RE: Rangoon Falls (Full Version)

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Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 1:16:21 AM)

I figure Pauk will be out of supply in the pocket area quite quickly unfortunately he can evac to the south leaving only a rearguard as I cannot breakthrough its annoying but not a lot I can do about it he willneed to evac ASAP because otherwise I will get to retreat a Jap army .

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 1:28:49 AM)

In the East well plans continue my reserve fleet is building at Pearl as is the reserve Army.

I have many options and just need to think about where I go next.

Enterprise is now at 14 sys and a fresh Essex Class arrived yesterday.

Colorado is at 32 and Hornet at 31 sys

I get another Essex class in 30 days so sometime in the next 4 weeks the Easter re offensiv will be launched and will go in to hit home.

I would love to launch a diversion in the West to try and suck his forces out of position but thats not possible now so I am sending in enough forces to get the job done whatever Pauk has no messing about this time.




Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 1:33:50 AM)

5th Fleet at Wake has

4 CV, 3 CVL, 20 CVE, 6 BB's, 8 Cruisers and 97 Destroyers.

3rd Fleet's Sqns are filling out

At Pearl or en route

3 CV's, 1 CVL, 21 CVE's, 9 BB's, 35 Cruisers, 96 Destroyers

In repair and hopefully ready or arriving in 30 days

2 CV's, 2 CVE's, 1 BB, 1 Cruiser and 16 more Destroyers.

In total thats a hell of a fleet and I will be combat loading 6,000 AV of 10th US Army.

This time my forces are going in hard location not sure seriously tempted to just do what I should have done last time and hit Toyohara !!!! 



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 1:38:53 AM)

In total that over 2,000 carrier aircraft

240 Marine Corsairs
144 USN Corsairs
600+ Hellcats
100+ Marine Hellcat NF#s
(Still 400 Wildcats I dont have enough Hellcats to re arm the whole fleet)



castor troy -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 10:11:24 AM)

Isnīt there a chance for you to station fighters at Chungking? This would end training raids in China for all time. Is it because the airfield is 100% damaged? No chance to repair it? Fly in 200 eng and eng vehicles and damage canīt be sustained. Then put 150 first line fighters there...



veji1 -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 1:34:54 PM)

I agreee with Castor, you should be able to finish off his training program soon and then his AF will fall apart quickly.

I know you want to win and have paid a heavy price to game mechanisms, but I must say that landing on Toyohara directly would bring this game to a violent and somewhat unfulfilling halt for us readers..

As I advocated for the Marians I guess my advice isn't very good, but don't you have other more "realistic and historic" targets regarding the ingame situation, that would allow you to bring death and destruction to Japan and still preserve a the feeling for the game ?



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 3:16:11 PM)

Opening Chungking and Chengtu is impossible Pauk keeps them well suppressed even now Chungking is 100 damage and Chengtu is 70 - if he give me an opportunity I will grab it !!!.

Re Toyohara I am not serious about it. It would win me the game but the game is not everything.

Problem with realistic targets is the attacker MUST get an AF quickly and despite overwhelming superiority I was unable to do so at the easiest of the Mariana islands.

Any of the others will have Mountains as well as lvl 9 forts - every where I could attack will have lvl 9 forts and rough terrain plus lvl 9 forts = 1 Div stopping 5000 AV.

Andy

Andy



Fishbed -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 4:55:35 PM)

Andy, when you say Toyohara, you mean... Sakkhalin/Admiral Laurent's familiar Toyohara? Or some Toyohara Im not aware of?

Yet even though I understand Castor's point, why not going for some very daring place. You're looking for the Mother of All Battles to destroy once and for all the IJN right? Well...

I'd tell you about Toyohara: why not [:D]
If it is to succeed, that would be a heck of a "home before christmas" strike once and for all [:D]



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 6:22:19 PM)

Oh it would work its a problem of the game one AF and its all over but as last time I looked at it it would ruin the game.

But as others have said although I may dream about it its a step to far for me in terms of credibility.

Its one of those just because you can do it doesnt mean you should Pauk has always played honourably within his set of personal rules I may not agree with them all but then I am dammed sure he doesnt like all of mine [:D][:D] but I also try to play honourably within the constraints I set for myself....

I thought about it against PZB as well but decided against it.

Overall tempting as it is I think th ebest answer is to

a. Hit Entiwock
b. Hit Marcus Island
c. Hit Guam/Saipan or Pagan
d. Throw 10th army in alongside 8th Army on Tinian.

Its a bit brute force but d. is the favourite now if for no other reason than a chance to write off 3,000+ AV of Japanese troops. But I am still deciding

Andy



pat.casey -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 7:32:16 PM)

You think d is going to do the trick? Seems likely that you'd just beach a second whale there, neh?



