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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/20/2018 5:27:09 AM

Orm

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Paul, that makes sense to me. But unless I'm mistaken, that's not how it works in MWIF. RAW7 has the same setup for China as the Collector's Edition, from what I can tell -- it calls for 1 MIL. But when I load a saved China-setup game, I get 1 MIL (Sian) only -- the reserve MIL (Lanchow) is in the China force pool, not the setup tray or on the map. Now, this save is not from the current version of MWIF, so maybe it's been changed?

It should be random which of the two Communist Chinese MIL is set up during the Global War setup. And, to me, it appears random. I've drawn the Lanchow MIL several times.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/20/2018 5:23:56 PM

Grotius

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Thanks, Orm. I think I'm misunderstanding the setup rule, then. China has two Communist MILs in its force pool: one (Langchow) is a reserve, one (Sian) is not. The scenario calls for one Communist MIL. But the rules also say China has called out its reserves. Shouldn't both MILs be set up, then? One is automatically on the board because it's been called out as a reserve; the other is in the force pool at setup because it's not a reserve. So when the scenario calls for a MIL, isn't it calling for the non-reserve MIL in the force pool?

< Message edited by Grotius -- 5/20/2018 5:26:11 PM >

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/20/2018 7:36:49 PM

paulderynck

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No. The idea is both MIL are in the force pool before anything happens - because Reserves were called out in 1936. To set up you randomly draw one of the two and the remaining one can be built. The set-up is saying one of the two was destroyed in fighting prior to the Global War scenario and has not been rebuilt yet. Making it a random draw is ADG's way of throwing in some variability to challenge the Allied player(s).

As I said, looking at an old set-up file does not show much because it would have been saved after random draws took place.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 12:48:43 AM

etsadler

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Question: When using Ships in Flames, which of the original ship counters are removed? I can easily see that you should remove the BB, CA, CL, CV sets, but I am not sure if the SS, AMP, and TRS are replacements for or additions to.

Thanks in advance!

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 1:41:06 AM

etsadler

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Ah, found the answer in the Campaign & Players' Guide. It was the last place I looked.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 2:40:44 AM

Grotius

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Rick, you guessed the rule almost perfectly! You also keep the WiF Convoy counters, as I'm sure you know.

quote:

The set-up is saying one of the two was destroyed in fighting prior to the Global War scenario and has not been rebuilt yet.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! The light bulb turns on. I needed to be reminded that Japan and China have been fighting for three years. Thanks for the clarification!

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 2:44:18 AM

Grotius

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Incidentally, I'm now setting up France in Global War, Collector's Edition. I've been pleasantly surprised how smooth and easy setup has been. Once you grok the system, it goes fast.

It all looks so pretty, too! The only aesthetic thing I'm debating about is whether to put all my CW ships in Plymouth on a task force display. Right now they're sort of floating in several stacks in a long line in the English Channel. (They must have long lines tying them to their moorings.)

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 4:15:23 AM

rkr1958

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Incidentally, I'm now setting up France in Global War, Collector's Edition. I've been pleasantly surprised how smooth and easy setup has been. Once you grok the system, it goes fast.

It all looks so pretty, too! The only aesthetic thing I'm debating about is whether to put all my CW ships in Plymouth on a task force display. Right now they're sort of floating in several stacks in a long line in the English Channel. (They must have long lines tying them to their moorings.)

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 5:28:16 AM

Grotius

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Wow! O.o

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 5:37:23 AM

RFalvo69

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Incidentally, I'm now setting up France in Global War, Collector's Edition. I've been pleasantly surprised how smooth and easy setup has been. Once you grok the system, it goes fast.

It all looks so pretty, too! The only aesthetic thing I'm debating about is whether to put all my CW ships in Plymouth on a task force display. Right now they're sort of floating in several stacks in a long line in the English Channel. (They must have long lines tying them to their moorings.)

"The War Illustrated", right? I have the whole ten volumes collection. Now it is available for free download in .PDF form. A real time capsule of WWII as seen in real time from the British point of view.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 6:26:19 AM

paulderynck

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I have yet to find Waldo in that picture.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 7:47:48 AM

Joseignacio

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RickInVA

RE: The Counters.

1) My Germans are clearly gray and black. Russia orange.
2) The counters separate so well that I can hardly see or feel the "nub".
3) Since in my first copy of WiF 1st edition the counters literally separated into the cardboard core and little paper fronts and backs that I had to glue back together, I wouldn't complain about much!

Enjoy!

They do separate (super) easily. I was pointing at something when my friend moved slightly the sheet and it accidentally hit my finger and a group of about 8 or nine counters almost separated from the sheet, with some of them almost individually cut off.

However, I wonder if "easy to separate " and "no "nub" issue is the same.

