RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My!

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My!

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 4:11:25 AM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
Ah, but see... Tanks use VEH! Guns use ARM, and I can never remember if squads do or not. I just remember that the cost of building out units that are almost all squads is very, very low. I think we even discussed it many pages back in this very AAR .

Why accelerate all the TKs? Why not just normal build? Have you looked at simply building the Std-A ships (IIRC costs 19?) and converting them to TKs (takes about a month)?

I understand that tanks use vehicles, I am just not going to increase my production past current levels.

I didn't accelerate all the tankers, but a whole slew of them. Plus LSTs. I went thru today and dialed it back to 431 merchant builds. I don't like shutting off ships, well, at least until it gets hopeless. I guess it kind of is, but still turning off ship is tough for me personally.

I get it. I look at it like this:

When's the ship going to arrive if I accelerate it? What do the Allies have by then? What do I expect to have by then (best/worst case)? How much use am I going to get out of it? How long until it will likely be sunk, and therefore be negative VPs for me?

At some point, TKs are going to cross the threshold to not worth it for me. I expect they will do so before I reach your game's date, but that also depends on how many I lose between now and then.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 8:38:19 AM

Spidery

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VP wise you look like you are in a better position than Obvert was!

Subtract the base VP, which are all temporary for Japan and going to the Allies eventually, and the ratio in Obvert's game was about 27200 J to 17600 A and in your game 42400 J to 33400 A. The Allies need to get a 2::1 ratio to win. In Obvert's game they needed about 37000 VP (not counting bases) but in yours they need 51000.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 8:57:00 AM

obvert

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You've both lost a ton of ships too! This probably is harder on Japan.

As far as building goes if you have surplus oil/fuel pooling in the DEI without the ability to get it to the HI, then build more, but maybe don't accelerate. If some of the Std-A/B are close those do convert to TK as Loka mentioned. The more you do build the more will sink eventually, but oil/fuel is something you have to move, so it's always a balancing act. The LSTs are fun, but not really critical. You have a ton of xAKL that function almost as well and are already there.

The Es start coming fast a furiously soon. These will stun you in their ability to shut down Allied subs.

Vehicles points are really low and you will need a bunch of these. I think mine was set to 250 if I remember, and I ended up short due to having to rebuild divisions. In 45 though a huge amount of new troops arrive.

_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 9:00:11 AM

obvert

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Spidery

VP wise you look like you are in a better position than Obvert was!

Subtract the base VP, which are all temporary for Japan and going to the Allies eventually, and the ratio in Obvert's game was about 27200 J to 17600 A and in your game 42400 J to 33400 A. The Allies need to get a 2::1 ratio to win. In Obvert's game they needed about 37000 VP (not counting bases) but in yours they need 51000.

Probably true, but I perhaps naively built nearly every base to max in the HI. Too much supply wasted, but also those base points were not all ones likely to fall. In general though yes.

The hotter and more bloody the war is the bette for your points ratio as long as you're getting better than 1:2.

It looks to me like you're doing great Lowpe!

_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 9:10:55 AM

njp72

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I can talk only from my own experiences but I was absolutely amazed at the acceleration of Allied VPs past Apr 44.

Once the Allies establish a foothold they rapidly obliterate everything in their path. Once I allowed the Allies into China my fortunes completely nosedived.

You can never have enough VPs - good luck

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spidery

VP wise you look like you are in a better position than Obvert was!

Subtract the base VP, which are all temporary for Japan and going to the Allies eventually, and the ratio in Obvert's game was about 27200 J to 17600 A and in your game 42400 J to 33400 A. The Allies need to get a 2::1 ratio to win. In Obvert's game they needed about 37000 VP (not counting bases) but in yours they need 51000.

Probably true, but I perhaps naively built nearly every base to max in the HI. Too much supply wasted, but also those base points were not all ones likely to fall. In general though yes.

The hotter and more bloody the war is the bette for your points ratio as long as you're getting better than 1:2.

It looks to me like you're doing great Lowpe!

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 4235

RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 12:45:42 PM

Lowpe

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Thanks everyone for the comments, much appreciated and put away for consideration.

On Vehicles: Yes, my pools are low. I guess production is low, as when I got the game I still had the starting production levels, I immediately expanded to 180-190 then boosted it sometime after that to 211.

Even though my pools are low, I only have two Armored units below TOE and those were the two regiments trashed from Tuang Gyi to Chiang Mai. Yes, I realize vehicles also are embedded in INF an ART too, but I am not certain raising them at this point is very cost effective.

