RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted

RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (Full Version)

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SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 2:43:18 PM)
So are all 5 people on the soviet team possibly beginner level now or I am misunderstanding? I for one think it is a great idea for the ground commanders of the Axis to outclass the Soviet counterparts but I do feel we would definitely need a supreme commander that does understand the game to a decent level as our guide and leader as without a strong and knowing hand to guide us a feel a team made entirely of beginners would fall apart very very quickly and offer no real fun for either team against well grizzled opponents

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 2:48:54 PM)
If that is true that is a serious point. I think only a few have indicated their experience here. I know it is not easy to give an idea of how experienced you are - but if you are on the starting line up it could help to give a judgement.

Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 3:22:39 PM)
Im okay to be a Soviet Supreme, but I have never played the Soviet on this game before. I do understand soviet strategies, I do understand we need to put factories in the East, and things like that. If im only there to coordinated strategies, and tell players to do stuff, I think I would do good. I dont know how to perform the factories to go to the East, but Im sure, as supreme commander, I can just delegate this to someone else, while deciding WHEN we do it. I kinda agree that an experienced soviet supreme would probably be best though haha, but I feel comfortable doing it nevertheless.

SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 3:46:13 PM)
I would definitely class myself as a beginner I have the basics down fine but with only 3 multiplayer games under my belt none of which lasting past the first blizzard experience is an issue for me I am very inexperienced and am yet to understand many of the nuances of multiplayer so everytime I experience something new which is constantly I struggle to understand what to do and how best to react without turning it into an incorrect series of moves followed by a death spiral That is why I thought it would really help us to have decent leadership as if others were also in the same boat as me (I know that drakken is in the same boat as me as I have read his AAR Doctorking also said he was new although I am not sure about our southern commanders they only have 4 posts in the matrix forums so being new I thought was a plausible guess) If we are told how to react with a guided hand and a commander who understands the game on a decent level then we could all minimise mistakes while still allowing the Axis commanders to have their fun before the blizzards otherwise if our commander is also new like the rest of our team we will just end up being headless chickens and poor sport I fear

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 4:02:01 PM)
I guess that means that ground commanders are all new to the game. If so the only issue would be the balance of Supreme Commanders? I would say I am experienced on the Axis side. I have actually never really had a long game as Soviets, it would be my first time properly. Although I think I know quite a lot about that role from playing against it. I usually play and enjoy the Axis side. If there were more than two people going for Supreme Commander I would be quite happy to stand back and let two others take it on. There would be a balance for sure then. Personally I would be quite happy to be a friend to the game and offer advice. I could be given title of chief military adviser! If I had the passwords of both sides though I could not be a reserve future player or member of either team. Perhaps we need another Supreme Commander - and it does not matter if they are experienced or not as they could be matched with the same? If any of the existing ground commanders want to step up would that do it?

Crackaces -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 5:37:47 PM)
One possiblity is to get the game started and then with the publicity in the AAR .. more players wanting to join in ..thus start with a beginner supreme commander say turn 1 (likely a week or so ) and go from there?

Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 10:04:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces One possiblity is to get the game started and then with the publicity in the AAR .. more players wanting to join in ..thus start with a beginner supreme commander say turn 1 (likely a week or so ) and go from there? Im not sure changing Supreme commander after the game start is a good idea.

Crackaces -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 10:14:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces One possiblity is to get the game started and then with the publicity in the AAR .. more players wanting to join in ..thus start with a beginner supreme commander say turn 1 (likely a week or so ) and go from there? Im not sure changing Supreme commander after the game start is a good idea. I might propose there are 5 very distinctive phases to this game .. 1. German offense .. take initial objectives in 18 weeks 2 Russian winter offense 3 German offense II focused on the south 4 Red Army II German transition 5 The race for Berlin If phase 1 fails .. Germans resign .. no game .. If phase 2 fails still a game see Sillyflower vs Brian If phase 3 fails .. German resigns Then it is a matter of keeping the Russkies out of Berlin If you want to keep the game going the guy running the Germans had to know what they are doing and guide a consistent offense .. on the other hand the Soviets (if they can keep morale up ) have a lot of room to play with for an expert to save the day

SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/10/2017 10:50:32 PM)
Well fingers crossed this is going to be an enjoyable long term commitment for us all The best chances of that happening is if we start on the correct footing for all parties involved, be patient and not go off half cocked otherwise one of the teams is likely to break down and we will have to search for new comrades in arms from step one again

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 12:35:05 AM)
I think it would be best for everybody if I didn't have such a central role for the outcome of the whole game as Axis AG Center commander! Maybe the person currently assigned Soviet Southern Front would like to swap?

