RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4

RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (Full Version)

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thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 4:49:06 AM)
The Soviet response to this threat was to build a powerful defense in the land bridge sector, between Orsha and Vitebsk. The best Soviet generals are here, except for Rokossovsky, who is commanding an understrength mechanized corps in the swamps. Leadership is particularly important in this game. As the Soviets, you have a poor lineup of leaders at the beginning. One of the most helpful things you can do to make your forces stronger in the early going is to replace Army commanders with your best guys. Replacing an army commander costs about 15 AP, depending on the political ratings and rank of the guy you’re firing and his replacement. This means that, realistically, you can do one or at most two a turn (50 AP per turn for the Soviets in 1941). All the hexes across that land bridge front have defensive CV in the 30’s except for the southernmost hex, thanks to the good commanders. Central sector’s defenses are strong, but somewhat crustal – if the Germans can break through in the land bridge area and turn north to link up with a similar breakthrough east of Polotsk, a lot of Soviet divisions could be pocketed. There are a few rear-area blockers, but very few. Another use for AP is building support units. You should be doing plenty of this, too, though it is a longer-term remedy. The support units you build in July 1941 are going to be pretty much useless until the fall anyway, since they start at experience 10 and learn rather slowly. The turn you build them they are unarmed. But ultimately you want to have at least six artillery/mortar units in each army, and then you will need more guns for the artillery breakthrough divisions you get in 1942. Looking at those Soviet armies in the critical sectors, they vary widely in support unit allocation – there are a couple of armies with no SU at all, while others have as many as eight artillery regiments. Obviously, the Soviets didn’t use the Telemecus method of balancing support allocation. This is something that is more commonly used by the Axis: you set the support level for all your HQ’s to 0 except for your high command. Then, over a period of two or three turns, all the SU move up the chain of command to your GHQ at no cost in AP. You allocate them as needed at the beginning of the turn, also for no cost in AP, allowing them to migrate back up the chain of command for reallocation when no longer needed. The downside to this method is that you need to start each turn with SU allocation. This is a good function for an experienced CoS in a multi-player game such as this. One notable weakness in the Central sector’s defenses is that very few units are guarding the escape route for the armor in the swamps. Those units are valuable, if not for the generally outmoded equipment they possess then for their experience and morale values. If they can escape successfully, the Soviet counteroffensive in the winter will be much stronger. Central and South sectors seem to each be expecting the other to cover their line of retreat, with the unfortunate result for the Soviets that they are relatively unprotected and likely to be cut off and destroyed. [image]local://upfiles/56634/049388E4E57D4EF6A243CDDFB3FDD24D.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 4:50:03 AM)
In the southern sector, Soviet forces began the turn with the majority of Southern Front isolated by a roaming SS Motorized Division. The isolation, however, was not a solid pocket and thus merely an annoyance, cutting supplies for a turn and slowing Southern Front’s withdrawal. Along the Dnepr up to Kiev, only a very tenuous screen of Axis forces – some Germans from 6th Army, a reinforced panzer corps from 1st Panzer Group, and a bunch of Romanians – faced a similarly weak screen of Soviet forces behind the river. Scattered forces remained around Odessa, where the defenses are a little more muscular than the Germans could have detected during their turn. [image]local://upfiles/56634/DCD92E22933E4E2485DA420258DCC037.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 4:51:07 AM)
Soviet forces in this sector confined themselves to continuing their steady retreat in central Ukraine, while solidifying their line behind the central Dnepr with poor-quality units that will still most likely prevent any dramatic German moves in the area. Southern Front has now managed a screen that at least extends all the way from the Black Sea to the Dnepr, preventing any German units from simply walking past their positions. Their front is not strong, and they are obviously counting on poor supply and limited infantry support to prevent rapid German advances to the east into the Dnepropetrovsk/Zaporozhye region. The factories in both those cities, and those in Kremenchug, have not yet been evacuated, offering the Axis a juicy strategic target if they do have enough MP to get there. There is one weak cavalry division in Dnepropetrovsk, but even if the Germans don’t have the MP for a hasty attack to displace it, simply putting the city in ZoC will make evacuation of the factories harder (rail cost is doubled if you are moving out of a ZoC). It is unusual to see Army Group South be so quiescent. In multi-player games, it is often difficult to convince a regional commander that his region is unimportant, and he should give up assets to more critical sectors. It seems in this game the Axis CoS, Hobotango, has managed this feat. Notably, Soviet southern front apparently had the opportunity to open the small pocket in the vicinity of Uman and did not do so. Perhaps they figured that rescuing (or postponing the death of) the understrength mechanized corps in the pocket wasn’t worth the additional division they would have had to put at risk by advancing from the Dnepr line. [image]local://upfiles/56634/54D0D7AF2F544496AF17517579136515.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 4:52:12 AM)
Losses this turn were 163,914 Soviet to 18,491 Axis (255:62 in the air). Deployed forces are 3,848,708 Soviet to 3,392,889 Germans (7,522 to 3,616 in the air). Intensity of air combat has been low for a couple of turns now. Both sides are keeping their air bases well behind their lines, meaning that air interceptions are unusual and interdictions very unlikely (looks like the Germans had about ten missions this turn). The Soviets did not do the by-now standard widespread bombing missions. Looks like both sides are hoarding their air forces and letting the ground troops fight it out.

