The 11th Hour, er Turn

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> SPWaW AAR/DAR >> The 11th Hour, er Turn

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The 11th Hour, er Turn - 5/27/2003 9:59:18 AM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

Or is it the 12th?

No partisans were spotted this time so we head for the front. I know that there is at least one more and likely two. I'll search for them soon.

I give ground in the south hoping to regroup. Everyone is heading that way anyway so I just follow. In a turn or two the tide will change again. My haevy arty is pounding the advance up the road but I can't see any effect. I just can't see.:confused:

The North sees more Tank to tank action. Everyone else is running. My Char Bis takes out one R40 or was it a 35? Also two of two of those recycled things from WWI went down to R35s. All other shots bounced like an India rubber ball.

The North road looks open but who knows. I need to get to those 81mm mortars. I silence them and CP is done. No arty, no routing, no running (who am I fooling??)

Come on Capt. lets punch those wet paper bags and move on out.

Carrion my wayward friend! There'll be peas when we are done.:cool:

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 31

Turn 12 - 6/1/2003 9:42:31 PM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

I'm thinking the Poles have a hard time running when their pants are full of cr@p.

It seems the French push has lost some steam. No doubt the incessant irritation of 75 and 81mm shells raining down from Polish artillery is helping. :D

Even though I've set some nasty ambushes along his advance, my pathetic little pea-shooters just can't make a dent. 40mm AA are starting to join the fireline. This is [I]not[/I] good news. :mad:

Next up are going to be the howitzers direct firing into the advancing French armor. This is the last act of defiance, when I start commiting my artillery to direct fire confrontations. :eek:

Many wagons and trucks, their usefulness as transports evaporating, are either heading for the retreat hex or serving as OpFire decoys. (I know it's cheap, but I'm getting my @$$ [I]so[/I] whipped, I'm getting desperate. :rolleyes:

At least Buzzard's not rolling through me without a fight. :cool:

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 32

Rolling through you?? - 6/2/2003 11:46:14 AM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

Ha !! As if anyone could just roll through the defenses you put up.

Hoards of partisans. Dozens of engineers. ATGs by the score. AUX tanks that can only be penetrated but luck or a CharBis monsters and NOW. Bofors 40mm!!! That kill my tanks!!!

This is no stroll through the Tulips, my friend. I'm a tip-toeing with big sticks and I still can't punch a hole. 2/3s of my mighty French forces are running and I'm trying to fight while arty takes croisant breaks every second turn. [SIZE=1]bitch bitch bitch grumble grumble grumble. I sound like a ____ with PMS.[/SIZE]

Despite the routed units, tanks that can't hit anything [SIZE=1]not new for me.[/SIZE] and the general lack of cohesive command [SIZE=1]that is me[/SIZE] its a lot of fun smashing and bashing and not hurting much of anything.

I'm just running with what still answers the horns and whistles. You have been pushing forward in the south. Me in the north. Sounds pretty even to me. Some your tanks die this turn. One of mine dies. Some of my infantry are routed some of your partisans get wasted.

Its a good game. BTW I am not bailing any crews in this game.

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 33

Hey CP - 6/17/2003 10:06:21 PM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

Did you see this?

The Poles are kicking butt.:D

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=457901#post457901

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 34

Well sure, but - 6/17/2003 11:51:08 PM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

I could bait [I]Jess'[/I] Germans with a stick and a wet blanket. :D

Against a competent opponent (and that's an understatement concerning you, buddy) the Poles are a real challenge. :eek:

I haven't dropped out, just busy in other things. Please have patience for my poor performance in turning this game turn around. I'll do it soon. Promise. :rolleyes:

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 35

Turn 17 - Lunch! - 6/19/2003 1:22:25 AM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

Buzzard, your lunch is lying on the road (in the form of dead or retreating Polish tanker crews :rolleyes: )

Not much exciting happened in the last 2 minutes.
Some Voltiguers have been driven back from the southern hill.
Several Citroens got smart and exited the battlefield. (No medals for them!)
Much noise was made by Polish ATGs and AAs, but nothing much was accomplished. (I did use up some more of my precious ammo, tho') I might as well be fighting Tigers for all the good it's doing me. :(
The collapsing Polish front is congealing into a target-rich environment even as the French stop and nosh on crullers and cheap wine.

