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- 4/13/2002 12:19:53 AM   
Svennemir

 

Posts: 542
Joined: 11/2/2001
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		That's okay - no problem. I might even prefer 130%, having played a bit more (against the AI, and that works fine.)

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 31
- 4/13/2002 12:33:19 AM   
Svennemir

 

Posts: 542
Joined: 11/2/2001
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		If I read the numbers correctly these changes penalize direct fire but not splash damage.

This means weapons like rifles and SMGs that rely on direct hits (have only WARHEAD value of 1 meaning very low splash) will be penalized in comparison with high-splash weapons.

So the 130%/130% adjustment will primarily, if I'm correct, affect infantry weapons - but not heavy IGs to the same degree.

The vierlings will, with a WARHEAD value of 2, receive quite an impact this way, but still rifles and SMGs will suffer more.

These are just observations, comments or corrections are welcome. I hope this is not annoying? :)

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 32
- 4/14/2002 1:08:27 AM   
RockinHarry


Posts: 2963
Joined: 1/18/2001
From: Germany
Status: offline 		...downloading it now! (sigh..:rolleyes: ISDN )

________
Harry

_____________________________

RockinHarry in the web:

https://www.facebook.com/harry.zann

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 33
- 4/14/2002 5:44:05 AM   
Mark Ezra

 

Posts: 340
Joined: 12/29/2000
From: Jasmin Ranch, Acton CA
Status: offline 		Go it dl'd and started a PBEM . So far very smooth. Got to say Thanks... The GMC M3 75mm is fixed and has a proper HE/AP load. The OOB's seem to play well.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 34
Couple of Questions - 4/14/2002 6:25:48 AM   
JimPY

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 5/11/2001
From: St. Louis
Status: offline 		I am playing the H2H Task Force Wilder scenario. I have my infantry toughness preference set to 170 and the artillery v. soft to 150. I notice that the German 60/100 panzerfaust is decimating my infantry. Since this is the first SP that I have played in which the panzerfaust could be used against infantry, I am curious if this weapon was, or could be used, against infantry? And was it this powerful? When I played the Bloody River scenario, I noticed that the Japanese 50mm seemed more deadly than usual. Are these weapons affected by the artillery v. soft setting? Your assistance is appreciated. So far I like the sounds and feel of H2H.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 35
- 4/14/2002 12:25:40 PM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		I'm downloaded and ready for some opponents. I hear of a new US OOB83, is this a part of the MOD also?

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 36
- 4/14/2002 4:43:45 PM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Svennemir
[B]I hope this is not annoying? :) [/B][/QUOTE]

How could it be ? You're playing H2H and you're making your own thoughts on it...that's all I asked for...:D
Your observations should be about right, how things come out with these settings...



[QUOTE]I am playing the H2H Task Force Wilder scenario. I have my infantry toughness preference set to 170 and the artillery v. soft to 150. I notice that the German 60/100 panzerfaust is decimating my infantry. Since this is the first SP that I have played in which the panzerfaust could be used against infantry, I am curious if this weapon was, or could be used, against infantry? And was it this powerful? When I played the Bloody River scenario, I noticed that the Japanese 50mm seemed more deadly than usual. Are these weapons affected by the artillery v. soft setting? Your assistance is appreciated. So far I like the sounds and feel of H2H.[/QUOTE]

As both weapons are direct fired, I don't think the Arty setting is causing this.
It might be, that the new v7.1 splash damage could be the reason.
When the inf toughness is at 170%, it becomes quite hard to achieve direct kills. It's possible, that the splash casualties are not affected the same way and they stayed about the same or at least do not get lowered the same way...this would cause the impression, that large warhead weapons do not suffer that much from 170%...but I'm not sure...
So it is possible, that the 170% inf toughness distorts the usual relation of casualties done by direct fire with small warhead weapons and the large ones...

