RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (Full Version)

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lastkozak -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 11:54:27 AM)

*Sigh*!

Oy vey what a mess! The defensive forces around Moscow look like a painter's pallet! Are there even any forces to defend a line? My suggestion is the Central Front Units around Moscow attempt to harass the Germans; he has left several openings. I doubt he will let me slip past, but it will force him to tighten the pocket. If insufficient supplies exist in the remnants of the Moscow Garrison, I would recommend air dropping supplies also.

I strongly suggest no Attacks, unless it appears like a guaranteed victory, and or it is Blizzard; although with mild Blizzard the Germans will be tough as **** and will not be all depleted in spring. Boy is this game set up to benefit the Germans.

What is the date?

Are we using random or historical weather?



lastkozak -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 12:03:14 PM)

September 4th, 1941???? That is not close to winter!!!! We have minimum 6 turns til mud!

The Volga line you suggest, although is a major river, it is a convoluted. The straighter the line the fewer the units, thus the higher the stack of units. Use the major rivers when we can, other wise, choose a minor river and the best defensive obstacles you can.

The reinforcements coming in are few until November. Thus they are coming in depleted. we need to control how many men are being placed in the new reinforcements and how many to the front units on refit.

How many T-34's and KV-1's do we have?

There are 6 Tank divisions, that do not flip to brigades til January, all other tank brigades begin flipping as of this turn. Their excess will begin trickling back to the pool. We need to find those 6 Divisions and place them somewhere to absorb all those tanks, so we have something to strike with come winter, if we even can.



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 1:31:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thedoctorking

Funny, when I look at the "report" map and the Commander's Report "battles" tab, I don't see any Axis attacks. Yet they clearly attacked - they are across the Neva next to Osinovets and have broken through behind Velikie Luki. Something wrong with the save game?



There was a bug with the save game, yes. The German commanders sent us a PM about it ( they sent it to you as well if I remember correctly )




quote:

ORIGINAL: lastkozak

*Sigh*!

Oy vey what a mess! The defensive forces around Moscow look like a painter's pallet! Are there even any forces to defend a line? My suggestion is the Central Front Units around Moscow attempt to harass the Germans; he has left several openings. I doubt he will let me slip past, but it will force him to tighten the pocket. If insufficient supplies exist in the remnants of the Moscow Garrison, I would recommend air dropping supplies also.

I strongly suggest no Attacks, unless it appears like a guaranteed victory, and or it is Blizzard; although with mild Blizzard the Germans will be tough as **** and will not be all depleted in spring. Boy is this game set up to benefit the Germans.

What is the date?

Are we using random or historical weather?



The central front will most likely receive all reinforcement for the next two turns in order to build the defensive line on the river. ( still in theory, nothing official right now ). So yes, the plan is to attack Moscow with all forces available, receive reinforcement to build a defensive line on the river, and once the defensive line is ready, retreat all forces to that line.

I am not sure if the game is set to mild blizzard or not... Id have to double check. And as for the weather, I think we are using the Historical. Il have to double check as well.


quote:

ORIGINAL: lastkozak

September 4th, 1941???? That is not close to winter!!!! We have minimum 6 turns til mud!

The Volga line you suggest, although is a major river, it is a convoluted. The straighter the line the fewer the units, thus the higher the stack of units. Use the major rivers when we can, other wise, choose a minor river and the best defensive obstacles you can.

The reinforcements coming in are few until November. Thus they are coming in depleted. we need to control how many men are being placed in the new reinforcements and how many to the front units on refit.

How many T-34's and KV-1's do we have?

There are 6 Tank divisions, that do not flip to brigades til January, all other tank brigades begin flipping as of this turn. Their excess will begin trickling back to the pool. We need to find those 6 Divisions and place them somewhere to absorb all those tanks, so we have something to strike with come winter, if we even can.



Winter is coming, dont worry about it..... [8|]

We have lots of reinforcement coming, in the next couple of turns, we are planning to send them all your way. As for everything else you said, this is up to you. You are the commander of the central front and so you do as you see fit. I do not know how many T-34s and KV-1s we got, not many, thats for certain.

Same for air troops, while Kratsch is the Air Marshall, you still control the missions being done with the airplanes available to your front.