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 12:37:15 AM)
If not, I'll do my best for the cause of Western Civilization [:D]

SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 12:44:42 AM)
Our south and south western commanders are a duo of friends under one account I believe I am happy to fill any role as I am here for the experience and knowledge that can be gained from bouncing ideas and strategics with so many other teamates so if you or anybody else does want to swap with me just ask and I will gladly switch as I really don't mind at all what position I play aslong as everybody is happy

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 12:55:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SparkleyTits Our south and south western commanders are a duo of friends under one account I believe I am happy to fill any role as I am here for the experience and knowledge that can be gained from bouncing ideas and strategics with so many other teamates so if you or anybody else does want to swap with me just ask and I will gladly switch as I really don't mind at all what position I play aslong as everybody is happy Whichever you like. What role do you have right now? I'm basically here to learn as well.

SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 1:05:56 AM)
I am playing nortern front for mother Russia at the moment It's completely up to your preference buddy don't feel obliged to switch if you would prefer AGC I am happy with literally any front

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:18:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SparkleyTits I am playing nortern front for mother Russia at the moment It's completely up to your preference buddy don't feel obliged to switch if you would prefer AGC I am happy with literally any front Are you more experienced than I? Have you played against humans before? I would feel more comfortable with playing defense at first if you are ok with that

SparkleyTits -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:46:57 AM)
I have played three games against humans so far so I still definitely class myself as inexperienced and a beginner but I have the mechanical basics down so I am comfortable if you would prefer to play defence mate yeah. No problemo

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:54:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SparkleyTits I have played three games against humans so far so I still definitely class myself as inexperienced and a beginner but I have the mechanical basics down so I am comfortable if you would prefer to play defence mate yeah. No problemo OK, let's do it, then. I'm the northern front Russian.

Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:57:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces One possiblity is to get the game started and then with the publicity in the AAR .. more players wanting to join in ..thus start with a beginner supreme commander say turn 1 (likely a week or so ) and go from there? Im not sure changing Supreme commander after the game start is a good idea. I might propose there are 5 very distinctive phases to this game .. 1. German offense .. take initial objectives in 18 weeks 2 Russian winter offense 3 German offense II focused on the south 4 Red Army II German transition 5 The race for Berlin If phase 1 fails .. Germans resign .. no game .. If phase 2 fails still a game see Sillyflower vs Brian If phase 3 fails .. German resigns Then it is a matter of keeping the Russkies out of Berlin If you want to keep the game going the guy running the Germans had to know what they are doing and guide a consistent offense .. on the other hand the Soviets (if they can keep morale up ) have a lot of room to play with for an expert to save the day I dont know... Im alright with just playing the damn game. haha. No rules, just, fight to the death until 1945. War has no rules after all. One thing I was thinking about is having a forum for "Top Secret documents captured" Meaning that, every operation the enemy team prepared, a couple of turns before actually doing the operation, the supreme commander would roll 3 dice at the same time, if the number is 4 or lower. He needs to take one of his front commander's objective and overall plan, and post it in the "Top secret documents captured" Meaning the enemy would have access to the plan. Every supreme commander would also be allowed to post FAKE operation in that thread. Meaning that, the enemy would never be sure if the operation is real or fake. The chances of hitting 4 or lower is extremely low. I think that would add a lot of realism to the game....Just an idea like that though. http://dice.virtuworld.net/?nr=39we

Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 3:02:15 AM)
Im not sure if the other supreme commander have the idea of coming up with operation though. I was thinking about drawing strategies and objectives, and making a sound plan with the help of each ground commander. and deciding overall what to do as a supreme commander, and then putting the operation official and distributing each goal to every front commander a couple of turns before executing it. Wich would mean, before each attack, I would have an operation planned, named, documented and dated. Wich would be perfect for the "Top secret Documents captured" thread.