_______
I did raise my Jack fighter production levels, 1 point today. Lol!

I am pretty certain this will go to 100 or more by the time the J2M3 arrives as I can't see protecting the HI and sweeping the Allies with current production of George. I bought back several fighter squadrons that were destroyed in the KB losses and these will go to HI protection too.

For the first part of 44 I will be living with the Ki100I, George and Jack. Oscar for escort. A6M5c rear area defense. I guess I have Nicks too, in this area. Still have several squadrons of Tojo IIc, one shuttered factory and 100+ planes in the pool. I don't know what to do with the factory it is a large one at 150.

I like the Ki100I, I was talked into the plane, had regrets, but then once in service it does very well in its place of defender, bomber killer, ship protector. It isn't that bad sweeping either. Not great but the best the Army currently has.

---------

Nightfighters. The Nick D comes along in a few scant days. Production will be high, as I understand these guys die pretty quickly. It is my interim NF until the Peggy comes along, but I am not expecting that until April 44. A lot can change between now and then. I have been going thru my old posts identifying all the squadrons that can go to Nick D's and once again I am disappointed in the number...but my goal is to have every NF squadron manned and fully functional protecting the HI when the B29 comes around.

------

Here is looking forward to a new year. It will be bloody!

(in reply to njp72)

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 1:55:07 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

The Es start coming fast a furiously soon. These will stun you in their ability to shut down Allied subs.

Here are my upcoming E's. As you can see I boosted them all, I want them out there hunting Subs.

Which type of E is commonly referred to as Super Es?

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 2:04:33 PM

ny59giants

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quote:

Which type of E is commonly referred to as Super Es?

I think they were the "E No. **" before the data base was adjusted.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 3:01:04 PM

Lowpe

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Type C and D then. They seem as effective as the Eorufu's I have already which is very good.

Fuel efficient little guys! I look forward to using them to aggressively hunt Allied subs, which I hate with a passion.

I find the sub war very interesting, the Allies seem to jump around on strategies, and occasionally it all goes quiet (upgrades I guess), but it is fun and different if a little clicky!

Allied subs might be in for a shock then in 1944...I will also be using the Lorna, and once air radar gets active it might be very unpleasant. Let us hope so!

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 4:41:01 PM

HansBolter

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I can't see them being nearly as effective with only 7 ASW devices (all depth charges) as they apparently were before the nerf.

7 ASW is a minimum for most American ASW craft after mid 43 with most having either 8 or 11 including specialized devices such as Hedgehogs and Mousetraps.

These E babies don't look like much to get excited about from an Allied perspective.

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Hans

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 5:01:30 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter
These E babies don't look like much to get excited about from an Allied perspective.

But for JFBs', you see, we have much lower expectations!

Any port in a storm, you know.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 5:44:56 PM

ny59giants

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Don't forget to check each of your "E" for leaders. They come out with lousy experience and it will be the ships captain and TF commander's qualities that make them successful. They don't cost many PPs.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 6:14:34 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Don't forget to check each of your "E" for leaders. They come out with lousy experience and it will be the ships captain and TF commander's qualities that make them successful. They don't cost many PPs.

I have changed most of my better ships, especially those that I have tasked as hunter killers! Great advice.

Here are the 10 knot sub chasers. They use a lot of fuel considering how fast they steam! I used to just set these guys in ports with 2 hex reactions, but now I have gone to using them extensively in troop and supply convoys to the Islands around Japan. Stick 7 or so in a task force, and nothing has ever bothered the merchants. Seems to work really well, but is restricted to short range use really.

Every ship has a use, except for maybe the early SSTs.

I like these Sub Chasers.

But, then again, I am strange as I like Japan.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 6:21:24 PM

Lowpe

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And finally, the greatest three ships for escorting Tonan Whalers or other large and fast tankers. Don't lose these guys early on, but they do make good Amphibious ship leaders too early on.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 6:25:40 PM

obvert

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I don't care what their stats are, but they work. There are a lot of them which is the most important thing. Suddenly you have too many escorts and you can run hunter-killer groups. The 3inch ASW mortar is the difference I think which the Etorofu also have. It's effective deep and these guys just seem to kill whatever they attack if the DL is high. Best combined with lots of air search.

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/7/2015 7:32:01 PM >

_____________________________

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 10:21:18 PM

Lowpe

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I finally found a post showing B29 losses in Obvert's game vs. Jocke.

