RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (Full Version)

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Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 11:13:34 AM)

I want to thank everybody that is participating with this open beta. The feedback is helping me to work faster (partly by allowing some room for making mistakes) and I am sure we'll have those Pull Points fully hammered out in a further two or three iterations.



demiare -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 11:56:20 AM)

Pull system fail to work correctly in case of several assets:
Image is here
To avoid wasting x2 LP into nowhere I forced to place a 40% traffic sign in branch (40% to all three sub-branches).
Something clearly wrong here - while 100% block now (beta7) allow pull system to pass it (thanks Vic!), but I don't sure I want it cost me twice as much LP...

P.S. Sorry for Gdrive link but I'm too lazy to figure what imagehosts are allowed here.[8|]



Destragon -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 5:24:05 PM)

I can reproduce Demiare's issue. The junction on my city here is pulling 500 points to the south west, even though it only should be pulling 300.

[image]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/504754524079259678/731923569885577217/unknown.png[/image]



Smidlee -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 5:39:48 PM)

Try to delete the south road and instead connect the water directly to the nuclear resource. See if it only pulls 200.
Also try to 100% at the intersection at the end of the red mark instead of trying to block at the city.
I noticed Demiare also put the block in the city instead of the intersection. That way you don't have the pull coming from multi-directions.



Destragon -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 5:52:01 PM)

I noticed another issue.
When you have multiple assets in a line and this line connects back to your main road as a loop, then the pull points for these assets will be oversupplied.
Here on the left I have 100 pull points coming from the capital, which would be enough to satisfy both of these assets. But then on the right, another 100 pull points are coming from the road. I assume this happens because the game hasn't marked the pull points of the second in line asset as "satisfied"?

[image]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/504754524079259678/731930718544068678/unknown.png[/image]


quote:

ORIGINAL: Smidlee
Try to delete the south road and instead connect the water directly to the nuclear resource. See if it only pulls 200.

Well yeah, it works as intended like that, that's how I had it in my game beforehand. I built this split in the road just to see if I can reproduce the issue.



Smidlee -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 6:01:20 PM)

The intersection on the right should have "Travel signs for : Pull points checked since this setting is for each intersection. If you've got two intersection uncheck then it make sense both intersections will allow pull points. This is only useful in the case one route gets cut off by the enemy.

Have you tried to block the intersection where the resources split off instead of in the city above? There settings seem to work for each intersection independently.



Destragon -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 6:12:22 PM)

Nah, I'm pretty sure this is just a bug. It only happens when you have multiple assets in a line.
See here, there's only 1 asset in the loop this time and now the junction on the right isn't sending any pull points southwards.

[image]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/504754524079259678/731935903215255613/pullbugs.jpg[/image]



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 8:59:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Destragon

I noticed another issue.
When you have multiple assets in a line and this line connects back to your main road as a loop, then the pull points for these assets will be oversupplied.
Here on the left I have 100 pull points coming from the capital, which would be enough to satisfy both of these assets. But then on the right, another 100 pull points are coming from the road. I assume this happens because the game hasn't marked the pull points of the second in line asset as "satisfied"?

[image]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/504754524079259678/731930718544068678/unknown.png[/image]


quote:

ORIGINAL: Smidlee
Try to delete the south road and instead connect the water directly to the nuclear resource. See if it only pulls 200.

Well yeah, it works as intended like that, that's how I had it in my game beforehand. I built this split in the road just to see if I can reproduce the issue.


It takes the fastest route so 1 asset pulled from the north and the other from the west



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 9:05:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Destragon

I can reproduce Demiare's issue. The junction on my city here is pulling 500 points to the south west, even though it only should be pulling 300.

[image]https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/504754524079259678/731923569885577217/unknown.png[/image]


Agreed. Will look into this for beta8. Thanks and if you d be so kind send that savefile to vic@vrdesigns.net



Destragon -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/12/2020 9:32:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Vic

It takes the fastest route so 1 asset pulled from the north and the other from the west

Oh yeah, I see. The rare metal mine is 4 steps away from the city with both the top route and the lower route.
Hm, I guess maybe it could be possible for the game to realise that supplying the one asset would also supply the other asset. I dunno.

But either way, it's really nice that we can finally restrict non-pull points from traveling down a road. Thanks.
Seeing that a mine that needs 100 logistics actually only draws 100 logistics is pretty cool.

quote:


Agreed. Will look into this for beta8. Thanks and if you d be so kind send that savefile to vic@vrdesigns.net

This is the same save file as from the "more pull logistics weirdness" email. You just need to build this road south of the capital.
Do you want the save again?



