RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (Full Version)

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tbear2b -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:24:57 PM)

We'll need to put together at least some basic rules, then we can hammer out more if this league becomes more permanent. 

I would actually vote to not use financials.  I'm not sure they would work, considering we have a bunch of different years, anyway.  If we all had fictional players, or were using teams from a single year, we could use financials, but in PureSim, I'd vote for not using them in any case.  Sure, you can stockpile guys without financials, but you can also actually afford to keep your good prospects, since you wouldn't lose money for consistently being bad.  Although, of course, that can also lead to teams diving on purpose at the end of the year to get better draft picks, but I'm hoping no one around here will do that.



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:29:38 PM)

Guys, Matrix DOES have a chat room. We could set up a private chat room for GM discussions. 

Tbear, I'm with you on the issue of financials. We should not use them. Since we can't trade players for cash, I don't think that money should be an issue. All we would have to rely on is our basic GM skills, and our personal persuasiveness, heh heh.

This makes me think that trade discussions could be quite interesting. Let's keep it on as personal a level as we can. We have no contol over game results, right? just personnel decisions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what we are really doing is getting a feel of how the business end actually works, and how well the owners/GMs of the league can work together whilst competing against each other. This should be fascinating, and insightful.  



Deltadog -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:32:20 PM)

My only experience with on line leagues were using BBpro (2 versions)  In those leagues we ran 1 series at a time.  Of course, as I recall, all series were 3 games long and that does not appear to be the case with this game.  Simming a week at a time, what happens if there is an injury?  Does the cpu make the substitution and will the sim stop and the human manager be asked who he wants to substitute.  What if there is a double hitter, how do you arrange to use a differant catcher for each game if you want?  (you cannot be certain that the opponent will pitch a RH and a LH, so setting up different catchers in each line up will not work.)  What do you do if a tired player needs to sit out a game, sit him down for the whole week?  Do you have any control over which relief pitchers are used in what order (other than designating one as a closer).  Do you just set up the  basics and have to rely on the cpu for the rest?

Since only Al appears to be the only one with any experience with such a league, he may be the only one with these answers.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:37:30 PM)

KG, I'll try to answer some of your questions.

No Financials - this is a season sim and experimental at that.  If we choose as a group, we can continue on with another league, making whatever conceptual changes we want and do it career scope with another league setup.  One thing I hope to get out of this, aside from a good understanding of PSBB online abilities/limitations, is a good group of league owners who can move on to something bigger/better.  At least get a core group, although I am sure some won't be interested.

Trades - just no trading with an AI team (I guess).  Because I don't want to have to 'OK' that, because I can't be partial.  If we can come up with some way, then no big deal.  On human trading, I don't see that trades need to be OK'd by me, unless something looks seriously ridiculous.  Then I think we'd all step in and say something.

It's not H2H.  Basically you send in your lineups, I sim them a week at a time.  We may use a chat format where you can come online while I do it if choose - or if Atcranker wants to help, he can do it also - this allows you to respond to any injuries for lineup changes.

If you want Forbes, choose the 1970 team, KG!  [;)]  Interleague sounds like a good idea, only in that it allows us to really pit these unique teams against one another and still have a playoff.  Open to the thoughts of others on this.  I am not an interleague fan, but it is less of an evil to me than the current inbalanced schedule situation.  But I digress.  Here I think it could serve us.  Glad you mentioned it, KG, because it pulled me out out of funk of just saying 'No' to something I don't like.

Rotations and closers are up to the individual.  Lemme say this - I won't be using a closer on my staff, even though Eddie Watt was chosen normally in those situations.  I want to go with history, although the current PSBB relief staff code doesn't really do it justice for the pre-closer era.  It just doesn't work properly.

DH is another thing entirely.  While it works, three of the AL teams didn't historically use it.  So I'd vote a strong 'NO' against that.  Truth is, it would only make our earlier AL teams that more like to beat the living SH*T out of the other teams.  Our boys did it when it was still a man's game.  [;)]



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:38:36 PM)

OK, let me find this chatroom thing and I am going in.

"I'm going in!!!!"


OK, I'm back out. Mainly because I can't find it at all. KG?



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:45:32 PM)

Phil, go to Services at the top of the page, and hit "live chat".   When you login, don't use spaces. You'd be SittingDuck.

I'm in there now, in the Main Room.

C'mon on in, guys, and let's talk for a bit. [;)]



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:48:44 PM)

Delta, I will tell you this - there is no perfect way and compromises have to be made at some point.  No online league can mimic the flexibility and control we have in our own personal leagues.  Conversely, none of our own personal leagues will ever have the challenge, fun and reward of constructing/managing an online league.  Just apples and grommets, for comparison.

So I am open to suggestions on dealing with stuff.  I've seen quite a lot of different approaches in the various leagues I've been in, like owner-created 'substitution lists' (ie., if this guy goes down, then so and so replaces him and the order changes as thus) and then of course, there is the chatroom capability.  This is used mainly for injury subs, because no way can a commish sit there and converse all the info on an owner's team to them and account/handle every little change. 

So usually some combination of things together, constructed and agreed to by the league, get things to a happy medium.  And you just get on with it.