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:01:22 AM)
In commentary from Comrade Marshal Fetterkrolle, in the northern sector: Riga fell to a very lucky attack, I was hoping they would hold out 1 more turn, but they did not. Atleast it has slowed down axis advancements in the North. The Germans had to use 8 divisions to push us out, and with the best general in the game Walter Model! [image]local://upfiles/56634/B94D3CA691154705AE6504AA8026D5C6.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:02:05 AM)
He continues: All of these axis formations wont reach the defensive lines for atleast 2 turns, so I would say the 3 divisions was worth losing in the long run [image]local://upfiles/56634/6178AF77A7304F5E87D16EA42ECA139C.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:02:31 AM)
This turn the Northern defence recieved 8 new formations. 5 rifles, 2 naval brigades and 1 cavalry division. I am very suprized at the high CV from the brigades! (Some of these were taken from finland, along with 7th independent army) This Turn I will help with the defence of velikie luki as it is a likely target next turn. VL is sort of around the line where me and Littlebrother cut the defensive line between North and Center. Considering that is the case I helped with what units I have. Note that there will be a lot more reinforments coming from Center. [image]local://upfiles/56634/C81158298A3A4DBCBA79B3EC06F17C9E.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:02:57 AM)
The Finns join the war and start advancing. In a turn or two they will face no enemies at all. But their efforts are not in vane, so far they managed to probably kill one division. [image]local://upfiles/56634/44A3D4D552A24A669073DB1E592873F2.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:03:20 AM)
In addition we have 3 new forts being built North of leningrad, it should be all we need to defend against the weak finish forces :wink: Hanko is also evacuated to avoid any potential disasters

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:04:18 AM)
Comrade Marshal Tonyhnz, commander of southern sector, chimes in: south 04 swamp trying to extricate units/build def line [image]local://upfiles/56634/310E1F7871C141E49006B3B690DFAFCE.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:04:49 AM)
south 04 middle building defence along dnepr line [image]local://upfiles/56634/ACA423FC82AD41E68203811ABEE7C463.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:05:18 AM)
04 south bottom axis moved behind some units so reestablished zoc and blocked a little down by crimea [image]local://upfiles/56634/C7F1E3402A6F411A89201F3F0CD0D071.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:06:12 AM)
And Comrade Marshal Littlebrother, commander of central sector, reports: 6th CAV, heroes of the motherland, courageously take the first steps into the fatherland by liberating Ostrow Mazowecka. Next Warsaw then on to Berlin! [image]local://upfiles/56634/BF8F167EF75F4ED8A62CEC16A6CC6F92.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:06:44 AM)
Feels a bit ahistorical to have a SOV CAV division running amok within a few miles of Warsaw...

