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RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 5:24:02 AM   
brian brian

 

Posts: 3191
Joined: 11/16/2005
Status: offline 		I've been hoping PBEM could temporarily be 'NetPlay' for combat resolution, say particularly for large, important affairs at sea in 1941-42. I would play that way 80% of the time.

The other 20% would be 'solitaire'. Usually against the AI I guess.

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 91
RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 6:03:06 AM   
Peeking Duck?

 

Posts: 96
Joined: 8/30/2001
Status: offline 		AI Opponent 80%
Net Play 15%
PBEM 5%

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 92
RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 6:18:08 AM   
paulderynck


Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: brian brian

I've been hoping PBEM could temporarily be 'NetPlay' for combat resolution, say particularly for large, important affairs at sea in 1941-42. I would play that way 80% of the time.

The other 20% would be 'solitaire'. Usually against the AI I guess.

I understand there is supposed to be an ability to switch back and forth. This would also be awesome for when you start out in one mode and must switch to the other for some reason, because you still aspire to finish the game.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to brian brian)
Post #: 93
RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 8:47:55 AM   
Obsolete


Posts: 1492
Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline
AI Opponent - 50%

NetPlay - 50%


Note:  These are the main things I look for in a wargame.  I believe not paying attention to both of these elements are what has caused the devastation of what would have been many other great games.



_____________________________



King-Tigers don't let Tiger-I's get over-run.

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 94
RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 10:14:18 AM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: brian brian

I've been hoping PBEM could temporarily be 'NetPlay' for combat resolution, say particularly for large, important affairs at sea in 1941-42. I would play that way 80% of the time.

The other 20% would be 'solitaire'. Usually against the AI I guess.

So, your answer is :
AI Opponent 20%
PBEM 80%

This is it ?

(in reply to brian brian)
Post #: 95
RE: Simple Survey - 5/10/2009 6:42:15 PM   
Zorachus99


Posts: 1066
Joined: 9/15/2000
From: Palo Alto, CA
Status: offline 		Netplay 100%.

_____________________________

Most men can survive adversity, the true test of a man's character is power. -Abraham Lincoln

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 96
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 5:30:15 AM   
brian brian

 

Posts: 3191
Joined: 11/16/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp


quote:

ORIGINAL: brian brian

I've been hoping PBEM could temporarily be 'NetPlay' for combat resolution, say particularly for large, important affairs at sea in 1941-42. I would play that way 80% of the time.

The other 20% would be 'solitaire'. Usually against the AI I guess.

So, your answer is :
AI Opponent 20%
PBEM 80%

This is it ?


I'll go with

PBEM 80
AI 10
Solitaire 10

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 97
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 5:39:47 AM   
Manack


Posts: 37
Joined: 8/29/2005
Status: offline 		AI Opponent - 50%

NetPlay - 50%

(in reply to brian brian)
Post #: 98
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 6:49:08 AM   
mic211


Posts: 20
Joined: 12/8/2008
From: Danmark
Status: offline 		AI opponent - 75 %

Netplay - 25 %

(in reply to Manack)
Post #: 99
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 10:56:39 AM   
Joseignacio


Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline 		AI 90%
Netplay 10%

(in reply to mic211)
Post #: 100
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 2:56:32 PM   
madman_matt


Posts: 2
Joined: 9/29/2008
Status: offline 		Solitaire - 5% (just to test it first, before playing any real game)
Head-to-head - 10%
AI Opponent - 5% (just to test it first, before playing any real opponents/friends/groups)
NetPlay - 50%
PBEM - 30%

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 101
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 4:09:56 PM   
Gresbeck

 

Posts: 106
Joined: 7/13/2004
From: Ferrara - Florence
Status: offline 		First 6 months of game:
100% AI (as a totally newbie, I'll play A.I. till I get decent results)

Later (assuming I can get decent results against A.I.)
50% A.I.
50% PBEM

No chance I will ever play solitaire, or netplay.

(in reply to madman_matt)
Post #: 102
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 4:18:17 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SewerStarFish

AI, almost completely -- though I'd play solitaire if you think there'll be no AI.

<edited to actually answer the survey-reedited to spell actually korektlee>

Be carefull if you edited your post, chances are high (100%) that I miss it and that I report the original vote in the Excel spreadsheet that I am updating with your votes for Steve.

So you'd better reposting rather than editing an old post.

This one from SewerStarFish is OK, because somehow Steve pointed it to me.


Ah, a last thing, please don't confuse "Solitaire" play with "AI Opponent" play.

Here are the 5 mode of play, reminded to you :
Solitaire - you play both sides and make all decisions.

Head-to-head (Hotseat) - two players use a single computer, with the players taking turns moving their units/making decisions using the same mouse and keyboard.