Crackaces -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 12:24:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo Im not sure if the other supreme commander have the idea of coming up with operation though. I was thinking about drawing strategies and objectives, and making a sound plan with the help of each ground commander. and deciding overall what to do as a supreme commander, and then putting the operation official and distributing each goal to every front commander a couple of turns before executing it. Wich would mean, before each attack, I would have an operation planned, named, documented and dated. Wich would be perfect for the "Top secret Documents captured" thread. The decisions that will have to be made really might not be so focused on secret plans .. I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH ..

Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:25:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces The decisions that will have to be made really might not be so focused on secret plans .. I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan.

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:43:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces The decisions that will have to be made really might not be so focused on secret plans .. I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan. Presumably, we'll have separate forums for each side? Any sort of intelligence roll or something like that could just allow you to look at one or more posts from the other forum. Have to do it on the honor system, though.

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 2:54:30 PM)
I have had a very experienced Soviet player, who has not posted so far on this thread but has many AARs, PM me saying they are interested. But they just cannot commit until mid-October because of a big work requirement. But they said we should get back to them if we can use them. The other team game I think was only on turn 3 after a month. So a possibility is Axis Supreme Commander - Telemecus Soviet Supreme Commander - Neogodhobo (with all team mates helping) until mid october, then mid-october we could ask for the experienced player to take over. Neogodhobo would be guaranteed another place on the team - I think should also be at least deputy Supreme Commander as well so there would be continuity. Also if there is an issue of balance:- The Supreme Commander cannot do ground missions, but can be involved in other combat roles like air bombing missions. But I could make a self-denying ordinance that I will not involve myself in any combat roles until/at least an experienced player takes on the other Supreme role. Neogodhobo - I am most worried whether this is being unfair to you. Having volunteered to say you could take on the Supreme role this would be saying yes then no. So it could feel like being treated like a football when you are the hero making the sacrifice to help all. Is there a better way this could be done for you? Others - do you feel this would make the game fair? I have not caught up with the posts above, I am not ignoring them but still have to read them. Otherwise if this is good we could start.

Crackaces -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 3:37:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces The decisions that will have to be made really might not be so focused on secret plans .. I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan. I'm saying .. the supreme commander might be more of a role hearding cats ;)

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 3:51:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo Im not sure changing Supreme commander after the game start is a good idea. I would have thought that a while ago - but I would say now it is OK. The reality is that many games of WitE stop because an opponent disappears from contact. This can be for valid real life reasons. But I hope we have a set up here that can carry on even when some players cannot. So it would mean other team members taking over anothers go when they cannot, or replacing players who drop out. In the other team game I keep a checklist of everything I intend to do, and all my plans etc., in a team dropbox so all my team mates can see as much or as little as they like. So a good team should be transparent and know what others are doing - hopefully they can take over from me if something happens to me. So unlike a solo game it is a good idea to be more fluid and welcome changes. That said continuity does help. But there is the possibility that whatever titles different players take, some of the roles that they do can continue even if the team is reshuffled. I think we are torn between the heart and the head. On one side getting it set up right from the start can save a lot of tears. On the other hand keen wargamers want to rush in and are frustrated not to start. I guess on this forum we'll come to a consensus when we think is a good time to start.

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 4:04:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan. I'm saying .. the supreme commander might be more of a role hearding cats ;) I suppose it is worth distinguishing what a Supreme Commander has to do, with what it would be good for them to do. The absolute requirement for the game is that the Supreme Commander HAS to allocate things like points, units etc to the others, and their responsibilities. But someone who does that job well might start doing something else - and might find what they have to do a very small part of the game for them. Personally that is where I think the interest comes from for the role - and the thing I would love to compare notes on with other Supreme Commanders whether or not I am one in this game. Some approaches are i) Make a strategic analysis of your situation and that of your opponent, develop a grand strategy over multiple turns, and let that lead on to who gets what. Is this Neogodhobo's idea? ii) Spend a lot of time with other players getting their plans and ideas, seeing where they cannot all be done, and man managing the way to get as much as possible for all. Perhaps what Crackaces is suggesting? I think there is a lot more to be said on this and it will be a hot topic for the game. Perhaps a "Dummy's guide to how to be a Supreme Commander" can be written afterwards?