In general, it was possible and quite often done, to fire with PzFausts, PzSchrecks, Bazookas or even PIATs at infantry.
Normally you would do this, when the infantry is in some sort of cover and it's actually a obstacle, you're aiming at to hit the nearby infantry (like a house or dense woods).
The point, that HEAT rounds cannot cause casualties, because the explosion is directed to a little point, to achieve penetration, is a bit misleading.
It is still quite some explosives envolved, that cause the typical blast effects. What is missing, is the extra amount of material to scatter around like in normal HE grenades, to be really lethal.
The HEAT roundsI fired, could be felt up to 300m away...should be enough to scare one when standing only 10m away :D
In the game the highest casualties I saw done by a PzFaust
was 2, I think. They mainly cause, what they were used for...suppression...
Th use of these weapons is again a feature, best handled by human players.
For the PzFaust, there're 3HE and 2AP shots with full ammo on.
The HE rounds in the case of the PzFaust and the PzSchreck can be fired at tanks also, so you wouldn't waste them against infantry, when tanks are around...
The AI is now making an excessive use of it, a smarter player would never do...
In history, the Russian might have been the ones who used it the most against infantry. Due to the enormeous numbers of PzFausts produced and it's easy handling, the Russians fired most captured PzFausts in street fighting against infantry, with quite some success (and they could do this, because they did not have to save them for use against German tanks...were there's no tank, you can't fire at it...)

[QUOTE]I'm downloaded and ready for some opponents. I hear of a new US OOB83, is this a part of the MOD also?[/QUOTE]

Indirectly...many, if not the most changes were made in the H2H OOB aswell. I took the comments from Brian Price, Overlord, AmmoSgt and others from their posts and worked them in.
The result is not exactly the same, but I think pretty close, with some additional stuff I put in from my own thoughts...

_____________________________

[URL=http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/spwaw_h2h_modrework.php] [IMG]http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/PzLeos-H2H-Title-1.jpg[/IMG] [/URL]

Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 37
So far so good - 4/14/2002 9:35:38 PM   
El Vito

 

Posts: 42
Joined: 3/25/2001
From: Ohio
Status: offline 		I thought I posted this earlier but I guess not.
Currently have a game of H2H going right now. Me as the Germans against a Soviet opponent. We started before I read these posts so we turned from 130% to 100%. Everything seems fine (although no vierlings in this battle). I have to say the German OOB's are excellent (even in German). The sounds and action I also like. Haven't played any other country yet. I do have a couple observations, one being that the platoon doesn't highlight on the battle screen when you click on a unit. It does on the overview map though. And the platoon leader doesn't get the parenthesis around the plus sign. I can live with it though, just have to pay a little more attention to detail.
I'm not sure how the munitions get used, are they like movable ammo dumps and how much do the munitions resupply? is it more than ammo carriers? Or are the munitions to be used in the new defensive positions? Maybe someone could give me some insight into this. Great game though, I will keep H2H and 7.1 (with the Bulgarian and US Engineer fix) installed separately so I dont have to switch OOB's over to be able to play both versions.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 38
- 4/14/2002 9:50:44 PM   
JimPY

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 5/11/2001
From: St. Louis
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Panzer Leo
[B]




"When the inf toughness is at 170%, it becomes quite hard to achieve direct kills. It's possible, that the splash casualties are not affected the same way and they stayed about the same or at least do not get lowered the same way...this would cause the impression, that large warhead weapons do not suffer that much from 170%...but I'm not sure...
So it is possible, that the 170% inf toughness distorts the usual relation of casualties done by direct fire with small warhead weapons and the large ones..."

I have always thought that in SP1 and future WW2 SP's too many casualties were caused by direct fire as opposed to artillery and grenades. I find that infantry toughness at 170 and artillery v. soft at 150 in v7.1 addresses this issue. Before v7.1 I had both set at 200, but in 7.1 that goes too far. However, the H2H 60/100 panzerfaust was too lethal to infantry, so I reduced its HE kill from 11 to 9. I reduced the bazooka to 5 from 7. Both seem more realistic now.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 39
H2H Mod - 4/14/2002 10:38:08 PM   
RockinHarry


Posts: 2963
Joined: 1/18/2001
From: Germany
Status: offline 		excellent work Joerg....hey that rhymes! :D

Seriously...I burned the unzipped files on CD and managed (on home PC) to put the new stuff in seperate alternate folders, so no need for me to have two (or more) complete installs of SPWAW on the hard disk. A good idea probably would be to include in your mod text file a list of the to be changed/updated files in the various folders to ease file copy and backupping? :)

All the B/W photos are excellent and add much to the feel of the units! :) I also like the idea putting the uncommon stuff from the german OOB to the Czech OOB. Or does anybody know when the germans used their big vessels for ground support other than Westerplatte/Poland? Norway? Else?