Kill me already! If you've got the cajones. :p

I see your reinforcements, and I am not afraid (much :cool: )

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 36

Re: Turn 17 - Lunch! - 7/1/2003 7:55:57 PM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Capt. Pixel
[B] even as the French stop and nosh on crullers and cheap wine. [/B][/QUOTE]

Yep, That's what they are doing.

[B]Kill me already! If you've got the cajones. :p [/B][/QUOTE] After lunch, have patience. MMMM eyeballs!!~

[B]I see your reinforcements, and I am not afraid (much :cool: ) [/B][/QUOTE]

Be afraid, be very afraid. Long barreled guns shoot straight AND far. He he he he.

I think I'd like a little Polish Squash. They tend to stick to the tank treads though and it makes them hard to .... well you get the picture.

Its not over yet but it is getting close. Just let me try these expensive new guns. They even came with their own ammo trucks.;) New toys and all that...

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 37

Turn - Who knows? - Momma!! - 7/5/2003 4:09:19 AM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

(oh jeez, now I'm sounding like M4 Jess. Just shoot me)

The Poles are in retreat. (No news there) It's not quite a rout, but holes are being eaten in my lines everywhere.

Citroens and wagons are being pulled to the rear area before we lose our retreat hex. We're gonna need something to evacuate the civilians. :(

Armor superiority for the French is becoming dominate on the battlefield. 40mm AA, 47mm AT, R-40s and H-35s can't stop them. Hits bounce off like rubber balls. We can hear the French tank crews laughing. Aiieeee!

In all respect, my Polish troops are doing their darndest to hold what they can, but we're slowly being forced back by the determined French. They're causing some French casualties, but not enough, I'll warrant. We fight on, desperately.

I find it amazing that a squad will step into the line of fire from a Hotchkiss, take multiple fire and appear to be totally unaffected by it. This is particularly disconcerting as this is a H2H game and MGs are considerably more deadly than in 7.1.

Buzzard would tell you that he's taking a lot of Opfire. (I DO know how to mount a defense) But that much of it (all of it?) has little or no effect on his troops or tanks. It's been quite disappointing, all in all. The Poles are just pathetic, and there's no way around it. Never again. Never again. ;)

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 38

I was taking OP fire. - 7/5/2003 11:46:50 PM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

CP you do make a fine defence. Infantry in front of MGs and AT. ATGs and MGs always paired. This turn you used your own advice too much (How to make the most of your direct fire) and set too many MGs and ATGs to low ranges. I walked up with Mech units and killed them. :p

Your forces are pretty much surrounded with only one road east left open and I threaten that. The stand you made on the south hill is collapsing as I advance up the road. You still hold the centre hill but it is a lost cause as the front is shrinking around it on four sides. Even though I lose 3 AFVs this turn, I have plenty of reserves to take the field. My AUX are just now getting to the front. They are mostly guns and transport as I had so much armor left.

I will agree to honorable terms and your wounded will receive medical attention. My doctors are well aquainted with amputation and I love the left-overs (mmmm!!) Polish drumsticks;)

I been having fun with it. Everyone should try it.

We should have played '44 or '45, it would have been more equal. The only time I played it in that way, the Polish had good morale and pushed back the French( I was French). The lend -lease armor was pretty much the same. You said it at the beginning, [B]" I am in trrooubble". [/B]
Its the equipment. I was less cautious than usual because the tanks were pretty much involnerable. I also keep my companies intact, with their platoon commanders and company leaders. It makes a huge difference to moral and rally. I have had to bring my HQ forward to stop a few routed units but they turn around quick enough and don't run off the map.

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 39

It ain't over 'til it's....... - 7/7/2003 8:49:49 AM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

Aaargh - It' over. I am a lunchable for the Buzzard45. :(

My right flank is virtually gone. This is where I positioned my less-than-useful AUX tanks. Nothing but smoking hulks left there. The best armor available to the Poles, and it couldn't do squat. Even French Cavalry were wandering about unmolested. :eek:

My left flank is brittle and fracturing rapidly. There are two more layers of MG and AA guns overlooking any further French advance, but he's not really required to move any further to achieve his objectives.