Fishbed -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 7:33:41 PM)

I think you'd better look for a real extermination engagement with his fleet, maybe during that very same invasion. Once KB gone, you can wander around with no fear... But you difinitely want to knock it out from the war at this stage. As kinda Marianas operation...



veji1 -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 7:40:59 PM)

I am not aware of the actual AV arithmetics anymore, but if you can pull of d, it would be the best game wise : then you can finish of the 2 other islands, bag quite a lot of Jap units, and start flatening the Bonins methodically...



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 8:10:19 PM)

Well if 12,000 + AV cannot win then that is a real problem....

9 Fleet Carriers, 4 Light Carriers 43 CVE's, 16 Battleships, 44 Cruisers and 200+ destroyers in one almighty mass I hope KB comes out to play...

I have waited for superiority and now I am going to use it no more hasty attacks every new carrier that arrives has a full complement of experienced pilots in its fighter wings add to that 10 Sqns of marine Corsairs and 4 of Marine Hellcat NF's and I have enough pilots for one more massive effort. .

3,500 AV x 4 for forts = 14,000 AV defensively BUT my 16 BB's and 44 Cruisers of which 14 are 8" will cause a lot of damage during round the clock bombardments.

The fact is unlike last time I have 400+ Superforts locked and cocked at Pearl.

The plan would be to operate 4 BG's out of Wake as they get fatigued/damaged rotate them between Wake and Pearl.

In every way since last time I am stronger except tanks as most of them are already on Tinian.

I will close Marcus decisively with air and keep it closed and before I land a single trooper I will feint towards the PI as though I am bypassing the Marianas - Pauk will HAVE to commit forces to stop me he wont have a choice or he will have to withdraw his carriers if I stay concentrated he will have to run.

I am tempted to wait 30 days for Shangri La and then go KB hunting at the Palaus if he keeps KB anywhere close then I go after them with everything I have i.e. provoke the carrier battle BEFORE I decide to land troops.

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 8:44:38 PM)

A real thought I have is to do to pauk what I did to PZB.

If I strike towards Borneo with 14th Army or even SEA i.e. bypass Malaya and if I can secure the Marianas then I can strike all out for the PI (not neccesarily Luzon) if I take air bases in the PI, Borneo and Marianas then my Fleet and Armies are united once more at that point Pauk has a MASSIVE problem.

Deplying 6th US Army currently in Burma plus say 14th Army to support 8th US Army and 10th US Army I think causes mayhem for Pauk...

That would leave a Chinese Army plus 12th Indian Army to defend my gains in Burma and upper Malaya



Fishbed -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/7/2008 9:26:06 PM)

Well, I dunno. Your early "jumps" campaign was quite successful against PzB. Invading the Northern Guinea coast, bombing Palau into submission and prepare for a deep strike on the Philippines is an option...

I think you definitely have somekind of an obsession with the Marianas Andy, I'd hate to see that cause you some very painful harm ^^



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/8/2008 8:37:35 PM)

SWPAC is closed to me I sucked most of the forces out and could launch an offensive if I wanted to.

Against PZB I won the first carrier battle in SWPAC  my attacks were very limited in nature and only accelerated AFTER I had eliminated his carriers.

Against Pauk I lost the first carrier battle off the Marshalls and then made a mistake in Malacca straight that cost me another carrier TF so its my own fault.




Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/9/2008 3:08:43 PM)

Another turn passes. Interesting development was LR CAP P40N's over Chengtu that give me a few more possibilities to re open an AF.

Apart from that all is quiet.

I am prepping for an attack on Moulmien in a few days and also for an attack in the south 1 hex west of VP.

OK in 28 days I get Shangri La - in 60 days I get 2 more Essex Class.

I was going to attack after I get Shangri La but I may wait for the other 2 as well as this would provide more superiority for the next attack.

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: Rangoon Falls (1/9/2008 3:10:50 PM)

p.s. waiting those few extra days will guarantee Hornet and Colorado from repair yards as well so would be usefull....



Andy Mac -> IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/9/2008 8:38:30 PM)

I just want to re emphasise something because I think this is important.

Readers of My Limited AAR and Pauk I assume better one [:D][:D] need to understand a few things.

1. Pauk is one of the best players I have faced in any game - he is carefull methodical and he punishes mistakes. (and lets face it I have made a few whoppers yes I have been unlucky but I have made some real stinkers as well)
2. He is an honourable player when we discuss differences in views on HR's or game mechanics we have an open discussion and like ADULTS we agree a way foreward
3. At no time have I EVER had an issue with Pauks fair play on any issue when I lost 3 BB's to a bug PAUK OFFERED ME A REDO - HE WANTED TO DO A REDO - it was MY DECISION because I don't like naval redos please everyone note this one carefully IT WAS MY DECISION not to do a redo just as it is MY DECISION not to train pilots via ground attack.
4. I am aware from a friend who reads both AAR's that there is some argy bargy on Pauks AAR if as a result of this my game ends I will get a 2by4 and come looking for whoever is responsible as my stock games are the only thing keeping me sane during AE and trust me you don't want an insane land team lead on that project.......

