RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (Full Version)

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FrankieITA -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/12/2014 7:37:03 AM)

On the Eastern front situation is more boring than the western one.
British X Corps (Almost an Army on it's own) has interlocked with the gothic line and is cautiously advancing units to order a general assault the next turn. Polish II Corps is just stopping the enemy in mountaineous terrain and nothing more useful. I plan to conduct X and XIII British Corps in a concentric attack towards Rimini, using the polish as support for both advances. Supply situation is optimal with all rail lines repaired up to the first trenches. Reserves are numerous and offensive is imminent.

[image]local://upfiles/47491/2B912079736E416C8771ECC72367898A.jpg[/image]



FrankieITA -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/12/2014 3:48:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

What an outstanding screenshot. I like the way you play......you're a lot more organized than I am. What turn is this shot? Cool post.


Thank you, always kind. I actually waited a turn more to make the screen because it wasn't ordered enough, it's easy to keep everything ordered and near when you are on the defensive, I sometimes tend to disperd too much my units when I get to the offensive.
By the way this is turn 108.
Now I've played a little more turns and I'm getting slaughtered in front of the Gothic line on the Eastern front, but the Americans are advancing in the western front and let's see how Elmer handles it. Elmer chose a strong defence of all the Gothic line with Infantry and Paratrooper regiments, it ordered an armored counterattack the turn next my first attack on the line and finally withdrew all armored and support units after 2 turns of clash, leaving few half-chewed infantry to make a last defence. It actually impressed me and I wondered if it was in some kind-of-way scripted.



sPzAbt653 -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/12/2014 9:01:16 PM)

quote:

... and I wondered if it was in some kind-of-way scripted.


Yes, and thank you for reporting it. I've been waiting for that to happen for a long time. [:D]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/14/2014 11:56:43 PM)

Here's the West side in T48. I've been playing War in the Pacific v2.9 and I've now gotten it out of my system and I'm back to
this scenario. I was testing the new naval rules in the more advanced versions of TOAW and I have to say I like it. Anyway, back to
this......Everybody is streaming north and Napoli is my more immediate goal.





[image]local://upfiles/16287/FDF2AF1420F3461D9D950D484AF3A7E9.gif[/image]



Petey -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 1:18:28 AM)

Larry you seem to be doing a lot of one-dot attacks. Is that true? If so, I assume it is in attempt to reduce casualties. How does that work out for you in taking hexes? I've been traveling and will get back to the game in the next day or two.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 2:12:39 AM)

Hey there Petey dude: Um.......Whenever the enemy is entrenched I like to use one-dot attacks just to get the unit(s) to disentrench and then once they are disentrenched THEN I unleash the full combat power. This tactic only works if you get more than one combat round
per turn. I also don't like to get my units into stacks where they are yellow dense or worse. I can do green dense but I tend to avoid the yellow dense stacks when I'm attacking something.

Thanks for that question my friend. I needed to hear from somebody and you've made my day.

EDIT: Oh. It just dawned on me that you might have been talking about the one-dot attack(s) depicted in the picture. In that specific
case I was using one-dot attacks because supply was low and I was taking care to attack but not burn all the supply my units had.



Petey -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 2:20:30 AM)

Wow that's some good advice. I usually pile up the units at yellow and some times more dense. I'll give both a try.

I'm happy if I get two combat rounds per turn. You've inspired me to focus on upping my combat resolution technique when I get back to the game. [:)]

Yes my question was specific to that picture.

A couple of more questions:

What the difference between local and tactical reserve?

How do you play artillery 1, 2 or 3 dot setting?



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 3:03:10 AM)

quote:

What the difference between local and tactical reserve?

Um......my understanding is that "tactical" setting is used to give the arty unit the signal that they are to fire
in defense of units in range. Some of the arty units in Sicily to Brenner Pass have a range of 5 hexes.
And the "Local" reserve setting is to get the unit to move ( during the opponents turn ) one hex in the direction
of the attack. You can get short range units into the attack this way for those occasions when the atttack
goes on and on.

quote:


How do you play artillery 1, 2 or 3 dot setting?

Um...I usually regulate the arty based on it's supply and readiness levels. If the supply or readiness is less than
about 50% then I usually rest it. If it's at 60% but less than 90% then I like to set it on two-dot attacks. If the
supply and readiness is 90% or above then I sometimes put the arty unit on three-dot attacks. I usually use the
one-dot setting to conserve ammo when the supply level is at least 50% but less than 60%. Or you could use
the health-dots in the upper right corner of the unit displayed on the map. If they are red they don't fire. Yellow
is for one-dot attacks. Everything else they are three-dot attacks. It depends on the scenario and the equipment
that is firing and the supply level of the arty piece. You'll get a feel for it as you do it more. If the arty piece is
really really needed for the attack to succeed then I usually dedicate it to that mission rather than just set it 'T'
and let that be good enough. Experiment w/ it and see what kinds of attacks give the best result for the style of
play you use.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 3:07:24 AM)

I'm going to take this theater option just to see what it does. And to see does it work?