Although Kratsch was planning of reorganizing the whole Air Forces this turn I believe. Youd have to talk to him for more information.

Well be waiting Kratsch's answer on all of that and then we can start doing the turns.



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 8:54:30 PM)

Alright everyone, we can welcome Darojax in the team as our new Central Front Marshall. He has a good amount of experience with both WitW and WitE, so this will be a nice welcome for the defense of Moscow.



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 10:42:22 PM)

o7 Comrades

I understand that several previous Central Front Marshals have been 'excused'. I will try to last a bit longer. : )

As mentioned I have been playing quite a lot of WitE and also WitW and consider defensive warfare my best field. I have been informed we are facing a challenging situation, I will do what I can. o7

Dax



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 10:43:11 PM)

-



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/8/2018 10:46:29 PM)

I was wondering if there is a post that outlines exactly what fronts/armies and air units that I have command over? How does it work with assigning support units to the corps/armies etc?

And btw, are we using Discord?



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 12:16:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darojax

I was wondering if there is a post that outlines exactly what fronts/armies and air units that I have command over? How does it work with assigning support units to the corps/armies etc?

And btw, are we using Discord?



Dont worry about the German avatar ;) Although we expect you to change it something more along the line of a central front commander of the USSR....[8|]

hhm, well, as for your armies, I will tell you wich one exactly, but I will do this tomorrow because I am getting tired right now.....[>:]

and as for the support units, well...hhm I dont know, wev never talked about that before. Do as you please with the support units Id say.

The air units, well everything that is assigned to your armies is yours, the only thing is , the air marshall is the one who moves them OUT of armies, and who decides everything about how air troops are assigned. The only thing you will do with your air units is send them in missions.

By tomorrow I will arrive with the drawing that separates your armies from other Fronts, but if you refer to page 14, on the drawings around Moscow, you can pretty much see what troops you have.

From the Green units on top to the blue and purple units below, and if you look at the mini-map, you can see there is a few more armies below, those are yours too. You can see there is a big gap between you and the Southern armies. So thats where your control stop.

Il make it more obvious by tomorrow.


EDIT : Nice work on changing the avatar to a soviet one :)



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 12:22:24 AM)

Yup, german look changed to soviet! : p



Kratsch -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 8:49:49 AM)

Gents,

We are playing at pretty much historical pace, ie a turn takes us a week. We are 12 turns in, with 240 to go.

The situation in my view is frankly pointless to continue just for the sake of it; the Germans are where they shouldn’t even be in 6-8 turns!
It appears that the German team are of exactly the same opinion, as they offered a restart. You can really only offer such a thing if the situation is beyond doubt warranting a restart, as it would be pretty arrogant otherwise. They could not have made their assessment of the situation any clearer while staying polite and respectful to their opponents.

The point is to have fun and enjoy the experience. Playing a forgone conclusion for several years is not fun for both parties, and will strongly discourage future new team members from joining. We are seeing this already now, and it will get a lot worse.

The game has a snowball principle, whereby advantages with time tend to get even bigger. The situation is way out of kilter, and the pace of that will only further increase. This is my major gripe with the game in 41, I.e. the balance is so brittle.

I would very strongly vote for taking up the Germans, book it as a learning experience, and restart so that we can all enjoy it. Playing on just for the sake of it out of stubbornness serves no purpose apart from being able to say in 3 years, ‘we did not quit’. I have played strategy and war games of all sizes for too long to have the pride of have to say that if it comes at the expense of several indivuals fun. And frankly, hundreds and hundreds of playing hours each of us will invest in this project are not worth it.



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 12:38:15 PM)

Personally I do not mind at all fighting despite almost hopeless odds. If things spiral out of control the Axis will just eliminate most of our units and there will come a point where we all can see there is nothing to be done, the Red Army is defeated. This is where we should surrender, I would not say we are there yet.

However:

My first observation: I would strongly suggest that the north and south fronts pull back forcefully immediately! We need to reform the front line! Unless there is a consistent front, especially North-Center, the fascist dogs will have no issue to circumvent the entire Central Front, and then it will not matter how valiantly I can get my men to defend and fight.



