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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 10:50:38 AM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		While the Allies were bombing Magwe, they thought to sneak two more cargo ships into Akyab.

Nells, flying at 4000 feet get past the CAP, thanks to the Oscars sacrifice, and scratch two more cargo ships. At least they were large ships.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 10:57:53 AM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

About your China question above, I'd have to see a bigger picture. Can you post a larger shot of China?

The clock is ticking here, and I'd be thinking territory rather than cleaning up run-down Chinese units at the minute. You want the mountains especially. Are you there yet?


Not to well on getting the mountains, my thought had been to eliminate Changsha pocket and move west with those forces...

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Post #: 1562
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 11:01:57 AM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Allies stop bombarding at Prome, and to be quite honest, I am somewhat afraid to start since the horrible losses I suffered on my first bombardment.

The Aoba is hit with two fish outside of Rangoon, the sub gets punished a little, but not enough.






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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 1:02:33 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

About your China question above, I'd have to see a bigger picture. Can you post a larger shot of China?

The clock is ticking here, and I'd be thinking territory rather than cleaning up run-down Chinese units at the minute. You want the mountains especially. Are you there yet?


Not to well on getting the mountains, my thought had been to eliminate Changsha pocket and move west with those forces...



If you have them surrounded you can get them anytime. Better to get them after you have more territory and possibly after Chungking Chengtu so they don't just respawn to fight you again.

_____________________________

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Post #: 1564
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 1:09:11 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		I wonder if I can hit Imphal with a lightly escorted bomber raid.

That has to be his transport fleet flying in supplies...

IJA bombers have been fairly quiet, so they are ready to go...but escorts will be not great.

Only 24 defensive guns.






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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 1:27:28 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert
If you have them surrounded you can get them anytime. Better to get them after you have more territory and possibly after Chungking Chengtu so they don't just respawn to fight you again.


Perhaps I am being really stupid here in China, but my general thought was to to push west and secure the mountains before moving more in the Central Plains.

I have been trying to do things in China with basically only the local supply. I am not shipping supplies to China, but would have to if I step up the bombing campaign in China in the Central Plains.

My basic strategy was to push China back to the central plains and defend. Really to conserve supplies.

I am 4.25 million supplies, growing 10K a day.









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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 3:13:33 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Status: offline 		Looking good for you I think.

EDIT: I think going for the mountains is a good idea if you plan on the destruction of the forces in the central plains. If your goal is the bases in the Chungking basin you might just as well go straight for it. This might entice him to head for the hills.

< Message edited by JocMeister -- 8/8/2014 4:20:10 PM >

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Post #: 1567
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 3:34:07 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Looking good for you I think.

EDIT: I think going for the mountains is a good idea if you plan on the destruction of the forces in the central plains. If your goal is the bases in the Chungking basin you might just as well go straight for it. This might entice him to head for the hills.


+1

This is exactly what I was advocating.

_____________________________

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Post #: 1568
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 6:46:58 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Cross your fingers, the Artillery at Prome is bombarding. I hope I don't suffer huge losses again from some blip. I am moving six more heavy artillery units there, in the hopes that they can really nail Allied afvs. I flew in another good squadron of Zeroes A6M5c for defense...they are so far superior to the Tojo IIas especially against bombers.

Bombing Imphal during the day. Hopefully, he has no CAP and I can nail those transports. Night bombing another base in Burma. I am struggling to be able to use my bombers in a meaningful way in Burma....

That reminds me of a question: many people have mentioned the Jack as being a great fighter especially for its climb ability, but the Tojo II series climb is better but ultimately lacks cannons. So why is the Jack so good?

I get a Ki202 factory to 10 percent repaired...long way to go.






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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 7:13:28 PM   
mind_messing

 

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quote:

That reminds me of a question: many people have mentioned the Jack as being a great fighter especially for its climb ability, but the Tojo II series climb is better but ultimately lacks cannons. So why is the Jack so good?


It's an IJN fighter.

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Post #: 1570
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 7:41:10 PM   
JocMeister

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing
It's an IJN fighter.


+1

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Post #: 1571
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 9:32:56 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		So a better comparison is Jack vs George. I picked George, as I wanted the heavier firepower...although later versions of Jack adds all cannons and the middle Jack has a SR of 2.






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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/8/2014 11:26:56 PM   
obvert


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Status: offline 		The J2M2 is not better than the Tojo IIc, but as mentioned above, it is a lot better for LBA than the planes it replaces, the A6M5, usually. The service rating sucks, but the J2M3 is great with service 2 and comes sooner than the second gen George.