EDIT: This is T50

[image]local://upfiles/16287/8A3D153B9D3C4D60993B72562A1199AE.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 3:17:52 AM)

Here's the East side in T50. I've got two divisions in floating reserve off the coast near Tomoli. They are going to simulate coming
ashore by having to use the single pier that Tomoli has plus whatever additional lighters the port may use for unloading transports.
I'm getting closer to the Gustav Line and I expect it to be fully manned already. I've seen dozens of German units railroading south
toward this spot. I've got 3/4 of the planes on INT missions and I'm plinking a lot of German traffic. I like especially to go tank
plinking. The P-40 is supposed to be good for that. I don't have any P-39's but they are good for tank work too.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/6EEBD1B5F51B4E50A0429CCCE4911BAC.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 3:25:32 AM)

Here's the West side in T50. Everybody near the coast is drifting northward and traffic is a minor hassle. I'm running into the roadblocks
just before the Gustav Line and I'm pounding them w/ the planes and I'm bringing up the arty to help out. Supply is good and everything
is okay so far. I'm going to run into Panzers at the Gustav Line I'm guessing so I'm moving everybody carefully to maintain a supply
level and readiness level about 60% or so. When they dip less than that they rest.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/CD992CFA46E241F18688C84763748EC6.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 4:28:08 AM)

Here's the T51 front lines. I'm seeing some rail running across the width of the peninsula and ending up at Rome so I'll have to get the
RR engineers busy working on that as soon as I capture Rome.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/840C41F2084C442E98EC86C727A98612.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 5:36:42 AM)

Have I shown you guys a close up of the West side lately? I'm already running into the single digit supply areas. I tend to move too far
too fast and run out of gas. Then the unit doesn't move again until it gets to about 60% readiness. And moves in spurts thereafter
until the supply level rises again.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/209FDF7B6A724FEBBEAC923DC7BF7D0B.gif[/image]



Martin_Goliath -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 8:23:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

quote:

What the difference between local and tactical reserve?

Um......my understanding is that "tactical" setting is used to give the arty unit the signal that they are to fire
in defense of units in range. Some of the arty units in Sicily to Brenner Pass have a range of 5 hexes.
And the "Local" reserve setting is to get the unit to move ( during the opponents turn ) one hex in the direction
of the attack. You can get short range units into the attack this way for those occasions when the atttack
goes on and on.


Petey: What Larry says pertains to ranged units; it enables them to try to support combats within range without needing to be dug in. This is handy if you are planning to move on later in your turn. As to non-ranged units, T means "try to react to combats in neighbouring hexes": if a comm check is passed, the unit will move into a friendly hex under attack. L means "try to react to combats in hexes within movement distance", and may lead to the unit moving towards trouble spots during the enemy turn. I do seldom use L, but other people might point to advantages I am unaware of.
And Larry: Nice description of your philosophy when using artillery. It would be great to collect reasonings like these from various people in one place, so that you could compare different ways to do things.




larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 9:12:39 AM)

I like your description better. Way to go. Also, Petey, you could check out the Articles collection at Rugged Defense.
They have a constellation of articles to read.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/796FE951E71A4D0D9A643E82DFDF54C9.gif[/image]



FrankieITA -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 9:31:26 AM)

Maybe stupid questions: is there a logic to use artillery in Local instead of Tactical? It seems not as you all tell it.
If I move the artillery unit during my turn and put them in T mode after I moved it, will it be able to support defence during next enemy's turn?



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 9:37:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: frankieITA
Maybe stupid questions: is there a logic to use artillery in Local instead of Tactical? It seems not as you all tell it.

I don't remember ever using L on my arty. I HAVE used L for some of my reserve units to get them started on their way to the
scene of the crime. I get the impression that L is seldom used.

quote:

ORIGINAL: frankieITA
If I move the artillery unit during my turn and put them in T mode after I moved it, will it be able to support defense during next enemy's turn?

Yes, that's my understanding. I do this a LOT. I've even used T on land combat units that I don't want to specifically dedicate to
participate in the attack but if they do it won't hurt anything.



Martin_Goliath -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 10:08:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: frankieITA

is there a logic to use artillery in Local instead of Tactical?

I did a quick check (not fully conclusive), and it seems that artillery with L setting does not behave as expected: Combat reports state that "xx artillery supports" defence or attack, but there is no equipment from that unit in the combat inventory. When supporting a cooperative defending unit, the artillery moves in that direction like non-ranged units do.

Edit: Maybe this IS the expected behaviour, apart from the "xx artillery supports" message. I think I have encountered spurious support messages in combat reports in other circumstances too.

