RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (Full Version)

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Lowpe -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 1:47:25 PM)

Most players want high aggression leaders because they will always fly or attack. They miss the boat[;)]...letting the local commander make decisions is often for the best.

You have multiple roles for Subs...from dropping mines, to pickets, to cargo raiding, to fleet support...

Don't forget to change their threat level too...where appropriate. Nothing wrong with using Low threat and a high aggression captain for instance.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 1:57:48 PM)

Ah, that's helpful! I'll adjust threat tolerance for those subs at sea (until I can replace commanders when the subs return to port to refuel).



AcePylut -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 2:12:12 PM)

Just to clarify – low-aggression commanders wasn’t a suggestion, it was a question. I don’t know the answer or what impact it would/could/might have on late war US Sub survive-ability.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 2:16:12 PM)

That's something that Jeff (Lowpe) has discussed at length in some of his AAR writing, so your comment jogged my memory. Jeff has played with settings in various ways, with some good success reported.



MakeeLearn -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 2:19:37 PM)


For sub commanders, a high Naval increases ASW survival.

The low threat option sounds good, will maybe focus them on non warship targets in a convoy.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 2:24:21 PM)

I've always focused on high Naval and high Aggression ratings. I'm going to switch over to high Naval and low aggression, as much as I can. I'll also switch a goodly number of subs over to a Low threat tolerance. When all that's done, I'll be able to see if it seems to make any difference in Allied sub survivability in hostile waters.



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 2:30:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've always focused on high Naval and high Aggression ratings. I'm going to switch over to high Naval and low aggression, as much as I can. I'll also switch a goodly number of subs over to a Low threat tolerance. When all that's done, I'll be able to see if it seems to make any difference in Allied sub survivability in hostile waters.

The aggression shouldn't be too low. Low sixties/high fifties works but forties would result in few attacks. The term "aggression" doesn't just mean "tendency to attack", it also means "patience level". Aggression in the high seventies will have your impatient sub commanders fire at the first escort they see or surface to use their deck gun when they still have torpedoes left. Mid-level aggression patiently sneaks past the escorts more often to take a shot at bigger fish.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 3:10:17 PM)

John just sent this email: "Turn is here.  [I'm] going to run a couple of errands and then I shall jump on the turn.  Figure a couple of hours until you see it."

He sent that at 11 a.m. eastern time. There's no way the turn is going to arrive in a couple of hours. He'll probably send it sometime between 3 p.m. and 5 p.m., with a 40% chance that something will come up so that it won't arrive until after 9 p.m.



witpqs -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 3:23:19 PM)

Oh, ye of little faith - and much experience! [:D]



Mike McCreery -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 4:00:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

John just sent this email: "Turn is here.  [I'm] going to run a couple of errands and then I shall jump on the turn.  Figure a couple of hours until you see it."

He sent that at 11 a.m. eastern time. There's no way the turn is going to arrive in a couple of hours. He'll probably send it sometime between 3 p.m. and 5 p.m., with a 40% chance that something will come up so that it won't arrive until after 9 p.m.


I vote for sometime tomorrow!!

John has exceeded my expectations regarding picking up and continuing this game :]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 7:02:22 PM)

[sm=innocent0009.gif]



MakeeLearn -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 8:34:20 PM)



The motto of all militaries: "HURRY UP AND WAIT!"



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 8:39:51 PM)

The turn arrived at 3:28 eastern time. [8D]



AcePylut -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 8:50:32 PM)

Well it's 4:50PM Eastern and no posts about the turn yet from you [:-] [:D]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/14/2017 10:05:04 PM)

That's 'cause I went for a run up Lavender Mountain in Georgia summertime heat and humidity (a few ripe blackberries were the only bright spot). Now I'm preparing a message for church tonight, as our preacher is handling other matters. So it's been a busy afternoon. I'll get back home around 8:30 p.m. eastern, at which time I'll sit down with the turn and see what's up with the evil Japanese.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:32:38 AM)

8/21/44

After church this evening, I joined my family for dinner, sat down to talk for awhile, and the next thing I knew, it was 2 a.m. and I'd gotten in a solid five hours of sleep already. Now it's 3:30 a.m. and I'm wide awake. Time to read, I suppose.

KB: Enemy carrier TFs withdraw from the Miri sector and seemingly vanish into the Java Sea. I'd anticipated an all-out assault on Miri's oil production, so this was a nice surprise.

Peep Show: No enemy fighters over Formosa today, so Allied bombers worked unopposed. John has loaded up Shanghai with aircraft. Allied army will reach Swatow day after tomorrow. Lots of enemy divisions bound (I think) for this region. Let'm come into the open, where Allied bombers can get at 'em.

In Indochina, the main Allied stack is two hexes from Hanoi; down south, an important attack tomorrow on the outskirts of Saigon; and I think John is planning some kind of counteroffensive in the Thailand region, possibly by land and sea.



[image]local://upfiles/8143/52CA48E8F7C44638A7715F9D1C2E59DF.jpg[/image]



jwolf -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 1:18:56 PM)

quote:

KB: Enemy carrier TFs withdraw from the Miri sector and seemingly vanish into the Java Sea.


Perhaps to Singapore to rearm?



crsutton -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 3:00:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Most players want high aggression leaders because they will always fly or attack. They miss the boat[;)]...letting the local commander make decisions is often for the best.