AI Opponent - the player takes one side and the Artificial Intellengent Opponent plays the other.

NetPlay - 2 to 6 players with each player having his own computer; there are game 'sessions' where all the players log into the game and communicate their decisions using the internet.

PBEM - Play by email for 2 players, with all decisions communicated via email (an option to temporarily switch to NetPlay if they so desire).

(in reply to Sewerlobster)
Post #: 103
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 6:20:06 PM   
obermeister


Posts: 74
Joined: 4/24/2009
Status: offline 		Solitaire - 10%

Head-to-head (Hotseat) - 0%

AI Opponent - 80%

NetPlay - 5%

PBEM - 5%

Question: From a game mode aspect, I don't know that there's any difference between Solitaire and Head-to-Head? Or would I have more freedom to 'overrule' dice results in Solitaire? This would be very, very useful to me in the WIF game I'm playing in, since it would give me the ability to set up the board the same way it is in our cardboard game, and then run simulations to test certain plans.

If this isn't the case, then I'm guessing if you want to play solitaire, you'd just choose "hotseat" from the game menu?

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 104
RE: Simple Survey - 5/11/2009 7:23:21 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obermeister

Solitaire - 10%

Head-to-head (Hotseat) - 0%

AI Opponent - 80%

NetPlay - 5%

PBEM - 5%

Question: From a game mode aspect, I don't know that there's any difference between Solitaire and Head-to-Head? Or would I have more freedom to 'overrule' dice results in Solitaire? This would be very, very useful to me in the WIF game I'm playing in, since it would give me the ability to set up the board the same way it is in our cardboard game, and then run simulations to test certain plans.

If this isn't the case, then I'm guessing if you want to play solitaire, you'd just choose "hotseat" from the game menu?

Hotseat has prompts built in that tell the players to switch who is seated in front of the computer (i.e., switch sides). The Axis player doesn't get to see the US Entry chits. When making simultaneous decisions (e.g., air-to-air combat), the players should not see what the other side is doing.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to obermeister)
Post #: 105
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 8:30:08 AM   
Rodwell


Posts: 22
Joined: 8/3/2008
Status: offline 		100% PBEM as soon as I feel comfortable with the rules (AI opponent until then)

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 106
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 11:15:03 AM   
grisouille_slith

 

Posts: 614
Joined: 6/7/2007
Status: offline 		Solitaire: 10%
Head-to-head: 0%
AI: 50%
NetPlay: 0%
PBEM: 40%

(in reply to Rodwell)
Post #: 107
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 11:30:08 AM   
Caquineur


Posts: 96
Joined: 4/21/2009
From: Aix en Provence, France, Europe
Status: offline 		NetPlay 100%

Who said we French Southerners were talkative chatterboxes ?

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 108
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 1:01:23 PM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: SewerStarFish

AI, almost completely -- though I'd play solitaire if you think there'll be no AI.

<edited to actually answer the survey-reedited to spell actually korektlee>

Be carefull if you edited your post, chances are high (100%) that I miss it and that I report the original vote in the Excel spreadsheet that I am updating with your votes for Steve.

So you'd better reposting rather than editing an old post.

This one from SewerStarFish is OK, because somehow Steve pointed it to me.


Ah, a last thing, please don't confuse "Solitaire" play with "AI Opponent" play.

Here are the 5 mode of play, reminded to you :
Solitaire - you play both sides and make all decisions.

Head-to-head (Hotseat) - two players use a single computer, with the players taking turns moving their units/making decisions using the same mouse and keyboard.

AI Opponent - the player takes one side and the Artificial Intellengent Opponent plays the other.

NetPlay - 2 to 6 players with each player having his own computer; there are game 'sessions' where all the players log into the game and communicate their decisions using the internet.

PBEM - Play by email for 2 players, with all decisions communicated via email (an option to temporarily switch to NetPlay if they so desire).



How about an update on the voting results?

Good Hunting.

MR


_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 109
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 1:25:12 PM   
Ron

 

Posts: 506
Joined: 6/6/2002
Status: offline 		AI Opponent - 100%


(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 110
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 3:22:24 PM   
macgregor


Posts: 990
Joined: 2/10/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gresbeck

First 6 months of game:
100% AI (as a totally newbie, I'll play A.I. till I get decent results)

Later (assuming I can get decent results against A.I.)
50% A.I.
50% PBEM

No chance I will ever play solitaire, or netplay.

How do you reconcile never playing solitaire with 50-100% AI?

