RE: Naval and Defense News (Full Version)

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Triode -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/9/2016 8:45:03 PM)

Syrian Mig-29 with AKU-170 launcher and R-77 missile
[image]http://i.imgur.com/UbCoKqI.jpg[/image]




Hongjian -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/10/2016 11:59:25 AM)

http://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/3690250

Chinese Su-35K: Everything stays the same, even the Russian language of the controls (because Chinese characters are hard to read on the MFDs). Chinese pilots are already experienced with reading Russian cockpit controls due to their Su-27SKs back in the 90s. Only thing that will change is that the satellite navigation system is changed to China's own Beidou system.




Hongjian -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/10/2016 12:05:29 PM)

http://alert5.com/2016/10/09/major-chinese-radar-entered-service-probably-pave-paw-equivalent/

quote:

Major Chinese radar entered service; probably PAVE PAW-equivalent

China’s state-owned China Electronics Technology Group Corporation (CETC) announced on Oct. 8 that its 14th Institute has handed over a major radar installation to the People’s Liberation Army.

The radar is believed to be a PAVE PAWS-type early warning long-range radar to detect incoming ballistic missiles.


Again, the 14th institute delivers. This was long rumored and would coincide with the recent public acknowledgement of the HQ-19/KKV-ABM system




OldSarge -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/10/2016 8:27:16 PM)

Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

quote:


Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates (AP) — Two missiles fired from rebel-held territory in Yemen landed near an American destroyer in the Red Sea, the U.S. Navy said Monday, the second such launch targeting ships in the crucial international waterway in recent days.


I can't seem find an article that as any more detail on this incident. Looks like the Bab el-Mandeb strait will be the new hotspot to watch.





jtoatoktoe -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/10/2016 9:34:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OldSarge

Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

quote:


Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates (AP) — Two missiles fired from rebel-held territory in Yemen landed near an American destroyer in the Red Sea, the U.S. Navy said Monday, the second such launch targeting ships in the crucial international waterway in recent days.


I can't seem find an article that as any more detail on this incident. Looks like the Bab el-Mandeb strait will be the new hotspot to watch.




Reuters is really the only entity that has tried to even cover it well.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-yemen-security-usa-ship-idUSKCN12A082

For some reason most of the media either has small articles or nothing at all. Kind of strange seeing the implications that could become of it. In my opinion the U.S. should launch Airstrikes on any remained Missiles and their radars in the area and make it clear that we won't tolerate missiles flying at us in International Waters. You can send a message without getting dragged heavily into this civil war.




Dysta -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/11/2016 4:01:37 AM)

I wouldn't be surprised if the destroyer is evaluating the threat before to commence the interception. It's risky, but also worth to keep their swords sheathed when those arrows can't reach them.

But I think US will soon stand up to recent missile threats, the problem is when.




Cheechako -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/11/2016 11:16:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OldSarge

Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

quote:


Missiles fired from rebel-held Yemen land near US destroyer

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates (AP) — Two missiles fired from rebel-held territory in Yemen landed near an American destroyer in the Red Sea, the U.S. Navy said Monday, the second such launch targeting ships in the crucial international waterway in recent days.


I can't seem find an article that as any more detail on this incident. Looks like the Bab el-Mandeb strait will be the new hotspot to watch.




According to this link, 2 SM-2s and an ESSM were launched at one ASCM with a possible intercept.

https://news.usni.org/2016/10/11/uss-mason-fired-3-missiles-to-defend-from-yemen-cruise-missiles-attack






ExNusquam -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 12:55:22 AM)

quote:

In addition to the missiles, the ship used its Nulka anti-ship missile decoy, the sources confirmed.

The theorem holds: Every ASM that has been fired in anger at a vessel that employed countermeasures has missed.

I hope more info comes out on this, it will be interesting to see if this was another countermeasure success or the second (!) successful kinetic intercept of an ASM. Unfortunately in this case I'd place better than even odds on final AAR being classified.




Dysta -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 5:54:12 AM)

China will use micro nuclear power plants as moral shield and borderline to fortify the position on SCS, as many alarmists suggested before:

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/11/could-china-build-the-worlds-smallest-nuclear-power-plant-and-send-it-to-the-south-china-sea.html




Jagdtiger14 -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 6:28:58 AM)

It was recently proposed that the US military enforce a no-fly zone in Syria. Anyone here think that's a good idea?

Also Russia recently announced it could/might launch S300's at suspicious aircraft heading in the direction of their operations...and that the operators of the S300's would not have enough time to identify prior to launch.