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:56:41 PM)

OK, is this chat room too quirky to use?  I didn't any capability to set up a Private Room. Erik or Shaun or any admin, how do we do this?



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/19/2006 11:58:53 PM)

yeah, that could be an issue.  something to follow up on.



Nukester -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 12:02:55 AM)

All good and legit questions, but I thats what this league is all about.....what do we need to know, do, set, export, etc, in order to get a PureSim league up and running. I could get an OOTP league up and running with my eyes closed, but dont have a clue as to what to do here.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 12:04:27 AM)

no joke - ootp is very good that way.  this is definitely something that needs to be addressed for the ascension of PSBB.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 12:28:36 AM)

Dear Lord....

Ted Williams.  Owns the World.  I just did the import.  [X(]



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 12:32:41 AM)

Alright. I'm back. Look, I'm a solo player, but I want to help get this off the ground.  Once we get the kinks worked out, I think it'll be fun. 

Once we get the ground rules ironed out,  I propose that we just go forward with it and learn as we go, just like the real-life majors did way back when. 

I'm outta here for the evening.  Talk to you guys tomorrow.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 12:47:56 AM)

Yeah, I think that is basically how we're approaching it.



Deltadog -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 1:41:42 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SittingDuck

Delta, I will tell you this - there is no perfect way and compromises have to be made at some point.  No online league can mimic the flexibility and control we have in our own personal leagues. 



I understand what you are saying and am not trying to be picky, just want to be sure I know what to do under these circumstances. It really does not matter how these situations are handled, just want to know how before I did not do it. [X(]



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 2:18:57 AM)

I understand what you're saying. 

I think we'll learn some valuable things from this that can help future leagues, too.  It'll be fairly easy - not going for the PITAssociation.

LOL!



Woodruff -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 3:15:02 AM)

Rather than using the quirky chat room, we could always use an IRC channel. I use mIRC which is a VERY user-friendly piece of software, and IRC channels are really nice.

One of my fantasy football simulation leagues (much like what we're trying to put together here) uses one.

Another nice feature of IRC is that if you want to "talk trade" with someone in private while we're all together, you can go into a private channel right there and be in both the group discussion and your private trade discussion.

Anyway, just another option there for us.

For what it's worth, having at least several owners hanging out "listening to the results" is a lot of fun, as you get the moans and groans and all that...lots of fun.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 4:47:22 AM)

Without much ado, here's the league!

Rapidshare link: http://rapidshare.de/files/30115449/PSBB_Greatest_Teams_2.rar.html



I am currently looking at FTP space solutions. Hope to have an idea of what way to go by the end of tomorrow.

Now a few notes:

1) I find import an interesting issue. The first time I tried building the assn, Ted Williams imported as 100/100/100 [X(] (I mean, there isn't a smilie appropriate enough for that!). Second time (this build), because I was learning about the import process, he came out with 86 PH instead (still those 100's though). Deadly. Anyhow, I just don't get the import variance, but I guess it is OK.

2) Those of you who don't know what to do - don't worry about it. Just look over your team and play around with it. You can process the spring and play out games - it doesn't matter. This is the base file I'll be working off of for the league; I don't expect to have to recreate it. After I get FTP stuff worked out, then I'll set up the data in the program so we can start messing around. So in the end, you'll be d/l the final, ready-to-go initial league file again in the (hopefully) near future - the one with which everything will happen.

ATTENTION: We do have one critical issue that requires input and resolution --

The import process only imports the players that are in the database for each team per season. This means that some teams have less than 35 players, some more. This leaves us with an obvious problem, for which I ask for suggestions on solution. However, I do think I have an interesting solution:

a) All teams with 35+ players must decide which excess players to cut (we're a NO FINANCES league, remember)
b) These go into the FA pool
c) We conduct a draft lottery (random selection, snake process) for the teams with 35- players to fill their rosters

Now I'll have to check if we'll have enough players released into the pool for this solution.

A few things that are basically out, and I'm sure you'll agree.

1) No creating fictional players - what's the point for a Greatest historical teams league?
2) Not doing the early amateur import route - mainly because that will leave ME with the decision of which players to cut as I do the import for each team. It would be a nightmare and could only be done with each owner sitting on my shoulder telling me, "keep him, cut him and him, give me a sandwich..."

Well, enjoy. I'll update a little bit more tomorrow when I get some more info. Man, I can't wait for the PSPN Report and forecast for top teams. This will be like the all-time PSPN report for excitement!









SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 4:51:30 AM)

*brainfart*



Deltadog -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 5:01:46 AM)

It looks as if no mater what Ted Williams is going to get good hitting numbers. When I first got this game I set up a 1955 historical league and Williams numbers are 100 - 82-96 which is not that far from what you are getting.

I have to agree with your suggestions. Your proposal seems like the only reasonable way to cut down the excess players and the FA pool for those with too few is the most reasonable way to address that part of the problem.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 5:14:27 AM)

Every Yankee could hit him over the head with a bat and he'd rule the league.