< Message edited by Joseignacio -- 5/22/2018 7:09:51 AM >

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 8:04:46 AM

Joseignacio

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From the WifList:

quote:

Gidday WIffers,

just posted up the latest text rules and campaign books (with hyperlinks and errata), the xl setups for all campaigns (including errata) and the latest errata in the downloads section of our site (https://www.a-d-g.com.au/pages/downloads).

As pointed out we are bringing out a 100 counter countersheet for the few recalcitrant counters and also leaves 90 counters free for extra counters.

What would you like to see? Please give me a hoy and as soon as I have the draft version done I will post it too up on our website.

Hope you are enjoying the game.

regards
harry

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/21/2018 2:47:33 PM

Grotius

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quote:

However, I wonder if "easy to separate " and "no "nub" issue is the same.

I think the counters are great. There are little nubs on the sides of the counters, but they're usually not noticeable to me. In a few cases I've sanded them down in a low-tech way, with my fingernail. If they ever become an issue, I might try filing them with the file on a nail clipper, but so far it hasn't been an issue.

This is the first wargame I haven't clipped (with my Oregon Laminations counter-clippers) in a couple years.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/22/2018 7:08:04 AM

Joseignacio

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

quote:

However, I wonder if "easy to separate " and "no "nub" issue is the same.

I think the counters are great. There are little nubs on the sides of the counters, but they're usually not noticeable to me. In a few cases I've sanded them down in a low-tech way, with my fingernail. If they ever become an issue, I might try filing them with the file on a nail clipper, but so far it hasn't been an issue.

This is the first wargame I haven't clipped (with my Oregon Laminations counter-clippers) in a couple years.

I actually bought a used copy of the previous WIF at a price almost like new, because all the counters were clipped. I hate having to clip.

(It means, I don't clip games)

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/22/2018 4:46:22 PM

Courtenay

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In a game I just did, the Communists started with the Lanchow MIL.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/22/2018 10:07:11 PM

rkr1958

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RFalvo69

quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Incidentally, I'm now setting up France in Global War, Collector's Edition. I've been pleasantly surprised how smooth and easy setup has been. Once you grok the system, it goes fast.

It all looks so pretty, too! The only aesthetic thing I'm debating about is whether to put all my CW ships in Plymouth on a task force display. Right now they're sort of floating in several stacks in a long line in the English Channel. (They must have long lines tying them to their moorings.)

"The War Illustrated", right? I have the whole ten volumes collection. Now it is available for free download in .PDF form. A real time capsule of WWII as seen in real time from the British point of view.

Naw ... just found it on-line. However, here's my favorite (so far) from the Daily Telegraph.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/23/2018 4:30:48 AM

warspite1

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The world's most formidable... mmmm.... not exactly

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/23/2018 6:10:10 AM

Orm

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Why did the Royal Navy name two ships after two French Marshals?

Reliability both in officer and a ship is the first thing that an Admiral values. The Marshal Ney, judged by this standard, was a hopeless sinner; but her officers and men made up for her deficiencies. Her engines not infrequently exploded when asked to start; her engine-room was scarred as if by shrapnel from the fragments of burst cylinder heads, and the escapes of the engine-room staff were miraculous. Her Chief Engineer, Mr. Swan, stuck to the engines like a Trojan and almost overcame their bad habits; and really, when talking to him, you were almost converted to the opinion that just one little alteration would make them start next time the ship was required. Added to this, when they did not burst, they usually would not start, and when once started no one liked to stop them for fear of not being able to start them again. But, without exaggeration, the more they burst and the worse they behaved, the more Mr. Swan loved them and the more cheery Captain Tweedie became.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/23/2018 10:17:48 PM

paulderynck

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Anyone know why HMSs Beatty and Jellicoe were renamed Howe and Anson? Was the final Admiralty report on Jutland declassified in 1940?

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 5:33:56 AM

Grotius

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While we're on the subject of French names for ships, WIF CE has a CV (probably a CVL?) named "Comm Teste". The counter has an "E" on the back suggesting it should set up in Europe, and it shows a date of 1927, but the Global War scenario doesn't list it as setting up in Europe. I assume it just goes in the French force pool?

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 11:56:35 AM

Centuur

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

While we're on the subject of French names for ships, WIF CE has a CV (probably a CVL?) named "Comm Teste". The counter has an "E" on the back suggesting it should set up in Europe, and it shows a date of 1927, but the Global War scenario doesn't list it as setting up in Europe. I assume it just goes in the French force pool?

That's the Commandant Teste, a Seaplane carrier. That really was a strange vessel, since it didn't have a flight deck at all but could transport about 20 sea planes, which could be launched by catapults and had 12 100mm guns like cruisers have. Personally, I believe it should be available at setup, since the ships was operational when the war started...