The J2M2-3 are not better than the N1K1-2, but the service 2 coming sooner is big, and the climb rate is fantastic. In stock it's also got that extra bit of speed which helps immensely against the best Allied fighters.

Build both. Try them out. See what you like. For my needs I like both.

_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

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Post #: 1573
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 11:20:29 AM   
Lowpe


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No night bombing. In fact no Allied bombing of any type.

Raid on Imphal goes in and damages 7 transports against zero CAP. Hopefully this will force the Allies to assign CAP to the base. The transports are probably delivering supplies to China or Prome.

The IJA bombardment of Prome results in heavy losses for both sides, both sides gain 7 land combat victory points.






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Post #: 1574
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 12:17:04 PM   
ny59giants


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Status: offline 		Jack vs Tojo - Climb rates

Players now have two sets of air data. Stock vs DBB's most recent which was redone by Symon/JWE. I think all the DBB mods use it now and so does the latest three mods being done by John 3rd and me (along with others). Many of us readers start to post things and forget what mod or stock scenario the AAR is based on so we make comments based on what we are playing. I'm using the latest DBB data, so my comments are from that system.

From DBB:
Ki-44 IIa = 3370
Ki-44 IIc = 3318

J2M2 = 3585
J2M3 = 3560

Climb rate is better, add in cannons, and its IJN vs IJA.

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Post #: 1575
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 12:19:43 PM   
ny59giants


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Status: offline 		Ledo - Any recon info on this base?? As Allied player, I usually base my transports here to get supplies into China along with the Ceylon AA brigade to take a bite out of Japanese bombers. Might help to do a raid here as some point.

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Post #: 1576
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 12:30:22 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		At Prome, I am going to bombard more, this time adding in the infantry divisions and tank division, while putting into reserve the three artillery units that suffered losses and disruption.

The Infantry and Tank division are dug in to a fort level of 2, and add a substantial number of tubes, while exposing their troops to substantial counter battery fire.

My goal is to continue eating supply, and hopefully trading losses 1-1 victory point wise.


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Post #: 1577
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 12:42:12 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Ledo - Any recon info on this base?? As Allied player, I usually base my transports here to get supplies into China along with the Ceylon AA brigade to take a bite out of Japanese bombers. Might help to do a raid here as some point.


I have to move my bombers, to avoid the inevitable Allied bombing and sweeping response, but will rest for a few days and then hit Ledo.

Does bombing the airfield the transports deliver to increase op losses for the transports?

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Post #: 1578
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 1:26:54 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Allies simply have so many toys....the only way that I see to stop these beasties is hitting the base.






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Post #: 1579
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 1:51:58 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Prome will be a size 10 airfield before to long if the supplies keep flowing to it. Ugh.

I am going to reinforce the Magwe push with another infantry division...making it a 3 division assault.

Will my troops simply present in the road hex effect the flow of supplies from hexside to hexside or do I need to block a road hexside? I think I know the answer.






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Post #: 1580
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 7:03:34 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

The J2M2 is not better than the Tojo IIc, but as mentioned above, it is a lot better for LBA than the planes it replaces, the A6M5, usually. The service rating sucks, but the J2M3 is great with service 2 and comes sooner than the second gen George.

The J2M2-3 are not better than the N1K1-2, but the service 2 coming sooner is big, and the climb rate is fantastic. In stock it's also got that extra bit of speed which helps immensely against the best Allied fighters.

Build both. Try them out. See what you like. For my needs I like both.


Right now, I am thinking I will totally skip the Jack line. George and then Sam for land based naval defense. I should get the Sam-J a year early I think.

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Post #: 1581
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 7:16:25 PM   
Spidery

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

The J2M2 is not better than the Tojo IIc, but as mentioned above, it is a lot better for LBA than the planes it replaces, the A6M5, usually. The service rating sucks, but the J2M3 is great with service 2 and comes sooner than the second gen George.

The J2M2-3 are not better than the N1K1-2, but the service 2 coming sooner is big, and the climb rate is fantastic. In stock it's also got that extra bit of speed which helps immensely against the best Allied fighters.

Build both. Try them out. See what you like. For my needs I like both.


Right now, I am thinking I will totally skip the Jack line. George and then Sam for land based naval defense. I should get the Sam-J a year early I think.



Is the Sam-J better than the basic Sam? Slightly faster, worse climb and maneuver, 30mm instead of 20mm cannon. Depends a bit how the game handles the UP-mounted cannon in fighter versus fighter combat.