Nebelwerfers41 and 42: Good two have them right now, but why do they have that much ammo? Do you know of high reload rates and wanted to portray this? Have some good online sources for me? :)

Volkssturm: Nice addition, but in my opinion bit too overpowered! :eek: The poor Volkssturm (armed german civilians in fact) seldomly had good or enough weapons available, not to speak of appropriate ammo. From what I know from various sources and also my experience as "relic hunter", these guys mostly were equipped with foreign weaponry like french 8mmLebel rifle or MosinNagant. These and some Panzerfausts should be more accurate weaponry for Volkssturm units. Giving them Panzerschreck, I think is not quite credible. It´s not that easy to operate as the Panzerfaust and I can´t think of armed civilan operating Panzerschrecks properly! (They´ll probably kill themselves :eek: )

Gebirgsjägers with special forces attributes is good idea, when used accordingly (in mountainous terrain). Ski capability fits nicely to the new ski jaegers.

Shelters is also a nice idea and shapes look very good.

Hope I´ll find time soon to really play with H2H, but I definitely will do oncoming scenario works with H2H files as alternative, maybe even exclusively. :cool:

BTW: What time stamp had your modified V7.1 mech.exe before? I found the latest V7.1 mech.exe (from latest patch) satisfactory concerning infantry casulaties and splash damage.

___________
Harry

_____________________________

RockinHarry in the web:

https://www.facebook.com/harry.zann

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 40
Re: So far so good - 4/14/2002 11:36:30 PM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by El Vito
[B]I do have a couple observations, one being that the platoon doesn't highlight on the battle screen when you click on a unit. It does on the overview map though. And the platoon leader doesn't get the parenthesis around the plus sign. I can live with it though, just have to pay a little more attention to detail. [/B][/QUOTE]

:confused: Sorry, don't know what the reason could be...someone knows ?

[QUOTE][B] I'm not sure how the munitions get used, are they like movable ammo dumps and how much do the munitions resupply? is it more than ammo carriers? Or are the munitions to be used in the new defensive positions? Maybe someone could give me some insight into this. Great game though, I will keep H2H and 7.1 (with the Bulgarian and US Engineer fix) installed separately so I dont have to switch OOB's over to be able to play both versions. [/B][/QUOTE]

They're like immobile ammo carriers. The same reload rate, but no movement on their own...that's all about these ammo boxes.



[QUOTE]I have always thought that in SP1 and future WW2 SP's too many casualties were caused by direct fire as opposed to artillery and grenades. I find that infantry toughness at 170 and artillery v. soft at 150 in v7.1 addresses this issue. Before v7.1 I had both set at 200, but in 7.1 that goes too far. However, the H2H 60/100 panzerfaust was too lethal to infantry, so I reduced its HE kill from 11 to 9. I reduced the bazooka to 5 from 7. Both seem more realistic now.[/QUOTE]

The usability of inf AT-rockets against infantry is one of the more experimental features (like Gebirgsjaeger as special forces).
If folks seem to agree, that things should be different, these are the first to get changed.
I did some further testing with the PzFaust 60/100 and had results of 0-3 casualties (3 with 2 direct plus one of splash and quite rare - 1 of 20 shots or so).
Compared to the actual warhead size of this weapon I can't say I think it's unrealistic, but that's just how I feel about it...maybe there're more folks, that find that too drastic...



[QUOTE]Nebelwerfers41 and 42: Good two have them right now, but why do they have that much ammo? Do you know of high reload rates and wanted to portray this? Have some good online sources for me? [/QUOTE]

Reload time for a 6 barreled NW 41 was around 90 sec for a trained crew (Handbook on Germ...). Many pics show NWs with piles of ammo next to them and I see no reason why they shouldn't fire larger loads of ammo over the time...
Good Internet resources on NWs are rare, so I don't have one I would really recommend. One of the best is this German page (although the explosives load for the 150mm is not correct):[URL=http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waffen/raketenwerfer.htm]Lexikon der Wehrmacht[/URL]