My center currently commands their objectives and have a nice view of the battlefield. But a single platoon of Polish Rifles isn't going to last long. Now that they're almost totally surrounded.

My artillery managed to move from the right flank threat and get repositioned, but too little, too late, I'm afraid.

On the one hand, you may be right about holding my ranged fire to 0 from the ATGs. On the other hand, you were wrong about the MGs - they [I]were[/I] set to 20 Range. engaging the enemy at those ranges is probably what got them killed. It wasn't so much that you 'walked up and kille them' as you drew their Opfire at range and then charged in with those fast APCs (Lorraines) to finish them off.

The ATGs did perform exactly as I wanted. That is, they didn't fire until I was ready to engage. Unfortunately, when I chose to engage, they were almost totally ineffective at damaging French equipment. Given the short to medium engagement range (mostly determined by the terrain, ~8 hexes or closer), after 2 or 3 shots, they were spotted and remained so until they were destroyed. Oh well.

Even the best of strategies can fail under extreme situations. (That's an excuse, if you didn't recognize it. :) Feeble, ain't it? :rolleyes: ))

I did get the sense that you'd over-extended your flanking force and was hoping to capitalize on that unbalance with my AUX forces. It might have worked except for the 'rubber ball' ammo given out by munitions. The almost constant 'Hit - ricochet, Hit - bounce' was just getting to be too much to handle.)

------------

Buzzard and I have been discussing aside how one might make a more balanced Meeting Engagement between these two belligerents in '40.

The only method I could arrive at might be to limit Rarity of equipment to 0 or 1. Even that leaves the French with a decided armor advantage (Char B1), but at the cost of most of their artillery selections being eliminated. Were the French really that hard up for artillery in '40? :confused:

Other suggestions included 'borrowing' units from the Brits or Soviets, or increasing the points by 20% or more for the Poles.

All-in-all, I think the Poles as modelled in 1940 were only suitable for defense, and probably not terribly competent in that capacity either.

------------

Good game Buzzard45, you skunked me and you skunked me well. I was reeling backwards within a couple of turns of the initial contact and you never let me regain my balance.

Congratulations, you were, without a doubt, the better commander in this battle.

'Tip of the Hat' old chum. Well done. :D :cool:

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 40

Ahh Shucks. - 7/7/2003 10:47:57 AM

Buzzard45

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/11/2003
From: Regina, Canada
Status: offline

Thanks for the set-up Lars. You picked pretty much what I would have so it made it easy to play. The only extras would be an ammo wagon or two and maybe some AA guns for defence.

Capt Pixel, You are far too modest. The only place that you let me advance was on your right (north). I was stymied other in the south and centre (okay I was trying for a defensive stance there but still). You certainly set-up great ambushes. I am using the techniques in other games. I especially like the MG and ATG pairing with a little infantry to stop the run up and kill with mech. I lost a lot of those Lorraines. Your arty was also more effective. There was no time for scouting and recon in this game, so that was no weakness. It was all hit and hit again. well maybe hit and RUN_AWAY. :eek:

Thanks for the kind words though. I don't feel as though I deserve them. I'll PM my password as I may want to use it again.

We should play again with a more level playing field. Or better a mirror game. Nothing levels a field like having to play both sides. If you win both sides you deserve the win.

_____________________________

" Look alive!! Here comes a Buzzard"
POGO

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 41

- 7/7/2003 8:26:02 PM

Lars

Posts: 205
Joined: 7/19/2000
From: V�ster�s, Sweden
Status: offline

Hi Guys,

I really enjoyed following your progress in these DAR�s. I hope you enjoyed playing it as much as I did reading it. :D

It was a difficult pick of nations you choose and I had a fear of the Poles being too week when I set it up. They did not have a lot of equipment to choose from and I maybe should have given them at least a 10% advantage.
I had some hope for the 40mm AA though, to be able to inflict some casualties on the more heavy French tanks. But since the mobility of the French units were better, I probably should have set the starting lines closer too the centre for the Poles.