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta7 (last update 12th july!) (7/15/2020 11:27:38 AM)

quote:


This is the same save file as from the "more pull logistics weirdness" email. You just need to build this road south of the capital.
Do you want the save again?

Double checked it and it will be fixed for the next open beta.



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/15/2020 3:09:34 PM)

Posted v104-beta8

No new stuff, but quite a few bug fixes.

Whats left for v104 beta testing is further improving the Pull Points. Notably the remaining issue it that the algorithm can still be much better where it concerns finding the optimal route for the Pull trajectory, which is not always the shortest.

After that i'll move to official v105 patch.

best wishes,
Vic



Tchey -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/15/2020 7:42:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Vic

Posted v104-beta8

After that i'll move to official v105 patch.



Thanks for your hard work !

Do you have an idea if you’re going to keep updating the game at that pace for a long time before moving to something more "stable" ?
Or it all depend on bug reports ?



Malevolence -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 12:47:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Vic

Posted v104-beta8

No new stuff, but quite a few bug fixes.

Whats left for v104 beta testing is further improving the Pull Points. Notably the remaining issue it that the algorithm can still be much better where it concerns finding the optimal route for the Pull trajectory, which is not always the shortest.

After that i'll move to official v105 patch.

best wishes,
Vic


If your next drop is v105 via the normal matrix update, please add an minor separator or indicator in the v105 update notes for changes made between v104-beta8 and v105.

Why? Because if the release update is not a merge from beta, it can be onerous to identify only the added change notes that document fixes made between the beta and the released update.

[image]local://upfiles/34589/36732F74BF5B42F8BA8FEEBA217321C9.jpg[/image]



Leslac -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 10:09:42 AM)

Latest beta (and 6-7 too I think), OHQ doesn't seem to influence combat outcomes. Only SHQ gives a percentage bonus. Or at least the OHQ bonus isn't visible.

Edit: Nevermind... It's when your OHQ is useless that their bonus don't appear.



On another note - I've received around 10 gravitic collectors from one recycling station. That's 5000 free energy production. Considering how important energy is, this is unbalanced to put it mildly. Compared to most of the other ancient artifacts, this is without a doubt the best.

I'd lower the chance of getting the gravitic collector substantially... Especially on hard or higher difficulties.



bvoid -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 1:10:23 PM)

Nevermind gravitic collector..... Cloning center is what's overpowered.

Population is the most important resource and there is no other way to create it from scratch. 500 pop per month is crazy! This should be nerfed to 50/month I suggest. That would be 100 per turn.

Also: I _always_ seem to manage to get a cloning center early on. Watch out for the gold artifact site and immediately start scavenging it. Should produce less population AND be rarer AND possibly use a LOT of power.



Culthrasa -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 2:49:10 PM)

Cloning centre is THE artifact to get yes.... The auto factory and grav collector are nice yes... but CC is the one :)
Also don't nerf plz! :)



mek42 -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 2:49:25 PM)

If I made a copy of the game folder would I be able to have a production version and a beta version?



CzarKasm -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 3:00:55 PM)

Cloning Center = Endless supply of Soylent Green

Food problems solved!



hapshott -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 4:20:44 PM)

Hello,

I get an error message that card 105.png is missing. This is with a clean install, patch 1.03 and then the beta8 patch. I also cannot find this card in the zip file (no card folder). Did I do something wrong?

best regards,

Hapshott



Fizbun -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 4:40:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hapshott

Hello,

I get an error message that card 105.png is missing. This is with a clean install, patch 1.03 and then the beta8 patch. I also cannot find this card in the zip file (no card folder). Did I do something wrong?

best regards,

Hapshott


Latest version is 1.04 not 1.03, maybe the problem is there my dude



Malevolence -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 5:40:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mek42

If I made a copy of the game folder would I be able to have a production version and a beta version?


Yes. Keep in mind, your savegames would be separated.

Ensure your separate shortcuts execute the correct runtime.



hapshott -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 11:19:49 PM)

Thanks for pointing out that 1.04 Is the base patch. I completely missed the release of the 1.04 patch. [>:]



OldSarge -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/16/2020 11:56:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Malevolence

quote:

ORIGINAL: mek42

If I made a copy of the game folder would I be able to have a production version and a beta version?


Yes. Keep in mind, your savegames would be separated.

Ensure your separate shortcuts execute the correct runtime.