[QUOTE]Volkssturm: Nice addition, but in my opinion bit too overpowered! The poor Volkssturm (armed german civilians in fact) seldomly had good or enough weapons available, not to speak of appropriate ammo. From what I know from various sources and also my experience as "relic hunter", these guys mostly were equipped with foreign weaponry like french 8mmLebel rifle or MosinNagant. These and some Panzerfausts should be more accurate weaponry for Volkssturm units. Giving them Panzerschreck, I think is not quite credible. It´s not that easy to operate as the Panzerfaust and I can´t think of armed civilan operating Panzerschrecks properly! (They´ll probably kill themselves ) [/QUOTE]


I would have liked, to portray worser Volkssturm units than these, but the limitations of the game do not allow that...
The Volkssturm in H2H is the "first wave" Volkssturm (out of 4 mobilization categories, I think).
They were the only Volkssturm to have at least some sort of short militia-style training and an organized equipement.
The PzSchreck was indeed the regular AT weapon they were issued in the last months of the war.
These units did see combat on the Eastern Front and took part in quite some battles in the end.
For historical accuracy, one should not use them in the West, as these Volkssturm units never reached the status of the Eastern ones.
They are still very poor infantry, but with heavy equipement.
Their ROF is lowered and the FC is at 0, making the rifles almost useless. The only two guys with at least a bit fighting ability would be the machine gunner and the man with the PzSchreck...
But try them out, after the few shots of the PzSchreck are gone, they are almost useless... :D




[QUOTE]Hope I´ll find time soon to really play with H2H, but I definitely will do oncoming scenario works with H2H files as alternative, maybe even exclusively. [/QUOTE]

Ohh, that would be great !!!


[QUOTE]BTW: What time stamp had your modified V7.1 mech.exe before? I found the latest V7.1 mech.exe (from latest patch) satisfactory concerning infantry casulaties and splash damage. [/QUOTE]

It is the latest patch mech.exe... :)


have fun... :)

_____________________________

[URL=http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/spwaw_h2h_modrework.php] [IMG]http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/PzLeos-H2H-Title-1.jpg[/IMG] [/URL]

Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 41
Rebuilding old scenarios in H2H - 4/15/2002 1:44:01 AM   
JimPY

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 5/11/2001
From: St. Louis
Status: offline 		I have just finished examing and/or rebuilding about 30 or so old scenarios that came with some version of the game in the past. I thought that I would list the odd units that I replaced or fixed. I am sure that I missed some, but here goes:

1. US m36 Jackson - I changed the gun to 90mm L50 m3 and added 5 ApCR.

2. Australian 3 in mortar looks like halftrack, replaced it.

3. German SSmg42 looks like AT, replaced it with Laf424

4. All German motorcylces replaced with Krad. For mg cycle I used Krad millet(sp) and substituted weapon 4 mg34 for k98.

5. Sometimes halftrack 150/1 needed replacement, but not usually. Also, had trouble with 150/10 at times and had to repurchase it or entire company. Used PZgrendare to repurchase.

6. All MkIVG's were repurchased.

Brits, Soviets, Japanese and Canadian looked good.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 42
- 4/15/2002 10:59:03 AM   
Mike Rothery

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 10/9/2000
From: Canberra, Australia
Status: offline 		We are close to re-launching Combat Command, the SPWAW multoplayer gaming leagues, over at [URL=http://www.warfarehq.com]WarfareHQ.com[/URL]

Is there any interest in our running a league specifically for PanzerLeo's modified OOB's?

_____________________________

MikeR

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 43
H2H Mod - 4/16/2002 2:35:05 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		Mike there just might be enough interest in a separate league but the Mod has just come out and its too soon to tell how successful it will be. I myself will be starting a game with it soon. Word needs to get around.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 44
Re: Rebuilding old scenarios in H2H - 4/16/2002 3:10:02 AM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by JimPY
[B]I have just finished examing and/or rebuilding about 30 or so old scenarios that came with some version of the game in the past. [/B][/QUOTE]

Thanks for your great support, JimPY :)
It would be very good to have scenarios converted to H2H OOBs, to have enough stuff for the folks who like to play the AI.
But watch out...there're always nasty little things one oversees when going through the changes for the first time...I know what I'm talking of :D (always when you think you got it, another weird unit sneaks into your formations :rolleyes: )...