Crackaces -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 4:24:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Telemecus quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan. I'm saying .. the supreme commander might be more of a role hearding cats ;) I suppose it is worth distinguishing what a Supreme Commander has to do, with what it would be good for them to do. The absolute requirement for the game is that the Supreme Commander HAS to allocate things like points, units etc to the others, and their responsibilities. But someone who does that job well might start doing something else - and might find what they have to do a very small part of the game for them. Personally that is where I think the interest comes from for the role - and the thing I would love to compare notes on with other Supreme Commanders whether or not I am one in this game. Some approaches are i) Make a strategic analysis of your situation and that of your opponent, develop a grand strategy over multiple turns, and let that lead on to who gets what. Is this Neogodhobo's idea? ii) Spend a lot of time with other players getting their plans and ideas, seeing where they cannot all be done, and man managing the way to get as much as possible for all. Perhaps what Crackaces is suggesting? I think there is a lot more to be said on this and it will be a hot topic for the game. Perhaps a "Dummy's guide to how to be a Supreme Commander" can be written afterwards? The concept of putting together the plans of the individual ground commanders spiced with a vision of the five stages of the game as I highlighted above. If the idea is "I" then the supreme commander simply needs obedient ground commanders .. if "ii" then the supreme commander needs expertise within that front. Given the number of AAR's .. it is easier for one to grasp a small part well than the whole salami ..

thedoctorking -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 4:29:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Telemecus quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces quote: ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo quote: ORIGINAL: Crackaces I might propose they are mainly focused on where AP's are spent (HQBU's vs OOB ), some allocation of OKH resources , re-purposing of units between fronts .. think of all the big decisions and allocation of resources you make as a single player .. now think 3 players vying for AP's as an example. Fix Gudarin's OOB? Or save AP's so Armor can cut off PSKOV ... There are subtle compromises in objectives and corrdination between fronts .. but I would contend my previous statement is the big job of the supreme commander for OKH .. Im not sure I understand what you are saying because I dont quite see the relation with what I was saying.. ? EDIT : Are you saying, that the supreme commander do not come up with operations to execute to win the war ? I would certainly come up with operations that have been thought of, prepared, reviewed by ground commanders (according to their area of operation ) and then put in action. ALONG with all the other decisions that has to be made. You cant win a war without a proper plan. I'm saying .. the supreme commander might be more of a role hearding cats ;) I suppose it is worth distinguishing what a Supreme Commander has to do, with what it would be good for them to do. The absolute requirement for the game is that the Supreme Commander HAS to allocate things like points, units etc to the others, and their responsibilities. But someone who does that job well might start doing something else - and might find what they have to do a very small part of the game for them. Personally that is where I think the interest comes from for the role - and the thing I would love to compare notes on with other Supreme Commanders whether or not I am one in this game. Some approaches are i) Make a strategic analysis of your situation and that of your opponent, develop a grand strategy over multiple turns, and let that lead on to who gets what. Is this Neogodhobo's idea? ii) Spend a lot of time with other players getting their plans and ideas, seeing where they cannot all be done, and man managing the way to get as much as possible for all. Perhaps what Crackaces is suggesting? I think there is a lot more to be said on this and it will be a hot topic for the game. Perhaps a "Dummy's guide to how to be a Supreme Commander" can be written afterwards? The Supreme Commander should also be responsible for making moves for any of his subordinates who hasn't turned in their moves by the deadline. There should also be a rank hierarchy among the lower commanders so someone can take over the Generalissimo's job if he doesn't turn in his orders by the designated time. And everybody should have a regularly updated strategic goals statement on their forum so that people taking over their job can do something like they would have done. The Supreme commander would be responsible for looking at all his subordinates' plans and editing or commenting on them to reflect his own priorities.

Telemecus -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 4:34:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thedoctorking The Supreme Commander should also be responsible for making moves for any of his subordinates who hasn't turned in their moves by the deadline. The rules do not allow the Supreme Commander to move/combat ground units in contact with the enemy - but the sentiment of the point is right. The team manager (who could be the Supreme Commander) has to arrange for another team player to take another player's go when they cannot.

KenchiSulla -> RE: 2by3+ Teams Axis&Soviet Wanted (9/11/2017 5:29:35 PM)
All good... As AGS commander it makes sense that I am deputy supreme commander... [:D]

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