Up until late September the primary night fighter was only the first Irving. No Nicks at all. You can see this particular night must be darn near the initial Dinah NF debut, and from reading I believe Obvert stuffed that first group with good pilots to boot.

At the beginning of the year Obvert had 12K plane losses, almost 20K lost in 1944.

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/7/2015 11:23:13 PM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 11:38:48 PM

Lowpe

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Since group-think here thinks my Vehicles very low, and I guess you can include me in that group think. What are the deleterious effects of having low vehicle points.

As I understand it, a new vehicle costs 1 vehicle point and 1 manpower per load value of the vehicle in question.

Here is a look at my AFV's courtesy of Tracker. Please note, most tank shortages come from the two Regiments that were trashed and all but destroyed in the fighting prior to Chiang Mai, and then at Chiang Mai, and then thru the long retreat to Raheng.

I wonder why the vickers has such a high load cost? Scarcity?

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/8/2015 1:27:10 AM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 11:40:42 PM

Lowpe

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Ok, I don't think AFVs are that bad, the only below strength are at Raheng and at Chungking.

But here is a look at the other vehicles:

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 11:51:37 PM

Lowpe

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Now, then, that doesn't look so good. But at least some of the shortage is because I have turned off reinforcements.

Now, here is the potentially major deleterious effect:

When a reinforcing unit becomes active, you must pay for the troops and vehicles. If you don't have enough in the pools, the unit will start at 25% starting strength to represent emergency mobilization. Which means units might take several weeks to build up to full strength and you might lose any nifty experience they enter with (not sure about the latter).

So you want to have generous pools when there is a fresh unit coming in with lots of vehicles. This may cause me to micromanage my vehicle pool closely.

Now, a second nasty effect is the under strength Artillery as it becomes very fragile in battle.

And a third is the in general lower support available to the troops which impact in reducing fatigue, disruption, etc, etc.

Here is the tracker chart for vehicles...My red pool of vehicles is pretty much base lined around 0. I can see the incoming demand quite nicely, i.e. when the units appear.

I didn't think of this until now, but at the end game, when supplies are super tight, perhaps if you set all your devices to stockpile right prior to a big infantry unit coming on as a reinforcement (and you don't need the AV), you would get the unit at one quarter strength, subsequently eating only 1/4 the supplies? No idea if that would work.

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/8/2015 1:02:09 AM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 11:56:10 PM

Lowpe

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And for comparison here is the armaments chart, where I am in seriously good shape.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/7/2015 11:57:04 PM

Lowpe

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And the final deleterious effect is that if my vehicle factories are bombed out, there is no pool available to draw from. Back to the shoeleather express for everyone!

But come on, how many AFBs bomb the vehicle factories? Sure, they bomb manpower and that can trash any factory, but actually target vehicles?

And finally, I can't see any way shape or form I can last until Russian activation where vehicles are eaten for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

The usual outcome when Japanese armor meets American armor.

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/8/2015 1:21:07 AM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 6:00:09 AM

obvert

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

And the final deleterious effect is that if my vehicle factories are bombed out, there is no pool available to draw from. Back to the shoeleather express for everyone!

But come on, how many AFBs bomb the vehicle factories? Sure, they bomb manpower and that can trash any factory, but actually target vehicles?

And finally, I can't see any way shape or form I can last until Russian activation where vehicles are eaten for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

The usual outcome when Japanese armor meets American armor.

That is seriously great pic! Ha!

Nothing like photography to give the real perspective on things.

You might be okay on vehicles as long as you don't lose full divisions like I did. It's the late divisions in the HI that eat up most of it adding to your combat losses. If you can build a small pool it could keep you ahead until 45 at least when you'll never have enough. Again though, those divisions are on the HI so you can just turn off replacements and keep your necessary troops in vehicles if you want to.

_____________________________

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 8:29:47 AM

Spidery

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June 1944 you will be wanting about 8000 vehicle points to upgrade from the Type 1 medium tank to the Type 3. Going from a so-so tank to one of the best tanks in the game. You might stockpile Type 1 until then so you can avoid building tanks that are just going to be upgraded. You'll get the vehicle points back when the replaced Type 1 tanks are recycled but that is not until the end of 1944.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 12:04:03 PM

Lowpe

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Jan 2, 1943

No night bombing. Speaking of which, another Navy squadron comes in a few scant days, raising my total of Navy night fighters to 3 squadrons of 18, 18, and 20 planes. They are all flying the Irving Sa, which is the three gun version and will have radar in 6 months. Nick D will start production in several days, and I have found only two squadrons I can immediately upgrade to it (4th and 5th Sentai) with 36 and 42 planes respectively (they both resize to 49 in March 44). The 4th Sentai is restricted to General Reserve, but that is okay.