[QUOTE]Is there any interest in our running a league specifically for PanzerLeo's modified OOB's?[/QUOTE]

Thank's Mike, I really feel honored seeing you asking this question...:D
But I think Drex has a good point there...it's pretty early for people making up their mind and for me to see, if I made some major mistakes or everything is running smoothly enough for Combat Command...
I tested H2H a lot with some friends, but you never fix it all...

So I would suggest, that we wait for some gamers to really test it to the bone, throw in their remarks and I will see, what makes sense to fix (that will take at least another week or two)...I really would like to have some comments on how things worked out, what faetures were liked and which ones not.
Once the players decided, what they want in H2H and what not, the fix will be done in a day or two, resulting in the first and last OOB patch for H2H...after that I'll retire...it's just too time consuming and real life needs more attention than it had the past months from me... ;)
Then, I would ofcourse be very happy to see H2H used in Combat Command, but that's peoples choice :D

_____________________________

[URL=http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/spwaw_h2h_modrework.php] [IMG]http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/PzLeos-H2H-Title-1.jpg[/IMG] [/URL]

Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 45
- 4/23/2002 5:27:29 AM   
TotenkopfZZ

 

Posts: 53
Joined: 4/11/2001
From: Cedar Falls, USA
Status: offline 		In the H2H mod, did you include a list of the icons you changed? I made a few of my own and want to know where I might be able to fit them in if I use your mod.
Specifically, I am referring to the Icon Data List.txt file. There are some useable slots in there that I placed my own icons in.

Thanks

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 46
- 4/24/2002 2:39:48 AM   
ruxius

 

Posts: 909
Joined: 5/5/2000
From: ITALY
Status: offline 		Hello , please look at my post just as a sort of curiosity...no any intent to be harmful against anyone...

Reading about all the revised OOBs listed here and since at least this mod only deals with enhancing icons formations oobs ecc.ecc (but not coding ) I was wondering why H2H was born and why we had not instead a version 7.2 ?
Are these improvements unbalanced for 7.1 ?

Since 7.1 allows to play 1vs1 , all of these issues (which better model the Hum vs Hum ) shouldn't be also a part of 7.1 ?

in other words ..have we any hope Matrix will in some way let the best of H2H to be included in 7.1 ? maybe the same creators of this mod could manage this...
If I can ask: why the creators of this mod didn't worked next to the official version ? it seemed reasonable and also typical in Matrix tradition..
Is this a testing period for H2H ? the best of it will ever converge within SPWAW official version ?

Listing of improvements here seems to be very interesting but I
do not like to have two versions of this game...so I am asking about...

Thank you for any answer (and good luck !)
(any contribution to this game for me is always welcome !)

_____________________________

Italian Soldier,German Discipline!

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 47
- 4/24/2002 3:18:38 AM   
Svennemir

 

Posts: 542
Joined: 11/2/2001
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		Of course there is a CHANCE that there will somehow be a 7.2. But as I have understood, that chance is very small. 7.1 was/is meant to be the final one.

That's part of the reason why I'm interested in H2H - not only is this an excellent modification, it is a window of opportunity with regards to further improvements that we would probably not see otherwise.

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 48
- 4/24/2002 4:59:51 AM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by TotenkopfZZ
[B]In the H2H mod, did you include a list of the icons you changed? I made a few of my own and want to know where I might be able to fit them in if I use your mod.
Specifically, I am referring to the Icon Data List.txt file. There are some useable slots in there that I placed my own icons in.

Thanks [/B][/QUOTE]

No, I didn't include a list. I wrote the icon numbers of most units I changed on a list and will send you a mail. It might not be complete, but near to...(a hint for free slots I do not use anymore: many camo versions of German tanks/Sdkfz)

[QUOTE]I was wondering why H2H was born and why we had not instead a version 7.2 ? [/QUOTE]

Because a v7.2 would be an official Matrixgames version. H2H was done without involvement of Matrix members.
I first just started to make myself a version designed to my taste. With time the whole thing got bigger and bigger, so I began to include good ideas and features (icons or sound,e.g.) I downloaded from Fan pages.
The problem with all these good things out there is, that you have to download every piece and work it into your SPWAW version.
So I thought it would be neat idea to collect all this stuff and make one package out of it, including all the things I had altered myself to get my "dream version" of SPWAW in one easy to install, handy set.
After everything was done, I thought some other folks may have the same taste like me and probably would like to download it.
So I asked Fabio and with the support of his great site everyone who is interested can get his own copy of my changes...that's the story behind H2H...