Another way to balance the game could have been, not to allow any reinforcement for the French player. Or to allow the Polish player to pick Soviet equipment for it�s reinforcement�

To Buzz:
When I set up games for others to play, I rarely put ammo-transport in the force. I like to force the players to be careful with their ammo and not over-use their artillery. ;)

/Lars

_____________________________

:D Plays for fun! :cool:

[img]http://publish.hometown.aol.com/kenkbaran/images/spwaw-virtual-b-o-b2.jpg [/img]
[img]http://www.redzoneforums.com/images/avatars/gia

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 42

- 7/8/2003 3:02:46 AM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

Yes, thanks much Lars. :)

I enjoyed seeing how another player would select a force. It gave me some interesting insights.

The Poles are lacking in available selection in 1940. I knew that, but was willing to give it a try. I, too, had greater hopes for the 40mm AA AND the 47mm ATGs. Unfortunately, they just didn't seem to have the punch. Hitting the French wasn't the problem. Penetrating the armor was nigh-on impossible.

The major fault on my side was that I had virtually NO defense north of the road. it was all wide open except for a couple of scout vehicles. Artillery and possible armored reinforcements were to handle that contigency.

My plan was to watch, and possibly reinforce, the North, Hold the Center and punch through on the south road. Much to my distress, the North is where Buzzard pushed his armor assault. A superb French defense kept my southern forces at bay.

Reinforcements for the Poles consisted mostly of armor with one ammo truck. The armor speeded towards the French armor in the north and did actually slow them for a couple of turns. Eventually French armor superiority overwhelmed their fall-back and ambush tactics.

The ammo truck got to the mortars and howitzers just in time to join the scramble to relocate artillery further south. That was quite a circus what with wagons and citroens all running south with whatever they could drag along. :rolleyes:

Once I lost overwatch along the northern road (~ turn 10), it was all over. I couldn't contain the salient that Buzzard had forced.

Infiltrators were probably my Most Valuable Unit. I'm sure they were causing consternation among the French rear area troops. At least I know I had fun trotting them around and stirring up trouble. When they took out an immobilized Char B1, I thought I might have a chance of being a real pain-in-the-a$$. :)

The second MVU would have to be the artillery. 81mm mortars and 75mm howitzers were coming in regularly and dealing a great amount of suppression almost every turn. (But you'd expect nothing less from Capt. Pixel. :cool: )

Buzzard used excellent approach tactics. He drew what Opfire he could at range with large, impervious tanks and then flung his Mech Inf and cruiser tanks forward to dispatch MGs and ATGs waiting in ambush. Even though these Poles might have had a chance to drive the Mechs away, we just couldn't hit anything. (Well, once again, we could hit, but we couldn't damage the French armor) Buzzard successfully kept his forces together and came forward in force. No piece-mealing here. drat! :(

Judging from what I could see on my side, I kept the Buzzard wondering enough to slow his advance to half or less. Had he known what was actually in front of him, I'd have been writing this AAR three or four turns ago. :D

Thanks again Lars for setting this up for us. And thank you, Buzzard45, for joining me in this 'Massacre'. But the only 'Twin Peaks' I saw were the retreating arses of my poor, pathetic Poles. :)

I already have a good idea of where you are with what, but if you'd care to look, my password was 'Krakow'. Original, huh?

Good game, thanks again guys. :cool:

Buzzard45, we shall meet again. Next time you shall not be so fortunate. Muahahahahahahahaha :cough: :cough: :cough:

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 43

- 7/11/2003 1:00:24 AM

Capt. Pixel

Posts: 1219
Joined: 10/15/2001
From: Tucson, AZ
Status: offline

Buzzard45 sent me his password so I could get a look at his units.

I've gotta say we both put quite a hurt on each other. I'd estimate his non-reinforced casualties at ~75%. Mine, on the other hand were closer to 90% (including reinforcements, oy!)

The shotgun VHs were equally covered (1150 vs 1150), but Buzzard had the map and the momentum.

His reinforcements were just stepping up to the plate and Eight(!!) ammo trucks were making their way to his artillery. (I had one ammo truck desperately trying to keep up with 4 mortars and 4 howtizers pumping rounds)

Had either one of us been [I]real[/I] commanders, we'd have both been retreating much earlier than this. Casualties of this magnitude would have gotten both of us court-martialed. :rolleyes:

_____________________________

"Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible. "
- Stonewall Jackson

(in reply to Lars)

Post #: 44

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