Are you researching the Shinden at all?

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Post #: 1582
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 7:26:52 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Upcoming turn goodness:

Air raid on Mili....100 fighters sweeping, 70 bombers hitting the airfield hoping to get some of those long range recon planes there. The air base is only size 2, so hopefully it will be a good raid.

Bigger IJA bombardment at Prome. This could be nasty for me.

Submarine swarm off Calcutta. Haven't done this in a while, and Allies are using Calcutta to ship supplies to Akyab. His ASW search is weak here, strong near Akyab.

Lots of planes in Burma on naval attack. I dangled the CA force, and normally Allies respond with trying to protect Akyab with something. Sent Lilly IIbs to Car Nicobar which might surprise him. It is nice, able to fly out of a level 2 air field --- chose 11 hex range. Wouldn't it be sweet to surprise his British carriers floating around here...although how good the 100 kg SAP bombs will be on an armored flight deck?

Other than that building up the Kuriles, expanded search there as well and I transferred one of the islands over to the General Reserve.

Marianas & Bonins are being built up continuously.

I need to find a home for the KB away from his prying eyes. Ulithi maybe? Guam? I fear it is so far back as to take it out of the defense of the Marshalls.

I would like to do some strategic bombing, but I am afraid of opening up that can of worms since the Allies haven't done much of it at all. As long as Magwe is still pumping oil, I can't really afford to use that particular tool. I have almost 3 million oil!

I moved some fighters to Lanchow and AA is on the way there as well. It probably is a good base for high SR planes like the Tony...


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Post #: 1583
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/9/2014 7:32:28 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Spidery
Is the Sam-J better than the basic Sam? Slightly faster, worse climb and maneuver, 30mm instead of 20mm cannon. Depends a bit how the game handles the UP-mounted cannon in fighter versus fighter combat.

Are you researching the Shinden at all?



Sam J -- I chose it because it is a bomber killer. It can really shred 4Es. Plus I am hoping the Ki202 will keep the enemy fighters busy. If I can protect the HI until late 44, there should be literally a ton of Ki202s.

No Shinden. I like it a lot, but wanted to try some different end war planes, plus I wanted to go big with very few frames at the end. Not realistic, I know, but then neither is the endgame.


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Post #: 1584
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 4:36:51 AM   
Lowpe


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Night bombing by IJA ineffective. Flak downs a bomber over Burma.

However, during the day a very good showing the Empire. The Lilly IIb struts their stuff,
notching another cargo ship (not the British CV I was hoping for), while Zeroes outnumber some Allied fighters near Prome.

In the Marshalls, Mili is swept to no resistance, and the airfields bombed, but no long range recon planes are damaged.






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Post #: 1585
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 4:46:05 AM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Well, well, well!

The poor Hermes is out of drydock...we last roughed her up with some shells from a battleship off northern Oz.

How this ship, sailing around with one escort, has managed to avoid being attacked and sunk by Betties is a testament to advanced weather and monsoons.

Anyhow, her days might be numbered now. Hopefully she has 40-80 percent flooding damage and is moving slow.

My Cruiser forces in undetected and subs will swarm the area. Where do you think she will head for?




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Post #: 1586
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 4:49:22 AM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Finally, the bombardment at Prome. I lost 3 lcu VP, while the Allies lost 7. Granted there was some losses in China and probably elsewhere too for the Allies.

I will keep it up as long as the supply gets to Prome!




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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 8/10/2014 6:00:06 AM >

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Post #: 1587
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 5:06:44 AM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Burma -- big picture.

Hermes will be tough to catch I think...even a full speed run by the Cruiser force would be very risky...getting real close to Allied air power at Madras.

15 P40K and Hurricanes downed for 3 Zeroes and 2 Tojo. Good day in Burma.




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RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 8:35:43 AM   
JocMeister

 

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Status: offline 		I think your opponent is in trouble. Looks like he has realized that too and started pulling some units from Prome to guard his flank. Now I wonder if he has enough to stop you. Any idea on what he has at Akyab?

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Post #: 1589
RE: Burma Bungle! - 8/10/2014 12:24:17 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

I think your opponent is in trouble. Looks like he has realized that too and started pulling some units from Prome to guard his flank. Now I wonder if he has enough to stop you. Any idea on what he has at Akyab?


9 units, 19,000 men, 131 guns, 61 afvs. Akyab still damaged from the bombardments from a week ago.

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Post #: 1590
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