On another note, Turkey has mentioned that it intends to (assist?) in taking Mosul and doesn't care how loud the Iraqi leader screams against it. Not sure what could happen when/if Turkish forces arrive in the area since Mosul is surrounded by Kurdish fighters and Iraqi forces.




xavierv -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 6:15:50 PM)

Well... why the heck not ? :)

Thales Captas-1 Towed Sonar Tested Aboard CNIM's L-CAT Landing Catamaran
quote:

During the Euronaval 2016 press tour held last month, Navy Recognition learned that Thales recently partnered with French company CNIM to test the Captas-1 towed sonar aboard the L-Cat landing catamaran. The test demonstrated how Captas-1 may be deployed from compact platforms as well as the ability of the L-CAT design to conduct other missions than amphibious operations.

http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4427




jtoatoktoe -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 9:21:20 PM)

More missiles fired today at the same U.S. Ships off Yemen.




comsubpac -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 9:42:18 PM)

U36 the last boat of the 212A class has entered service.

http://www.marine.de/portal/a/marine/!ut/p/c4/NYuxDsIwDET_yE6CBBJbSxkQYmGBsiWtVSw1SWUcWPh40oE76S3vDh9Ym_ybJ6-ck5_xjv3A-_CB6AUKBZKSXkCcnsRKCUrIWQmcdR5v63skGHIiXVkHypWTeM0CSxadV1NEqgEesTe2a83O_GO_zfFy6M5uu-lO7RWXGJsfu29WFQ!!/

I have seen news reports that the Marine wants two additional boats.

Additionally the Gorch Fock not only gets new masts but also a new deck.

http://www.marine.de/portal/a/marine/!ut/p/c4/NYzBDoIwEET_aBdMjNEbBE28ehG8lbK0G6Ely1YT48dbDs4kc3kzgw_MDubFzijHYCZssbN86t8wG4FEPUkKKxAHT6wUwPM0rqPx8qHkCFwU68don5CbbL0S3rfPgcDGQLplninndGI0CixRdNpIEskEeMCuKJu6OBR_ld_qfDnv2_K4a671DZd5rn6zgKQZ/

The German Heer has made its yearly Informations Lehrübung ILÜ. This year for the first time with the Puma and dutch soldiers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hu13J1yafko&t




Broncepulido -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/12/2016 10:13:02 PM)

For more data on the Yemen naval incidents, simply remember USS Ponce (AFSB(I)-15) is equipped from August 2014 with operationally capable test Laser Weapon System (LaWS):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Ponce_(LPD-15)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Weapon_System




Dysta -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 1:57:43 AM)

So that means something cause Yemeni have to fire missiles at two ships, so they can test the laser to intercept them?

It is indeed fishy, but my point is still stand: if jamming works or the missile itself is inaccurate, there is no need for hard-kill solution.

Besides, US Navy is still remain silent of how these missiles were stopped:

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/u-sees-mounting-evidence-houthi-role-strike-u-050613809.html




redcoat -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 2:28:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jtoatoktoe

More missiles fired today at the same U.S. Ships off Yemen.


I wonder what the missiles are. C-801 anti-ship maybe?




Anathema -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 2:53:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jtoatoktoe
For some reason most of the media either has small articles or nothing at all. Kind of strange seeing the implications that could become of it.

If there aren't any images or video of a news story, especially for TV or cable news, then it only ever gets a brief mention. Likewise if there is no reporter present or eyewitness accounts to fill in all the details and multiple sources to confirm everything there is only so much they can report apart from the basic facts, in this case basically repeating whatever the Pentagon spokesman says until more details become known.




Tashtego -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 3:22:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: redcoat


quote:

ORIGINAL: jtoatoktoe

More missiles fired today at the same U.S. Ships off Yemen.


I wonder what the missiles are. C-801 anti-ship maybe?



Check this link out.

https://news.usni.org/2016/10/11/uss-mason-fired-3-missiles-to-defend-from-yemen-cruise-missiles-attack




jtoatoktoe -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 4:03:45 AM)

The U.S. has struck and destroyed 3 radar sites in Yemen.

Pentagon Statement.
[image]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CunbHSNWEAEPqh7.jpg[/image]




Dysta -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 4:28:50 AM)

"...and elsewhere around the world. "

It's a message to China, as US will stop whatever the threat comes into them. This can be a petty example of what if China had start a fight in any regional sea.

Well the problem is, China has more than just missiles, and starting a fight is the least logical (but wishful for US) thing to do.