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 4 (4/16/2019 5:07:24 AM)
He continues: Assigned a majority of the incoming Reserve Front to counter a possible combined AGN/AGC push to wedge the area between VL and the landbridge [image]local://upfiles/56634/227F50E4A3A44EF38DE5A22D7C4DA6BD.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 8:58:05 PM)
TTG Neutral AAR, Axis turn 5 Axis turn 5 saw a dramatic offensive against strong Soviet defenses in the center, while Army Groups North and South cleaned up their rear areas and advanced to contact with the Soviet main line of resistance. In the north, AGN started the turn with one of its infantry armies still engaged in the vicinity of Riga, while the other was concentrated in front of Polotsk. Soviet forces had established a very impressive line of fortifications around Pskov, while the line to the east of Polotsk looked rather fragile. [image]local://upfiles/56634/837A2466ABDE4D7BB66534EE8137FD36.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 8:59:10 PM)
AGN began the turn by wiping out the refugees from Riga, then the elements of 18th Army that still had movement points left marched due east. Their goal is to offer a plausible threat to Soviet Northern Front in the Pskov region and prevent reinforcements from that sector from moving south to support the schwerpunkt between Polotsk and Mogliev. The armored forces in northern Latvia, consisting of LVI Panzer Corps under the command of the peerless von Manstein, maintained this plausible threat this turn by attacking Soviet forces west of the Sinyaya River south of Pskov. The presence of von Manstein, visible to the Soviet players in combat reports, will suggest that this sector remains an important one for the Axis and, they hope, keep the Soviets honest in the north. Meanwhile the concentrated strike force of AGN, 18th Army and XXXXI Panzer Corps, launched an attack against the Soviet line east of Polotsk. Model was reassigned from I Corps in 18th Army (where he led the attack on Riga last turn) to XXVIII Corps in 18th Army. Normally, you want all the attacking units in any combat to be part of one corps, because if there are units from other HQ’s present, they are nerfed. But in this case, AGN’s commander guessed that Model’s leadership skills were more important, and so each of the four front-line attacks had XXVIII Corps units in them. Additionally, if there are more than one HQ’s units present in an attack, they can all conceivably commit support units, and in this case each attack was supported by at least three artillery SU. The results were gratifying to the Axis; all four attacks succeeded. However, good Soviet leadership meant that almost all defending units made their morale rolls and retreated instead of routing. The second-line defenders were also strongly dug in, and when the second echelon forces took the newly-conquered hexes, they discovered defense strengths in the 20’s or 30’s. German armor made a few successful attacks at the southern end of the line, but AGN was unable to break through the Soviet defenses. This shows the success of the Soviet defenders in creating good defense in depth positions – in my commentary on their last turn, I was critical of their forward defense strategy but in this case it seems to have paid off for them. They were facing only one panzer corps; with both corps the second-line forces would probably have been driven back but still a significant breakthrough would have been unlikely. [image]local://upfiles/56634/18D528BA671E46D681562F38D4A3B6D5.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:00:07 PM)
In the land bridge sector, AGC faced an even stronger defensive line. Reported defensive CV’s were in the 30’s, and recon showed the presence of armored forces in reserve. The defenses behind the Dnepr south of Orsha looked somewhat less imposing, but there the difficulty of crossing a major river would hinder Axis exploitation of any breakthrough. A breakthrough was certainly possible with AGC’s armor enjoying movement allowances near maximum thanks to HQBU’s for three corps last turn. Farther south, a corps of 4th Army and some of the infantry of 2nd Panzer Group faced a thin screen of Soviet defenders in the swamp sector, with elements of 1st Panzer Group and 17th Army pushing into the swamps from the south in an attempt to link up and pocket a huge group of Soviet armored units – the potential victims of the first-turn “enlarged Lvov “ pocket that the Axis did not form under our agreed house rule. AGS also saw no defenders to the east of its pocketing forces – perhaps a distraction given the terrible terrain north of Kiev. [image]local://upfiles/56634/8A3CBAE2638A459D8CDEF1F2E2F31644.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:01:09 PM)