[QUOTE]Since 7.1 allows to play 1vs1 , all of these issues (which better model the Hum vs Hum ) shouldn't be also a part of 7.1 ? [/QUOTE]

All changes cannot be part of an official version, because they are sometimes not waterproof concerning the AI.
Matrix was often limited in the past because of taking care of the AI...I didn't care...this works most of the time, but I can't guarantee it...:rolleyes:

[QUOTE]have we any hope Matrix will in some way let the best of H2H to be included in 7.1 ? maybe the same creators of this mod could manage this[/QUOTE]

The whole array of changes is hard to overview. H2H was made parallel to the official versions for over 1 1/2 years.
To work it into an official OOB is some weeks if not months work...time I do not have (I did H2H on my own, so there's no team to put the work on)...

[QUOTE]If I can ask: why the creators of this mod didn't worked next to the official version ? it seemed reasonable and also typical in Matrix tradition.. [/QUOTE]

To coordinate it with Matrix would have been impossible. The only reason why I was able to complete this monster project was, because I was the only person I had to ask for permission when doing a change...I had to make no compromise and if I had an idea, I just implemented it...otherwise H2H wouldn't have been ready before the year 2005 ;)
Matrix gave me all support I had hoped for...editors and this forum to give me input...without this genereous way of being so informative about details of the game, nothing would have been done...and ofcourse all the blood and sweat Paul put into the improving of SPWAW...in the last months I think I felt sometimes the same things Paul was going through...you think you had a good idea, changed everything and it took you hours and hours, just to have someone come up with an argument why your changes are bullshit - and he's right...so changing it over again and again...:D

[QUOTE]Is this a testing period for H2H ? [/QUOTE]

It was tested a lot before Fabio put it up for download. Actually the first version was ready for realease a week after v7.0 was posted by Matrix, but then v7.1 was announced and I held H2H back, to include changes of the official version.
And yes, it is a testing version, but only to a small degree. I will defenetily post an update of the H2H OOBs in the near future, working in the last ideas and corrections folks point out. But this will be only the OOBs (320KB).
The rest (44MB zipped) will stay the same.
So should you think, that it's best to wait for the final version, I would rather propose to download the whole thing, take a look at it (it is playable, no critical errors - a working version) and tell me what you like and what not...if some of your arguments make sense, I will put them into the OOBs and you can download the 320KB...is that a deal ?:cool:
These OOBs will be the last changes I do to H2H. There will be no other versions. I simply will not have the time to support it anymore...ofcourse it is open to anybody else to work on it, as it always was with any SPWAW version...

****, that was quite a lot of text...hope I could answer your questions...

have fun...

_____________________________

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Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 49
- 4/24/2002 5:42:28 AM   
ruxius

 

Posts: 909
Joined: 5/5/2000
From: ITALY
Status: offline 		Thank you Panzer Leo , your answers were really exaustive..
I can see in you a true passion for SPWAW and I like this very much..
All your reasons and explanations were good..
Your work meets enthusiasm here and that will be very important because in such way it will bring that testing to your work that may bring it to become official....

I mean Matrix games officially stopped SPWAW because she had to move all efforts toward the huge forecoming CL...
what I was trying to say is that if you offer to them a full tested and structured work it would easy for them to check it and select what could be considered an official upgrade for ver 7.1
That's why this time is good for testing it and you should try to
organize your files..
This is a way to encourage your efforts

If most of the things you designed are good why not taking them and put into an official upgrade for 7.1 ?
Since you give a ready-to-use package..why not ?

Gwork !

:p

_____________________________

Italian Soldier,German Discipline!

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 50
- 4/25/2002 1:05:24 PM   
David Heath


Posts: 3274
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Staten Island NY
Status: offline 		I fully support Panzer Leo in how he wants to do it. I love what he did and he is correct. This NEVER would have been done any other way.

Leo keep going and I can promise you I am enjoying your work. If there is anything we can help with feel free to ask.