Here ends the sermon normal serivce will be resumed and you can all wonder at the next stupid mistake I make [:D][:D][:D]

Andy



veji1 -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/9/2008 8:44:01 PM)

Classy..[&o]



Fishbed -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/9/2008 8:48:56 PM)

:)

quote:

I was going to attack after I get Shangri La but I may wait for the other 2 as well as this would provide more superiority for the next attack.


Right.
If you get defeated in 30 days, these two additional Essex will hardly be enough to get you back on your feet for another attack before the next year. I believe you're quite right to wait for them [:)]



Gen.Hoepner -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/9/2008 8:50:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

I just want to re emphasise something because I think this is important.

Readers of My Limited AAR and Pauk I assume better one [:D][:D] need to understand a few things.

1. Pauk is one of the best players I have faced in any game - he is carefull methodical and he punishes mistakes. (and lets face it I have made a few whoppers yes I have been unlucky but I have made some real stinkers as well)
2. He is an honourable player when we discuss differences in views on HR's or game mechanics we have an open discussion and like ADULTS we agree a way foreward
3. At no time have I EVER had an issue with Pauks fair play on any issue when I lost 3 BB's to a bug PAUK OFFERED ME A REDO - HE WANTED TO DO A REDO - it was MY DECISION because I don't like naval redos please everyone note this one carefully IT WAS MY DECISION not to do a redo just as it is MY DECISION not to train pilots via ground attack.
4. I am aware from a friend who reads both AAR's that there is some argy bargy on Pauks AAR if as a result of this my game ends I will get a 2by4 and come looking for whoever is responsible as my stock games are the only thing keeping me sane during AE and trust me you don't want an insane land team lead on that project.......

Here ends the sermon normal serivce will be resumed and you can all wonder at the next stupid mistake I make [:D][:D][:D]

Andy



Well said Andy!



bobogoboom -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/10/2008 5:35:41 AM)

i will say in this aar what i said in the other one. i thank both of yall for one of the best and most complete aars out there. I get a lot of enjoyment out of them and they have really helped me with the learning curve that is witp.



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/10/2008 3:00:19 PM)

Pauk has a small movement bug issue off of VP.

Its the old 59 mile then stuck issue I am going to pull XXXIII Corps back to VP for a few days to aid him getting the units out.

I was preparing an attack as they will be low on supply but if I attack and win the same bug will stop them retreating so its easier all round to let them out of the pocket - they could have done so anyway so I lose at most one retreat of a force I am not strong enough to follow up aginst anyway.

This is a known issue and there is no question its a bug so I am pulling back.

In other news Deliberate attack at Moulmien got 1:1 so this is good news I will rest a few days continue round the clock air and sea bombardments and then hit him again it should not take long to finish off Moulmien.

Andy



Hortlund -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/10/2008 3:03:35 PM)

Thats very nice of you



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/10/2008 3:05:28 PM)

p.s. I hit Chengtu with LRCAP again and jumped another training run.

Chengtu AF is soooo close to being open.....

If I get it open Pauk is in trouble in China !!!!



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/10/2008 3:08:14 PM)

Its not a quesiton of nice its a land movement bug we have always dealt with these it happened to me at Wyndham and in Burma and we had to redo a turn and also at Songkia where the same bug that faces Pauk happened to me fair is fair.

The only one we did not redo and with hindsight we should have was the Perth one but in all fairness neither of us new it was a bug then so its just one of those things.

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/11/2008 6:03:49 PM)

I attacked againb at Moulmien trying to be cute and ordered all British units to standown as I need to work out where I am going to get replacements as they are reallly short.

Didnt work out as planned as I just failed to get 1:1.

Looks like I am stuck with another grinding attack.

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/11/2008 6:42:06 PM)

p.s. Pauk hit Chengtu hard but my fighters were resting so the AF is shut and will remain shut for the forseeable future

Andy



Andy Mac -> RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE (1/11/2008 6:45:29 PM)

The fleets are coming together achingly slowly I cannot believe I need to wait but I do

The next fight is make or break I must win and will big I am restocking fighters and bombers and sitting tight.

The BPF starts to arrive soon and I think I may need to ask them to perform their historic role as an adjunct to the US Pacific Fleet.

Indefategable and Implacable are actually not bad ships and with Saratoga and Cabot to support make a powerfull TF especially with the RN CVE's in support.

I may just send the whole lot to the Pacific or I can use them from my coast hopping stikes along Malaya.

Andy



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