The principal offensive in the Smolensk region went in across the Dnepr north of Mogliev, hooking northward and recrossing the Dnepr between the Soviet main line of resistance and Smolensk. In the land bridge itself, 9th Army did push in a bit in order to choke the Soviet defenders, while 2nd and 4th Armies massed for more attacks next turn. The offensive did not lead to a complete pocket, but probably most of the Soviet divisions in the southern half of the land bridge area will become casualties at some point. Meanwhile, pressure to the north may lead the Soviets to fear a double envelopment that will rip the center out of their lines. Continuing to brawl in the area will no doubt appeal to the aggressive instincts of Soviet Central Region commander LittleBrother, and may be the right decision, but one that will mean high risk of serious losses. To the south, 17th Army and 1st Panzer Group contacted 4th Army in the swamps, completing the slow-motion enhanced Lvov pocket. Meanwhile, elements of 1st Panzer Group were able to withdraw from the swamps and prepare to move southeast to rejoin the rest of the group in eastern Ukraine. AGC did leave an enormous hole between Mogliev and Zhlobin, while the Soviets still control territory on the western shore of the Dnepr, facilitating river crossing. An aggressive Soviet commander could send cavalry through that hole to displace Axis HQ’s and choke, if not cut off, supply to the enormous German panzer spearhead east of the river. [image]local://upfiles/56634/FA333EDD4CF74E6C800066B7C75634CA.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:02:29 PM)
Army Group South faced a fairly solid Soviet line along the Dnepr from Kiev down to Kremenchug, and then a skirmish line of weak Southern Front units south to the Black Sea. Only 1st Panzer Group and its supporting elements of 2nd Pz Gp were in contact in that area, while the infantry remained one or more turns behind. And the armor in this sector is now far from its sources of supply and only had movement allowances in the 20’s at the start of the turn. The Soviet commander in this sector had followed a consistent policy of fleeing out of the range of the Axis attack, and it certainly appears at this point that he has succeeded. [image]local://upfiles/56634/37E33BDB5DB24F6CAD7453CBF9716AC2.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:03:16 PM)
AGS moved conservatively to address these concerns. The armor of 1st Panzer Group moved a little bit to consolidate, but conserved fuel (and maybe gave the false impression of having done an HQBU). The infantry of 17th, 9th, and 11th Armies moved as rapidly as possible to catch up with the tanks. The Romanian infantry crossed the Dnestr and made for Odessa, though they might conclude after seeing the defenses that they need some Germans to help clear the place out. [image]local://upfiles/56634/255B7E9515EA4E5BA50F533746F08898.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:04:31 PM)
Total losses this turn were 244,263 Soviet to 20,183 Axis. Air losses were 406 to 120 – 75 German level bombers were killed in unescorted ground support attacks over the Army Group Center armored spearhead. The Soviets did not do a huge number of bombing raids that would have used up the German fighter miles/fuel/ammo. Looking at the German fighter groups, they seem to have plenty of fuel and ammo and miles remaining at the end of the turn. They don’t have any staging bases near the combat, though. What appears to have happened is that as the panzers moved into the Soviet rear, they simply got beyond the range of the German fighters based in eastern Latvia. The Ju88’s bravely continued to try to provide ground support, but the Soviet defensive fighters had a field day. Lesson learned: keep staging bases up with the advancing panzer spearheads. Total deployed numbers are 3,632,196 Soviet to 3,400,569 Germans (7,300 to 3,601 in the air). The Red Army has taken 1.1 million losses to date, with another 250,000 guys cut off and almost certain to become casualties. Still, this number could be much higher. Much depends on what is going to happen in the center in the next couple of turns. If the German offensive bogs down in intensive combat in two interlocking salients, then the Soviets have gained a significant advantage. If the Germans can isolate and destroy the twenty-five divisions from Reserve Front that are currently west of their land bridge salient, on the other hand, their offensive towards Moscow will gain momentum.

