We gave EwaldvonKleist ample warning quote: ORIGINAL: Telemecus quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist And the pocket formed by Army Group North last turn was opened hehehe lowsugar will be angry - and you do not want to make lowsugar angry do you? quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist After one hour thinking about it I still see no reason why not? After turn 7 thinking about it you know the reason why [;)]

EwaldvonKleist -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/12/2017 9:10:32 AM)
quote: quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist After one hour thinking about it I still see no reason why not? After turn 7 thinking about it you know the reason why Yeah, I have learned the hard way :) I had look at my T6 turn and I really screwed up. At least 5 units could have been placed in a much better way to make pocketing much more difficult. And finally I left the fact that the infantry can support the panzers completely out of consideration. I still expect a court martial for this, my U2 will help me to escape in this case [sm=scared0018.gif]

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/12/2017 1:33:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist I had look at my T6 turn and I really screwed up. At least 5 units could have been placed in a much better way to make pocketing much more difficult. And finally I left the fact that the infantry can support the panzers completely out of consideration. I still expect a court martial for this, my U2 will help me to escape in this case You are your own toughest critic. Never mind who else is after you I worry about the beating you will be giving yourself! I am not sure there are any right answers for the Soviets during the first Axis offensive. Pretty much anything Axis really wants they can get - the only question is at what cost. Whether you go deep or you go hard there is always a counter. If it is any consolation when the weather changes you will be smiling - and we may need that U2 to escape the other way.

EwaldvonKleist -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/20/2017 1:36:09 PM)
Due to some real life issues I unfortunately will not be able to fulfill my role as the commander of the northern front during the next weeks. Please continue with the game. When (if) I come back, I will be happy to assume a command again. Let me emphasize that I don't leave this game because of the last turns disaster, I absolutely dislike this attitude and I am more than willing to save what can be saved in the North, but can't play WitE in the near future (and have to pause two games going favourably for me as well). Thanks for the game so far and I hope you will find a good replacement :) Regards EvK

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/20/2017 2:45:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist Due to some real life issues I unfortunately will not be able to fulfill my role as the commander of the northern front during the next weeks. Please continue with the game. When (if) I come back, I will be happy to assume a command again. Let me emphasize that I don't leave this game because of the last turns disaster, I absolutely dislike this attitude and I am more than willing to save what can be saved in the North, but can't play WitE in the near future (and have to pause two games going favourably for me as well). Thanks for the game so far and I hope you will find a good replacement :) Regards EvK That is a big loss for both the game and your team. I hope the real life issues go well. That said a few weeks is not a big gap as far as this game is concerned so I think you will fit back in very soon. If not maybe we can nick you to the other side? We have lots of spreadsheets on our dropbox! [:)] I feel guilty using the trashtalk forum to trashtalk now! I can see you absolutely want to hold Leningrad and expect to win - which is a great attitude to have for your opponents but pretty miserable one for the Soviet player. I still think your endless delays on our advance and sucking up resources and units was absolutely fine. Doing that inevitably means encirclements - no encirclements and no delays is worse. That was not a disaster but pretty normal. But I know you will not be convinced by anything less than perfection! And we all know you would still be fighting us in the Urals with your teeth if it came to that! I was saving this to depict the day when you finish preparing your legal defence. [image]http://i.imgur.com/dPDo4OR.jpg[/image] Ewald Von Kleist (the other one) will miss you. ICQ will miss you. As one mathmo to another - come back soon!

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/23/2017 2:23:37 PM)
Message for thedude357 - We cannot PM you as it says your storage is full! Nothing urgent, we are still waiting for the Soviet turn to come back and I will resend all PMs when you have space so you will not have lost anything. But I thought you would want to know!

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/28/2017 5:40:57 PM)
Soviet Team, I have sent a few PMs - there is some action needed urgently from you guys! Hope to hear from you soon!

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (7/31/2017 10:38:14 AM)
Thanks for chasing up the interests in joining the Soviet team - let us know how it goes. Just to confirm we have the turn save from the Soviets for turn 7 and Axis turn 8 is now going from army group commander to army group commander. One of our team is on a work trip - but has been very dedicated and taken their laptop to do their turn in the hotel. However I will tell them I am sure we will be happy to make allowances for them as it is less than ideal circumstances to finish their go.

M60A3TTS -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 11:38:23 AM)
So far there are 7 complete turns in 4 months of real time. Both team leaders need to see their side done in no more than 10 days if there is to be any real progress. Otherwise the whole thing may as well be dropped. I suggest if either side doesn't complete within two weeks, it's an auto-loss.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 2:18:54 PM)
The Axis team has always completed in 10 days, and had two turns completed in 3 days. This is the first time we have had to delay, still well before any large number of days has passed, and for a real life situation that has been signposted at the start. I understand the frustration but this cannot apply to the Axis team and certainly not now.