Edit 2: A closer look revealed that support during bombardment DOES take place (the artillery equipment does not show in the combat loss report, but they DO contribute). However, L does behave a bit strange, as supporting artillery continue moving until they are in the attacked hex - see another thread (post #6) http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3537325&mpage=1



Petey -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 9:24:48 PM)

I'm at the beginning of turn 53 and I'm resting and reorganizing my troops just North of Rome. Not any real resistance at the Gustav line.

[image]local://upfiles/45526/18A520AEABA04F7B9F7974F8BEE910A0.gif[/image]



Petey -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 9:31:09 PM)

Eastern view of turn 53 beginning. Clearing the Gustav line and will rest the troops. I will begin rebuilding the rail line to Rome. I assume it is the only rail supply line to the East coast. Having a real hard time with Paint. It's been years since I used it last.

[image]local://upfiles/45526/BEE5A46AECE645AFB303B8448BF0686A.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 10:08:09 PM)

quote:

Having a real hard time with Paint.

MSPaint is a lot easier than GIMP. I have both but use Paint because it's easier and quicker and does just about everything I need it to
do. The more you use it the easier it becomes. I'm not seeing a lot of Germans in your pictures.....what in the world did you do to
arrange that? Cool.



Petey -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 10:41:13 PM)

I slogged my way pretty casually up the boot. Made amphib invasion one at Salerno and one at Naples. Surrounded and eliminated the axis as I went. Quite frankly at the moment I've got more troops than I need, although most are in poor supply. The units are effectively not being resupplied sitting on 5 or 8 supply hexes. I'm going to halt for a few turns and rebuild the rail line from Rome to the east coast so the Commonwealth troops can supply up. I've rebuilt it on the East coast up to Foggia but I see that line really doesn't go much further north. I've got the West coast line rebuilt from Salerno to Rome.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 10:53:51 PM)

quote:

I've rebuilt it on the East coast up to Foggia but I see that line really doesn't go much further north.

Yeah, I noticed that too. You'd think that it would go straight through to the north along the coastal road to connect the separate
parts of the country better but nooooooo. So the only thing to do is go north from Rome and veer NE and thence across the width
of the peninsula. It's longer but there's not much of a recourse.

quote:


I've got the West coast line rebuilt from Salerno to Rome.

Already? What turn did you say this was? Way to go dude. Congratulations on finding a way through the Gustav Line. I'm guessing
supply is your biggest handicap right now.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 11:12:21 PM)

Here's the rail line that goes NE from Rome to the East coast. And thence north. I don't even have Rome yet so I may have to have a
few engineers on the East coast building toward the West maybe, to get this thing built faster.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/B16510269A7B40B5BE787D6A43262361.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 11:19:22 PM)

Okie dokie.....I'm at T53 and we're starting to see Germans manning positions along the Gustav Line. Petey may have found a way
through but I'm finding it up and running when I get there. Maybe for now I should just gather the troops, get organized, build the rail
further west and get ready for the final assault on the Gustav Line when everybody is ready and I've got the arty positioned and so
on. Nah, I'll just wing it from here.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/F1FED075EE3C4B5592A28F10070F9364.gif[/image]



sPzAbt653 -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 11:32:04 PM)

quote:

Petey may have found a way through ...


Maybe Petey is still playing with the Partisan version ?

By the way, after removing the partisans I gave the Allies a 'guerrilla effect' of 1%. I'm seeing a lot of converted hexes in these screen shots, it looks like way more than 1%. I guess I misunderstand what 1% means.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 11:40:16 PM)

I'm seeing bou cou partisan activity all over the map. This is what Rome looks like and it's typical. Maybe the factor you have to enter
is the amount of partisan activity subtracted from 1000 or something.

EDIT: Hey Petey, do you have any partisan units in your scenario?

[image]local://upfiles/16287/6D52D595AF51451F886E764FB53B9112.gif[/image]



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/15/2014 11:49:19 PM)

Hey Steve: here's a saved game file for you go load into TOAW so you can take a look around at the partisan activity or
something similar.



larryfulkerson -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/16/2014 12:21:06 AM)

Um......I think I may have found a hole in the German lines. There's a hole that I'm thrusting units through and I plan to make the hole
bigger as my next goal.

[image]local://upfiles/16287/0E19315F357C4EEB9C0522AC0D33167E.gif[/image]



sPzAbt653 -> RE: Sicily to Brenner Pass Revised (2/16/2014 3:16:28 AM)

quote:

Um......I think I may have found a hole in the German lines.


Yeah, I'm some kind of stupid. Replacing Partisans with Guerrillas and expecting a different outcome ? *shakes head*

Well, new version 2.3 is posted, with no partisans and no guerrillas. I would still like to include a non-stupid solution to the Partisan effect on German units and operations.



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