You have multiple roles for Subs...from dropping mines, to pickets, to cargo raiding, to fleet support...

Don't forget to change their threat level too...where appropriate. Nothing wrong with using Low threat and a high aggression captain for instance.


I have always wondered if low aggression sub commanders would more likely bypass shooting at an escort and target a merchant instead. I tend to have high aggression commanders and find that my subs target low priority escorts about half the time when attacking TFs-usually missing and then getting pounded in return. Never tested it though.



dave sindel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 3:08:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Most players want high aggression leaders because they will always fly or attack. They miss the boat[;)]...letting the local commander make decisions is often for the best.

You have multiple roles for Subs...from dropping mines, to pickets, to cargo raiding, to fleet support...

Don't forget to change their threat level too...where appropriate. Nothing wrong with using Low threat and a high aggression captain for instance.


I have always wondered if low aggression sub commanders would more likely bypass shooting at an escort and target a merchant instead. I tend to have high aggression commanders and find that my subs target low priority escorts about half the time when attacking TFs-usually missing and then getting pounded in return. Never tested it though.


I have noticed this same trend. I am going to try the "low aggression commander" tactic as subs come back to port for replenishment and see if I notice any difference.



HansBolter -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 4:54:57 PM)

I would think that a low aggression commander would be put off by the presence of the escorts and not attack at all.

Have to admit I have never tested it though.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 6:32:31 PM)

8/21/44

Peep Show: No enemy CAP over Formosa. Four of five enemy airfields showing 100% damage; Takao damage in the 80s.

Night Bombing: Scattered small groups of B-29s target Harbin, my first night-bombing raid of the war. No CAP encountered; no damage done.

China: US divisions and combat engineers will reach Swatow tomorrow.

Indochina: Allied troops mess up a battered mixed brigade NW of Saigon; it declined to retreat, so it oughta really get messed up tomorrow.

Also, enemy combat TF at Cam Ranh Bay. No reason for it to be there unless it's going to Formosa (I think). But I don't think KB is up/over here. I think it's in the Java Sea or at Singers.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/C46DD8984B1040CE9B697271908EB14F.jpg[/image]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 6:43:27 PM)

8/21/44

Death Star: DS and Mini DS have merged in the Philippine Sea. Who cares? Big deal! Why even mention it?

Well, truth be told, getting these reinforcements into theater without loss is hugely important. So I went ahead and mentioned it.



[image]local://upfiles/8143/AD434D53D47046AA86E3AFBD08D3BAFD.jpg[/image]



Lowpe -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:02:11 PM)

If you want to track night bombing effectiveness, you need to look at damage in a day or two...first reports are always low, and you can cause damage without getting any hits on the replay but there always seem to be a lag in seeing the results....best look at VP screen.

Moonlight is 21%. What altitude did you fly at? Full bomb loads or partial? DL on the day before, and did you fly recon on the night of the attack? AA present: light, medium or heavy?

What attack did you do --- manpower, plane factory, light industry, etc?

Harbin was a good first pick...but if you were playing me...you would have run into night fighters too, there.[;)]



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:16:37 PM)

10k altitude; no enemy CAP or flak; extended range, so reduced bomb load; no recon (that'll come later, but not prior to the first attack of the war); target was aircraft factory.



Lowpe -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:40:32 PM)

What do you have that can fly night recon missions at that range? Anything?

I forgot to ask what the weather was?

I am assuming you have decent leaders and flying from a large runway with a good HQa present.




Bullwinkle58 -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:57:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

10k altitude; no enemy CAP or flak; extended range, so reduced bomb load; no recon (that'll come later, but not prior to the first attack of the war); target was aircraft factory.


Pinpoint night bombing on specific industries, especially without recon, is a low-return proposition. You can go lower; just avoid balloon heights. And Manpower bomb. Fire is your friend. You won't get your hoped-for target every time, but you have a lot better chance of getting something.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 7:58:43 PM)

Flying from a level 8 field; I didn't pay attention to the weather; pilots and leaders are good; I don't have an air HQ present yet, though some will get there eventually. I do have a ground HQ - 8th Army. I wonder if it would help to install a leader with an high Air rating. It probably would work?



Mike McCreery -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 8:15:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

10k altitude; no enemy CAP or flak; extended range, so reduced bomb load; no recon (that'll come later, but not prior to the first attack of the war); target was aircraft factory.


Pinpoint night bombing on specific industries, especially without recon, is a low-return proposition. You can go lower; just avoid balloon heights. And Manpower bomb. Fire is your friend. You won't get your hoped-for target every time, but you have a lot better chance of getting something.


What he said. Even if you burn resource on the HI you still get strategic points. Hit some areas that only have that once in a while to keep him on his toes :]



BBfanboy -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 8:39:50 PM)

Pretty sure an Army or Corps HQ will not assist air ops under any circumstances, so save the PP on the leader switch. A Command HQ would help with air admin tasks like replacement and upgrade, but not sure if it would affect air ops at all.



Canoerebel -> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent (6/15/2017 10:11:46 PM)

8/21/44

14th Air HQ: Turns out I do have a big air HQ at Foochow....with an excellent commanding officer to boot.

[image]local://upfiles/8143/8C680033810142C294B6BDED6330CF1B.jpg[/image]



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