The 4th and 5th are both in Nick FBs now, which I stopped production of, so these planes will probably end up going to some freshly converted bomber to FB squadrons I have my eye on. I like them for rear area bomber defense.

The rest of the Army NFs:

53rd Sentai 49 planes (4/44) goes to Nick D
14th Sentai 27 planes goes to Peggy I
81st Chutai 12 planes goes to III KAI Dinah
82nd Chutai 9 planes goes to III KAI Dinah

106, 107th, 16th IF Chutai are all reinforcements around October.

I have seen the 28th Sentai as a night fighting squadron, but for the life of me I can't find it. Can't find squadrons that join up to form it.

Back to the war: Helens raid Akyab, and I lose 3 to flak. Allies unfortunately moved out their airplanes (20 bombers, and 37 aux) so I pretty much have to settle for other damage. You may say what is the point, but the Allied 4Es bomb Udon Thani and Vientiane leaving my troops alone which is good because the TOE of the AA present in the ground troops was able to repair from a battered 25% to 50% given the days respite. Also, I just want to do offensive things to keep the Allies dedicating part of their forces to defense.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 12:10:41 PM

Lowpe

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Indochina/Burma:

Allies don't bomb any troops. It may be a fatigue thing, or it maybe the weather. The George sweep doesn't fly (Pegu), and Chungking isn't bombed, so perhaps weather.

The Allies settle for bombardments across the front, and in general Japan gets the better of it. The 1st Tank Div arrives in the Moulmein/Bangkok defensive positions, and their presence will allow the swapping of the weary 1st Division out to be replaced by the fresh heavy 4th ID.

Tavoy gets fast transported in supplies, and a BB bombardment force is standing off, within range, but has 3 detection. I might re-route to something else or simply retreat.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 12:13:38 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Spidery

June 1944 you will be wanting about 8000 vehicle points to upgrade from the Type 1 medium tank to the Type 3. Going from a so-so tank to one of the best tanks in the game. You might stockpile Type 1 until then so you can avoid building tanks that are just going to be upgraded. You'll get the vehicle points back when the replaced Type 1 tanks are recycled but that is not until the end of 1944.

Great advice.

Will need to examine it, and see what I can turn off.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/8/2015 1:19:00 PM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 12:19:05 PM

Lowpe

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Sub activity: I lose a PB fast transporting supplies, and an E, one of the W-19 class Es that had two hits on a sub yesterday and ran out of ammo. I have noticed, that once a DD, or E runs out of ammo they are very vulnerable. The E was returning to port with 3 other Es (3 with ammo, led by an Etorofu) and was shot at twice, with the second sub getting the hit.

In return, bombers nailed the Hoe (Gato class) of Dinagat. At least it shows sunk for now.

1943 sub losses, the December reports are somewhat iffy.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 1:26:33 PM

Lowpe

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Chungking

Big attack tomorrow. Forts are at 2, Chinese raw AV at 2000. Hopefully the weather clears and I get a good day of bombing in. Will try the Myojo divebombers for the first time. Not great ground skill, but they are there to eat up more supply primarily.

You can see the scattered Chinese units all around, If I can grab Chungking I will need to wipe them out, a long process. Several are totally surrounded.

If I can take Chungking, that really improves my strategic position!

Just seems a shame it comes down to huge stacks. However, if there were stacking limits, and China was getting destroyed units back at Chungking overstacking the base that would be pretty bad too.

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 1:57:54 PM

Lowpe

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Just a quick note on pilot training. Tracker's chart told me the cost in HI at the beginning of the month should be 54K; however, actually cost was 39K.

You see, I have run out of Navy pilots and pull them from the school prematurely. Doesn't really hurt the pilots or the training school any since Tracom has really upped their skill set.

But it did save me over 10K in HI.

Is this a cheat? Don't know, but I do need the pilots. If I remember correctly, I had pull the Navy pool of 10-12 month trainees down to like 1-200. Today, after the new month and some more Tracom wonders it is back up to 1000 at 41 experience.

I graduated 0 Navy pilots this month into the replacement pool.

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/8/2015 2:56:52 PM >

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RE: Bolts, Cats and Spits, Oh My! - 5/8/2015 4:50:13 PM

JocMeister

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Wonder how many VPs it will net you? Hopefully enough to prolong the game for a month or two.

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