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 1:23:13 PM

RFalvo69

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958
Naw ... just found it on-line. However, here's my favorite (so far) from the Daily Telegraph.

That image actually comes from this issue of "The War Illustrated", pag. 16-17

http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/TWI/TWI-39-09-16.pdf

The whole archive of the magazine is online. As I wrote, it is a wonderful companion to any book about WWII, showing how things were perceived in real time...)

["The Polish marshland will hamper and bog down the mechanized German Army, whereas the agile Polish Cavalry will be able to move and strike unhampered"... Uhm... Cough...

]

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 5:53:15 PM

paulderynck

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Grotius

While we're on the subject of French names for ships, WIF CE has a CV (probably a CVL?) named "Comm Teste". The counter has an "E" on the back suggesting it should set up in Europe, and it shows a date of 1927, but the Global War scenario doesn't list it as setting up in Europe. I assume it just goes in the French force pool?

There should be errata on this coming on ADG's webpage if not already there. It is supposed to set up on the European map.

Here's an excellent counter inventory resource if you don't have it already. https://sites.google.com/site/frenchwifpage/home/world-in-flames-collector-s-edition-wif-ce/wif-ce-counters

And if you got it awhile back, you should get it again as there were errors in it that have since been corrected.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 6:49:31 PM

Grotius

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Paul, thanks for that helpful reply. Sure enough, the new Excel file with setups now indicates where the Commandante Teste sets up! On the Europe map, as you said. This was driving me crazy, so I'm glad you pointed me in the right direction. I guess I'll just use the Excel file from this point forward, and I think I'll backtrack to make sure I didn't miss anything else.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/26/2018 8:09:37 PM

Courtenay

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quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

Anyone know why HMSs Beatty and Jellicoe were renamed Howe and Anson? Was the final Admiralty report on Jutland declassified in 1940?

Maybe someone read the Encyclopaedia Britannica article on Jutland, published in 1922? It ends with these lines: "... if a battle represents in war the economy of the decisive blow; if the enemy fleet can still play an important part in the campaign; [...]; if Nelson's teachings are sound -- then the battle of Jutland, taken by itself, must rank merely as a great and unique opportunity for the British fleet, of which advantage was not sufficiently taken."

< Message edited by Courtenay -- 5/27/2018 2:14:57 PM >

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/27/2018 3:24:22 AM

paulderynck

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I was half-joking as I think Jutland was well analyzed in the public domain by 1939, but that source picture was from 1939 and per Wikipedia, the renaming was done in 1940. Maybe they were looking for admirals who had been more successful and/or perhaps felt there would be stigma attached since by then they were at war with the same foe. Where's Warspite when we need him?

< Message edited by paulderynck -- 5/27/2018 3:36:17 AM >

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/27/2018 4:53:37 AM

warspite1

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One could always look at the KGV write-ups

The final two ships, Anson and Howe, were to have been named Jellicoe and Beatty respectively in honour of the two First World War admirals. Most sources state the names were changed as these two officers had only too recently served with the RN, although other sources suggest that the names were changed as a result of controversy over their performances in the war. The last two battleships were thus named instead after Admirals of the Fleet George Anson and Richard Howe, both prominent during the seven years war with France.

In British Battleships 1919-1945 (Burt) the author states the former reason. But others - including Jellicoe's grandson Nicholas in Jutland The Unfinished Battle states that Churchill vetoed the names. I can believe either version - they are both plausible. My personal opinion is that it would have been a travesty if Beatty had had a ship named after him - I don't think he was fit to command a destroyer let alone a battlecruiser squadron.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/27/2018 12:53:09 PM

Capitaine

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Beatty was admittedly rash or more politely aggressive -- that was sort of his trademark, and the reason he was ultimately elevated to the command of the GF -- but I feel that the loss of battlecruisers at Jutland couldn't be laid at his feet. He *engaged* as all British commanders were expected to do, and he had superior numbers. The British BCs were particularly thin on armor compared to the much more stalwart German BCs, and that was by design. The cordite handling flaw just had not been perceived by the British to be the major problem it turned out to be (compared to similar German problem realized due to Seydlitz at Dogger Bank). And even after the BCs at Jutland, Hood was lost due to a similar weakness. But then the British tend to condemn any sea commander who doesn't win regardless of the reason. That is the effect of their tradition of naval dominance.

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RE: In case someone is interested on how WIF (no MWIF) ... - 5/27/2018 6:04:57 PM

paulderynck

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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

One could always look at the KGV write-ups

Thanks and sorry I did think to look at them and was about to amend my post but had a computer reset that spoiled my ability to get back into the forum until whatever the time-out period is now. So after a few attempts, I gave-up until today.

Thanks for all the effort you put into writing up the naval units!

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