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 2:23:10 PM)

quote:

We are playing at pretty much historical pace, ie a turn takes us a week. We are 12 turns in, with 240 to go.


Yes, and that is somewhat of a problem, we are trying to do this as fast as possible. The Axis team do their turn in about 2-3 days. We do ours in about 7 days. We just need to watch the forum every day for development of turns, thats all.

quote:

It appears that the German team are of exactly the same opinion, as they offered a restart.


Its about the third time they offer a restart. the first one being in June 41. They always do when a new team member comes in, and the previous commander let their armies being massively encircled.

quote:

will strongly discourage future new team members from joining. We are seeing this already now, and it will get a lot worse.


Each big multiplayer game is like this. Our sister game ( the other 4v4 MP game ) has seen about 8 members being changed from both team. Ask Telemescus, he has the exact numbers.. So this is pretty normal stuff. People always leave in 1941 because they always think the situation is desperate. And while yes, it is, its also historically true that it was desperate. Berlin will be in our sight.


quote:

I would very strongly vote for taking up the Germans


3 Players voted to continue against 1. ( And the axis team wants to continue the game as well )
So we will continue the game.
I know you have been wanting to abandon the game for several turn Kratsch, and thats alright if you do, but please let us know quickly so we can advance in the turns.




Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 2:28:32 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Darojax
However:

My first observation: I would strongly suggest that the north and south fronts pull back forcefully immediately! We need to reform the front line! Unless there is a consistent front, especially North-Center, the fascist dogs will have no issue to circumvent the entire Central Front, and then it will not matter how valiantly I can get my men to defend and fight.


This sounds like a good idea. Have you seen the drawings on page 14 ? I was thinking of reforming the line at the river with the new reinforcement. And then bring all the other troops there.



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 2:38:40 PM)

Yes I have seen the drawing, just wanted to emphasize speed. : )

Who are we waiting for currently?



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 2:54:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Darojax

Yes I have seen the drawing, just wanted to emphasize speed. : )

Who are we waiting for currently?


Well technically, its my turn to do, and then Kratsch, but as I mention in page 14, I was waiting for a approval or dismissal of current strategy by all members, in order to know where to give reinforcement and whatnot.

But wev been waiting long enough, I will just go on and proceed with the plan as drawn on page 14. Reinforcement for this turn will be all given to the Central Front, and same with the next turn as well. After this we will give reinforcement to South and North.

We need to make up troops in the center because we have been seeing massive encirclement.

After I do my turn, it will be Kratsch's turn to do the Air force turn, and then it will be Central Front. I will do my turn, right now.




Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/9/2018 3:13:49 PM)

83,000 infantry were sent to Gorky in order to prepare the new defensive position. Along with it, Armored division that needs to be refitted.

6,000 infantry was sent North at Cherepovets

28,000 Infantry was sent South at Voroshilovgrad.


Next turn we can expect 10 Rifle Division, 4 Cavalry division, 1 Naval Infantry brigade and 9 Tank Brigade, as reinforcement, that will be sent to Central and Northern front.
And we can expect about the same amount of troops, that will as well be divided between North and Center.

The third turn, on the 25, I will send ALL reinforcement South. So 15 Rifle Division, 6 tank brigade, and a few other cavalry/naval division.

Kratsch : Just keep defending the south like you are doing.

DOCTORKING : If you can retreat the yellow divisions near the center, it will be great, otherwise I fear they might be encircled.

DAROJAX :

Everyone in the circle is yours, and I also highlighted the expected defensive position you are to take within the next 2 turns :

[img]https://i.imgur.com/CRiPqeo.png[/img]



Kratsch -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/10/2018 9:04:41 PM)

Initial air done.

I have done:
- moved high fatigue and low morale units to the reserve
- upgraded a few fighter units
- did recon
- moved some airfields and fighters to the rear as they have started doing strategic bombing of our industry
- allocated all reasonable and available new air units to mainly the central area
- relocated some empty airfields out of doomed Leningrad.
- done my airfield bombing
- dome some fighter sweeps

Note:
- there are still several newly arrived shell division on the eastern map board.

All air in your front allocated air-fields is yours to use as you wish; I would recommend for 2x bombing prior to any attacks.