M60A3TTS -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 3:25:45 PM)
No problem, but it would have been better just playing the Barbarossa scenario. At least that would have a reasonable chance of being completed. In time this will be more of a pick-up game than anything else.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 3:40:16 PM)
At the moment it is that way, but the Axis team have certainly been ready for a faster game. I think this is a Soviet side issue, we can only follow your pace after that. Earlier on we did offer some help if you needed it, and I know EwaldvonKleist was keen. It is still available. We have spent a lot of time working how to go fast in our turns by working out protocols so everyone knows what to do without refer backs and asking for permissions, e.g for airforce etc. We are still actively discussing how to make things easier and quicker. When it is our turn we know who should be working the game file, and know that they know it. We have scheduled and altered sequences to make sure it is not left without action - so far in the game there has only ever been 1 evening during our turn when nobody could take action. We have been making estimated times of arrival so that the next player can clear the decks and be ready in expectation of when their go arrives. When a new player or players joins the team we know that turn probably will take longer - but we have had two changes of team ourselves. So far and other than that from our side we cannot know what issues you need to tackle. We know that getting four people to work together on a turn is much more difficult than one, but there are ways of managing it and making it faster. If there is anything we can do to help that would be a positive contribution we can make.

M60A3TTS -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 4:01:40 PM)
And I have no problem acting as the traffic cop for both sides in terms of keeping things moving along. It's clear where the main source of delay has come from. Where is the Axis on T8 currently and when do you expect to have it complete? No rush, relatively speaking you haven't had it long. Just looking for info.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 4:24:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS Where is the Axis on T8 currently and when do you expect to have it complete? No rush, relatively speaking you haven't had it long. Just looking for info. No problem - and actually this is one area that can be improved. When the Soviet turn arrives it is always a surprise. So it means we cannot get ready in advance. Just as I give ETAs a day or so in advance to team mates if we can get ETAs between sides I know it would help us. It just means we can plan to avoid doing other things then, or plan to do other things at other times. Purely meant as a helper rather than a ticking clock. Possibly that would help you too? Recently our turns have been taking about a week. Each time we are taking slightly less time but only marginally at the moment. We have had four days of action and completed two army groups. But as signposted earlier we have a team member away from home. They have their laptop, been looking at the file and been in contact. But I think the safer assumption is to assume nothing until they return tomorrow and I have assured them that will not be a problem. If we then go as before you would be seeing mid-week for the file to be back with the Soviets. Possibly there can also be further ETA updates nearer the time as we get more sure? I have deliberately avoided timings for turn arounds within the team as I have found that putting that sort of pressure sometimes makes people actually take longer, as well as being less fun. So probably why I am a bit defensive! I am in the management school of get rid of the barriers rather than beat the stick. We do actually have some very quick players on the team. And when we were doing turn arounds of 3 days it was happening naturally as we ironed out the little delays and hand over issues. So the longer time we have settled as a team the faster/more efficient I expect we will get.

EwaldvonKleist -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 6:12:27 PM)
@Tele: That copyright Comic is funny [:D]. I hope you didn't ctrl C, ctrl V it from somewhere without permission? @all: The delays have always come from the Soviet side. A few observations: 1) Hortlund has sometimes been AWOL for some time, therefore the time between the finishing of the Axis turn and the orders to the front commanders has been several days in one occasion. 2) Shonyu took very long to response and to play a turn. 3) The overall response to suggestions and attempts at some intense strategy discussion, expressed by E-Mail, PM and in the thread, has been very low. Please note, that blaming people or starting arguments isn't what I aim for. Just trying to identify the reasons. Having no time or being offline is nothing bad, but an organization must be flexible enough to carry on. I am not critisizing people, but the organization. So some suggestions: S1) One front commander gets access to the inter team dropbox and acts as a vize commander, who overtakes command if Hortlund hasn't taken action for two days. M60 is the natural candidate for this position. S2) Taking a turn has to be announced in the thread, so there are never two people playing their turns at the same time. S3) If a commander of a front doesnt do his turn two days after either the fresh turn or a turn from one of the other fronts has arrived on the dropbox, any other commander can play the turn. S4) Optional: After everyone has played his turn, the front commanders peer review their turns. Such a cross checking could have saved us 2 armies at min, by fighting operational blindness. S5) Optional: An E-mail notification system so you dont need to check everything all the time. That are easy to introduce things which will make things more structured and quicker. Please take steps to speed up the game Soviet comrades, or it will fade out, which would be a tragedy. For I would like to rejoin in a few weeks! We mustnt leave the leadership in terms of organization to the fascists!