I am currently looking at my Verizon DSL account and considering the 100MB storage space option for $6.95/month. Depends on what type of traffic restrictions we're looking at. Plus, no contract and I can cut it off immediately once 75% of you bail on me. Or the Orioles aren't winning enough. [;)]



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 5:26:01 AM)

I'm going to repost the league as I have a team name display issue, but no big deal.

I thought I'd trot out the other 4 CPU-controlled teams (which will allow for some expansion if others want to get into it):

NL:
1975 Cincinnati Reds
1954 New York G'ints (Say Hey...)

AL:
1984 Detroit Tigers
1954 Cleveland Indians


Hmmmmm - as far as I know, there is no ability to create interleague schedules. Anyone else know about this?



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 5:47:01 AM)

UPDATE on rosters:

There are no where near enough 'surplus' players on teams to offset the deficiency for other teams.  Most teams have around 30 players, which is enough if there are no debilitating injury streaks for a team.

The Sandbox mode does not allow the early ammy import option, so that's out.

And I don't like the 'Create a Player', because they can be too hot and that stinks.

So, do we play with injuries off?  Or wing it and gut it out?  We can always cheat a bit - if a team would lose a guy to injury that would put him under 25 players, I could auto-heal that just-injured player.

Or, we could total all the players in the league.  Find an average number and teams above that release players to get down to the number.  That will leave a few other teams (some have 29 players, like Boston and Cleveland) that would have to do that draft that I spoke of earlier.

I think the latter option sounds like the best alternative, with the auto-heal injury as a last ditch preventative measure.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 6:14:14 AM)

Figured it out. Look at the following info. Basically, teams with more than 33 players will release their excess to the FA pool. Then teams below 33 players will draft to fill up their rosters to 33 players. Then we'll have four players left in the FA pool. Drafting will be, as I mentioned earlier, random order but no snake process.

Also, I'll need to create 2 scrubs per team to keep the roster levels at 35 men. Annoying. They'll be bottom rate scrubs.

The resulting historical FAs in the pool will exist for anyone to scoop up, but everyone MUST keep two scrubs on their team at all times. This will leave four legitimate players in the FA pool to help teams with injury or what-have-you, meaning people can cycle guys on and off their team. Example: I get a DL injury; I pick up one of the 4 FAs. Once my guy comes off DL, the borrowed FA goes back into the pool.

I might also create some more scrubs to leave in the pool just in case we do have some injury issues, but I don't foresee that.





[image]local://upfiles/7532/2728ED7875C342639E89B246FC521795.gif[/image]



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 7:01:49 AM)

Ok, I'm back for a moment. I accessed my team, and set a logo. However, I was NOT able to change from a 4 to 5-man pitching rotation. It seems that we're all stuck with 4.

So, all that's left is setting up that ftp site, right? AND addressing the roster imbalances. You're gonna stick me with Three Rivers, huh? That's fine. I was there once, so at least I had a first-hand view. (Ugly!! No place for baseball.) [:'(]




KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 7:28:44 AM)

Now, Phil, you know that no one really gives a flying f*ck about where we play, so let's get going.



KG Erwin -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 7:34:42 AM)

Now, next question --are we gonna do a commissioner's meeting chat for the team owners before we get started?   A "let's get acquainted" thing?   That might be nice.



Deltadog -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 8:17:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SittingDuck
Also, I'll need to create 2 scrubs per team to keep the roster levels at 35 men. Annoying. They'll be bottom rate scrubs.

The resulting historical FAs in the pool will exist for anyone to scoop up, but everyone MUST keep two scrubs on their team at all times.



Just so I understand what you are saying,

I currently have 3 players more than the 35 limit. What I must do is cut 5 of those I have and draft 2 scrubs that you create. Is thus correct. If so I assume that the scrubs will not have a year number associated with them. If this assumption is wrong, you may want to designate them some how. Looking at the Yankee team now there are a couple of players already there that could be confused with scrubs easily. (ie Dick Tettelbach55 5-5-10 pot 1)

2-You say you are going to repost the league file.

a.- Have you done so already?
b.- Are the player's numbers going change. (Don't want to spend more time looking at those in the original file if they will change)





SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 6:29:45 PM)

Delta - I don't think I'll be rebuilding the league. I think the file will work the way it was last built. Haven't reposted it yet but will do so in a few minutes.

RE: 2 scrubs/team:

Drafting them would take an eternity with all these teams and be hard to get owners together for. So what I propose is that you stipulate what type of scrubs you would like to have: SP, RP, some position. I will also give them dual positions, so you can stipulate that, too. Consider them mediocre defensive fill-ins with nearly zero offensive power. Sub-Mendoza boys at best. The purpose of these scrubs is to fill out the roster to 35 men, because the program won't proceed without that.

I'll name them obvious things like Bill Indian, 1955; Joe Yankee, 1955; Spiff Brewer, 1982. Things like that.

Uploading the file in a minute.



SittingDuck -> RE: Puresim Multiplayer League - Greatest All-Time Teams! (8/20/2006 6:30:53 PM)

KG's point about choice of parks, to me, seems somewhat reasonable. I'd propose you can use any park that was used within a 10-year period of your team's year. Open to any thoughts on all of that.

Reminds me I have to work on the parks. Ugh.



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