We need to do a lot of running in all areas. Both in the south and centre it should be possible to again for a last time break into the pockets.

In my final air phase I will:

- relocate airfields if needed
- do supply drops into areas that could not get any supply otherwise

File is up



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/10/2018 10:06:09 PM)

Alright, sounds great, thanks !
Yes it seem I forgot to see those divisions below, Il bring them up during my final turn



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/10/2018 11:23:18 PM)

Comrades.

Turn uploaded to dropbox.

I've done what I can with the assets available. Most of the units close behind the frontline have been placed in reserve and in checkerboard formation to maximize zone-of-control in order to delay the fascists as much as possible. Needless to say the situation is not encouraging.

Out of curiosity how do we go about changing HQ leaders, should that be desired?

o7 CentCom Darojax


[img]https://i.imgur.com/Sf1PlrMl.jpg[/img]
(click image for full size)



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/11/2018 10:27:41 AM)

P.S.

The "Harass" maneuver north of Moscow was considered, but please believe, there simply are not enough forces available. If the airborne corps there had been pushed down south/southwest they would simply have been overrun and utterly wasted for no gain at all. I decided to pull them back so they may be used in a more constructive manner.



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/11/2018 8:25:29 PM)

Alright Comrade, no problem, this sounds good. Should slow the Germans enough to be able to organize a defensive position along the line. Just dont forget you will need to add the STAVKA units to your own armies yourself.

And as far as changing commanders goes, just tell me wich commander you want changed, from what armies so I can easely find him, and with who you want instead, and I will do it.

Also, Im not sure what you did with the other files, but we keep all files in the dropbox. For future reference, because as of now, all files disappeared except yours. Unless it was someone else ?



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/11/2018 8:31:48 PM)

Roger on all.

Oh sorry! The other files were moved to the archive folder, they are moved back now.

Will not move any files in the future!



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/12/2018 12:44:21 AM)

Alright, North is done, It is now South's turn, and Air turn.



Darojax -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/13/2018 8:34:47 AM)

Who are we waiting for?



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/13/2018 12:33:28 PM)

Southern Commander Kratsch



Kratsch -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/15/2018 6:40:55 PM)

Sorry for the delay Gents,

was away for a few days, and the laptop died. Will get a fine by tomorrow evening at the latest.



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/16/2018 4:40:38 AM)

Alright.



Kratsch -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/18/2018 1:12:55 PM)

Dear All,

several things have happened over the past few days both at work and at home that have required my full attention. They also mean that for the foreseeable future I will have to massively reduce my gaming time to pretty much a single gaming partner I have played for many years with (completely different game with quick turns).
I am afraid that I won't have the time to participate in this enterprise here any longer in anything even close to the timescales a group game needs.

I am really sorry, but wish you all good luck, and am looking forward to hearing how it all turned out in the end!

Best wishes,

Henrik



Neogodhobo -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/20/2018 12:00:57 PM)

Alright Kratsch, no problem !
Have a good one !

__________________________________________________



Alright guys, well we found a replacement for Kratsch, the name is Mamluke. He will be our new Southern Commander and should be doing the turn shortly.
I ask if he wanted to take the role of Air Marshall and Factory Evac, but if he does not, we will need people to take on these role. So if anyone has experience with them, or want to try their luck, now is the time to propose ;)

So...

Welcome Mamluke ! And good luck on the Southern Front :)



Mamluke -> RE: 2by3+ SOVIET SIDE ONLY, German dont enter. (2/20/2018 1:54:52 PM)

hello everyone, I'm the new Southern commander.

So I'm having a problem with the save game file, I think I need to use the "2by3+ 012-Sov.04 NorthDone.psv" to do my turn, however I notice a discrepancy. All my regular save games have the file type .sav like "Patriotic war.sav" but all the save files in the drop box are the .psv type.
When I put the .psv file in question in my save folder, I can't load up the save game, it simply doesn't show up in the Load Game screen.

Another thing that seams wrong, I was not ask at all about a password when I got the Drop box, in fact, I could extract files at will from the drop box even before Neogodhobo send me the email with the password.

So yeah, I must have done something wrong. I'm thinking of asking for help in the Axis thread but it seams appropriate to ask here 1st.



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