EwaldvonKleist -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 6:18:44 PM)
Going offline again soon, just wanted to leave some stuff for discussion :)

Hortlund -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 6:35:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Telemecus When the Soviet turn arrives it is always a surprise. NO ONE EXPECTS THE SOVIET TURN! [image]local://upfiles/1562/7999DC0FF9AD4903A98D89D035A98F1F.jpg[/image]

M60A3TTS -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 7:04:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund quote: ORIGINAL: Telemecus When the Soviet turn arrives it is always a surprise. NO ONE EXPECTS THE SOVIET TURN! [image]local://upfiles/1562/7999DC0FF9AD4903A98D89D035A98F1F.jpg[/image] It's decided then. The next Soviet commander late with their turn will be put in the comfy chair.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/5/2017 7:16:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist @Tele: That copyright Comic is funny [:D]. I hope you didn't ctrl C, ctrl V it from somewhere without permission? All those copyright symbols on the cartoon are being ironic ... at least I hope so and that will be my copyright infringement defence. Some of our experiences that might help? -At all times during our turn we have always had one team member whose responsibility is to work the file at the point. This has always been clear to them, and known to all others. We have done it by having an agreed sequence of play up front in our "allocations" (where we have how many points each can use, rail cap etc.) and PMs to all with any changes. Indeed we even discuss it in planning while the turn is still with the Soviets. We have been alive to the problems of forked game files, but I think by having a system to make it clear always at all times whose file it is we have never gone near it. -I know I have had a fair idea of team members availiability in advance, so we have made contingency planning. When Timmeh disappeared we knew it could be an issue during the Soviet turn and already had the contingency of Stelteck covering straight away if it stayed that way when the Soviet turn was returned. I think if a player is incommunicado ahead of the turn, given the turnaround needs of the game, it is fair to take their go straight away? It is worth planning ahead. Probably with ETAs from the other side this would be easier? EwaldvonKleist is right it is not a blame thing. If something happened to me I would be reassured to know the others would carry on my bit if I cannot. Indeed this should be a strength of a team game that it can carry on even if someone is not availiable at that time. The German commanding officer/chief of staff duo had the one standing in for the other and similarly in the soviet system etc. So it does echo the history. We should have teams that can stand in for each other during absences without it being a big issue at all. quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist S1) One front commander gets access to the inter team dropbox and acts as a vize commander, who overtakes command if Hortlund hasn't taken action for two days. M60 is the natural candidate for this position. Actually this was a surprise to us. We had all given our emails to be on the game/inter-team dropbox at the beginning and I only just realised others are not on the game dropbox. I have now started copying all files straight to our team dropbox, but having all in the game dropbox as at the beginning is more sensible. I have always been clear on the Axis team that whatever our roles in the game, about the game we are all equal and should have the same access. If we also see the game file as soon as the other side sends it we can all also start planning our own bit of the turn straight away. It is also worth saying that the role of Supreme Commander is not i) to be the best player or ii) to be the team manager. For example on the Axis side just look at the AARs to see how much more experienced Stelteck is as a player than I am. I have probably taken on the role as a team manager in the sense of scheduling, sequence of play, recruitment etc - but there is no reason why it has to be the Supreme Commander or indeed one of the four players. That role can be performed by someone else, or whoever is availiable on the team at that time. In football you have the captain who arranged things on the pitch where the manager cannot, and the manager usually would be hopeless as a player - why not here? quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund NO ONE EXPECTS THE SOVIET TURN! For someone in Sweden you are incredibly au fait with British culture! quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS It's decided then. The next Soviet commander late with their turn will be put in the comfy chair. For non-Brits explanation will be needed - google Monty Python's Flying Circus. If you are German give up - you will never get it! quote: ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist Going offline again soon, just wanted to leave some stuff for discussion :) Come back soon - you are missed!

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/8/2017 6:25:03 PM)
Turn save file in dropbox Although very feint now I can hear Sardaukar and EwaldvonKleist whispering, "Say what you like about Stalin and Hitler, but they did not break no...." I know EwaldvonKleist messaged me that M60A3TTS is on the Soviet team. It may be worth announcing here what is the the current Soviet team for all. Also it may be worth pointing out the game house rules for those just joining - see http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4245675 (first post in the sign up thread). They were written by Panzerjaeger Hortlund specially for the game so PH will come down hard on anyone found breaking them! [;)]

Hortlund -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/8/2017 8:03:49 PM)
Ha-Ha, Kharkov was empty

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/8/2017 8:11:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund Ha-Ha, Kharkov was empty No it was not! [;)] [image]http://i.imgur.com/5SpPfdb.png[/image]

Hortlund -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/8/2017 8:20:15 PM)
That is just a clever ruse. The important stuff was gone.

Telemecus -> RE: 8 player multiplayer - THREAD FOR BOTH SIDES (8/8/2017 8:21:01 PM)
The tank factory ran once we crossed the Dnepr - everything else was left behind! I'll let the good citizens of Kharkhov know you do not consider them important!

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