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:09:12 PM)
In the words of AGS commander Mrhuggles: "Whoops forgot turn 4, but it involved me continue to chase the soviet armored and mot units into the swamp, and sending LAH mot all the way around nikolaev to encircle the units there Unfortunately the other units under my control were not fueled up enough, and tony's defense in the south was too well done on the following turn to encircle the units once again I decided against partially blocking them (which even then I was not sure I would be able to do) and instead maneuvering my armored and motorized units into areas where they could refuel and be ready for further gains in the coming turns , while my infantry catches up A tentative plan for the next few turns is as follows" [image]local://upfiles/56634/20EC03298D844E0599A7F0A58A0827FB.jpg[/image]

thedoctorking -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:11:06 PM)
And he continues: In the north, with help from AGC the fate of the forces in the swamps is sealed as they were finally blocked from the north and south, infantry forces will advance from the center of AGS to take the western side of Kiev" [image]local://upfiles/56634/36263A13CB9247AC9A2BA0FFDAF030AF.jpg[/image]

SparkleyTits -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:48:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thedoctorking What appears to have happened is that as the panzers moved into the Soviet rear, they simply got beyond the range of the German fighters based in eastern Latvia. The Ju88’s bravely continued to try to provide ground support, but the Soviet defensive fighters had a field day. Lesson learned: keep staging bases up with the advancing panzer spearheads. I expect nothing less of my men, more sacrifices of these kinds will be both required and expected in the future!

Fanstar1 -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/25/2019 9:49:19 PM)
I don't think AGN's slow start will affect the game much, at least not as much as the encirclement of much of southwest front in the mozyr swamp.

Nix77 -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/26/2019 8:46:46 AM)
Well that's a punch in the face for the Soviet side, 10+ mechanized divisions crossing a guarded Dnepr in a single turn! Ouch! Or should I say even doublecrossed? :) The panzers even have supply line secured... I can imagine the message to Stavka from Pavlov: "We have a small breakthrough southwest of Smolensk."

joelmar -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/26/2019 4:42:40 PM)
thedoctorking: really nice AAR well done! Good analysis and a very cool idea. Helps me validate and refine my Axis playing for sure. Really appreciated thank you.

Hardradi -> RE: TTG multi-player teaching game: Axis turn 5 (4/29/2019 9:14:46 AM)
Likewise, much appreciated thedoctorking.

thedoctorking -> TTG multi-player teaching game: Soviet turn 5 (5/6/2019 5:54:01 PM)
TTG Teaching Game Neutral AAR Soviet turn 5 When the Soviets opened their turn 5, they discovered a dramatic Axis offensive in Army Group Center that threatened to unhinge the Orsha-Vitebsk land bridge line. In the swamps, the “extended Lvov” pocket was at last completed. Army Groups North and South, however, had made limited offensives. Army Group North, as reported in last turn’s Axis AAR, found the defenses in the Polotsk-Vitebsk sector to be more impressive than they looked at first glance. German 16th Army and XXXXI Panzer Corps had only succeeded in pushing the defenders back one to two hexes, despite the frightening presence of Model. The front line units were still strong. As anticipated, Reserve Air Command’s planes were nowhere in evidence. There were few German planes involved in any of these attacks either, interestingly. The German air bases are only a few hexes away and sitting on rail lines, but perhaps they ran out of fuel, ammo, and miles supporting the Army Group Center attacks. This is something to think about if you have many attacks to make; perhaps leave a few air units on limited range to conserve them for attacks later in your turn. To the north, Axis raiders pushed Soviet forward outposts back, but the main line of resistance was untouched. Some of 18th Army’s infantry has shown up within striking distance, though. [image]local://upfiles/56634/65B7EC47217543B4A0305426B5CAAE07.jpg[/image]

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