You can also use the Generic Mod Enabler JSGME. There are several examples around the forum JSGME

Here is another post explaining how to set it up it by VPaulus on the Slitherine forums: JSGME Setup



Foxador -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/17/2020 5:15:10 AM)

You have a history option for the planet to have a very small size for colonization, is it possible to have one that does the opposite? One where it was heavily colonized so the population was like in the billions? That way you can have a map with a lot of ruins on it and I believer a slightly higher starting planet pop



Elver -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/17/2020 11:46:59 PM)

quote:

-No longer showing agricultural fields during Colonization Planet generation phase if Domed Farms are used


This takes care of the graphical oddity that was present when I reported this, but the other oddity remains: planets with even full-nutrition non-water-based alien plants will still create dome farms during colonization; you can even start with non-functional dome farms owing to a lack of water, but can build xenoag on the first turn which thrives w/o water. It's really weird and seems rather off for planets with no surface water but entirely viable e.g. sulfuric-acid-solvent plants to use dome farms to create Terran water-solvent crops they'll struggle to water.

This previously was an extremely rare niche case, but is now fairly common when selecting the Alien Life history and a hostile planet class (e.g., Cerebus).

[Edit: these planets still list Domed Farms as the recommended type of agriculture as well]



jwarrenw13 -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/18/2020 5:34:11 PM)

Question. Will there be a basic primer on how the new logistics system works when it goes final? I finally broke down and started playing a game with the betas. I don't fully know what is going on because I honestly play without getting too deep into all the numbers behind the log system. I try to use mainly the bottleneck overlay and then after any adjustments the preview points overlay to manage logistics, mainly just by eyeballing those overlays and the supply status of units instead of counting lug nuts on trucks. I've found that the new system seems for me at least to be easier to use with less management than the 1.04 sytem, but it is still complex and requires management. In other words, pretty good. In playing a full game through turn 86 now I've found I'm making more use of building more truck stops and less use of roadblocks to keep things moving, and I have a widespread log network in this game much more complicated than in the two full games I played before trying the beta. In those games I usually had just one operation going at a time. In this game I have one major operation going but four minor operations going at the same time on a Medusa planet fighting alien life forms as well as minor and major powers. In my previous two games I was on a Siwa planet. I'm able to keep all these operations going, though I am having to actively manage to keep supply going to my units. And I enjoy actively managing, but I don't want to go too deep into counting lug nuts. But I still don't fully grasp the changes with the beta supply system and am wondering if someone has written or is going to write a new supply system for dummies tutorial for people like me to are not going to go deep into the numbers and count lug nuts. To the lug nut counters, thanks for all the hard work.



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/19/2020 9:25:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elver

quote:

-No longer showing agricultural fields during Colonization Planet generation phase if Domed Farms are used


This takes care of the graphical oddity that was present when I reported this, but the other oddity remains: planets with even full-nutrition non-water-based alien plants will still create dome farms during colonization; you can even start with non-functional dome farms owing to a lack of water, but can build xenoag on the first turn which thrives w/o water. It's really weird and seems rather off for planets with no surface water but entirely viable e.g. sulfuric-acid-solvent plants to use dome farms to create Terran water-solvent crops they'll struggle to water.

This previously was an extremely rare niche case, but is now fairly common when selecting the Alien Life history and a hostile planet class (e.g., Cerebus).

[Edit: these planets still list Domed Farms as the recommended type of agriculture as well]


Could be a biohazard level issue?

best wishes,
Vic



Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta8 (last update 15th july!) (7/19/2020 9:40:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Vic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elver

quote:

-No longer showing agricultural fields during Colonization Planet generation phase if Domed Farms are used


This takes care of the graphical oddity that was present when I reported this, but the other oddity remains: planets with even full-nutrition non-water-based alien plants will still create dome farms during colonization; you can even start with non-functional dome farms owing to a lack of water, but can build xenoag on the first turn which thrives w/o water. It's really weird and seems rather off for planets with no surface water but entirely viable e.g. sulfuric-acid-solvent plants to use dome farms to create Terran water-solvent crops they'll struggle to water.

This previously was an extremely rare niche case, but is now fairly common when selecting the Alien Life history and a hostile planet class (e.g., Cerebus).

[Edit: these planets still list Domed Farms as the recommended type of agriculture as well]


Could be a biohazard level issue?

I might have to review the rules here.

As it makes sense you could do agriculture with a biohazard suit on.

best wishes,
Vic







Vic -> RE: Open Beta Patch v1.04-beta9 (last update 19th july!) (7/19/2020 9:44:44 AM)

And beta9 has been posted!

There still might be some glitches left in the Pull logistics system, please do give it a spin, ideally with a new game, but I am quite happy now as to the design.

Also added Agricultural Crops details report :)

and some bug fixes.

Thanks for all the feedback, it helps so much to make SE a better more solid game!

Best wishes,
Vic




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