David

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 51
- 4/26/2002 12:44:58 AM   
ruxius

 

Posts: 909
Joined: 5/5/2000
From: ITALY
Status: offline 		[SIZE=5][FONT=arial][COLOR=darkred]WOW[/COLOR] [COLOR=orange]WOW[/COLOR] WOW ![/FONT][/SIZE]

[B]Panzer Leo BE PROUD !![/B]

The latest post seems to be a very promising one for your work !
Keep your chance !
SO now and AGAIN for a final Unity : Good Work !

_____________________________

Italian Soldier,German Discipline!

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 52
- 4/26/2002 4:01:45 AM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		Feels great to read this kind of encouraging posts !:)

Thank you, guys !

And a special thanks to you David and the Matrix team! If I should be in need of something from Matrix concerning H2H, I will ask...but up to now you already did so much to put this great game step by step closer to perfection, that I sometimes just wonder how far you've come...(it's always a real shock when you take a look at the old SP versions and how things behaved back then and compare it to SPWAW 7.1 - just great what you made possible !).

For now, the best thing to do is to find the last glitches and errors in H2H with the help of the ones interested. If the support on this task stays as good and frequent as it is now, I think this won't take to long...so keep on pointing out stuff you want to have changed and I will see what I can do...

_____________________________

[URL=http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/spwaw_h2h_modrework.php] [IMG]http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/PzLeos-H2H-Title-1.jpg[/IMG] [/URL]

Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 53
- 4/26/2002 4:30:35 AM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by ruxius
[B]
If most of the things you designed are good why not taking them and put into an official upgrade for 7.1 ?
Since you give a ready-to-use package..why not ?
[/B][/QUOTE]

Sorry, didn't answer your question...:rolleyes:

It is not that easy...my changes are not documented, as they are so many and it would have been to time consuming. So I doubt, that it is possible to take a look at my OOBs and extract most of the changes and put them into an official version. The easiest thing would be to take some sounds or icons, but even the b/w pics would mean to make 1800 changes in the OOB...
To much work for either Matrix or me to do...
I also think, that there wouldn't be much difference if you make the H2H changes "official" or take it like it comes now...the result would be the same. Lot's of changes do not permit to use scenarios not made for H2H (or campaigns), so all this stuff would have to be changed, too, including some patches for MCDF and MCLV...(but who should do this ?)
To have H2H as "quasi" official, just depends on the support of scenario designers and players...if there should be enough scenarios and campaigns to use with H2H it somehow would be something like a next SPWAW version (call it 7.2 or whatever...).
But a real v7.2 (that would also mean changes to the mech.exe the sort of battle routines or other hard coding) is as I understand Matrix rather unlikely...the official v7.2 will be called "Combat Leader"
:D

_____________________________

[URL=http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/spwaw_h2h_modrework.php] [IMG]http://www.theblitz.org/member_sites/panzer_leo_spw@w/PzLeos-H2H-Title-1.jpg[/IMG] [/URL]

Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 54
- 4/26/2002 1:43:32 PM   
David Heath


Posts: 3274
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Staten Island NY
Status: offline 		Hi Leo

What I meant was if you wanted to know why something was setup a certain way or a code question. I am sure Paul or myself could answer the question and maybe save you a little work. I must say I am impressed by what I have seen. You seem to really have H2H under control and we (Matrix) really think any true SPWaW should give this a try.

David

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 55
- 4/26/2002 11:03:12 PM   
Panzer Leo

 

Posts: 526
Joined: 6/13/2001
From: Braunschweig/Germany
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by David Heath
[B]
What I meant was if you wanted to know why something was setup a certain way or a code question. I am sure Paul or myself could answer the question and maybe save you a little work. I must say I am impressed by what I have seen. You seem to really have H2H under control and we (Matrix) really think any true SPWaW should give this a try.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Couldn't ask for more...:)

If You or Paul could keep an eye on what we discuss on the "H2H - what do you think ?" thread and maybe step in if we run into the wrong direction (sometimes it's hard to figure out if a strange value is simply wrong or was set intentionally), that would be great !
It is not an easy task to keep the overview on all parameters that go into the values, so a professional advice from time to time would really be appreciated...:D

_____________________________

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Mir nach, ich folge euch !

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 56
- 4/27/2002 4:02:33 AM   
David Heath


Posts: 3274
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Staten Island NY
Status: offline 		Sure that was help we were talking about.

David

(in reply to Fabio Prado)
Post #: 57
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