Jagdtiger14 -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 6:42:23 AM)

US struck 3 radar sites. Weak response as usual.




Gneckes -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 8:52:52 AM)

What, would you have preferred a massively escalating response instead?




Jagdtiger14 -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 6:10:45 PM)

As it is, Gneckes...Iran is now sending two of its destroyers to the Gulf of Aden on the "concern for pirates".

Since you are concerned about escalation, I'll ask again if anyone thinks a no fly zone in Syria is a good idea?

I'm not sure if there is a naval blockade vs the Houthi's but there better be one now. How are they getting their hands on cruise missiles (Chinese Silkworms perhaps)?

See Dysta's post #2 in Yeman Scenario? (Mods and Scenarios) for further suggestions.




Gneckes -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 6:12:50 PM)

Can we keep the politics out of here please?




Jagdtiger14 -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 6:21:53 PM)

quote:

Can we keep the politics out of here please?


Obviously "politics" is how/why this is happening in the first place, don't you think? Are not politics and military affairs intertwined? If this thread is only about the types of missiles, weapons being used, my apologies. I'll go ahead and delete what I think you think is political. Correct me if I hav'nt been thorough enough.





kevinkins -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/13/2016 10:31:02 PM)

Where is the political post? I think operational considerations in the news are OK for this thread.

Anyway, not sure if the response was weak per se but delayed. What's with the second salvo for example?

As far as Syria and a no-fly, this was in the morning news:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-obama-aides-expected-weigh-syria-military-options-155259609.html

"Anthony Cordesman of Washington's Center for Strategic and International Studies think tank suggested the United States' failure to act earlier in Syria, and in Aleppo in particular, had narrowed Obama's options.

"There is only so long you can ignore your options before you don’t have any," Cordesman said."




mikmykWS -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/14/2016 1:26:32 AM)

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles.

Mike




ExNusquam -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/14/2016 3:08:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles.

Mike

Mike, I concur with your assessment. Much about the missile exchanges over the last 2 weeks has not been publicly disclosed, but there's quite a bit we can determine from the information released.

1. The USNI article says that the 3 Radar sites were also active on 30 September when the Swift was hit. This indicates that the US has been watching these sites preemptively, well before the first incident.

2. Tacking on to that point, the fact that the Radars were hit within 24 hours after the second incident likely means that the US had target/weaponeering plans in place already. Since nearly 2 weeks have passed since first CDCM shot, there has been ample time to ensure that these were the sensors that were passing targets to the CDCM TELs.

3. While we don't know the exact combination of weapons/countermeasures employed in each exchange, this is a big for the USN; It's been 25 years since anyone last successfully defeated a Warshot ASM. This means several things:
a. The USN's training has not atrophied over 25 years of doing nothing but shooting LACMs.
b. The AEGIS system is still effective in the littoral.
c. Alternatively, the Houthi's have poor coordination in their CDCM C2 systems and either launched out of range or engaged the wrong vessels (Much like MV Moonlight was hit when Hezbollah engaged the INS Hanit).

4. Unless there are further CDCM shots I don't expect the US to undertake inland strikes against the Houthi CDCM TELs or Ammo dumps. The US is attempting to insert itself as a neutral party as part of a political resolution, and additional strikes would undermine this narrative.

5. Pending more information or additional launches, I think the biggest impact this will is on shipping through the Bab el Mandeb strait. It will be interesting to see what next months statistics are on tonnage transiting through BAM and the Suez.




kevinkins -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/14/2016 3:33:15 AM)

Thanks for the summary. Out of curiosity (scenario design based), what other sensors would be in that area of the Arabian Peninsular? I mean that the USN would not want to pick off by mistake. This could make for an interesting addition to a scenario I am finalizing. My thoughts are radars to monitor shipping for legitimate navigational purposes. But these should be known as easy to avoid.




Jagdtiger14 -> RE: Naval and Defense News (10/14/2016 7:04:56 AM)

quote:

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles. Mike





The response was so perfect that they shot another missile the next day at the same ship.

Can someone explain to me:
1. Are the Saudi ground forces so small or weak that they cant go on any offensive? Or even defend their own territory from the Houthis?
2. Why hasn't the West (in conjunction with Arab allies) done something about controlling the bottleneck area?...ie...why are the Houthis allowed to control Perim Island (Mayyun) in the Red Sea bottleneck, and have an army base adjacent at Bab-el-Mandeb???

See the Yemeni Civil War up to date active template:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Yemeni_Civil_War_detailed_map




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