(in reply to Gresbeck)
Post #: 111
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 3:29:11 PM   
cantona2


Posts: 3749
Joined: 5/21/2007
From: Gibraltar
Status: offline 		Solitaire 100% until i learn as i've never played WiF
AI 20% once i learn
PBEM 80%


< Message edited by cantona2 -- 5/12/2009 5:08:04 PM >

_____________________________

1966 was a great year for English Football...Eric was born


(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 112
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 3:30:37 PM   
Caquineur


Posts: 96
Joined: 4/21/2009
From: Aix en Provence, France, Europe
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gresbeck

First 6 months of game:
100% AI (as a totally newbie, I'll play A.I. till I get decent results)

Later (assuming I can get decent results against A.I.)
50% A.I.
50% PBEM

No chance I will ever play solitaire, or netplay.


How do you reconcile never playing solitaire with 50-100% AI?


According to the definitions Steve has given (excerpt below) , "Solitaire" and "AI opponent" are two different modes of play

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

...There are 5 modes of play:

Solitaire - you play both sides and make all decisions.

...

AI Opponent - the player takes one side and the Artificial Intellengent Opponent plays the other.

...



Hope this answers your question

Alain

(in reply to macgregor)
Post #: 113
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 7:13:53 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rodwell

100% PBEM as soon as I feel comfortable with the rules (AI opponent until then)

Nice flower !




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Rodwell)
Post #: 114
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 7:17:33 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian
How about an update on the voting results?

Do you allow me to do that Steve ?
anyway, this is public data, anyone can do what I did, time provided.
This can skew the results, but, anyone can look at the previous votes the same way.

(in reply to Mad Russian)
Post #: 115
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 8:23:59 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian
How about an update on the voting results?

Do you allow me to do that Steve ?
anyway, this is public data, anyone can do what I did, time provided.
This can skew the results, but, anyone can look at the previous votes the same way.

Let me do that (later this morning).

I have been updating the spreadsheet you sent me. Right now I have 84 responses. Does that match what you have?

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Froonp)
Post #: 116
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 9:34:51 PM   
Rexor

 

Posts: 295
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: The Oort Cloud
Status: offline 		AI opponent: 95%
PBEM: 5%

_____________________________

"Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe." (H.G. Wells)

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 117
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 9:42:40 PM   
felixghost


Posts: 19
Joined: 6/30/2004
Status: offline 		Solitaire - 10%

Head-to-head (Hotseat) - 0%

AI Opponent - 70%

NetPlay - 10%

PBEM - 10 %

(in reply to brian brian)
Post #: 118
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 9:57:29 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline 		Survey
I ran a simple survey of the World in Flames forum members asking which mode(s) of play they expected to use, as a percentage of the time they spend playing MWIF. This was motivated by my conversation with Dave about how important the AI Opponent would be. My guess prior to this survey was that the break down would be 50% NetPlay, 30% AIO, 20% PBEM. I was completely wrong.

The scrren shots are taken of spreadsheet that Patrice created for summarizing the responses from this survey. As I write this we have had 86 players respond; that is a healthy simple size, though perhaps biased, since the survey is of active forum members. Patrice used the word 'votes', which is imprecise. I think of them as 'responses' - since no one is getting elected.

The dominant mode of play is going to be AIO (52%) with PBEM second (23%), NetPlay third (17%), with Solitaire and Head-to-head making up the rest. You can see these numbers in the first page of the spreadsheet.

From the comments players made when completing the survey, Solitaire, and to a lesser extent AIO, will be used to gain experience with the game so they can play against human opponents using PBEM and NetPlay. But there are over 60% of the customers who expect to play against the AI most of the time. If you look at the bar chart, you’ll see that AIO overwhelms the other modes of play for use Predominantly (75% or more of playing time). It is also equal to the sum of all the other modes of play for use Most-of-the-time (50% to 74% of playing time).

Overall, PBEM beats out NetPlay slightly, and almost 90% of the respondents had zero interest in Head-to-head play. Solitaire use is apparently expected to be a learning/planning tool rather than a means of playing the entire game from start to finish.

My conclusion is that I now agree with Dave: the AIO is crucial for sales. Indeed, I see this as a personal challenge, with players saying they can play MWIF better than any AIO I can create.




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to felixghost)
Post #: 119
RE: Simple Survey - 5/12/2009 10:38:35 PM   
Froonp


Posts: 7995
Joined: 10/21/2003
From: Marseilles, France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets


quote:

ORIGINAL: Froonp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian
How about an update on the voting results?

Do you allow me to do that Steve ?
anyway, this is public data, anyone can do what I did, time provided.
This can skew the results, but, anyone can look at the previous votes the same way.

Let me do that (later this morning).

I have been updating the spreadsheet you sent me. Right now I have 84 responses. Does that match what you have?

Yes. Plus those 2 between your post & mine.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 120
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